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Title: COVID Fraud – Lawyers & Medical Experts start legal proceedings against W.H.O and World Leaders for ‘Crimes against Humanity’
Source: [None]
URL Source: https://clickwooz.wordpress.com/202 ... s-for-crimes-against-humanity/
Published: May 9, 2021
Author: Klark Jouss
Post Date: 2021-05-09 12:59:38 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 12142
Comments: 72

A team of over 1,000 lawyers and over 10,000 medical experts led by Dr. Reiner Fuellmich have begun legal proceedings against the CDC, WHO & the Davos Group for crimes against humanity.

Fuellmich and his team present the faulty PCR test and the order for doctors to label any comorbidity death as a Covid death as fraud. The PCR test was never designed to detect pathogens and is 100% faulty at 35 cycles. All the PCR tests overseen by the CDC are set at 37 to 45 cycles. The CDC admits that any tests over 28 cycles are not admissible for a positive reliable result. This alone invalidates over 90% of the alleged covid cases / ”infections” tracked by the use of this faulty test.

In addition to the flawed tests and fraudulent death certificates, the “experimental” vaccine itself is in violation of Article 32 of the Geneva Convention. Under Article 32 of the 1949 Geneva Convention IV, “mutilation and medical or scientific experiments not necessitated by the medical treatment of a protected person” are prohibited. According to Article 147, conducting biological experiments on protected persons is a grave breach of the Convention.

The “experimental” vaccine is in violation of all 10 of the Nuremberg Codes which carry the death penalty for those who seek to violate these International Laws.

The “vaccine” fails to meet the following five requirements to be considered a vaccine and is by definition a medical “experiment” and trial:

Provides immunity to the virus This is a “leaky” gene therapy that does not provide immunity to Covid and claims to reduce symptoms yet double-vaccinated are now 60% of the patients requiring ER or ICU with covid infections.

Protects recipients from getting the virus This gene-therapy does not provide immunity and double-vaccinated can still catch and spread the virus.

Reduces deaths from the virus infection This gene-therapy does not reduce deaths from the infection. Double- Vaccinated infected with Covid have also died.

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#14. To: goldilucky, A K A Stone, Tankumo, WWG1WWA, watchman, and Everyone (#4) (Edited)

Thank you for posting this article.

I will further add to it this law that also applies regarding restrictions and testing of biological agents on people. See here:

www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/50/1520a

I did “see here” and I read that:

Subject to subsections (c), (d), and (e), the prohibition in subsection (a) does not apply to a test or experiment carried out for any of the following purposes:

(1)Any peaceful purpose that is related to a medical, therapeutic, pharmaceutical, agricultural, industrial, or research activity.

(2)Any purpose that is directly related to protection against toxic chemicals or biological weapons and agents.

(3)Any law enforcement purpose, including any purpose related to riot control.

Thank you for posting this most informative link …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-16   5:08:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: WWG1WWA, A K A Stone, Tankumo, watchman, goldilucky, and Everyone (#2) (Edited)

This brought a smile to my face.

Why?

What pleases you abut wasting huge monetary and time expense on a baseless lawsuit?

Litigation is a huge monetary and time expense. The drain on nerves isn't pretty either. In fact, some of the time wasted is bad not necessarily because of the time but how it's spent. If it's spent worrying about tasks that don't deserve it, abandon those tasks. Save time. Save money. Avoid the drain on nerves.

7 Ways To Waste Time And Money In Litigation

No surprisingly, Reiner Fuellmich’s lawsuit has not reached any court so far.

Ho hum …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-16   5:46:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Gatlin (#11)

watchman  posted on  2021-05-16   7:27:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: watchman, and Everyone (#16) (Edited)

BC man shares blood clot story on social media

Ah Ha.

One bit of anecdotal evidence.

You are presenting a simple claim on social media relying only on personal observation, collected in a casual or non-systematic manner which is generally regarded as limited in value.

Anecdotal evidence has a number of potential weaknesses when compared to other types of evidence.

Anecdotal evidence is troublesome in larger chance that it may be unreliable due to cherry-picked or otherwise non-representative samples of typical cases.

Psychologists have found that due to their cognitive bias, some people will likely seek out unusual examples rather than typical examples. Even when accurate, anecdotal evidence is not necessarily representative of a typical experience.

Misuse of anecdotal evidence is an informal fallacy and is sometimes referred to as the "person who" fallacy ("I know a person who..."; "I know of a case where..." etc.) which places undue weight on experiences which may not be typical.

You can view a table here that shows how statistical and scientific methodology are opposites of anecdotal evidence.

Carefully consider this: On average, 274 people die every day from blood clots while there are ONLY 28 blood clot cases reported from the COVID-19 vaccine – With 3 deaths may be linked to J&J . More than 146 million people have now received at least one dose of vaccine, and more than 103 million people have been fully vaccinated.

And you show such great concern about a single anecdotal evidence – because that is ALL you have.

Such FALSE concern – Pffft.

Get fucking real …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-16   10:55:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: watchman, and everyone (#16)

BC man shares blood clot story on social media

After researching this: I find:

There is no evidence that this incident was caused by the vaccine.

Can you show any such firm evidence?

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-16   11:54:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: Gatlin (#17)

More than 146 million people have now received at least one dose of vaccine, and more than 103 million people have been fully vaccinated.

Real poison for a fake pandemic.

These vaccines are made by the "pharmaceutical" industry.

The Greek word pharmakeia means "medication ("pharmacy"), i.e. (by extension) magic (literally or figuratively):--sorcery, witchcraft".

You're here to advance a globaalist agenda: sickness, depopulation, destruction. You work unknowingly (or knowingly?) for Apollyon.

In the end, you will lose.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-16   21:54:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: watchman, and Everyone (#19) (Edited)

More than 146 million people have now received at least one dose of vaccine, and more than 103 million people have been fully vaccinated.

Yes.

Verified truth as opposed to interpretation.

Real poison for a fake pandemic.

You call the vaccine a poison.

MPoison is a substance that is capable of causing the death of a living organism when introduced or absorbed. Yet you cannot provide proof in one single incident where a person has died from the vaccination.

You call the pandemic a fake pandemic.

A pandemic is defined as the prevalent of a disease over a whole country or the world. You continue to call COVID-19 a fake pandemic while Authorities in 219 countries and territories have reported here about 162.8 million Covid‑19 cases and 3.4 million deaths since China reported its first cases to the World Health Organization (WHO) in December 2019. Amazingly, your illusion of truth effect is wrongly perceived or interpreted and it will not let facts change your mind. Why is that?

Your illusory truth effect – also known as the illusion of truth effect, validity effect, truth effect, or the reiteration effect – tendency to continually believe false information to be correct after repeated exposure defies scientific methodology. The scientific method is a rational, logical thought process that is used to figure out facts and truths. All of the answers must be able to be proved. You have failed to prove anything you have said.

These vaccines are made by the "pharmaceutical" industry …

… and approved or licensed by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA).

You left that that out, so I added it for you.

The Greek word pharmakeia means "medication ("pharmacy"), i.e. (by extension) magic (literally or figuratively):--sorcery, witchcraft".

You are correct. The Greek word pharmakeia is used in Galatians 5:19.

The word is a fairly general one. My Greek dictionary defines it as: “witchcraft, magic, the use of spells and potions of magic, often involving drugs–a magic spell. It is a fact that witchcraft and magic in the Greek world often involved the use of drugs–either by the witch or the one on whom the magic is worked. I have heard the same thing taught that you quote. It is not absolutely false, but it is not good use of the Greek. Probably, whoever gave you this bogus definition also told you that we get the word pharmacy from this Greek root word. That, of course, is true, but this does not mean that the meaning of the word has not changed! Put it this way, if one were to use and administer drugs for the sole purpose of creating a mind-altered state, then one could probably be judged to have violated the commandment not to be involved in pharmakiea. Probably whoever told you this got the definition second hand and did not bother to look up the Greek. I see this as an attempt to make the stricture in Galatians 5:19 practical for a modern, particularly an American crowd. This is a good thing to do, but in making the scripture practical, we should always begin with good exegesis. If you lived in parts of Africa, the definition given above would apply in all its meanings. I have visited churches in third world countries where the sin of magic spells and relying on witch doctors is very much prevelant; even among Christians. [Source].

My question to you is why are you relying on a mid 17th century origin via late Latin from Greek for anything when modern day definitions show that:

Pharmaceuticals are drug-containing products in dosage forms. A pharmaceutical is a chemical substance which is used in healthcare.

There is nothing in the English definition that pertains to – as you say:

(by extension) magic (literally or figuratively):--sorcery, witchcraft"

You say to me:

You're here to advance a globaalist agenda: sickness, depopulation, destruction. You work unknowingly (or knowingly?) for Apollyon.

I say to you that is incorrect.

I am here to help you gain factual knowledge so that you can understand why information is important and useful. With the hope that your curiosity will finally be piqued, and appropriately challenge you to perceive relevance of the content in order that you will be willing to exert more effort and will perform better as a result. From an important perspective, these dimensions are among the most strongly correlated with effective learning.

In the end, you will lose.

Nah.

Truth always wins agains lies and here is why:

Lies can grow and grow and appear to be truth in a twisted sort of way, but a lie can never be the truth. And it doesn’t matter who believes the lies because you know the truth of what you lived and that truth will always be reality no matter how many lies try to distort it or how many choose to believe it.

I will never stop speaking the truth and I will always keep clinging to the real Truth – because in the end, truth always continues to stand the test of time. A person that lies is always eventually revealed.

I shall continue to reveal you and everyone who thinks like you …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-17   2:29:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Gatlin (#20)

Not that I read all the tripe you post, but could you do me a favor and tone down the blue highlighter?

That way, just in case you post something worth reading, my eyes will be spared the semi-permanent blue imprint left on my photoreceptors.

Thanks in advance 8-/

watchman  posted on  2021-05-17   17:42:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: watchman (#21)

Test xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Is this better for you?

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-17   17:49:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Gatlin (#22)

Lookin' good.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-17   17:56:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Gatlin (#20)

I will never stop speaking the truth and I will always keep clinging to the real Truth

How can you cling to the truth or even know the truth until you know Christ?

Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life..."

If Jesus is THE truth, and you don't know Him (and you don't), how can you be so sure that you have the "real" truth in other areas of knowledge and understanding?

watchman  posted on  2021-05-17   18:20:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: watchman, and Everyone (#24)

How can you cling to the truth or even know the truth until you know Christ?

How do I know truth?

Presenting this question to me as a deep philosophical puzzle is suitable for you to ask someone so “brainy” to tackle. The answer is simple. Truth is what corresponds to reality. Consequently, what is real is true, what is unreal is false.

You constantly reference the Bible in that it makes some very distinctive truth claims. These claims the Bible makes either correspond to reality or they do not. You believe that they do correspond to reality.

Explain how you really know this.

That’s an excellent question since so much is at stake in the Christian faith in terms of the truthfulness of Scripture. The Bible is primary source for Christians on information about Jesus and about all of those things Christians embrace as elements of their faith.

Explain why you are persuaded that the Bible is the truth?

I will then ask a broader question and that is: How do you know that anything is true?

I am asking you a a technical question in epistemology. How do you test claims of truth? Is there a certain kind of truth that you test through observation, experimentation, eyewitness, examination, and scientific evidence – or, what do you use?

On second thought, do you test the claims of truth through the test of rationality? Is it logically consistent, or does it smack with inconsistency?

If you use the Bible, how do you determine the content of Scripture to see if is coherent?

One of the most astonishing things, of course, is that the Bible has literally thousands of testable historical prophecies, cases and stories where almost countless events were foretold. Do you merely search among those literally thousands of stories until you find one that supports your belief and then declare: Ah Ha – Here is Truth.

I hold no doubt that you do this – Cherry pick the verses that you like in order to support an idea or point that you are trying to make, while ignoring other verses that you don’t like, or don’t agree with.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-17   21:33:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: Gatlin (#25)

Explain why you are persuaded that the Bible is the truth?

I will then ask a broader question and that is: How do you know that anything is true?

Well, I'll try to be brief...

First, there has to be some absolute truth in the universe somewhere. So we begin there.

1. Christ says He is the truth.

2. Then Christ says that the Word of God is truth.

3. Finally, He says His Spirit (Whom He calls the Spirit of Truth) will lead His people into All truth. ALL truth!

However when He, the Spirit of Truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth...John16:13

This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words...1cor2:13

Which naturally leads me to your second excellent question:

On second thought, do you test the claims of truth...

This really touches on the failure of the Church today. You can easily see this failure, and it derives from this very question you asked.

Test all things; hold fast what is good...1thes5:21

Test ALL things! All things! Prove everything.

The Church is very good at testing Scripture. And we Christians do test scripture. Just go to any good Bible school and teenagers will be there hammering away at any questionable text, any weakness (because that's what teens do best). And the prof had better be on his game or he'll be eaten alive.

However. However! The Church fails miserably at testing and proving everything else...day-to-day stuff. Stuff in the news. Stuff politicians say. Events that happen...on and on. This has been the sad case of the Church for the past 125 years minimum. Especially as soon as we got "rich", toward the end of the 19th century. This failure is why we have no salt and light to offer the world today, and are being "trampled underfoot by men".

To sum it up: we have an example of truth (Christ), Who guides us by His Word and His Spirit to (eventually) all truth. It's really part of a relationship we have with God, as we are told to know and love the truth.

I could go on, get long winded, but will spare you that for now.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-18   7:22:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: watchman, and Everybody (#26)

Well, I'll try to be brief...

I don’t care if your are brief or not – I want you to be factually correct.

Christ says He is the truth.

Let’s STOP right here before we go any further.

I need you to tell me how you know “Christ says that?”

Then we shall proceed …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   8:03:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: watchman, and Everyone (#26)

I will continue …

However when He, the Spirit of Truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth...John16:13

How did John know this to be Truthful?

And why is the Gospel of John the Bible’s most “enigmatic gospel?”

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   9:19:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: Gatlin (#27)

I need you to tell me how you know “Christ says that?”

His claim of being 'the truth' is recorded in the Bible.

So, in a broader sense you are inquiring "did Christ really say that"? and "can the Bible be trusted to be accurate and trustworthy, especially in regard to Who Christ claims to be"?

This is where systematic theology comes in handy. Systematic theology systematically lays out the proof needed to make an airtight case that would verify that Christ is Who He says He is, and that His Words were accurately recorded, for example, by multiple witnesses.

Even before His arrival, prophets (under the penalty of death) began to foretell of Immanuel (God with us). The prophets got very specific.

Then, while He was here, multitudes both friend and foe acknowledged what He said and did, including historians like Josephus.

And after He left, His Spirit fell upon humans to confirm the truth of His Words.

One translation says it this way:

And so we have the prophetic word made more sure, to which you do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts.

Now, on a personal level most people start to believe what Jesus said on a more visceral level. They are usually the ones weighted down by the cares of this life, wondering what this life is all about. Why am I here? Why am I dying? Why?

Systematic theology is not going to work for these folks. They are looking for something, some truth to believe in. All this to say, that they find ONE thing in the Bible they can accept as truth, that being: they are sinful. This is the one truth that every single person can acknowledge. And it's in the Bible. So they begin to have that connection with the Bible. They can trust the Bible on that, if nothing else. And then they begin to look at the other truths to see if they can agree on those as well.

So you can take your pick. You can trust that Jesus says He is the truth based on sound theology confirmed over thousands of years, or, you can find that one truth in Scripture that you cannot deny, and start from there.

This is how I know that Christ's claim of being the truth is in fact credible and trustworthy.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-18   9:32:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: watchman, and Everyone (#29)

I need you to tell me how you know “Christ says that?”

His claim of being 'the truth' is recorded in the Bible.

You say “his claim.”

A claim is defined as:

State or assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof.

Pay attention to the part that states:

… typically without providing evidence or proof.

Where is the “proof” – Where is the “Truth?”

Show me …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   9:42:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: watchman and Everyone (#29)

So, in a broader sense you are inquiring "did Christ really say that"? and "can the Bible be trusted to be accurate and trustworthy, especially in regard to Who Christ claims to be"?

Indeed I am …

This is where systematic theology comes in handy …

, “systematic theology …

… is any study that answers the question, ‘What does the whole Bible teach us today?’ about any given topic.”

So, who gets to decide if the study under systematic theology is the Truth?

And how can he/she/they be believed?

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   9:53:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: watchman and Everybody (#29)

One translation says it this way …

And of course there are translation mistakes in the Bible.

In the original Hebrew, the 10th Commandment prohibits taking, not coveting. The biblical Jubilee year is named for an animal’s horn and has nothing to do with jubilation. The pregnant woman in Isaiah 7:14 is never called a virgin. Psalm 23 opens with an image of God’s might and power, not shepherding. And the romantic Song of Solomon offers a surprisingly modern message.

But most people who read the Bible don’t know these things.

They definitely should because extensive translation gaffs conceal the Bible’s original meaning.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   10:23:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: watchman, and Everyone (#29)

So you can take your pick. You can trust that Jesus says He is the truth

You are not trusting “what Jesus said” – You are putting all your trust and faith in what “some said that Jesus said.”

The Bible spans centuries of history, contains a variety of literary styles and varied languages with translations of words that have different meanings in those different languages. So the Bible is really just what some people say.

Tge Bible is not a book that arrived in complete form at one point in history. Instead – the Bible was written over a period of some 1,500 years by a great number of authors. Although it is viewed as one book, it’s actually a collection of many books.

How do you know what so many different people said is the absolute Truth? After all, Isn't the Bible just a collection of stories and myths? Even if it contains some history, how can you trust it so completely? Despite feverish searching with Scripture in one hand and cutting-edge technology in the other, evidence backing the Bible remains elusive.

Beauty and biblical evidence both lie in the eye of the beholder, it seems. No evidence of the events described in the Book of Genesis has ever been found. No city walls have been found at Jericho, from the appropriate era, that could have been toppled by Joshua or otherwise. The stone palace uncovered at the foot of Temple Mount in Jerusalem could attest that King David had been there; or it might belong to another era entirely, depending who you ask.

But someone said it happened, and you believe it happened. You believe it happened ONLY because you want to believe it. Where is the Truth that it did happen? Show me …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   10:37:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: watchman, and Everyone (#29)

This is how I know that Christ's claim of being the truth is in fact credible and trustworthy.

No, you don’t know that. To know means to …

… be aware of through observation, inquiry, or information.

You have no personal observations on anything that happened in the Bible. You have made no inquiry to that great number of authors who wrote a book over a period of some 1500 years. And the only information have is hearsay – what someone said?

So, you don’t KNOW a damned thing. You only BELIVE what someone wrote – and you only believe it because you want to.

And that is okay – you have the right to hold that belief.

But don’t spread the bullshit that it is all veritable Truth.

For it isn’t …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   11:30:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: Gatlin (#34)

… be aware of through observation, inquiry, or information.

You just described theology...systematic theology.

You have no personal observations on anything that happened in the Bible.

Yes, I do. The Bible is "living and active". The Bible is alive through God's Spirit. The Bible interacts with a Christian in a personal and observable way.

You only BELIVE what someone wrote – and you only believe it because you want to.

The very same thing can be said about your belief in covid.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-18   12:23:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: watchman, and Everyone (#35)

… be aware of through observation, inquiry, or information.

You just described theology...systematic theology.

No, I just gave you a definition of knowledge and you are maliciously spinning that definition to incorrectly associate it with systematic theology.

According to some theologians in evangelical circles, systematic theology is used to refer to the topical collection and exploration of the content of the Bible, in which a different perspective is provided on the Bible's message than that garnered simply by reading the biblical narratives, poems, proverbs, and letters as a story of redemption or as a manual for how to live a godly life. The danger is a tendency to assign technical definitions to terms based on a few passages and then read that meaning everywhere the term is used in the Bible.

Pay particular close attention to the passage where it is said that in systematic theology – “a different perspective is provided on the Bible's message than that garnered simply by reading the Bible.”

Repeating: “A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIBVE.”

So carefully understand this is saying that with systematic theology, you are being told what to think and you are not allowed to form your own conclusions from simply reading the Bible.

In systematic theology, you are being indoctrinated – brain washed – with a “different perspective of what provided in the Bible's messages.” I am not making this shit up. Read the quote again – it is what “some theologians in evangelical circles” are saying.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   18:40:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: watchman, and Everyone (#35)

You have no personal observations on anything that happened in the Bible.

Yes, I do. The Bible is "living and active". The Bible is alive through God's Spirit. The Bible interacts with a Christian in a personal and observable way.

Reading the Bible in not having personal observations.

You are reading about the observations by others.

And you form “beliefs” from the observations by others.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   18:47:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: watchman, and Evertyone (#35)

You only BELIVE what someone wrote – and you only believe it because you want to.

The very same thing can be said about your belief in covid.

There can be no clearer tacit admission by you that:

You only BELIVE what someone wrote – and you only believe it because you want to.

Thank you for your honesty – At least on this one point.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   18:51:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: watchman, and Everyone (#38) (Edited)

What’s wrong with systematic theology?

Last weekend during a church service the leader talked about a training scheme which the church is running saying something along the lines of we study the Bible in more detail using Wayne Grudem’s Systematic Theology. Now, I might be awkward, but I’m far from convinced that studying a systematic theology is a good way to learn about the Bible. To be honest, I’m not sure it’s a good way to learn anything, apart from the cultural and theological presuppositions of the author.

The problem with systematic theologies, is that they are systematic. God’s revelation to us in the Bible is not systematic. It’s messy, it’s complicated, it tells the story of people who mess up, of God who gets involved in the life of his creation and redeems it. The Bible narrative is compelling; sometimes exciting, sometimes complicated but it is not systematic. God did not give us a system, he gave us a story.

Systematic theologians go through the story, drawing threads together to make into a system – but the story isn’t neat and tidy and some bits don’t fit into their systems. What’s more, the system they choose is determined by their own background. Now, you might take a weighty systematic theology book and read through and think that it contains everything that you might ever want to know about God and the Bible. But as a challenge, look up the section on the theology of ancestors. You probably won’t find one. Yet, the Bible has tons to say about ancestors, think about the chapter upon chapter of begatting in the Old Testament. If that isn’t teaching on ancestors, what is? A systematic theology written by an African or an Asian might well have pages and pages on ancestors – but it doesn’t fit the system here in the West. This becomes a problem when (as often happens) people start to mistake the system for the message of the Bible. Important things (like ancestors) are left out because they don’t fit the system and other things get systematised to death (try reading what Grudem has to say about the Trinity) and lose the relational aspect that breaths life into the Scriptures.

My suspicion is that western minds, conditioned by a philosophical tradition that goes back thousands of years, default naturally to putting things into systems. Linnaeus did a great job systematising the natural world and the periodic table of the elements is a thing of beauty, but I remain unconvinced that what works for natural sciences actually works for the God who created nature. .

Repeating: I’m not sure systematic thrology is a good way to learn anything, apart from the cultural and theological presuppositions of the author.

https://www.kouya.net/?p=714

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   19:03:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: watchman, and Everyone (#35)

You only BELIVE what someone wrote – and you only believe it because you want to.

The very same thing can be said about your belief in covid.

No, that is not true – Definitely not.

I never simply read something about COVID and believe it. I read something and then I go on a research mission to find out as much as I can that is against it and also for it. It is after I have carefully studied everything possible, I then form an opinion.

My learning process is a deliberate action with a purpose to extract information from various sources for processing and storage. I can tell you that learning is the cognitive process of acquiring knowledge. Learning is the continuing process of acquiring new knowledge or modifying existing knowledge.

When I read something, the first thing that pops in my mind is – Why. I then immediately seek all means to understand that.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-18   20:01:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: watchman, and Everyone (#29) (Edited)

Now, on a personal level most people start to believe what Jesus said on a more visceral level.

I believe there are SOME people who do this.

Have you seen studies where MOST people do this?

They are usually the ones weighted down by the cares of this life, wondering what this life is all about. Why am I here? Why am I dying? Why?

I can understand this does happen at times.

Systematic theology is not going to work for these folks.

They are looking for something, some truth to believe in.

Ah Ha …

In that statement, you have now publicly declared that:

Most folks looking to the Bible for truth to believe in will not find that truth in systematic theology.

That is exactly what you said.

And on this, we are in complete agreement …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   8:17:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: Gatlin (#41)

Ah Ha …

In that statement, you have now publicly declared that:

Most folks looking to the Bible for truth to believe in will not find that truth in systematic theology. That is exactly what you said.

And on this, we are in complete agreement …

Let me be clear regarding theology for the unbeliever who is hurting and seeking: a theology textbook is not going to be the first thing they find.

They will pick up a Bible and find a connection, or a Christian will tell them about the grace of God toward sinners. This will be the beginning of their salvation.

But, Gatlin, there are 1000's upon 1000's of people who come to know Christ through a college class on systematic theology. Most are young people who grew up in church hearing the gospel every Sunday. But when they get away to college, begin to think for themselves, that deep study of God finally reaches their mind and spirit.

Theology profs are greatly remembered by students for their dry, keen wit. They are the intellectual giants who keep the doctrinal positions of the church fresh in the minds of God's people.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-19   8:55:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: watchman, and Everyone (#42) (Edited)

Let me be clear regarding theology for the unbeliever who is hurting and seeking: a theology textbook is not going to be the first thing they find.

Let me be perfectly clear to someone who is trying to impose his views on others and say that of course a theology textbook is not going to be the first thing a person seeking the truth finds.

I would never have thought that to be the case.

They will pick up a Bible and find a connection, or a Christian will tell them about the grace of God toward sinners. This will be the beginning of their salvation.

Possibly …

But, Gatlin, there are 1000's upon 1000's of people who come to know Christ through a college class on systematic theology.

Show studies to support your claim. What you say is just bullshit in an attempt to support your position. If you Look – you will find those attending a college class on systematic theology are in Christian liberal arts colleges which offer broad-based studies in arts and humanities from a faith-based perspective and have already come to know Christ – So that is the reason they are there in the first place.

They do NOT …

… come to know Christ through a college class on systematic theology.

You make no sense whey you say:

Most are young people who grew up in church hearing the gospel every Sunday. But when they get away to college, begin to think for themselves, that deep study of God finally reaches their mind and spirit.

First of all – You need to definitely stop using the word “MOST” unless you can document the numbers. And so far, you never have been able to.

You are saying the young people who grew up in church hearing the gospel ever Sunday were not able to think for themselves until they get away to college.

I ask that you please let me know how you have factually determined this to be true.

What research have you done – or studies have your rear that supports your thesis?

I am calling you out again – watchman – you are just making up bullshit as you go along.

Theology profs are greatly remembered by students for their dry, keen wit. They are the intellectual giants who keep the doctrinal positions of the church fresh in the minds of God's people.

You don’t KNOW this. It is just something you made up and set in your mind to believe.

If this were true – then you would have supporting documentation.

You are on a mission to make everyone think like you do – You are being overbearing about it. Your problem has been around for a while.

As Mahatma Gandhi famously (and sadly) said:

I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.

Unfortunately, he’s not alone – Read:

In U.S., Decline of Christianity Continues at Rapid Pace.

In Pew Research Center telephone surveys conducted in 2018 and 2019, 65% of American adults describe themselves as Christians when asked about their religion, down 12 percentage points over the past decade.

Meanwhile, the religiously unaffiliated share of the population, consisting of people who describe their religious identity as atheist, agnostic or “nothing in particular,” now stands at 26%, up from 17% in 2009.

Your outlook and methodology is doing nothing to support Christianity..

Try something different …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   11:12:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: watchman, and Everyone (#43)

Theology profs are greatly remembered by students for their dry, keen wit.

That is a tragedy because theology profs should not be there to act as comedians and leave memorable impressive displays of their dry, keen wit – but be there to strictly prepare course materials and teaching classes that prepare students to THINK.

I have no data to prove it, but I have a strong belief that with the over 1.3 million professors in 7000 schools – you would probably never find a professor who teaches something he/she doesn’t believe. That is the problem I see today – the college professors teach students WHAT to believe and not give students a firm foundation on which to determine their oqn beliefs.

That – Dear Sir – is called INDOCTRINATIOLN – And I would look upon any theology professor in the same consideration.

I not only feel this way, there are others who feel the same way. Here is but one of those in a similar light:

Is what is taught in colleges/universities skewed (often implicitly) toward what people (incl. professors) just believe or what they want to believe?

The answer is an astoundingly big "YES” – Big Time, Big Time …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   13:51:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: Gatlin (#43)

If you Look – you will find those attending a college class on systematic theology are in Christian liberal arts colleges which offer broad-based studies in arts and humanities from a faith-based perspective and have already come to know Christ – So that is the reason they are there in the first place.

Shooting your mouth off about stuff you know nothing about...as usual.

Did you not know that there are one year Bible schools through out the u.s., and over seas? These schools teach the Bible only, and the overwhelming majority of the students are teenagers just out of high school. Parents send their kids to one year Bible schools to prepare them for college. Christian colleges will transfer credits from affiliated Bible schools. These Bible schools have very strict rules, some more than others.

Most of the teens really want to be there...but some of them, well, not so much. Parents will often force their teens to attend Bible school because the teen has issues with authority, etc.

These Bible schools function like boot camp, while exposing students to some of the greatest guest lecturers/theologians/Bible teachers of our day.

have already come to know Christ

It might come as a surprise to you but just because the parents are Christians, that doesn't mean that their kids will be. And, as the late Christian singer Keith Green once said, "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian anymore than going to McDonald's makes you a hamburger".

Bible schools convert many of those kids who were just faking it to please Mom and Dad. Happens all the time.

But go ahead and pontificate...about theology, Bible schools, whatever...your foolishness always puts a smile on my face.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-19   14:10:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: watchman, and Everyone (#45) (Edited)

Shooting your mouth off about stuff you know nothing about...as usual.

So you say, in hopeless despair – While you can say nothing to disprove qny of the points I have made.

Did you not know that there are one year Bible schools through out the u.s., and over seas? These schools teach the Bible only …

And their courses are based on faithful exposition of the Scriptures where they dig both wide and deep into God’s word to strike a balance between Old and New Testaments, and also cover practical topics about the Church and Christian life.

Now show me where they all have courses in systematic theology – since you feel it is such a an important subject and this is what we are currently discussing.

Can you?

The overwhelming majority of the students are teenagers just out of high school. Parents send their kids to one year Bible schools to prepare them for college. Christian colleges will transfer credits from affiliated Bible schools. These Bible schools have very strict rules, some more than others.

Most of the teens really want to be there...but some of them, well, not so much. Parents will often force their teens to attend Bible school because the teen has issues with authority, etc.

These Bible schools function like boot camp, while exposing students to some of the greatest guest lecturers/theologians/Bible teachers of our day.

This is a noble and admirable effort.

It might come as a surprise to you but just because the parents are Christians, that doesn't mean that their kids will be.< i>

No, that comes as NO surprise to me at all.

In fact, there is very little in life that ever surprises me.

And, as the late Christian singer Keith Green once said, "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than going to McDonald's makes you a hamburger".

Cute …

And to that, I will add that you may call yourself a “Christian” – But if you check your Bible, you will find that Jesus wasn’t a snob who judged people for their imperfections like you consistently do. Check on that …

Bible schools convert many of those kids who were just faking it to please Mom and Dad. Happens all the time.

Again – I say this is a noble and admirable effort.

But you still haven’t said what this has to do with systematic theology – the subject we are currently discussing.

But go ahead and pontificate...about theology, Bible schools, whatever ...

Oh, I will do that. And I don’t need to approval or permission to do so.

… your foolishness always puts a smile on my face.

No surprise about that – For I have no doubt that you then tilt your head downward and shift your gaze to the left while touching you face often.

An oft-quoted 1995 study found that a smile provoked by embarrassment is often accompanied by a downward tilt of the head and a shifting of the gaze to the left. If you're embarrassed, you'll probably touch your face more often, too. A 2009 study on embarrassed smiles did confirm the head movements.

Yep – I can definitely understand why you smile.

Keep on with your smiles of embarassment …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   15:20:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Gatlin (#46)

And their courses are based on faithful exposition of the Scriptures where they dig both wide and deep into God’s word to strike a balance between Old and New Testaments, and also cover practical topics about the Church and Christian life.

Well, now. Looks like I'm making some progress. Well said.

you will find that Jesus wasn’t a snob who judged people for their imperfections like you consistently do. Check on that …

Show me where I consistently do this.

But you still haven’t said what this has to do with systematic theology – the subject we are currently discussing.

We aren't really discussing systematic theology...it's mostly just you obsessing over it.

tilt your head downward and shift your gaze to the left while touching you face often.

I have no idea what this means.

Keep on with your smiles of embarassment …

I am embarrassed. But I am embarrassed for you. You're obviously a quick minded person, gifted with intellect. Except. Except, Gatlin Who-ever-you-are, you have failed to use your intellect for your own good, to contemplate the very nature of your existence and of your Creator. Rather, you use your mind and talents to post nonsense about Covid 19, as if you work for the fools in high places who delight in poking and prodding humanity with poisons, hoaxes, and other assorted evils. Seems beneath you.

With all your intellect, you turn away from God. I fear that this passage of Scripture applies to you...

For it is written: “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.” Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God, the world through its wisdom did not know Him

God has frustrated your intelligence...He's got you doing the bidding of fools. By your own intellect, you've chosen unwisely.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-19   17:30:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: watchman, and Everyone (#47)

And their courses are based on faithful exposition of the Scriptures where they dig both wide and deep into God’s word to strike a balance between Old and New Testaments, and also cover practical topics about the Church and Christian life.

Well, now. Looks like I'm making some progress. Well said.

How can you call that YOUR progress when all I am doing is showing you’re the content of their courses and that it contains no systematic theology course.

Read the part again where I asked you to:

Now show me where they all have courses in systematic theology – since you feel it is such a an important subject and this is what we are currently discussing.

Your self-flattery praise and exaggeration when wrongly thinking of your achievement is at the expense of your denial and the glossing over of your faults and failings.

But if you have a craving need for self-congratulation – Then revel in it and enjoy yourself in a lively and noisy way.

Make a joyful noise unto the Lord,
All ye, all ye lands.
Serve the Lord, the Lord with gladness:
Come before His presence with singing.…

The full lyrics and a video is here

you will find that Jesus wasn’t a snob who judged people for their imperfections like you consistently do. Check on that …

Show me where I consistently do this.

Easily done – Start here at the top and read all the way down to the bottom – On every page.

We aren't really discussing systematic theology...it's mostly just you obsessing over it.

And you were responding.

So – What in the Hell do you calssify as “DISCUSSING?”

tilt your head downward and shift your gaze to the left while touching you face often.

I have no idea what this means.

Which validates what you told me here when you said:

Not that I read all the tripe you post

If you want “an idea” of what something means – The start reading entire posts for comprehension.

Otherwise – Just keep on making an ass out of yourself through neglect.

Keep on with your smiles of embarassment …

I am embarrassed. But I am embarrassed for you.

Misplaced – Yet another waste in your life.

You're obviously a quick minded person, gifted with intellect.

I know – but thank you – others have told me the same thing any number of times.

Except. Except, Gatlin Who-ever-you-are, you have failed to use your intellect for your own good, to contemplate the very nature of your existence and of your Creator.

You asked me earlier in your post to show you where you consistently judged people for their imperfections.

I should have waited until I read down to this point in your post and I would not have needed to waste time furnishing you the link above.

You are doing it AGAIN …

Rather, you use your mind and talents to post nonsense about Covid 19 …

I do not consider a pandemic that has caused 164,000,000 cases of COVID- 19 with 3,400,000 deaths worldwide to be “nonsense.”

You may however in blissful ignorance continue to do so.

… as if you work for the fools in high places who delight in poking and prodding humanity with poisons, hoaxes, and other assorted evils.

Wrong perceptions are the cause of all afflictions.

You don’t need to live this way—angry at the world and frustrated with yourself.

Read this

Seems beneath you.

Reading and responding to your tripe is beneath me – But I somehow manage to do it anyway…

With all your intellect, you turn away from God. I fear that this passage of Scripture applies to you...

It is not strange that you use the word “fear – Since the phrase “fear not” is used at least 80 times in the Bible, most likely because He knows the enemy uses fear to decrease our hope and limit our victories.

Since it is written to “FEAR NOT” – I don’t fear and neither should you …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   19:02:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: watchman, and Everyone (#47) (Edited)

God has frustrated your intelligence...

God has given me the wonderful ability to correctly analyze information and He has blessed me with the wisdom to be in tune with and aware of my surroundings. My willpower, common sense, perception and intuition are all constantly at peak performance. I have been blessed throughout my entire life.

… you've chosen unwisely.

God's will for our lives has reason and purpose. It is through scripture, where we can find meaning and principles discerning God's will.

I believe it is He who will let me know if I have ever chosen unwisely – and definitely NOT you.

Butt out with your attempts to cajole me to accept your opinions and ideas as the only ones that are right …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   19:23:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: watchman, and Everyone (#49) (Edited)

THE TRUTH IS MARCHING ON -

And Ole Gatlin is right there in step with it ...

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   19:29:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: watchman (#50)

My Morning Inspirational …

I have an icon link in the first position on my desktop
and I click on it each morning to start the day.

It is such a beautiful rendition that I never tire of hearing it.

I will share this with you in hopes that you also enjoy it.

In His Name …

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   20:15:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: watchman, and Everyone (#51)

Judged someone lately?

Sadly, the answer is – Yes.

Judging someone is fundamentally incompatible with authentic Christian faith.

Jesus said Christians should be known for how deeply they love, not how deeply they judge. >[? Yet studies show that in the eyes of many non-Christians, Christians are known for how deeply they judge, not for how deeply they love.

The problem in many cases is not that unchurched people don’t know any Christians. The problem is that they do. And they don’t like Christians— for good reason.

In Jesus, grace and truth are perfectly fused.

Remove grace from the truth and you don’t actually have truth at all, but a cold, steely imitation. (This is the shadow side of conservatism.)

The opposite is also true, of course. Remove truth from grace and you don’t have grace, but a spineless imitation. (As you’ve already figured out, this is the shadow side of liberalism.)

Fusing grace and truth is an exceptionally difficult venture and is usually only successful when you spend significant amounts of time on your knees and when the source of your attempt is actually Christ himself.

But when you see grace and truth fused, it takes your breath away. Why did people travel for days on foot in extreme conditions to meet Jesus? Grace fused to truth is what our hearts most deeply long for.

But in the church today, the hard edge of truth has crushed many. And one of the most frequent expressions of loveless truth is found in judgment.

Judgmentalism is incompatible with at least 5 wonderful things. Keep judging, and you will miss all 5 of Christian virtues discussed here.

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   22:39:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: watchman, and Everyone (#52)

When you look up the definition of “judge” used as a verb – You will find that it means to:

Form an opinion or conclusion about.

When you said to me:

  • With all your intellect, you turn away from God.

  • God has frustrated your intelligence...He's got you doing the bidding of fools. By your own intellect, you've chosen unwisely.

  • Shooting your mouth off about stuff you know nothing about...as usual.

  • In the end, you will lose.

You most definitely have “formed an opinion or conclusion about” me.

Therefore, it cannot be denied that you have “passed judgment” on me.

That now begs the question: Is it OK for Christians to pass judgement?

Give that some thought.

The Bible verses below will help you give an answer to me:

Luke 6:37 - Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

James 4:11-12 - Brothers and sisters, do not slander one another. Anyone who speaks against a brother or sister or judges them speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it, but sitting in judgement on it. There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbour?

John 8:7 - When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, "Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her."

Romans 14:3 - The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them.

Romans 14:10 - You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat them with contempt? For we will all stand before God's judgement seat.

What is your answer to the question: Is it OK for Christians to pass judgement?

Gatlin  posted on  2021-05-19   22:50:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: Gatlin (#53)

the definition of “judge”

Am I judging you, or am I speaking the truth to you [Eph.4:15]

With all your intellect, you turn away from God.

God has frustrated your intelligence...He's got you doing the bidding of fools. By your own intellect, you've chosen unwisely.

I said this in reference to your stance on Covid, in particular, the vaccine. You stand with evil men who wish to force an experimental vaccine on dumb down sheeple. You stand with false preachers like Franklin Graham who use their influence to harm God's people with an untested substance that no one is allowed to question. I tell you the truth. God hates this in no uncertain terms.

Shooting your mouth off about stuff you know nothing about...as usual.

I said this in reference to your ignorant statements about the teaching of theology. Remember how you said theology is brainwashing and indoctrination? Yeah, you said that.

In the end, you will lose.

As you stand with those who wish to control and inject unknown substances into fearful and confused people, who are not allowed to buy and sell unless they bow to the World Health Organization, you are taking a stand with Lucifer, who will soon morph this into eternal damnation, the Mark of the Beast. Yeah, you stand with that, too. Lucifer is a loser, and if you stand with him you will lose.

So, am I judging you or am I speaking the truth to you?

Hint. The truth only feels like judgment because the truth is painful. That's why grace is so important...so we can face the painful truth. Grace is the balm that soothes the pain.

watchman  posted on  2021-05-19   23:43:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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