
Bridget Kirouac, a medical marijuana patient who relocated from Maine to Florida, and who suffers from debilitating bone spurs, was found not guilty of cultivating medical marijuana in her Martin County home.
![]()
BREAKING: Bridget Kirouac found NOT GUILTY of cultivation and possession of cannabis. More tonight on @WPTVpic.twitter.com/KTNuuRqXd7
Jason Hackett (@JHackettWPTV) September 16, 2016
Informing the sympathetic jury, Im not a criminal, Im a patient, Kirouac told the attentive courtroom. All Im trying to do is survive. Kirouac used marijuana
Kirouac explained to the courtroom that she was an MMJ patient in the state of Maine with a valid recommendation for medical marijuana before relocating to the Sunshine State for its warmer climate. She held back tears while explaining her struggle with pain. When you get to that point, and you tried as many of the options that are available to you as I have dying becomes a very attractive prospect, she said.
The prosecution focused on the fact that medical marijuana was not legal at the time of her offense. They were ultimately handed a historical defeat with the jurys not guilty verdict for Bridget Kirouac.
Poster Comment:
A jury of your peers has determined that growing weed is legal.
THE END
#1: ConservingFreedom To: hondo68 (#0)
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-17 22:00:54 Reply Private Reply
#2: Deckard To: ConservingFreedom, hondo68 (#1)
I expect to see more cases like this one.
The shrill, shrieking authoritarians here ain't gonna like this one bit.
Deckard posted on 2016-09-17 23:57:06 Reply Private Reply
#3: nolu chan To: hondo68 (#0)
Hallelujah!!
This was the second medical marijuana case that Michael Minardi has won in Florida. The first was the case of Jesse Teplicki.
If you are ever charged with marijuana possession in Florida, be sure to cite the binding precedent of Florida v. Bridget Kirouac, opinion of the jury.
http://www.minardilaw.com/bridget-kirouac-found-not-guilty-of-possession-and-cultivation-of-cannabis/
That judge is a spoilsport.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-18 02:52:32 Reply Private Reply
#4: Deckard To: nolu chan (#3)
Not just this thread either - it's pretty much the same on any post you make about medical marijuana users.
Let's get one thing straight - the government does not own our bodies and as such has no business telling anyone what they may or may not use to medicate themselves.
Deckard posted on 2016-09-18 03:12:44 Reply Private Reply
#5: misterwhite To: Deckard (#4)
Pot, meet kettle.
You're the asshole who takes delight in the flouting of the law. To you, laws are merely a recommendation and they only apply to others, not you.
misterwhite posted on 2016-09-18 09:16:00 Reply Private Reply
#6: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#3)
Continued use will not be without risk of arrest, but after this no responsible prosecutor will waste taxpayer resources trying her for the "crime" of using medicine.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-18 11:08:35 Reply Private Reply
#7: ConservingFreedom To: misterwhite, Deckard (#5)
I'm completely confident that Deckard takes no delight in the flouting of just laws such as those against murder, rape, and theft ... but is pleased to see punishment not inflicted on those breaking immoral laws such as those against using governmentally-disapproved medicines.
So "Deckard" is really Bridget Kirouac? Who knew?
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-18 11:13:17 Reply Private Reply
#8: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom (#6)
Or they will prosecute because it will be another jury, and this case will not be citable for innocence. Absolutely nothing can be cited as marijuana being medicine.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-18 12:32:00 Reply Private Reply
#9: nolu chan To: Deckard (#4)
Not taking delight, just not taking your blathering bullshit.
Marijuana is illegal. Marijuana is not medicine. That is the law, like it or not.
Jury nullification is just fine. It does not change any law. It does not say marijuana is legal. It says the jury, based on the fasts of the case, found rendering a guilty verdict in the case before them would be an injustice. They are empowered and free to render a not guilty verdict. They do not change the law.
Each future defendant will have to roll the dice on a verdict, knowing that they have violated the law.
And arguing nullification to the jury is prohibited.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-18 12:37:17 Reply Private Reply
#10: misterwhite To: ConservingFreedom (#7)
Why not simply repeal the law? For everyone? That should be easy given that it's an immoral one.
misterwhite posted on 2016-09-18 13:15:20 Reply Private Reply
#11: Hondo68 To: nolu chan, settled law (#9)
Bullshit! The jury decided that the DA's and your presentation to the court is SPAM, that you're CT freaks, kooks, and weirdos.
It's settled law that weed is legal. The precedent is carved into stone, deal with it!
Hondo68 posted on 2016-09-18 15:31:50 Reply Private Reply
#12: nolu chan To: hondo68 (#11)
Neither a trial court, nor its jury, is capable of setting a binding precedent. How much ignorance can you display?
A precedent is binding upon all lower courts within the jurisdiction of an appellate court. A trial court has no lower court to bind. A jury is not the court and cannot create precedent, even upon the trial court. You are completely cluless. You do not know what a binding precedent is.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precedent
There is a binding precedent, but it is from the U.S. Supreme Court.
Gonzales v. Raich, 545 U.S. 1, 27-29 (2005)
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-18 15:51:35 Reply Private Reply
#13: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#8)
That would be irresponsible use of taxpayer resources absent any evidence that this jury was somehow skewed.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-18 15:53:13 Reply Private Reply
#14: ConservingFreedom To: misterwhite (#10)
I'm all for it.
Sadly, that doesn't follow. But the trend is in that direction, and I pray it continues.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-18 16:05:53 Reply Private Reply
#15: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#9)
Really? I did find the following, which falls short of "prohibited": "Most [not all - CF] judges also will prohibit attorneys from using their closing arguments to directly appeal to jurors to nullify the law.
"Recently, several courts have indicated that judges also have the right, when it is brought to their attention by other jurors, to remove (prior to a verdict, of course) from juries any juror who makes clear his or her intention to vote to nullify the law. " - law2.umkc.edu/faculty/pro...zenger/nullification.html
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-18 16:12:20 Reply Private Reply
#16: tpaine To: nolu chan (#9)
Why is arguing nullification before a jury prohibited, -- if,-- " Jury nullification is just fine." ???
tpaine posted on 2016-09-18 20:37:56 Reply Private Reply
#17: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom, TPAINE (#15)
For one example, see:
http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/417/1002/190492/
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 02:15:01 Reply Private Reply
#18: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom (#13)
The Court was quite clear in saying this does not mean that she can further use marijuana. It is UNLAWFUL. The jury verdict did not change that. If she tokes up tomorrow, that will be another prosecutable crime.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 02:19:47 Reply Private Reply
#19: tpaine To: All, nolu spam, wrong again (#16)
You quote an OPINION by Justice Jay: ---
So you return to the same old silly argument, -- that 'we must hold firmly to the doctrine', --- court opinions MUST be treated as 'law'. -- You're wrong..
tpaine posted on 2016-09-19 12:34:28 Reply Private Reply
#20: A Pole To: hondo68 (#0)
A Pole posted on 2016-09-19 13:25:09 Reply Private Reply
#21: A Pole To: ConservingFreedom (#15)
I was removed from the jury for that. I told judge that I will put my judgment and conscience before his instructions.
A Pole posted on 2016-09-19 13:29:50 Reply Private Reply
#22: A Pole To: nolu chan (#9)
Keeping jurors in ignorance is a nullification of the juries.
A Pole posted on 2016-09-19 13:32:48 Reply Private Reply
#23: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#18)
Completely beside the point ... color me unsurprised.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-19 16:18:30 Reply Private Reply
#24: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#17)
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-19 16:21:56 Reply Private Reply
#25: nolu chan To: tpaine (#19)
And you are an ingnorant asshole displaying your assholery.
You post responds to yourself at #16. At #17 I quoted from one case, U.S. v. Moylan, 417 F.2d 1002 (4th Cir. 1969). Moylan gave the correct precedent, and you are full of shit, as usual.
The quote from Moylan reads:
Moylan has a footnote 13: "Sparf and Hansen v. United States, supra n. 6 at 101-102, 15 S. Ct. at 293."
At the footnote 13 cited case, pp. 101-02, Sparf says:
Sparf quotes Georgia v. Brailsford, 3 U. S. 1 (1794) from an opinion by Chief Justice John Jay. The quote, as given by Sparf, is recited below, a bit more completely.
That early 1794 jury civil case was annihilated as any sort of precedent to the effect of espousing jury nullification in criminal or general cases by the U.S. Supreme Court in Sparf and Hansen v. United States,, 156 U.S. 51 (1895) which I have previously quoted to your dumb ass, and which is the case cited in the footnote to which you refer here.
As noted below, Georgia v. Brailsford 3 U.S. 1 (1794) was examined by the U.S. Sureme Court in Sparf, and the whole case was considered an anomaly. It was a trial by jury in the U.S. Supreme Court. The jury, so-called, was a panel of experts chosen for their expertise on the subject.
The U.S. Supreme Court granted cert in one case about jury nullification in 1894 and decided in 1895. That case, Sparf and Hansen v. United States,, 156 U.S. 51 (1895), forever put your insane bullshit to bed. Deal with it.
As Moylan noted in 1969, as I quoted:
And since 1969, add about another half-century to that standing precedent.
As you have been previously informed of this, I am sure you are merely being an asshole.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/156/51/case.html
U.S. Supreme Court
Sparf and Hansen v. United States, 156 U.S. 51 (1895)
Sparf and Hansen v. United States
No. 613
Submitted March 5, 1894
Decided January 21, 1895
[156 U. S. 82 - 86] Opinion of the Court
[156 U. S. 106 - 107] Opinion of the Court, conclusion
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 16:33:05 Reply Private Reply
#26: nolu chan To: A Pole (#22)
The U.S. Supreme Court set precedent to the contrary in 1895. It still stands.
See #25. The standing precedent is Sparf and Hansen v. United States, 156 U.S. 51 (1895)
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 16:38:11 Reply Private Reply
#27: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom (#24)
No, the U.S. Supreme Court set the precedent in 1895. See #25. The standing precedent is Sparf and Hansen v. United States, 156 U.S. 51 (1895).
Once you persuade the courts that over a century of standing settled precedent should be overturned, you will be making progress. Until then, you are just spewing doper bullshit.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 16:42:01 Reply Private Reply
#28: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#27)
Nothing there about ARGUING nullification - it says juries have an unenforceable moral duty to to receive the law from the court.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-19 17:01:04 Reply Private Reply
#29: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom (#28)
Your absurd interpretation of Sparf is pure bullshit pulled out of your ass. Here is a Federal court interpretation of that Opinion which covers 156 U.S. 51 through 107.
http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/417/1002/190492/
U.S. v. Moylan, 417 F.2d 1002 (4th Cir. 1969)
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 17:33:07 Reply Private Reply
#30: tpaine To: nolu chan (#29)
Your absurd interpretation of Sparf is pure bullshit pulled out of your ass.
Scotus opinions are not law.
tpaine posted on 2016-09-19 17:39:49 Reply Private Reply
#31: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#29)
Which in no way implies your claim that "arguing nullification to the jury is prohibited". As a logician you're a great copy-and-paster.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-19 17:48:46 Reply Private Reply
#32: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom (#31)
United States v. Luisi, 568 F. Supp. 2d 106 (D. Mass. 2008)
And your are a master weasel-word bullshitter, but have no substance to your bullshit. You just pull it out of yor ass.
Thank you, sir! May I have another?
Yes, you may.
United States v. Luisi, 568 F. Supp. 2d 106 (D. Mass. 2008)
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-19 18:41:24 Reply Private Reply
#33: A Pole To: nolu chan (#29)
Of course. The judge should provide legal advice to the jury. Jurors are not lawyers and what are the alternatives - hiring an outside advisor?
But how is it related to the main topic?
A Pole posted on 2016-09-20 04:07:42 Reply Private Reply
#34: tpaine To: nolu chan claims - Jury Nullification Threatens to Undermine the Democratic Process (#32)
Only in the world of nolu spam..
The 'democratic process', as applied by the progressive leftists, is leading the USA down the road to serfdom.
tpaine posted on 2016-09-20 06:27:11 Reply Private Reply
#35: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#32)
Nice job of proving what I already stipulated, dolt: that some judges - presumably including Judge Young (United States District Court, D. Massachusetts) - will prohibit attorneys from using their closing arguments to directly appeal to jurors to nullify the law.
Thanks for proving my point: As a logician you're a great copy-and-paster.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-20 22:58:19 Reply Private Reply
#36: Pinguinite To: A Pole (#21)
Something that is good to avoid doing, if one wants to have a seat on a jury.
If a jurist wants to nullify but knows most (or any) other jurors may blow a whistle on them, the best course may just be to refuse to vote to convict because you don't find key witnesses credible. Though adding expressions of sympathy for the accused should be quite safe to do as well.
Pinguinite posted on 2016-09-21 14:13:28 Reply Private Reply
#37: Pinguinite To: nolu chan (#32)
You and courts and anyone can say any thing they want to about how jury nullification is wrong, unlawful, a violation of this or that, or whatever else.
But at the end of the day, the jury has the de facto power and therefore full fledged Right to nullify, and there ain't nothing you or any judge can do to undo that power.
The moral standing juries have this power trumps all other considerations, including whatever "legal" or judicial opinion material you present to the contrary. If you want a legal precedent, look up the case of William Penn in 1670. Though perhaps you disagree with that verdict as well, and feel the imprisonment of the jury was appropriate for their refusing to convict.
Pinguinite posted on 2016-09-21 14:24:26 Reply Private Reply
#38: nolu chan To: Pinguinite (#37)
William Penn did not exist under the Constitution and whatever he said would not overturn a decision of the U.S. Supreme Court.
Your disdain for the U.S. government and its laws is noted.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-21 16:21:27 Reply Private Reply
#39: Pinguinite To: nolu chan (#38)
The US Supreme Court cannot overturn a jury nullification verdict. All they can do is whine about it, assuming they don't like it.
Your religious absolutism about judicial law being the perfect order of life is noted.
Pinguinite posted on 2016-09-21 17:38:46 Reply Private Reply
#40: nolu chan To: ConservingFreedom (#35)
Thank you for proving my point that you are nothing but a bloviating asshole. NOT JUST SOME JUDGES, the BAR ASSOCIATIONS do it as well as the judges.
Your attorney will not directly argue nullification as the judge will quickly admonish him to quit if he goes near it. If he continues, he will be stopped. If necessary, the judge can declare that the closing argument is finished. Then the judge can refer him for Rule 11 sanctions to include suspension or disbarment, plus a hefty fine.
Your lawyer will not go there because it can be expensive and may cost his license.
If you are representing yourself, the judge does not have to take your shit. He will warn you, and if necessary, tell you to sit down and be quiet. He may hold you in contempt. If needed, you may be taken to another room, restrained in a chair, and watch the rest of the proceeding on closed-circuit television.
Directly arguing jury nullification is prohibited in Federal courts and in 48 states. The two exceptions are Maryland and Indiana, and even there, "the jury instructions typically admonish the jury not to arbitrarily and willfully disregard the law or substitute their own judgment for what they think the law should be in a particular case."
See, e.g., D.C. Bar, Ethics Opinion 320, Jury Nullification Arguments by Criminal Defense Counsel
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-21 17:42:50 Reply Private Reply
#41: nolu chan To: A Pole (#33)
The judge instructs the jury on what the law is.
The jury determines the facts.
The jury is supposed to apply the law, as given by the court, to the facts.
The title of the thread contains the term "jury nullification."
As you observe, jurors are not lawyers. They are not expected to be fluent at interpreting laws. The rule prohibiting defense counsel from arguing nullificationto a jury is Supreme Court (federal) precedent dating to 1895. Similar rules have been adopted in 48 states.
If a juror argues nullification in the jury room, he may be reported to the judge and kicked off the jury. If he argues nullification in voir dire, he will not make it to the jury. He will be dismissed for cause.
The poster comment to the article was, "A jury of your peers has determined that growing weed is legal."
By that logic, assuming arguendo the defendant did the deed, the O.J. jury determined that murdering one's wife (plus 1) is legal.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-21 18:01:28 Reply Private Reply
#42: tpaine To: nolu chan (#41)
You argue: --
SCOTUS opinions and precedents are NOT LAW. -- Nor are state rules to the same effect. -- They are, in this instance, anti- constitutional..
tpaine posted on 2016-09-21 18:42:32 Reply Private Reply
#43: Hondo68 To: nolu chan, A Pole (#41)
That's my clarification in parenthesis, not part of the title. It seems like jury nullification, but I don't pretend to know for certain what each jurors reasoning was.
The jurors endeavor to reach a verdict, and they did. For whatever reasons, the jurors decided that the defendant was not guilty of a crime.
NOT guilty.
Hondo68 posted on 2016-09-21 18:45:29 Reply Private Reply
#44: A Pole To: hondo68 (#43)
He said the truth:
Im not a criminal, Im a patient, Kirouac told the attentive courtroom. All Im trying to do is survive.
A Pole posted on 2016-09-22 02:29:29 Reply Private Reply
#45: ConservingFreedom To: nolu chan (#40)
Fine, make that "some judges and some bar associations" - still doesn't add up to a universal prohibition, particularly since a defendant has the option of representing himself and if doing so could give a shit what any bar association says.
ConservingFreedom posted on 2016-09-22 12:44:53 Reply Private Reply
#46: A Pole To: ConservingFreedom, Willie Green, sneakypete, Vicomte13, TooConservative (#45)
This is a good point. If a law is badly written, and a person is obviously innocent by the moral standards, why to pay lawyers?
Present your cause to the jury directly and if jurors are not heartless morons you will be vindicated. BTW, if represent yourself, can you participate in jury selection?
A Pole posted on 2016-09-23 04:55:25 Reply Private Reply
#47: A Pole To: nolu chan (#41)
It does not make much sense.
12 random and average people are better judges of the facts than experts and court officials?
No, juries are to inject HUMAN factor to be ABOVE soulless machine of the law.
A Pole posted on 2016-09-23 12:27:45 Reply Private Reply
#48: nolu chan To: tpaine (#42)
SCOTUS opinions and precedents are law. tpaine opinions are bullshit.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-26 17:16:58 Reply Private Reply
#49: tpaine To: All, ---- SCOTUS opinions and precedents are law, ---- nolu sham opines (#42)
tpaine posted on 2016-09-26 19:27:25 Reply Private Reply
#50: nolu chan To: tpaine (#49)
Black's Law Dictionary, 6th Ed.
Black's Law Dictionary, 6th Ed.
It's the law. Everybody knows it but tpaine. If one is subjected to custodial interrogation without being given the Miranda warnings, no evidence obtained in the interrogation may be used against the accused. It is the law because the U.S. Supreme Court said so in the case of Miranda v. Arizona, 384 U.S. 436 (1966).
In tpaine's delusional world, there is no enforceable Miranda Rule as there is no such thing as case law. Nowhere in the Constitution does it say one must be informed of his rights prior to questioning, nor does it say answers to questions asked before the court-required warning may not be used against the accused.
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-27 00:41:49 Reply Private Reply
#51: tpaine To: All, --- anti- constitutional SCOTUS opinions and precedents are law, ---- nolu sham (#49)
The nullification principle involves the power to say no to the excesses of government, --- to onerous scotus opinions and unconstitutional precedences, --- and thus serves as a final defense against tyranny.
As Thomas Jefferson put it to Tom Paine in a 1789 letter, "I consider trial by jury as the only anchor ever yet imagined by man, by which a government can be held to the principles of its constitution." To get in touch with the fully informed jury movement write: Fully Informed Jury Association, Box 59, Helmville MT 5984, 406-793-5550
tpaine posted on 2016-09-27 23:38:07 Reply Private Reply
#52: nolu chan To: tpaine (#51)
To really get in touch, tell the judge, during voir dire, that you espouse jury nullification. Or get reported to the judge during deliberations.
"Fully Informed Juror, which "is essentially a study of juror nullification."
Nullification gets a juror kicked off the jury. "Fully informed juror," if espoused to the Court is grounds for dismissal.
United States v. Luisi, 568 F. Supp. 2d 106 (D. Mass. 2008)
[Excerpt]
nolu chan posted on 2016-09-28 01:08:46 Reply Private Reply
#53: tpaine To: nolu sham, anti-constitutionalist, anti- trump (#52)
The nullification principle involves the power to say no to the excesses of government, --- to onerous scotus opinions and unconstitutional precedences, --- and thus serves as a final defense against tyranny.
As Thomas Jefferson put it to Tom Paine in a 1789 letter, "I consider trial by jury as the only anchor ever yet imagined by man, by which a government can be held to the principles of its constitution."
To get in touch with the fully informed jury movement write: Fully Informed Jury Association, Box 59, Helmville MT 5984, 406-793-5550
We can hope juries are NOT stupid enough to follow your nasty little recommendations, nolu.
Only in the anti-constitutional world of nolu sham, and his socialistic progressives, -- do we see this idiocy advocated.
It's time to end their world. VOTE TRUMP...
tpaine posted on 2016-09-28 14:39:51 Reply Private Reply