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The Establishments war on Donald Trump
See other The Establishments war on Donald Trump Articles

Title: Cunning Lawfare Maneuver – House Will Withhold Submission of Articles from Senate…
Source: Conservative Treehouse
URL Source: https://theconservativetreehouse.co ... icles-from-senate/#more-178937
Published: Dec 19, 2019
Author: sundance
Post Date: 2019-12-19 00:28:18 by nolu chan
Keywords: None
Views: 2526
Comments: 9

Cunning Lawfare Maneuver – House Will Withhold Submission of Articles from Senate…

Posted on December 18, 2019
by sundance

Seemingly overlooked by most, when the House voted on the ‘rules of impeachment’ they removed the traditional appointment of House Managers to a later date.

Normally the House Managers would be appointed at the same time as the impeachment vote; however, by withholding the appointment House Democrats are indicating they will not immediately send articles of impeachment to the senate but will rather hold the articles as support for pending court cases toward their judicial authority.

A cunning Lawfare ploy.

As interested observers will note the House never voted to authorize the full judicial impeachment process; instead they voted to approve an inquiry into whether an impeachment should take place. By not voting to authorize articles of impeachment the House never gained ‘judicial enforcement authority’. The absence of judicial authority is now working its way through the courts in various cases.

It appears the absence of appointing House impeachment managers; and the decision to withhold sending the articles of impeachment to the Senate; is now a specific design.

As the process appears to be unfolding, the Lawfare contracted lawyers representing the House: chief legal counsel Douglas Letter, Barry Berke, Norm Eisen and Daniel Goldman will now argue before the courts that all of the constitutionally contended material is required as evidence for a pending judicial proceeding, a trial in the Senate.

What the house crew have assembled is an interesting back-door attempt to position a valid claim for evidence against the accused without having first gained judicial authority for it. The Lawfare crew will argue to the lower courts, and to SCOTUS, the blocked evidentiary material is critical evidence in a soon-to-be-held Senate trial.

The material they have been seeking is: (1) Mueller grand jury material; (2) a deposition by former White House counsel Don McGahn; and less importantly (3) Trump financial and tax records. Each of these issues is currently being argued in appellate courts (6e and McGahn) and the supreme court (financials/taxes).

The House impeachment of President Trump succeeds in applying the label “impeached president” that was their primary political purpose. President Trump is marred with the label of an ‘impeached president’.

Now the delay in sending the articles of impeachment allows the House lawyers to gather additional evidence while the impeachment case sits in limbo.

The House essentially blocks any/all impeachment activity in the Senate by denying the transfer of the articles from the House to the Senate. Additionally, the House will now impede any other Senate legislative action because the House will hold the Senate captive. Meanwhile the Democrat presidential candidates can run against an impeached President.

Lawfare’s legal svengali Lawrence Tribe recently penned an op-ed with this type of recommendation; and it appears the community that worships Tribe, including the House lawyers writ large, are following his advice.

While Politico outlines the plan from a position if the scheme as a new idea, the fact the House impeachment rules were changed to drop the appointment of the managers speaks to considerable forethought on this type of plan.

[snip]

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#1. To: All (#0)

On first thought, I have doubts about the efficacy of this plan.

The first problem is that there is no pending trial in the Senate, and there will be no pending trial in the Senate, unless and until the House sends the impeachment to the Senate.

Black’s Law Dctionary, 6th Ed.

Pending. Begun, but not yet completed; during; before the conclusion of; prior to the completion of; unsettled; undetermined; in process of settlement or adjustment. Awaiting an occurrence or conclusion of action, period of continuance or indeterminacy. Thus, an action or suit is “pending” from its inception until the rendition of final judgment.

An action is “pending” after it is commenced by either filing a complaint with the court or by the service of a summons. Johnson v. McCaughan, Carter & Scharrer, Colo.App., 672 P.2d 221, 222.

The Senate has sole authority over impeachment trials. They have no authority over the process at this time as there is no trial pending. The “complaint” has not been filed with the “court.”

The Report has been written and the vote has been taken. To say this post-vote process would be irregular is an understatement. They either seek to change the record after the vote, and present the changed Record, or require the Senate to hear or receive depositions of witnesses not in the record. While the House has sole (but not unlimited) power of impeachment, they have no authority whatever over an impeachment trial. From the time it is turned over to the Senate, the Senate alone has the power.

Another problem is that this signals in a bright, bold way, that the case was not ready for presentation to the Senate when the vote was taken.

nolu chan  posted on  2019-12-19   0:29:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: nolu chan (#1)

yep.

And it places all of the eggs in the basket of the judiciary. if the Supreme Court rules for the President on the different evidentiary prongs, there will a judicial answer that forecloses each of those prongs and leaves less and less for the Senate to decide on.

and if the election comes without the impeachment having been referred, and a new election occurs, if the GOP wins the House, they can reverse the impeachment and never send the articles over. if they lose, they can go to court and assert that a suspended legislative action died with the Old Congress and has to be either renewed by the new or dropped.

The Courts have been historically reluctant to become involved in political matters, but the Democratic house may have reached a level of standardless and unprprincipled interference with the presidency that a Federal judiciary stacked with the presidents appointees may need to decide to become involved in a political matter, to the thunderous applause of the people and the other 1 1/2 branches of government.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-12-19   7:40:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Vicomte13 (#2)

and a new election occurs, if the GOP wins the House, they can reverse the impeachment and never send the articles over

Well, there's that period from the election to the swearing in that the Democrats could use to forward the articles.

misterwhite  posted on  2019-12-19   9:33:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Vicomte13 (#2)

This ain't "cunning" imo...this is a genuinely desperate tactic, if the RATZ are ballsy enough to employ it.

"Devolve Power Outta the Federal Leviathan and Back to the States,
Localities, and Individuals as Prescribed in the US Constitution."

Mudboy Slim  posted on  2019-12-19   11:10:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Vicomte13 (#2)

I have seen suggestions elsewhere that the Senate cold just proceed with a trial and acquit. The Rules of the Senate on Impeachment Trials seems to make that impossible.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/12/18/pollak-senate-can-acquit-even-if-house-doesnt-transmit-articles-of-impeachment-constitution/

Pollak: Senate Can Acquit Even If House Withholds Articles of Impeachment

Joel B. Pollak
18 Dec 2019

Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) appears to be considering an idea Democrats have floated for several days of holding back the articles of impeachment to exercise leverage over the Senate and the president.

She declined formally to transmit the articles to the Senate on Wednesday evening after the House voted to impeach President Donald Trump.

Unfortunately for them, the Senate can act, regardless — and would vote to acquit.

That’s because the Constitution is absolutely clear about the Senate’s authority. Article I, Section 3 says: “The Senate shall have the sole Power to try all Impeachments.”

That is all.

[...]

That does not appear to be "all", as claimed. While the Senate has the sole power to try impeachments, that power does not appear to exist until the House managers are appointed and directed to carry the Articles to the Senate.

I fail to see where Nancy gains any leverage. All Mitch has to do is say take your time with your urgent resolutions, see you next year, and adjourn for the holidays. After the holidays, the GOP can pummel Nancy for sitting on the Resolutions which were so urgent they could not wait for the courts.

Nancy will have a hard time explaining this to the people. Imagine presidential candidates trying to explain this. It looks like political suicide.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CDOC-99sdoc33/pdf/CDOC-99sdoc33.pdf

99th Cogress
2d Session

Document 99-33

Procedure and Guidelines for Impeachment Trials i the United States Senate (Revised Edition)

Prepared Pursuant to Senate Resolution 439, 99th Congress, 2d Session

Submitted by Senator Robert C. Byrd and Senator Robert Dole

By Floyd M. Riddick, Parliamentarian of the United States Senate

Robert B. Dove, Parliametarian of the United States Senate

August 15, 1986

[excerpt]

II. RULES OF PROCEDURE AND PRACTICE IN THE
SENATE WHEN SITTING ON IMPEACHMENT TRIALS

I. Whensoever the Senate shall receive notice from the House of Representatives that managers are appointed on their part to conduct an impeachment against any person and are directed to carry articles of impeachment to the Senate, the Secretary of the Senate shall immediately inform the House of Representatives that the Senate is ready to receive the managers for the purpose of exhibiting such articles of impeachment, agreeably to such notice.

II. When the managers of an impeachment shall be introduced at the bar of the Senate and shall signify that they are ready to exhibit articles of impeachment against any person, the Presiding Officer of the Senate shall direct the Sergeant at Arms to make proclamation, who shall, after making proclamation, repeat the following words, viz: “All persons are commanded to keep silence, on pain of imprisonment, while the House of Representatives is exhibiting to the Senate of the United States articles of impeachment against ______ ______” ; after which the articles shall be exhibited, and then the Presiding Officer of the Senate shall inform the managers that the Senate will take proper order on the subject of the impeachment, of which due notice shall be given to the House of Representatives.

III. Upon such articles being presented to the Senate, the Senate shall, at 1 o’clock after noon of the day (Sunday excepted) following such presentation, or sooner if ordered by the Senate, proceed to the consideration of such articles and shall continue in session from day to day (Sundays excepted) after the trial shall commence (unless otherwise ordered by the Senate) until final judgment shall be rendered, and so much longer as may, in its judgment, be needful. Before proceeding to the consideration of the articles of impeachment, the Presiding Officer shall administer the oath hereinafter provided to the Members of the Senate then present and to the other Members of the Senate as they shall appear, whose duty it shall be to take the same.

[...]

nolu chan  posted on  2019-12-19   13:24:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: nolu chan (#5)

Here's the thing. Pelosi is relying on the CURRENT Senate rules. But the Senate can simply change its own rules. And if driven by white hot partisanship, it can do that fast, too.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-12-20   10:10:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Vicomte13 (#6)

Pelosi is relying on the CURRENT Senate rules. But the Senate can simply change its own rules.

Absolutely correct.

The Senate can add insult by adopting a rule that an impeachment is not considered to have been completed until House Managers present Articles of Impeachment to the Senate in proper form. The Senate will not take notice of any impeachment prior to the entire impeachment process having been completed.

By such rule, if the Articles are not presented, President Trump could maintain that he has not been impeached as the process was not completed. Compare to the batter who knocks it out of the park and fails to run and touch all the bases.

Also, the Senate could give Nancy a deadline by adopting a rule that following a vote of the required majority in the House for impeachment, any such articles not formally presented to the Senate by House Managers within fourteen (14) days of said vote, an entry of acquittal shall be made upon the record in the Senate, with a notation of non-prosecution as the reason therefor.

In the impeachment of Andrew Johnson, the Senate acquitted on Article 11, then acquitted on Article 2 and 3, and then adjourned sine die, and abandoned Article 1, and Articles 4 thru 10, with no further vote.

There is much idle talk of SCOTUS this or that, but I think they will be very reluctant to get involved and simply decline cert for a political matter.

nolu chan  posted on  2019-12-20   19:29:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: nolu chan (#7)

I agree to the denied cert if it's the Senate that acts. If the House tries some additional post- impeachment moves, the Supremes might grant cert if those moves would be prejudicial in some sense.

i expect McConnell will play this one like a symphony, for maximum effectiveness.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-12-20   22:49:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Vicomte13 (#8)

If the House tries some additional post- impeachment moves, the Supremes might grant cert if those moves would be prejudicial in some sense.

If impeachment is complete, and Trump stands impeached, then notification to the Senate should be a ministerial action.

If impeachment is not complete until the notification is made, everyone can stop saying Trump has been impeached.

It is an interesting question of exactly when the House power over impeachment ends, but it would seem to end when the act of impeachment is complete.

If the Speaker holds the authority to impeach and delay notification indefinitely, it would seem that on legislation, if enough Democrats crossed over to pass a law she did not like, she could delay indefinitely forwarding it to the President, effectively holding a pocket veto.

Perhaps we have entered the Twilight Zone and are experiencing an alternate reality. A radical element, not representative of the majority, has control of the Democratic Party and appears to take their cues from Animal House:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_h4DZeBleLs

nolu chan  posted on  2019-12-21   1:08:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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