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Title: If A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words, Then What Do These Memes Say? (Parts VIII & I)
Source: The Potters Clay
URL Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pa6ulv9aQno
Published: Oct 10, 2018
Author: The Potters Clay
Post Date: 2019-10-07 12:02:10 by Liberator
Keywords: Truth, Memes, Hmmm
Views: 53038
Comments: 340

A little Meme action...
If you haven't seen them, checkout the rest!

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part I
https://youtu.be/ptar5YtS_Sk

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth A Thousand Words - Part II
https://youtu.be/FchgUVA4SxE

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part III
https://youtu.be/Kth6X1g7bWk

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part IV
https://youtu.be/eVk3DIwf66c

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part V
https://youtu.be/qJAsGkP99rg

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part VI
https://youtu.be/z2a6g-nfQRU

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part VII
https://youtu.be/9Xsh2LJ1SvY

A Flat Earth Picture is Worth a Thousand Words - Part IX
https://youtu.be/X-D54GbpPjQ


Poster Comment:

Get bored easily? No time to watch long videos? MEMES TO THE RESCUE! Short & Sweet.

These are found at a Christian You Tube called, 'The Potters Clay'...

These are REALLY good. Fun stuff. I promise. Spectacular AND clever. It doesn't matter what your core belief is; you will come upon several memes that will stop you dead in your tracks and challenge you.

(STRONG SUGGESTION: To adjust and slow these memes down, go to your YouTube 'Settings', then adjust 'Playback Speed to .75. It will give you more time to contemplate the meme, since they move along pretty fast.)

When you have the time, please give them all a look; I consider them a crash-course in Earth-Science Truth, Logic, and Reason.

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#33. To: A K A Stone (#31)

A cruise to the end of the earth by the great ice wall that keeps the wildings out and keeps the sharks from falling off the edge of the earth is taking reservations.

I hate to admit it but I would love to go on this cruise, just to document all the kookeries.

Reminds me a bit of the old Freeper cruises. They organized a couple of them. They had a group back then called Clown Posse that existed mostly just to ridicule the freeper antics. And they never had such a bonanza as the photos and posts about the freeper cruises, especially the second and third freeper cruises. BobJ and Diotima in very unsexy and too-revealing photos. The Clowns actually had people at various ports of call for the cruise, taking photos of the sad-ass freepers. And at least one Clown was undercover, actually on the cruise ship with the freepers. It was wildly funny stuff, really mean-spirited.

I have regretted over the years that I didn't keep an archive of the antifreeper Clown Posse stuff. It seems that RimJob threatened them with lawsuits and they folded up and disappeared entirely.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-13   12:17:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Liberator, Pinguinite, A K A Stone (#24)

Curious geometry:

The nearest airport to Sydney is Kingsford Smith Airport (SYD) and the nearest airport to Santiago is Arturo Merino Benitez Airport (SCL).

Your flat earth map says Sydney to Santiago is 25,400km (15,782 nautical miles or 18149 statutory miles).

According to round earth maps, the distance is 11,340km (6,250 nautical miles or 7053 statutory miles).

According to this page, Quantas and LAN Airlines both declare the flight time is 12.5 hours duration. You can find other sites that go as high as 14 hours but the general range is established.

Typical estimates for modern intercontinental airlines is 500mph with some a little faster or slower. The regularly scheduled non-stop Qantas flights are QF27 and QF28 (eastbound and westbound) and these are daily flights advertised as 12.5 hours flight time. You can verify flight prices and times and duration and live flight status of Qantas QF27 and QF28 flights by referring to these flight route numbers in any search engine.

The 747-400, the most common variant in service, has a high-subsonic cruise speed of Mach 0.85–0.855 (up to 570 mph or 920 km/h) with an intercontinental range of 7,260 nautical miles (8,350 statute miles or 13,450 km).[16]

So a trip from Santiago to Sydney on Flat Earth Airlines (15,782 miles) would normally require the airliner to fly for 31.5 hours @ 500mph, in keeping with your Flat estimate . For Flat Earth Airlines plane to make that trip in just 12.5 hours, it would have to fly almost 1300mph.

However, if you fly on Round Earth Airlines between those two cities - a distance of 6,250 miles - it will take you . . . exactly 12.5 hours. Just as the airlines have advertised for years.

Keep in mind that airlines advertise 14 hours but they include at least a half-hour at both departure and arrival for airport delays, boarding, etc. The flight time is always less than what the airlines advertise. Also, some of these sites confuse nautical miles for statute miles so keep that in mind when you make calculations and make sure you know which number the airline is using. Airlines also have extra prep time for very long flights over the oceans and crew layover times that can affect the advertised flight time.

Expedia: Santiago to Sydney non-stop flights

Well, I'm kinda meandering here a bit.

Let me just point out something: there can be no non-stop flights whatsoever between Sydney and Santiago using Boeing/Airbus airliners. They would fall into the ocean with empty fuel tanks if they tried to make a 25,400km flight.

Aerospace-Technology.com: The top 10 longest range airliners in the world

Boeing and Airbus take pride in manufacturing some of the world's longest range airliners. The Boeing 777-200LR - with a massive range of 17,395km - tops the list, followed by the Airbus A340-500 with a range of 16,670km.
So are 300-400 people per day just dying when their airliners crash into the sea and no one ever mentions it or NASA is somehow deceiving us all? Are you stating that these non-stop flights do actually fly over the United States at any time, day or night, and none of the passengers ever notice all those brightly-lit cities along the way or that huge continental land mass? There are 300-400 people flying these non-stop flights, generally on a daily basis and none of them ever notice they were flying over South America and North America on their way between Chile and Australia? Or is NASA just deceiving us all by getting Qantas to advertise these flights but they never actually take the passengers on those flights after they book them and pay for them?

I could go on at length but I really don't want to contribute to making the world a stupider place.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-13   14:26:55 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: Liberator (#34)

The question of proof to the skeptic fascinates me, whatever the subject.

So, let me ask you something. If I put you in the cockpit of a long-range airc aircraft. Say, flying due north from New York. So you could look out the fron front window the whole time and see the instruments, and gave you detailed flig flight map so you could follow along the route with your finger. Every few hour hours we would land to let you rest/sleep, etc., so that you always knew where you you w you you were in fixed reference to the ground. Then we took back off and continued the the the the route, flying over the north pole, then across through Russia, and down the othe oth othe other side of the world, map in hand, stopping to sleep. Then up again, over the th the the South Pole, and back up this side of the world to New York, would you then beli b beli believe that the world was round?

What about if we went up further, into space, and you watched the world turn be below you, would you believe it then?

What would it take to convince you to believe that the world really is round?

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-14   8:59:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: Vicomte13 (#35)

What would it take to convince you to believe that the world really is round?

I always wonder if kooks would abandon their multiple kook theories if you thoroughly disproved their major kook theory.

I think they wouldn't. Being a CT nutjob or full-blown multi-kook is a mental habit and deep-set personality characteristic.

If you disprove one kookery, they'll just find another one. But then, I've never been able to put it to the test thoroughly. Which is what you are proposing.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-14   11:46:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: Tooconservative (#36)

I don't care about the "kook" label. I've heard many epithets hurled at me be because of things that I know that I cannot prove to others because I have no me means to do so.

I am fascinated by adamant deniers - of God, for example - or, in this case, of the the spheroidal nature o the the spheroidal nature of the Earth.

It does not make me angry, in the slightest degree, that people are Flat Ea Earthers. I just wonder what it would take to demonstrate to them that the Ea Earth is, in fact, a spheroid.

I'm pretty sure that no amount of book waving for finger-wagging would do it, just a just as no amo just a just as no amount of that has ever been able to convince me of a single thing concer concerning Go concer concerning God and his existence. I required independent, empirical evidence of the of the sort of the of the sort that I would accept. Nobody provided me that, or tried, but God did. did. So I did. did. So I know there's God, because I know God.

Since that time, others have vehemently wagged fingers and books at me telling me t me that I me t me that I DON'T know God, that I am delusional, etc., but I just laugh inside at t at them a at t at them and feel a little bit sorry for them, for reasons I needn't further elab elaborate.

I've thought about it. I think the world is round because I don't see any pa particular reason to question it. I've sailed the world around, northern and so southern hemispheres, seen that the stars are different down under, seen what lo looks to me like a curved earth, watched ships rise out of the sea on one ho horizon and sink into the sea on the other. That this is because the earth is cu cur cu curved makes sense to me. The notion that there is a giant conspiracy...about AN AN AN ANYTHING...always sounds nutty to me, and makes me wonder why the person ch chooses to reject things that they reject.

Still, it doesn't BOTHER me that people think the earth is flat. Heresy doesn't provoke any ire in me.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-14   16:13:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Tooconservative (#34)

Let me just point out something: there can be no non-stop flights whatsoever between Sydney and Santiago using Boeing/Airbus airliners. They would fall into the ocean with empty fuel tanks if they tried to make a 25,400km flight.

That's a good point. I didn't even think of that. There's only one plane that has ever been built capable of a non-stop flight of that distance, and it was the Rutan's "Voyager" aircraft specifically built for the task. 2 crew, 2 prop engines, one of which was switched off a couple days into the flight. It purported ly flew 28,000 miles and took 9 days to do it back in 1986.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-15   4:57:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Vicomte13 (#37)

just a just as no amo just a just as no amount of that has ever been able to convince me of a single thing concer concerning Go concer concerning God and his existence.

I presume this stuttering issue has never appeared for you during preview of your post, only after final posting?

I've never seen this happen to any of my posts. However, there is some preprocessing of comments before they are written to the DB.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-15   5:00:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Pinguinite (#39)

It happens on one compjuter - the other one - that I use during the day.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-15   6:56:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Vicomte13, Pinguinite (#37)

that I DON'T know God

This sounds eerily familiar...like something I might have said. Do you laugh inside and feel sorry for me?

I've sailed the world around, northern and so southern hemispheres, seen that the stars are different down under, seen what lo looks to me like a curved earth, watched ships rise out of the sea on one ho horizon and sink into the sea on the other.

Now I feel a sorry for myself...that I didn't get to have a cool experience like this! Were you Navy, Vic, or did you have your own boat?

BTW, do you really know God? (I hope so. That is the very reason for our existence)

If you know God, tell Ping about Him, because I'm pretty sure Ping doesn't know Him...

watchman  posted on  2019-10-15   7:25:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: watchman (#41)

Yes, I spend six full years at sea. North Atlantic, North and South Pacific, Indian, Mediterranean, the China seas, Persian Gulf, Caribbean, 6 of the 7 continents and islands near and far. Joined the Navy, saw the world, saw the girls, saw the stars, and saw lots and lots of the sea.

Yes, I've talked to God a few times, had my life saved by him and a couple of other miracles. Telling people about God doesn't do much in my experience - it annoys the one's who reject the idea of God, and it annoys those who believe in God because I come from a different angle.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-15   8:30:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: Vicomte13 (#42)

Yes, I spend six full years at sea.

What type of ship were you on?

Telling people about God doesn't do much in my experience...I come from a different angle

What about the Great Commission? Aren't you a Christian?

watchman  posted on  2019-10-15   8:55:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: Pinguinite, TooConservative, all (#38)

<<"Let me just point out something: there can be no non-stop flights whatsoever between Sydney and Santiago using Boeing/Airbus airliners. They would fall into the ocean with empty fuel tanks if they tried to make a 25,400km flight.">>

That's a good point. I didn't even think of that. There's only one plane that has ever been built capable of a non-stop flight of that distance, and it was the Rutan's "Voyager" aircraft specifically built for the task. 2 crew, 2 prop engines, one of which was switched off a couple days into the flight. It purported ly flew 28,000 miles and took 9 days to do it back in 1986.

Ergo, a large reason for the maps I'd post AND point: FLIGHT CONNECTIONS.

(Btw Ping -- I can't endorse or validate the maps or actual placement of places EITHER land masses of the two maps on this realm called "earth.")

I''m saying...

The purported mileage on that trans-Pacific airline is just one the main issue. The primary point and observation made here is the odd connection that is seemingly WAY out of the way on that Flight (which makes perfect sense on a Flat Earth Map.)

Here is yet another DOCUMENTED case; Bali-to-LAX Flight makes an emergency-stop...IN ANCHORAGE, Alaska. WHY?? (For the SAME reason IF our real is indeed a Flat-Plan.)

At about 2:45 is a Map and route that evokes the ver same "Hmmmm...."

CHECK IT OUT:

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-15   11:39:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: Vicomte13 (#35)

The question of proof to the skeptic fascinates me, whatever the subject.

As well it should.

So, let me ask you something. If I put you in the cockpit of a long-range airc aircraft. Say, flying due north from New York. So you could look out the fron front window the whole time and see the instruments, and gave you detailed flig flight map so you could follow along the route with your finger....flying over the north pole, then across through Russia...Then up again, over the th the the South Pole, and back up this side of the world to New York, would you then beli b beli believe that the world was round?

All of the above air route IS possible. EXCEPT flying "over the South Pole." ALL non-military travel and flights are official restricted beyond the purported 60 South latitude, and obviously OVER Antarctica and the supposed South Pole.

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-15   11:45:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: Vicomte13, TooConservative, designated Gatekeeper (#37)

I don't care about the "kook" label.

That's because you refused to herded into the pen with the other sheep. ("Kook" is a simple, LAME gaslighting technique designed to ostracize the weak and ignorant.)

I am fascinated by adamant deniers - of God, for example - or, in this case, of the the spheroidal nature to the the spheroidal nature of the Earth.

It does not make me angry, in the slightest degree, that people are Flat Earthers. I just wonder what it would take to demonstrate to them that the Earth is, in fact, a spheroid.

You've got the equation wrong, Vic.

Tell me -- what is the "Proof" that our realm is indeed "spheroid" or a "globe"? For you is it the primary source...NASA??

I've thought about it. I think the world is round because I don't see any pa particular reason to question it. I've sailed the world around, northern and so southern hemispheres, seen that the stars are different down under, seen what looks to me like a curved earth, watched ships rise out of the sea on one ho horizon. That this is because the earth is curved makes sense to me.

Thanks for your honesty.

If you're interested in valid explanations of the phenomena of horizons and curvature (due to limitations of our vision and perspective/vanishing point), they are readily available if you have a telescoping lens. What seemingly "disappears" over the "7-mile" horizon happens to re-capture ships and objects over twice that distance and often much further.

The notion that there is a giant conspiracy...about ANYTHING...always sounds nutty to me, and makes me wonder why the person ch chooses to reject things that they reject.

Q: Do you reject OR accept the ongoing conspiracy to oust Trump from office in a coup by 0bama holdovers and "Deep State" players?

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-15   12:00:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: A K A Stone (#28)

Waste of time.

You will just say CGI, fake, nasa is making it up etc.

Sounds as if you are saying it's NASA on whom you would base your "evidence."

Stone, come on. I haven't lied. I haven't mis-led you or anyone. I've simply documented many cases lies, mis-direction, and own words by NASA itself.

If you've watch even a snippet of countless evidences for/of NASA trickery, their credibility is shot. Why is it my fault that videos that further detail and document countless bad CGI, harnesses, photoshop, etc are available that expose and bogus science, "astronomy," and especially NASA? I'm just the bearer of the news and truth.

And again, simply, just how do you or anyone seriously believe NASA officials when they claim 1960s NASA technology to the Moon was "lost"?

Sincere question: On what authority or source(s) or documentation do you base the belief on a "Globe" of "Ball" realm? Remember -- I also recently believed the whole "Earth-is-Round" narrative (but didn't believe the Moon Landing/Mars/Solar System Space Travel thing.)

Btw, YES, Scripture is completely at odds with the deGrasse-Tyson wing of "The Cosmos" and "Creation." One OR the other is true. Can't be both, brutha.

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-15   13:09:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: Liberator (#44)

In the video you provided, the both plots of the airline course done by the narrator are done on "flat earth maps", believe it or not. The standard rectangular earth map depicts earth in flat 2-D form, just as the polar radial map does, but neither are accurate for purposes of plotting actual airline paths. If you want to see what the shortest course is between Bali and LAX, you must plot the course on an actual 3-D globe, not the standard 2D map of the earth. No one, not even flat earthers (with the exception of the video narrator, it seems), maintains that the 2-D rectangular map is the same as a spherical representation.

If you plot the path on a globe:

www.google.com/maps/place...34.0522342!4d-118.2436849

...you'll see that the straightest path from Bali to LAX would take a plane to farther north in latitude than the Canadian border with the US mid-west states such that Alaska is not so far out of the way. In that respect, for the purposes of plotting airplane courses, the radial map of earth can sometimes be more accurate than the rectangular map. To illustrate a case of when it's far more accurate, plot a shortest course from Chicago to Moscow on both maps. Do that and you'll see the polar radial map is far more representative of a spherical earth path in plotting the airline course than the standard rectangular map which would see the plane going over Europe.

The standard 2-D map does not depict the earth as a sphere. and cannot be used for the video narrator's argument. He must use a globe but doesn't do so either because he has an agenda and wants to deceive people or he's got a low spacial perception IQ.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-15   13:35:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: Liberator (#46)

TC already blew your satanic flat earth lies to smithereens. You can keep serving satan and spreading lies. Or use your brain for a change. The bible doesn't teach a flat earth.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-10-15   14:18:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: Pinguinite (#48)

If you plot the path on a globe:

www.google.com/maps/place...34.0522342!4d-118.2436849

...you'll see that the straightest path from Bali to LAX would take a plane to farther north in latitude than the Canadian border with the US mid-west states such that Alaska is not so far out of the way.

In that respect, for the purposes of plotting airplane courses, the radial map of earth can sometimes be more accurate than the rectangular map.

Dunno what you're looking at, but that Google Map did not help your case. From Bali in the South pacific, LAX/California is by far the more direct and closer destination over that of Anchorage, AK. Thus any detour from Bali to Alaska (or north of LA, including the Canadian border) is waaay out of the way. That's whether it's Google Maps, the Globe Earth Map and it's various representations on a flat piece of paper, or looking at a "Globe." Even the stated mileage reflects a longer distance.

The ONLY way this flight makes sense is as demonstrated -- On a Plane Earth. On a Plane Earth, as we can clearly see, Anchorage also provide a reasonable straight-flight stop-over and eventual connection onward toward LAX.

So what else can we conclude?

Either the stated mileage from Bali to LAX is erroneous.

OR...

The actual shape and stated geography of our Realm is erroneously stated.

The standard 2-D map does not depict the earth as a sphere. and cannot be used for the video narrator's argument. He must use a globe but doesn't do so either because he has an agenda and wants to deceive people or he's got a low spacial perception IQ.

Do *you* actually "see curvature" as you fly? At the ocean horizon? Or is it a 'Mandela Effect' and part of the life-long power of suggestion? I don't see it. And neither do countless other people.

As a reminder, flat earths maps are used by just about everywhere, by everyone. Including pilots who properly perceive PLANE/FLAT earth, use flat earth in their training simulations and fly based on IT. (Do you presume pilots are trained to maintain dipping the aircraft nose to account for "the curvature" of earth??)

Azimuthal Equidistant and Mercator projection seem to be the most popular of the maps, but then again ALL maps seem to present problems:

https://www.axismaps.com/guide/general/map-projections/

One can only look at that stop-over (and similar others) and scratch our head. I don't understand why one cannot just conclude, "I don't really know why or how that is" at worst. There's no shame in questioning the logic in convoluted plane routes and stop-overs that seem to be out of the way -- especially from the Southern Hemisphere.

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-15   14:46:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: A K A Stone (#49)

TC already blew your satanic flat earth lies to smithereens

On what planet? Imported Inverted Truth are still Lies. And still the true satanic agenda. (Moreover, many have recognized and observed TC's ongoing Gate-Keeper agenda. HELLO.)

Strange indeed.

You refuse to examine countless evidences I've provided yet fall on your knees unquestionably believing TC's misinfo, disinfo, spinmeistering of so-called "evidence AND sources of "truth"? That is un-freakin' believable. Believe what you want; BUT EXAMINE IT FIRST.

Stone, what do you gain by ignoring the submitted REAL evidence? Why at the same time suspend ALL logic, reason, and your own eyes? This is just...sad.

At the least -- and based on the volume of evidence I've provided to consider -- at the bare minimum the true intellectually honest person would say, "Yes, there is quite a bit I've been told is truth that must now question."

Luke, 8:17

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-15   15:00:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: Liberator (#51)

You've provided horse shit for the brain.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-10-15   15:52:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: Liberator (#44) (Edited)

Okay, fine Did some more digging, checking this guys facts. I'm a bit bored today.

#1) He claims the flight was from Bali to LAX. It wasn't. It was from Taiwan. I found 2 youtubes on the subject. Both were news reports, one in english, and the other in a foreign language. The english one stated and illustrated the flight being from Taiwan. The non-english one didn't show a map but the vid was titled as saying it was from Bali. The woman was from Taiwan. I searched and found a site saying no non-stop flights from Bali to LAX exist. I searched Kayak which gave flight opportunities only with 1 or more stops, no direct flights.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/travel_news/article-3270382/Caught-camera-amazing-moment-woman-gives-birth-premature-baby-girl-30-000ft-Taiwan-Los-Angeles-flight-crew-passengers-helping-out.html

#2) Your guy on your video claims it is a significantly farther distance from Bali to Anchorage than from Bali to LAX. He lied, at least as far as kooky spherical earthers are concerned. The spherical distances are 12693 km (Anchorage) vs 13149 km (LAX), so Anchorage is closer to Bali than LAX. But to be fair, he didn't state the km distance, he gave flight durations for the two trips as 23 hours and 45 minutes (Anchorage) and 19 hours & 30 minutes (LAX). But again, there are no direct flights that do either of these fictitious legs. Where did he get the flight time then? Seems little doubt the times were taken from trip duration estimates that included layovers somewhere and he was too conveniently lazy to notice the times included layovers. I guess stating travel times just fit in to this guys agenda to mislead people works better than providing actual distances.

So, this guy created this vid spewing a load of crap on two different major points of fact. And you bought it, hook, line and sinker. Apparently I have done more research on the topic than either you or the guy on the video, but that didn't stop him from making the video spouting fake information, did it? The Bible warns against listening to false teachings, but you didn't check this guy's message out before you promoted it here.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-15   20:20:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: Vicomte13 (#37)

It does not make me angry, in the slightest degree, that people are Flat Earthers. I just wonder what it would take to demonstrate to them that the Earth is, in fact, a spheroid.

I would not say it makes me angry either. I've repeatedly said we are all challenged with certain deficiencies. The only thing that does irritate me in this and similar cases is when someone who doesn't understand something purports to do so while completely walling off what I consider basic logic. I guess it's when the time and effort I expend to debate and, what I would consider "enlighten" simply goes absolutely nowhere. That is when it becomes frustrating.

I'm sure what I've just said is just as applicable to the my opposition as it is me on whatever subject. Many Christians say there is not enough faith in the world. I say the opposite. There's too much faith in the world. Faith in things that are simply not true. Our capacity to believe things is grossly underestimated and unappreciated.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-16   0:39:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: Liberator, Pinguinite, A K A Stone, Vicomte13 (#44)

The purported mileage on that trans-Pacific airline is just one the main issue. The primary point and observation made here is the odd connection that is seemingly WAY out of the way on that Flight (which makes perfect sense on a Flat Earth Map.)

Here is yet another DOCUMENTED case; Bali-to-LAX Flight makes an emergency-stop...IN ANCHORAGE, Alaska. WHY?? (For the SAME reason IF our real is indeed a Flat-Plan.)

A direct flight on Round Earth Airlines is possible for this route, using the two long-range airliners I mentioned above.

Aerospace-Technology.com: The top 10 longest range airliners in the world

Boeing and Airbus take pride in manufacturing some of the world's longest range airliners. The Boeing 777-200LR - with a massive range of 17,395km - tops the list, followed by the Airbus A340-500 with a range of 16,670km.

Using the superior Boeing to fly Bali to LAX nonstop would be 8616 miles. So, if there was demand for it and they could keep the flights packed full, there could be such nonstop flights. The Boeing, with a range of 9392 miles, would fly from Bali to LAX nonstop and still be able to fly another 776 miles before crashing into the sea with empty tanks. Well, if they didn't drift off-course or encounter a major storm or the jet stream pushing them around and eating up their fuel. Airlines like to have at least a few hours worth of fuel in the event of a major airport problem at the destination. So it is doable, just barely. But the airlines wouldn't like arriving over such an oceanic distance with empty tanks. Too risky.

As for this particular Bali-LAX flight, it was not nonstop. It had a 2 hour layover point in Taipei, Taiwan. China Airlines (don't be confused by others with names like South China Airlines), has at least one such flights per day that fly to (and from) LAX via Taipei. There are flights from other airlines that do much the same with stopovers in Hong Kong. Hong Kong and Taipei (non-communist Chinese airports) seem to be the preferred layovers for one-stopover flights. There are other cheaper flights but they have two stopovers and touch ground in communist China.

Here's a listing for an upcoming Bali-LAX flight on China Airlines with the Taipei stopover. This is the only Bali-LAX flight offered. No airlines offer a direct flight from Bali to LAX even though it is at least possible to offer such a flight using the rare long-range airliners from Boeing and Airbus as mentioned above. I snapshotted this today from Expedia and put it up on PostImg.cc for 31 days.

These ridiculous videos of flights on Flat Earth Airlines don't work out once you understand that these are not non-stop flights. The same was true above with the Santiago-to-Sydney flights (which routed via airports in Texas and/or California with one or two stopovers in the States) except for the Qantas flight which was a direct flight with no stopovers.

People should understand that Flat Earth con men who are preparing this information have to know that they are deliberately deceiving gullible people like Liberator with this garbage. He is their mark, their target. They hope to get him to come to some crappy conference or buy a book or flack their work for free around Teh Interwebs so other gullible people will buy books or attend kook confabs.

These are con men and Liberator is their rube. They are using him as a tool to get to us, hopefully to find other kooks who will help to spread their nonsense virally via Fakebook or Twitter or whatnot. The CT cultist personality type is perfect for them to exploit because people like Liberator are self-winding toys with a lot of energy to devote to helping the con men swindle them and other people as well. As with religion, those True Believers are your best profit centers and best evangelists.

Flat Earth should be considered a religious belief, much as 9/11 Truthers should be considered a religious belief. No facts will ever sway them and there is more than a little of the cultic fanatic about them. And they are ready, even eager, to be aggrieved martyrs for their little causes.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-16   8:05:56 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: Pinguinite (#54)

What you say about faith is interesting, particularly in the religious context. Millions, perhaps billions, of Christians have seriously deluded themselves by not understanding that the word we translate as "faith" in English - "fides" in Latin, "pistis" in Greek - and the word "faith" itself as originally used in English, does not mean "belief in", it means trust.

When someone shows his "Bona Fides" - his "good faith", or makes a "good faith" effort, this in no way means a "believable" effort, it means an honest or trustworthy thing. To have faith in God is not to believe God exists, it's to TRUST that God (who is already assumed to exist) will act in a certain way (presumably as revealed).

The meaning of the word "faith" itself has changed in English, and now "I have faith" means simply "I believe God exists". The same expression USED to mean "I trust that God will do what he promised". BELIEF in God was never an issue before the 17th Century. Everybody in the world believed in God, or "the gods" in the time of Jesus. There was not a single atheist in Israel. The Romans weren't, the Samaritans weren't, the Jews weren't - everybody believed in God. When Jesus called for faith, he was not calling for anybody to believe in God - that was assumed - nobody hearing that doubted that A God, or gods, existed. He was calling for people to TRUST God, that he would do what he promised he would do.

And that's a very, very different thing.

TODAY, the word "faith" simply means "belief". This is applied anachronistically

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-16   8:06:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: Vicomte13 (#56)

Good points Vic. The only thing I have issue is that everyone believed in God. I don't know how you could know that. Otherwise spot on imo.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-10-16   8:23:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: Pinguinite (#54)

I guess it's when the time and effort I expend to debate and, what I would consider "enlighten" simply goes absolutely nowhere. That is when it becomes frustrating.

Like I said a long time ago. It is like debating if 7 + 8 = 9. It is pointless and a waste of time and makes everyone stupider.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-10-16   8:26:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: Pinguinite (#53)

#1) He claims the flight was from Bali to LAX. It wasn't. It was from Taiwan. I found 2 youtubes on the subject. Both were news reports, one in english, and the other in a foreign language. The english one stated and illustrated the flight being from Taiwan. The non-english one didn't show a map but the vid was titled as saying it was from Bali. The woman was from Taiwan. I searched and found a site saying no non-stop flights from Bali to LAX exist. I searched Kayak which gave flight opportunities only with 1 or more stops, no direct flights.

Crap. I got up, full of my righteous sense of duty to keep all the Rounders from being corrupted into Flattism (as a duly-appointed Gatekeeper) and wasted a bunch of time on Expedia and other sites.

Only to post it and discover that you had covered the same ground in far fewer words.

You, sir, are the Master Gatekeeper.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-16   8:29:27 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: Pinguinite (#54)

There's too much faith in the world. Faith in things that are simply not true. Our capacity to believe things is grossly underestimated and unappreciated.

For years and years you claimed to be a Christian. What is it that changed your mind? Or were you never really a Christian and you just said that because you were raised with Christians or something like that? Or you just said it without thinking about what it was? Seriously what changed your mind to believe in someone who suggests things to people while they are in a trance like state?

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-10-16   8:29:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: Liberator (#51)

1I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; 2Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. 3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. 5But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

How does that apply to you Liberator. You have itching ears jumping from youtube to youtube channel hoping to find something that tickles your ears and is new. You've been duped rube.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-10-16   9:06:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: Liberator (#54)

I feel I was a bit harsh on my prior post yesterday. I apologize for that. I don't consider it a "sin" to be wrong about the shape of the earth or any other academic subject. If it honestly makes sense to you then keep believing it. But you should know that the youtube vid narrator, at the bare minimum in this case, has simply not done anything close to sound research on the subject. Either than or he is, yes, intentionally using false facts to support the allegations he claims.

I contend all these flat earth videos are defective. Proving insincere intent behind the mispresentation and arguments is quite hard and not our job, as seekers of truth. But they are nonetheless defective, for whatever reason.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-16   9:32:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: Tooconservative (#55)

A direct flight on Round Earth Airlines is possible for this route, using the two long-range airliners I mentioned above.

One thing I did notice but didn't mention on the Taiwan - LAX flights is that the east-west flights were a couple hours longer than the west-east flights. I supposed that was due to the routine air currents being easterly. In that case, the Bali-LAX leg might be possible for LAX bound flights but not for the return trip. Obviously the flight ranges you gave would be the theoretical ranges, and assume no wind at all.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-16   9:36:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#64. To: A K A Stone (#58)

Like I said a long time ago. It is like debating if 7 + 8 = 9. It is pointless and a waste of time and makes everyone stupider.

As I said before, if the debate is honest and real, it can yield an understanding as to why someone believes what they do.

If you go into a debate without an interest in understanding the opponent's thought processes, then you are not really debating. You are just wasting everyone's time, including your own.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-16   9:40:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#65. To: A K A Stone (#57)

The first real challenge to God was Newtonian physics. By reducing the universe to a predictable place, determinism became fashionable among SOME intellectuals (like Voltaire). But even the French Revolutionaries with their "Cult of Reason" were generally more reacting to the abuses of clericalism in the organized churches than the idea of God as such. And the people didn't really follow that: the Reign of Terror with its "Cult of Reason" only lasted 6 months before the "Thermidorean Reaction" ended the nonsense and chopped off the heads of the madmen. Soon enough Napoleon signed a Concordat with the Pope and the French people by and large settled back into a (regulated, less overmighty) Church. It wasn't really until Darwin and man as a sapient ape that actual belief in God himself began to decline. Looking to the Scriptures, the Hebrews and the early Christians were not contending with atheists, but with other gods and religions.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-16   9:46:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: Pinguinite (#63)

One thing I did notice but didn't mention on the Taiwan - LAX flights is that the east-west flights were a couple hours longer than the west-east flights. I supposed that was due to the routine air currents being easterly. In that case, the Bali-LAX leg might be possible for LAX bound flights but not for the return trip. Obviously the flight ranges you gave would be the theoretical ranges, and assume no wind at all.

It may also have to do with scheduled inspections and maintenance. They have to have factory-qualified techs to inspect and repair these airliners every so often. Typically, even in domestic flights, the planes get routed to a particular airport which has the qualified techs. When I worked for a railroad many years ago, I spent some time at the roundhouse and I observed the same thing. Some things can only be done in a hub with qualified techs on hand and you just schedule according to that requirement.

You also have required rest periods for flight crew. If your pilot has X many hours on duty, they have to be off-duty for a certain number of hours. Same for truckers, same for railroad engineers, etc. If you have, for instance, an extra hour of layover at Taipei airport to accommodate connections to other flights, that extra hour would show up in the required rest period for the pilots and air crew. Don't think that required rest and deadheading issues don't play a big role in scheduling. They do. And airlines are very rigorous about enforcing them. So are big trucking companies, bus companies and railroads.

I was interested somewhat in why the flight diverted to Alaska since I thought that Hawaii would be closer. However, there could be reasons for this. Prevailing cross-Pacific flight lanes might be one. Another might be that all flights must have an emergency alternate destination. In the event that a major airport like LAX is closed, where do you re-route the planes already in the air with LAX as their destination? In some cases, like these long trans-Pacific flights with so few airports, you can't just say that they'll all go to Honolulu because they would not be able to handle so much traffic. So it would make sense to have Alaska as an alternate for some of those flights. You have to spread them around. Think about, for instance, what you do if there is an outbreak of disease (Ebola, smallpox) and they close the airports. Or what happened on 9/11 where all air traffic gets grounded for days (unless you're a Saudi who is a member of the bin Laden family which gets you a special flight out of the country).

I would bet that factors like that would explain the flight hours being different on east-west vs. west-east flights on the same route and on the choice of an emergency alternate destination for a particular flight. But you would probably have to be an airline pilot or an airline fleet management person to know exactly what the particular reasons are for these scheduling/routing decisions are. You really have to keep in mind how much is preplanned for worst-case scenarios once you put people in the air and they must come down in X hours or they'll all die in a watery grave and all their heirs will sue your ass off after you get a lot of bad publicity that can end careers of top company officials.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-16   10:28:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: Pinguinite (#62)

But you should know that the youtube vid narrator, at the bare minimum in this case, has simply not done anything close to sound research on the subject. Either than or he is, yes, intentionally using false facts to support the allegations he claims.

I think you know that some of these videos are deliberate frauds, not merely some accident. That Santiago-Sydney one in particular. There is no way to explain that other than fraudulent intent, the kind that gets con men sent to jail on a regular basis.

I understand being polite and giving the benefit of the doubt and not attributing fraud/malice when ignorance is as good an explanation but there are instances where only fraudulent intent offers an adequate explanation in a court of law.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-10-16   10:42:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: A K A Stone, Liberator, Vicomte13, watchman, Tooconservative (#60)

For years and years you claimed to be a Christian. What is it that changed your mind? Or were you never really a Christian and you just said that because you were raised with Christians or something like that? Or you just said it without thinking about what it was? Seriously what changed your mind to believe in someone who suggests things to people while they are in a trance like state?

Or were you never really a Christian...

Tell me, Stone, how do you/we qualify a "real Christian"? How do you quantify what constitutes "real" belief?

What does it really mean to "believe"? Vicomte13 just posted a bit about the meaning of the term concluding the difference with the term "faith" meaning "trust" more than "belief". I do not know about the tech defs of terms between languages. That's not my area, but I do concur that "belief", if it is to be on par with "head knowledge", regardless of whether the knowledge is correct or not, is not something that God cares about.

The pseud-documentary called "The Secret", espouses a "Law of Attraction", which claims that whatever attitude you have in your heart is what will come to fruition in your life, whether good or bad. Leaving aside the question of how true that is (I think it is credible) I do think that describes what faith really is. It's not clenching your fists with your eyes shut trying to force your brain cells into aligning with a certain intellectual understanding, kinda like the child's fable story entitled "The Little Engine That Could" which I think we all know (a story that sure, is applicable for accomplishing challenging physical tasks) but it simply not applicable when it comes to understanding God.

No, when it comes to God, understanding or acknowledging the truth doesn't come forcefully. It comes from being open minded, which you are not. You proved it by your prior post about how debating the question of 7+8=9 is a waste of time. In the same way, in your mind, debating the age of the earth is similarly a waste of time. You don't care why I and a great many people think it's far older.

Unlike you, I am open minded. I always have been, even while I claimed to be a Christian. And my open minded nature allowed me to explore beyond the Bible. As a matter of theology, I subsequently found Michael Newton's work very credible. It fully qualified God as having all the patience the Bible talks about him having, in spite of the Bible's overall claim of the end of human life being the time when God's patience runs out. I find the theology of sin to be rather "messy" and always have, even while a Christian. Messy because sin must be done with intent, and intent is simply not qualifiable in many cases, particularly with very young children. Our comprehension of right and wrong varies abstractly. Under Newton, one's actual theological understanding of God isn't important. This solves the problem of God condemning people to hell for all eternity because of their sinful nature in spite of the fact that they may never had any opportunity to even hear about this one theological message about Jesus dying for our sins even though "Jesus" a name we are not spelling or pronouncing correctly as we have the wrong language. (But somehow, God knows who we mean anyway, right, so He allows us that leeway but not any other kind of leeway?) Sure you have your explanation about how it's okay for God to condemn people -- or allow them to condemn themselves. I, on the other hand, have an explanation for how that doesn't happen at all.

If "faith" is indeed not mere head knowledge, but rather expresses actual trust, then I think I can say that I have faith that God doesn't act this way with non-Christians, and will not act that way with me.

I will point out, as I have before, that over 90% of what Christianity teaches is compatible with Michael Newton's findings. Namely in terms of loving others, the Golden Rule, putting others first before yourself, loving your enemies, embellishing virtues and quashing vices. All of that is 100% the same. The only thing different is the theology of sin (though even there, there is some overlap), a final judgment after one life, the idea that our humanity is modeled after God, and of course, the question of how many times a soul can incarnate into a human body. And yes, I think it is accurate to say that Christianity does espouse that we did incarnate when soul merged with the human body. The difference is that Christianity says this can only happen once, while according to Newton, it can happen multiple times. In that light, "reincarnation" is not such a far-fetched theology.

Michael Newton makes more theological sense. At least to me. Everything falls in place with this model. Contemporary accounts which are easy to find claim past life experiences, and the one account I've posted of several times of the young boy recalling being a pilot that was shot down and killed in WW2 being exceptionally compelling as he allegedly was even able to recall shipmate names at a veteran reunion. Sure you write that off as demons, but then again, you're close minded. You won't listen to any arguments that contradict the Bible, just as Liberator won't, it seems, listen to any arguments that the earth is round.

I may not be a Christian, Stone, but it doesn't mean I don't have faith. God is better than anything you or I can possibly imagine. You may agree with that statement superficially, and yet you nonetheless still keep God in a box, not allowing him to be anything more than what the Bible depicts. You think that under God's watch and in accordance to a design that He signed off on, the vast majority of his children will end up burning in hell for all eternity. I say, God is better than that. And under Newton, God IS better than that. Our path is more than a single lifetime. Why shouldn't it be? And I have found what I believe to be validation in my own life that I have had past lives. No, not lives I can remember consciously, but experiences in past lives that would explain certain fears I've had in this life, and fears I am overcoming. Our journey is far longer, far more sophisticated, far deeper than a single lifetime could possibly offer.

It all makes more sense.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-10-16   10:59:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: Tooconservative (#66)

The main reason West to East flights are shorter is that the Jet Stream blows at 200 mph, so one's airspeed may be the same, but one's speed-over- ground is 200 mph faster West to East than East to West. Now, East to West we try not to fly directly into the most intense headwinds, but the Flight levels are only 1000 feet apart, so there's only so much you can do on the established airways. Up to a certain point, you can overcome the effect of the wind, but to do it you have to burn more fuel.

The reason the flight paths loop up like that is that they are flying great circle routes, which are the shortest distance between two points on the curved world. We're used to flat maps that distort everything. If you take a length of string and a properly shaped globe, and lay out a shortest- distance path, you'll use less string flying what looks to be an arc on a flat map. then by flying what looks to be straight on the flat map.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-10-16   12:54:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: Tooconservative, Pinguinite, A K A Stone, Vicomte13, Deckard, Watchman, A K A Stoneredleghunter, (#55)

Too Conservative:

"Flat Earth should be considered a religious belief, much as 9/11 Truthers should be considered a religious belief."

I'll let TC's statement stand alone a moment...

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-16   13:11:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#71. To: A K A Stone, redleghunter (#70)

Sorry. I messed up the "recipient" line to the above post.

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-16   13:13:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: Tooconservative, Pinguinite, A K A Stone, Vicomte13 (#55)

These are con men and Liberator is their rube....[blah, blah]...kooks ...nonsense... Fakebook or Twitter or whatnot [YouBoob]....The CT cultist...

Flat Earth should be considered a religious belief, much as 9/11 Truthers should be considered a religious belief....cultic.

Ok...I laughed. (sorry folks -- I'm only pinging you because TC pinged you to witness his unhinged CT about CTers.)

Q: Who exactly is "conning" who here? As has been pointed out often, the moniker "Too Conservative" is more irony than truth. By your own words, you appear to be no more "conservative" and tolerant of ideas than any other closet fascist.

Of further humorous curiosity:

In that you have comically self-anointed yourself LF's 'Captain of Gatekeeping,' the questions that must be asked:

Why do discussions, beliefs, and theories that challenge every single Powers-That-Be, institutional narrative or "Official Report" be immediately derailed, dismissed, derided, and otherwise spammed by you?

The consensus and THE truth? Everyone (other than apparently you) knows we have been and continue to be LIED TO. Whether by the Body Politic, Globalists, so-called "Science," the Media, and especially by the so-called, "Powers-That-Be" -- aka 'The Elites'. The only people who despise "Truthers" are...Gatekeepers AND those with something to hide. LIKE AN AGENDA.

People like Liberator are self-winding toys with a lot of energy to devote to helping the con men swindle them and other people as well.

Hilarious. "Swindle"? Who?? And out of what? Never mind. I'm still enjoying this inane insanity.

But speaking of "energy"....

What is it about "conspiracies theories" and challenging ALL official narratives that viscerally energizes and upsets YOU? After all, who cares about a tiny inconsequential forum of 25 posters, right?

Liberator  posted on  2019-10-16   13:50:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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