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Bang / Guns
See other Bang / Guns Articles

Title: The Gun in Atatiana Jefferson’s Hand Will Be Far from Irrelevant
Source: Dallas Observer
URL Source: https://www.dallasobserver.com/news ... he-cop-who-killed-her-11781823
Published: Oct 20, 2019
Author: Jim Schutze
Post Date: 2019-10-20 08:45:35 by nolu chan
Keywords: atatiana, jefferson
Views: 1101
Comments: 119

The Gun in Atatiana Jefferson’s Hand Will Be Far from Irrelevant

Jim Schutze
Dalas Observer
October 17, 2019 | 4:00am

The mayor of Fort Worth says there is no relevance or importance in the fact that Atatiana Jefferson, killed by a Fort Worth police officer Saturday, had a gun. The mayor is wrong.

According to the murder warrant for the former police officer who killed her, Jefferson, 28, pointed her gun toward the window at the police officer moments before the cop shot her. I am not arguing that the cop was within the law. That will be a very complicated question for courts to resolve. But I know this much right now: The gun is everything.

Read the murder warrant for former Fort Worth Police Officer Aaron Dean, as it talks about an interview of Jefferson’s 8-year-old nephew by a police investigator:

“(The nephew, name redacted) told (the investigator) that he and Jefferson were playing video games in the back bedroom. Jefferson told (the nephew) that she heard noises coming from outside, and she took her handgun from her purse. (The nephew) said Jefferson raised her handgun, pointed it toward the window. Then Jefferson was shot and fell to the ground.”

Sure, Jefferson had every right to keep a gun in her house. We do not know yet if she had legal authority to carry a concealed weapon. But this has nothing to do with gun rights anyway. This is about guns.

Her gun is what got her killed. Does that mean the cop was within his rights in shooting her? No, not necessarily. I’m not talking about rights. Rights are abstract. Atatiana Jefferson is dead. Death is not abstract.

Guns have their own cruel logic, no matter who holds them. If I want to survive a gunfight, I need to be one jump, preferably two jumps ahead of the other guy when it happens. Or I’m dead. It’s all about who gets the jump.

It’s not about who has a right to have a gun. It’s about who shoots first. In and of themselves, guns don’t make anybody safe. All a gun does is take you to a gunfight.

Once you’re there, you’re there. You’re in a gunfight. It’s not a conversation. Firing a gun is a process. The gun is not a button to be pushed. It has to be unholstered or removed from a purse or place of safekeeping.

The gun may have to be manipulated to place a cartridge in the chamber ready for firing. A safety mechanism designed to make it impossible to shoot the gun may have to be switched off. Then the gun is aimed. Then the trigger is pulled.

This will be read, I am sure, as a boot-licking, cop-loving defense of Dean for shooting Jefferson. This will also be read as racist, because Dean is a white cop and Jefferson was African American. But I’m really the last person to offer expertise on either of those questions in this case.

As we learned from the Amber Guyger/Botham Jean tragedy, in which a white Dallas police officer shot and killed a black man in his own apartment, the law can be complex and arcane in these matters. The Fort Worth shooting will be even more complicated than Guyger, because the cop in Fort Worth will have a better argument for self-defense.

This also will be a tougher prosecution because the Fort Worth cop resigned from the force before he could be questioned and before an internal affairs investigation could be launched. We should expect to see more of that.

The Guyger/Jean case reminded me that, quite apart from nominal liberalism and conservatism, white people and black people in this country still view social reality through very different lenses based on very different experiences. I believe that, whatever kind of terrible mistake Guyger’s shooting of Jean may have been, it is possible for it not to have been racial.

I don’t think I know a single black person who agrees with me. The ungodly procession of internet videos in the last few years showing white cops shooting unarmed black citizens rips away the curtain, my black friends say, on what really dwells in the white heart.

What is there, they say, is a superstitious tribal fear of the other. That inner fear is what makes white cops shoot black people quicker than they shoot white people, and the unmistakable pattern is the undeniable proof. For that reason, black people must live in fear that every transaction with a white cop may suddenly explode and cost them their lives.

That may all be true, every word of it, but none of it changes the reality of guns. I own guns. Always have. Grew up with a .22 rifle. Never hunted, just because my dad didn’t. I like hunters. They love the forest.

I worked on ranches and farms as a young man, carried some kind of rifle in the jeep or pickup for varmints. Never shot a varmint. I like varmints.

Shot clay pigeons with shotguns with my son when he was a kid. Keep a few guns in the house for protection. So I understand why people keep guns in their homes. I do it.

But I know this. If a cop comes to my house and I meet him with a gun in my hand, I stand a really good chance of getting shot dead. I don’t want to get killed, so, if I see a cop coming, I’m going to put down my gun and probably put both of my hands on my head.

For Atatiana Jefferson, it wasn’t that simple. She didn’t have that option. It doesn’t look as if either person, Jefferson or Dean, had enough time to perceive who and what the other was. She didn’t have time to see that he was a cop. He didn’t have time to see that she was in her own house.

All of that goes to the dismal algorithm of guns. Things will go wrong. A welfare check gets dispatched wrongly as an “open building.” To the cop, that means break-in, which means bad guy inside, probably armed.

Does the cop announce himself at the door? Of course not. Why would the cop do that? If the bad guy is in there with a gun, the cop who announces himself at the door is just giving the bad guy time to get two jumps ahead of the cop in the process of shooting. The cop, by practice and by instinct, always wants to be at least two jumps ahead. The cop always wants the advantage. It’s not a sport.

Should cops go around fearing that every bad guy they encounter has a gun? Of course they should. Because we have flooded our society with guns.

According to The Washington Post, the United States crossed a line of demarcation in 2008. In that year, the number of guns in the country exceeded the population.

In 1996, there were fewer than 250 million civilian firearms in the United States. By 2017, the number of guns was approaching 400 million.

According to the BBC, America is by far the most gun-owning country in the world, with two and three times more guns per resident than the runner-up countries of Yemen, Serbia and Montenegro. If those other three look like lawless, violent places to you, and if civilian gun ownership is any indicator, then we must be the most lawless, violent society in the world.

Doesn’t feel that way to you? Perhaps you think of this country as a relatively peaceful and secure place. That probably depends a lot on where and who you are.

In 2016, the University of Washington’s Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation published a study of global disease, injury and risk factors. It found that six nations accounted for half of the world’s total gun deaths that year not related to war or terrorism. The United States was second after Brazil. Mexico was third.

The same study put us much lower on the ladder for gun deaths per capita. We were No. 20 on that list. So that could mean our gun deaths are evenly distributed everywhere, from Minnesota farm country to the nation’s major cities, or our gun deaths are concentrated in places that must be among the most violent and dangerous in the world. I think we know the answer.

When cops go into our cities looking for bad guys, they go looking for bad guys with guns. While that may make police training all the more important, it also pushes training to a certain human limit.

Former Dallas police Chief David Brown, one of the most respected police officials in the country and a lifelong cop himself, told me he believes escalation of force and diversity awareness training are indispensable elements in any effective, responsible police academy curriculum. But he also told me something else.

He said he knows that the minute a freshly minted rookie from the academy climbs into a patrol car with a veteran trainer, that trainer tells him to forget everything he was taught in the academy. Brown told me the trainer will tell the rookie that the academy training will get the rookie killed, which may be OK with the trainer, but it will also get the trainer killed, which is not OK with the trainer.

What does that mean? I think you and I can answer that for ourselves by putting ourselves in the position. We are approaching an open house where we have reason to believe there may be an armed intruder (because in this country intruders must be presumed to be armed).

Do we announce ourselves to the intruder? No. We already have our guns in our hands. The safeties are off. The rounds are chambered.

What happens when we suddenly see the muzzle of a gun looking back at us?

That moment is not about rights. It’s not about training. It’s about guns and basic survival instinct. It’s about staying alive in a world of guns. There’s only one way to change that. Make it a different world.

Jim Schutze has been the city columnist for the Dallas Observer since 1998. He has been a recipient of the Association of Alternative Newsweeklies’ national award for best commentary and Lincoln University’s national Unity Award for writing on civil rights and racial issues. In 2011 he was admitted to the Texas Institute of Letters.

https://www.scribd.com/document/431151697/Aaron-Dean-Arrest-Warrant-ico-Atatiana-Jefferson

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 83.

#12. To: nolu chan, Vicomte13 (#0)

Should cops go around fearing that every bad guy they encounter has a gun? Of course they should. Because we have flooded our society with guns.

According to The Washington Post, the United States crossed a line of demarcation in 2008. In that year, the number of guns in the country exceeded the population.

This guy is a gungrabber. He's flying the gungrabber flag pretty openly despite his little attempt to portray himself as a lifelong pro-gun person.

I notice in the detective's report that the busybody neighbors called the cops because, despite the two vehicles being in the driveway, the front door and side door was open but the glass screen doors were closed.

And that is enough for cops to assume they should shoot first and ask questions later?

Send this badged idiot to prison for at least 5-10 years.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-21   0:44:51 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Tooconservative (#12)

I notice in the detective's report that the busybody neighbors called the cops because, despite the two vehicles being in the driveway, the front door and side door was open but the glass screen doors were closed.

And that is enough for cops to assume they should shoot first and ask questions later?

No. But that recitation left out the gun. You "forgot" the gun.

nolu chan  posted on  2019-10-21   12:39:16 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: nolu chan (#17)

No. But that recitation left out the gun. You "forgot" the gun.

It is entirely legal to have a gun in your own home.

If you are prowling around unannounced in someone's back yard in the middle of the night, then you are the one who should get shot, not the peaceful and law-abiding homeowner who is frightened by you trespassing on their property.

Unlike you, I'm not looking for some excuse to why this daft cop decided to blow away a homeowner for no reason at all. I only wish that she would have shot first.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-21   13:32:58 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: Tooconservative (#19)

No. But that recitation left out the gun. You "forgot" the gun.

It is entirely legal to have a gun in your own home.

And if you are in your car approaching an intersection with the right of way, it is entirely legal for you to proceed, even if a tractor-trailer truck is approaching and not slowing down. Your estate can sue for damages and give you a first class send off.

It is perfectly legal for you to open carry in public where it is permitted. You may even open carry in stores that permit it. Put the gun in your hand and you have a problem. The 8-year old nephew related that, "Jefferson raised her gun and aimed it at the window." The cop outside observed her gun aimed at him.

Your point that it was lawful for her to have a gun in her home is valid but irrelevant. If she was not going to shoot the other person with her gun, brandishing her weapon only served to get her dead.

The lawfulness of her weapon possession is irrelevant to the question of whether the officer's use of his weapon was criminal. Her pointing her gun out the window is relevant to the defense.

If you are prowling around unannounced in someone's back yard in the middle of the night, then you are the one who should get shot, not the peaceful and law-abiding homeowner who is frightened by you trespassing on their property.

ALL of the responding officers acted pursuant to an open structure call. They participated in an attempt to determine, from the outside, what was happening on the inside. Pursuant to protocol, they treated it as a potentially life-threatening situation.

None of the officers was trespassing.

Unlike you, I'm not looking for some excuse to why this daft cop decided to blow away a homeowner for no reason at all.

You are starting to sound like Matt Agorist. You again "forgot" the lady pointed her gun at the cop and did not respond to verbal command. Shame on you.

nolu chan  posted on  2019-10-21   23:12:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: nolu chan (#33)

And if you are in your car approaching an intersection with the right of way, it is entirely legal for you to proceed, even if a tractor-trailer truck is approaching and not slowing down. Your estate can sue for damages and give you a first class send off.

You're being dishonest, deliberately.

You know perfectly well that there is a huge difference under the law between publicly owned commons like a roadway and a private home under traditional castle doctrine.

If the woman was pointing the gun at a cop in public, he might arguable be justified in shooting her.

He instead skulked about unannounced outside her home, despite having two open doors where he could have knocked and announced his presence and resolved the situation. He instead prowled about outside the home when no one had even reported a prowler (but only open inner doors late at night). He alarmed the home's lawful resident, causing her to fear for her life and the safety of her nephew. When she picked up a gun to lawfully defend herself in her home from the alarming sight of an unannounced prowler in her backyard, he screamed something and shot her multiple times in only a few seconds.

That tape is going to bury him. And you're going to choke on it. Good.

The lawfulness of her weapon possession is irrelevant to the question of whether the officer's use of his weapon was criminal. Her pointing her gun out the window is relevant to the defense.

He chose to prowl unannounced on her property and, after he frightened her into picking up her gun, he shot her and killed her in front of her 8yo nephew, a scarring memory.

ALL of the responding officers acted pursuant to an open structure call. They participated in an attempt to determine, from the outside, what was happening on the inside. Pursuant to protocol, they treated it as a potentially life-threatening situation.

But they did not shoot the homeowner. Only one cop did that. Don't try to whitewash the criminal by equating the actions of those cops who properly did not blast a homeowner with this fool of a cop who just blasted away after he had frightened the homeowner so badly that she picked up a gun to defend her nephew and herself from a prowler inside her backyard in the middle of the night.

None of the officers was trespassing.

They were all trespassing and any jury is going to figure that out quickly, regardless of statutory language. The cops were not even responding to an emergency call summoning medical help or to stop a suspected crime in progress. They had a report of an open structure and walked directly past the the open front doors which were covered by closed screen doors. They made no attempt to enter or to announce themselves. If, as has been suggested, they believed a criminal was inside and they went into the backyard (where no alarm had been raised) then it is obvious that they intended to shoot someone through a window. And that is exactly what happened. They shot the homeowner through the window. So they show up, choose to prowl around in the dead of night unannounced and enter a dark backyard instead of just knocking on the door, scare the homeowner into grabbing her gun and then one of them kills the homeowner.

There was a dangerous criminal on the premises. It was the cop. And he's going to be convicted. I hope they execute him for it.

You again "forgot" the lady pointed her gun at the cop and did not respond to verbal command.

You are under no obligation whatsoever to obey commands screamed at you from outside your house in the middle of the night. The homeowner had no way of knowing who was screaming at her from the dark. The cop did not even try to identify himself as police because he had already started shooting. The laws that might otherwise shield a cop do not apply if the cop has not announced his presence and therefore his lawful authority to issue an order to disarm. Nor did he attempt to take cover or to determine the identity of his murder victim, the lawful dweller of the premises. He just yelled something and shot multiple times a second later. The timing of his yell and the gunfire following only a second later meant that almost no one could have responded to his command anyway since he was pulling his gun to shoot her as he yelled at her. The jury will rightly conclude that he had already decided to shoot her, no matter who she was, the moment he saw a gun. Or maybe the moment he saw a black person. She had no opportunity to see his police uniform in that dark backyard, nor to see his badge, nor did he claim to be police, nor did he announce his (entirely unrequested) presence on her property despite having multiple opportunities to do so just by knocking on the door.

Shame on you.

You're a complete disgrace and an embarrassment to LF.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-22   1:14:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: Tooconservative (#35)

You're being dishonest, deliberately.

You are being an idiot, deliberately. But at least you have torn the mask off being Too Conservative.

If the woman was pointing the gun at a cop in public, he might arguable be justified in shooting her.

Nah, he should just stand there until he is shot dead. /s

You know perfectly well that there is a huge difference under the law between publicly owned commons like a roadway and a private home under traditional castle doctrine.

The Castle Doctrine is irrelevant to the case. It is not about whether she acted lawfully. It is about whether the cop acted lawfully.

He instead skulked about unannounced outside her home, despite having two open doors where he could have knocked and announced his presence and resolved the situation.

The call to the responding officers was officially recorded as a burglary call. It is not protocol to knock on the door and call out, "Yoohoo, Mr. Burglar, are you in there?" That is a good way to get dead.

He instead skulked about unannounced outside her home, despite having two open doors where he could have knocked and announced his presence and resolved the situation. He instead prowled about outside the home when no one had even reported a prowler (but only open inner doors late at night). He alarmed the home's lawful resident, causing her to fear for her life and the safety of her nephew. When she picked up a gun to lawfully defend herself in her home from the alarming sight of an unannounced prowler in her backyard, he screamed something and shot her multiple times in only a few seconds.

That tape is going to bury him. And you're going to choke on it. Good.

You have a vivid imagination, and the writing skills of Matt Agorist. Your meandering mush is indistinguishable from the yellow journalism of The Free Thought Project.

He chose to prowl unannounced on her property and, after he frightened her into picking up her gun, he shot her and killed her in front of her 8yo nephew, a scarring memory.

He was in uniform, investigating a possible burglary in progress. He was not a prowler. When investigating a potential burglary in progress, cops do not announce their presence upon arrival.

ALL of the responding officers acted pursuant to an open structure call. They participated in an attempt to determine, from the outside, what was happening on the inside. Pursuant to protocol, they treated it as a potentially life-threatening situation.

But they did not shoot the homeowner. Only one cop did that. Don't try to whitewash the criminal by equating the actions of those cops who properly did not blast a homeowner with this fool of a cop who just blasted away after he had frightened the homeowner so badly that she picked up a gun to defend her nephew and herself from a prowler inside her backyard in the middle of the night.

ALL of the cops followed the protocol for responding to a report of a potential burglary. NONE followed the protocol for a welfare check. The documentation of the call, at the time of the call, reflect it to be a burglary.

Only ONE cop was right outside the window where Jefferson appeared with her gun. Only ONE cop observed the gun. Only ONE cop fired. He fired ONE shot.

None of the officers was trespassing.

They were all trespassing and any jury is going to figure that out quickly, regardless of statutory language.

Obviously, no prosecutor will argue that the cops were trespassing. They would find themselves sanctioned and before the state bar, and probably cause a mistrial.

The cops were not even responding to an emergency call summoning medical help or to stop a suspected crime in progress.

They responding to a suspected burglary as documented at the time. Had it been an emergency medical call, it may have gone to the FIRE DEPARTMENT, not the Police Department.

They had a report of an open structure and walked directly past the the open front doors which were covered by closed screen doors. They made no attempt to enter or to announce themselves.

They had a report of a suspected burglary, as documented. It was later classified as Open Structure in the arrest report.

In responded to a suspected burglary, it is not protocol to announce police presence upon arrival to see what shoots back.

If, as has been suggested, they believed a criminal was inside and they went into the backyard (where no alarm had been raised) then it is obvious that they intended to shoot someone through a window.

No Matt, they did not know whether a criminal was inside or not. That is what they were trying to determine.

It is not obvious that they intended to shoot anyone. When confronted by Jefferson at a window, gun in hand aimed out the window, at a cop in full uniform, and after he called out for her to show her hands, to raise her hands, the cop responded to the perceived threat and shot.

And that is exactly what happened. They shot the homeowner through the window.

No Matt. There is no they. There is a he. Officer Aaron Dean, the guy with the gun aimed at him; he shot.

So they show up, choose to prowl around in the dead of night unannounced and enter a dark backyard instead of just knocking on the door

No Matt. NOBODY prowled, or chose to prowl. No prosecutor will dare to make such a mischaracterization and find himself before the state licensing board.

The cops ALL followed protocol for responding to a burglary call.

There was a dangerous criminal on the premises. It was the cop. And he's going to be convicted. I hope they execute him for it.

No Matt. Jefferson acted lawfully, just not too intelligently. The cop is presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

You are under no obligation whatsoever to obey commands screamed at you from outside your house in the middle of the night.

It is a lifestyle choice. She pulled out her gun, aimed it out the window in the direction of a fully uniformed cop, did not respond to verbal commands, and she is dead. She was in lawful possession of a gun. She is no longer in possession of a gun. She's dead.

The homeowner had no way of knowing who was screaming at her from the dark.

Don't go to a window and aim your gun at the unknown. That is a way to get oneself dead.

The cop did not even try to identify himself as police because he had already started shooting.

No Matt. He was in full uniform. He called twice for her to raise or show her hands. The entire confrontation took 3 or 4 seconds. She confronted the officer with deadly force.

No Matt. The officer had not already started shooting. The shooting involved one shot. The shooting started and ended in the smallest fraction of a second.

The laws that might otherwise shield a cop do not apply if the cop has not announced his presence and therefore his lawful authority to issue an order to disarm.

No Matt. You just made that up. It is complete and total bullshit. He had a gun pointed at him. Yet again, you "forget" about the gun.

Recall Officer Jeronimo Yanez and Philando Castile. The defense was that Officer Yanez "feared for his life." Acquitted of second-degree manslaughter and two counts of intentional discharge of a firearm that endangers safety

Nor did he attempt to take cover or to determine the identity of his murder victim, the lawful dweller of the premises.

He was not Scott Israel.

Yet again, you "forget" about the gun. There was a certain urgency. There was a deadly threat not only to Officer Dean, but to all the officers who could have been shot.

He just yelled something and shot multiple times a second later.

No Matt. A SINGLE SHOT was fired. He did not yell something. The exact audible words have been quoted. Matt, you are starting to sound like Ilhan Omar. The cop yelled something. She confronted him by aiming her gun out the window. He fired about 3 or 4 seconds after becoming aware, and after issuing two verbal commands to show her hands, to raise her hands.

he was pulling his gun to shoot her as he yelled at her.

Where did you find that information, Matt?

The jury will rightly conclude that he had already decided to shoot her, no matter who she was, the moment he saw a gun.

Such is directly contradicted by the 3- or 4-second delay to give verbal commands.

Or maybe the moment he saw a black person. She had no opportunity to see his police uniform in that dark backyard, nor to see his badge, nor did he claim to be police, nor did he announce his (entirely unrequested) presence on her property despite having multiple opportunities to do so just by knocking on the door.

No Matt. Maybe he saw a gun pointed out the window at him. Yet again, you "forget" about the gun she had pointed out the window in the direction of Officer Dean.

Matt, Matt, Matt. It is not burglary protocol for the police to announce their presence to a potential armed intruder. NONE of the police announced their presence or knocked on the door. Officer Dean had been on the force less than two years. The senior people there did not announce their presence or knock on the door. They responded to a report of burglary. ALL of them followed the protocol for the report given to them.

nolu chan  posted on  2019-10-22   15:44:30 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: nolu chan, Deckard, misterwhite (#60) (Edited)

ALL of the cops followed the protocol for responding to a report of a potential burglary. NONE followed the protocol for a welfare check. The documentation of the call, at the time of the call, reflect it to be a burglary.

Only ONE cop was right outside the window where Jefferson appeared with her gun. Only ONE cop observed the gun. Only ONE cop fired. He fired ONE shot.

I thought you kept bleating it was an "open structure" call.

It was reported to police on a non-emergency tip line as a welfare check. Someone at HQ in the 911 dispatcher's office dispatched the call and may or may not have used the phrase "open structure".

Not a burglary which is an allegation of a property crime, possibly by an armed criminal.

You're a liar. Police have stated repeatedly that it was an open structure call, not a burglary. They have stated this publicly and they have put it in writing.

In the PD's own video, it is clearly labeled as an open structure call. Since you seem to know so few facts about the case, I'll post the video again. Look at the beginning of the video starting at 00:00:06 and lasting for 13 seconds. Even you can read that fast.

As for your ridiculous time estimate of the verbal warning and the shot, I downloaded the video to check it closely playing at slow speed.

The killer cop shouted "Put your hands up, show me your hands".

He began to open his mouth to yell at 00:01:34:28 (28 thirtieths of a second after the 1 minute 34 second point in the video).
He started to yell the 'P' in "Put" at 00:01:35:00, .0666 seconds after he started to open his mouth.
His voiced trailed off after yelling "hands", going quiet at 00:01:36:06
The initial sound of the gunshot began at 00:01:36:11 when the sound spiked and distorted sharply.

From the beginning of the 'P' in "Put" (00:01:34:28) to the beginning of the gunshot sound (00:01:36:11) is 1 and 13/30ths seconds. Or 1.43333 seconds. And I am actually being generous in that measurement by a few thirthieths of a second.

The cop also, FWIW, started to vocalize before his brain decided what to say and he subvocalized something else, perhaps a grunt, that he didn't finish just as he shot the bullet that killed his victim. Not exactly calm and collected.

They responding to a suspected burglary as documented at the time.
They had a report of a suspected burglary, as documented.
The cops ALL followed protocol for responding to a burglary call.

They did not. Only the first two officers were present. The other two were just arriving when the shot was fired that killed that poor woman.

All I know is the official police evidence that has been shown. Not initial wild reports in the press. You can keep trying to lie and try to call it a "burglary" (based on a few wild initial reports immediately after the murder) but every official document we have seen labels it an "open structure" call.

Let me just remind you that police are not free to blast away at anyone, even a burglar, just because they're received a burglary call. It is their responsibility to determine if a crime is in progress. And it is their responsibility not to shoot anyone if it can be avoided. In particular, not to shoot a lawful resident who was defending her 8yo nephew from people who had opened a gate to enter her backyard.

BTW, opening a closed gate contributes to trespassing culpability under Texas statutes.

He was not Scott Israel.

You keep repeating this as though it means something. Scott Israel was the sheriff in the Parkland episode, not the school security guard. Not that it matters in this case in the slightest. Your grasp of facts and reality are slipping badly.

Such is directly contradicted by the 3- or 4-second delay to give verbal commands.

As I have documented using FCPX, a pro-level video editor, the time from the beginning of his yell to the beginning of the sound of his shot was no more than 1.43333 seconds. Not 3-4 seconds. And the local papers have consistently reported this as "little more than a second" and very similar phrases. You're just making up that 3-4 seconds because you're in such a copsucking tizzy. No fair examination of the video footage could render anything more than 1.5 second from the first sound he emits to the beginning of the sound of his gunfire (at which point the bullet would have already hit her).

It is not burglary protocol for the police to announce their presence to a potential armed intruder. NONE of the police announced their presence or knocked on the door. Officer Dean had been on the force less than two years. The senior people there did not announce their presence or knock on the door. They responded to a report of burglary.

You're obviously confused. Only two officers were present for the shooting: the killer cop and the second cop who was seen in the video, a female named Darch. She arrived first, him about a minute later as I understand it. She had an extra minute to size up the situation without becoming alarmed in any way. This is in the police report that she filed. The other officers did not arrive until minutes later when it was already understood that it was an unlawful killing and the officers arriving rendered first aid but were unable to save the victim's life.

The police chief has already made an official statement that the killer cop was in violation of PD policy and protocol in his conduct on the call. His violation of PD policy led directly to the victim's murder. The chief said this very clearly.

Interim Police Chief Ed Kraus released the officer’s name on Monday afternoon. He said Dean resigned from his position in the police department on Monday morning, ahead of Kraus’ meeting to fire him.

If Kraus had the opportunity to fire Dean, he said it would have been for multiple violations, including violating the department’s use-of-force procedures, unprofessional conduct and violating the de-escalation policy.

. . .

Dean was a commissioned as a licensed officer in April 2018 after completing the Fort Worth Police Academy on March 8, 2018, according to a report from the Texas Commission on Law Enforcement.

. . .

Kraus said the other officer who was with Dean at the time of the shooting is being treated as a witness.

The other officer was Carol Darch who passed her police trainee eligibility test on 3/7/2018 with a rank of 65 out of 100 applicants. Yet she did not take lead in the backyard. Because she was following PD policy and not murdering the black voters. She had one more year of experience over the killer cop. And she is being considered a witness for the prosecution, not the defense. She will testify against him.

The whole thing started with a call from a neighbor who lives in a house that does not exist. Is that your story, and are you sticking with it? The initial information called into police was complete crap?

I'm saying that the locations of the brother/sister are not what the public has been led to believe by press reports. Another issue is where they parked the two cop cars "around the corner".

As for your endless bleating of "burglary", I don't hear it in the audio that has been released. This was apparently the audio from the 3rd or 4th cops just arriving at the house. No one said "burglary" or "open structure". The cop being dispatched responded seconds later with "shots fired, shots fired", meaning he was close enough to hear the shot but was not yet on-scene.

Listen for yourself. Where does anyone tell this cop that it is a burglary or an open structure?

I have not yet found any dispatch call to Darch or to the killer cop yet.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-22   19:52:48 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: Tooconservative (#72)

On Thursday, the 17th, the narrative surrounding the initial call to police was changed from that of a “wellness check,” to one of a “potential burglary.” Once again, anyone who has examined cases as such recognizes that this is often done in officer-involved shootings.

Officer Who Shot Atatiana Jefferson Wasn't Asked to Do Wellness Check Despite Neighbor's Request

Deckard  posted on  2019-10-22   20:03:07 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#83. To: Deckard (#75)

Officer Who Shot Atatiana Jefferson Wasn't Asked to Do Wellness Check Despite Neighbor's Request

Correct. He was called to an "open structure". Is that his fault?

misterwhite  posted on  2019-10-23   10:24:39 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 83.

#88. To: misterwhite, Deckard (#83)

Correct. He was called to an "open structure". Is that his fault?

The call was classified later as an "open structure" call. There is no indication that those words were ever used to Dean or Larch. They certainly were not used to the third (and likely fourth) cops who were arriving just in time to radio back "shots fired".

Listen to that recording again. Tell me at what points you think you hear any of these words: "wellness check", "burglary", "open structure".

I don't think you can. All I hear is a general description that cumulatively adds up to a wellness check.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-23 15:42:40 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 83.

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