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AG reveals ICE released thousands of ‘murderers and rapists’ from detention centers into US streets Status: Not Logged In; Sign In The Establishments war on Donald Trump See other The Establishments war on Donald Trump Articles Title: Urgent Concern Form Revised August 2019, Requirement for First-Hand Knowledge Eliminated Source: [None] URL Source: [None] Published: Sep 27, 2019 Author: nolu chan Post Date: 2019-09-27 19:46:58 by nolu chan Keywords: None Views: 3122 Comments: 26 Urgent Concern Form Revised August 2019, Requirement for First-Hand Knowledge Eliminated nolu chan 27 September 2019 ICIC CPD - ICWPA Disclosure Form DISCLOSURE OF URGENT CONCERN FORM https://www.dni.gov/files/ICIG/Documents/Hotline/Urgent%20Concern%20Disclosure%20Form.pdf Metadata: xmp:ModifyDate: 2019-09-25T14:39:15-04:00 xmp:CreateDate: 2019-09-24T16:25-04:00 xmp:MetadataDate: 2019-09-25T14:39:15-04:00 xmp:CreatorTool: Acrobat PDFMaker 18 for Word It appears that, few days ago, the form was changed to delete the requirement to have direct and personal knowledge of reported matter. The ICIG will now accept a report even if one "heard about it from others." See Twitter thread of Stephen McIntyre: https://twitter.com/ClimateAudit/status/1177580473566093312 The form of 24 May 2018 stated: ICIG-ICWSP Urgent Concern Disclosure Form Page iii FIRST-HAND INFORMATION REQUIRED In order to find an urgent concern “credible," the ICIG must be in possession of reliable, first-hand information. The IC IG cannot transmit information via the ICWPA based on an employee's second-hand knowledge of wrongdoing. This includes information received from another person, such as when a fellow employee informs you that he/she witnessed some type of wrongdoing. (Anyone with first-hand knowledge of the allegations may file a disclosure in writing directly with IC IG.) Similarly, speculation about the existence of wrongdoing does not provide sufficient legal basis to meet the statutory requirements of the ICWPA. If you think that wrongdoing took place, but can provide nothing more than second-hand or unsubstantiated assertions, IC IG will not be able to process the complaint or information for submission as an ICWPA. The form "Rev: August 2019", with a precise date unprovided, now states on page 2: 3. I know about the information I am disclosing here and: [ ] I have direct and personal knowledge [ ] I heard about it from others. Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread   Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 13. #3. To: nolu chan (#0) You might be interested in this. RedState: BREAKING: Intel Community Secretly Changed the Whistle-Blower Rules to Allow the Trump-Ukraine Complaint Just Days Before It Was Filed It's just one of RedState's bloggers so it may not mean much. I see that some people are starting to raise the idea that there never was such a disclosure form prior to this complaint. Anyway, I saw it and thought of your thread here. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-28   12:16:57 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #4. To: Tooconservative (#3) RedState: BREAKING: Intel Community Secretly Changed the Whistle-Blower Rules to Allow the Trump-Ukraine Complaint Just Days Before It Was Filed I had not seen this specific article, but have seen some similar coverage. I cannot determine, without a specific rev date, if this was to allow the whistleleaker complaint, or a post-complaint CYA effort. If the Rev date was after the 12 August submission, it would not change the requirement on 12 August. The metadata creation date of the online form is 24 September 2019. The purported Rev date is just August 2019. The published Complaint of August 12, 2019 is on plain paper. I have not seen any associated urgent concern disclosure form. nolu chan  posted on  2019-09-28   16:26:05 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #5. To: nolu chan (#4) It is interesting. You would think that they would be very careful if they actually tried to backdate the form revision. But then, no one thought that Dan Rather and his accomplice would simply forge GW Bush's military records from the typewriter era using modern proportional fonts in Microsoft Word and get caught red-handed doing it, ending Rather's career (except for his sad-ass little news show on that old HD channel). Most people aren't aware he's still alive, even at CBS. I'm not sure how these things work with the feds. I assume they have some office that approves and issues forms. Also that they would have a committee that would oversee changes to forms and that at least one person in upper management would have to sign off on any changes. I don't think the feds just let anyone change their forms at the drop of a hat. There should be a committee and someone in management signing off on it. I always thought Coates was a very weak choice for DNI, don't see why they chose him. The current Acting DNI is Joseph Maguire who took office as Acting Director on August 19, 2019. So if the Deep State was going to sneak something into the pipeline to leak about, it would make sense to do it when Trump's top political appointee was cleaning out his desk. Funny it only took a month of Coates being gone and all of a sudden a major impeachment scandal surfaces via some new complaint form that for the first time allows hearsay accusations, something explicitly forbidden for decades. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-28   20:32:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #6. To: Tooconservative (#5) I'm not sure how these things work with the feds. I have some familiarity how form management works with federal government agencies. GSA controls for all government agencies, except when it is No Such Agency or Alphabet City. The August 12 submission, as published, is not on any form. nolu chan  posted on  2019-09-29   13:16:23 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #7. To: nolu chan (#6) (Edited) The August 12 submission, as published, is not on any form. But shouldn't there be a design committee behind form changes and some official signing off on it on a particular date and certifying the official form, using another form that responsible officials use to designate the official new form along with a filed original of the official document? What I knew of formal document creation involved input from the department, a committee making recommendations, and a responsible designated official making an official approval of the final form, after which the form went into general use and all obsolete forms were discarded/recycled. That's what we did at a big corporation I worked at and that was just for routine employee matters, not national security. This is national security administration, not just Joe Blow going down to file some change of address form at the local post office. A lot of lawyers probably worked on this form. That is, if it is actually a legitimate form that passed the appropriate procedure under forms created for national security. These are not some ad hoc forms cranked out at a moment's notice. It's impossible to imagine that DNI's legal advisers did not have input into the creation of a new document, one that contravened a decades-long policy against filing hearsay whistleblower complaints, such as this case. There should be a record of the DNI legal staff working on the form and vetting it, perhaps discussion of it among legal staff, a final approval (or disapproval) of the revised form. What I'm saying is there should be a form design committee, a public official with final approval, and some records of the DNI legal staff involved in reviewing such a major revision to a form in use for decades unchanged. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-29   14:56:05 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #8. To: Tooconservative (#7) What I knew of formal document creation involved input from the department, a committee making recommendations, and a responsible designated official making an official approval of the final form, after which the form went into general use and all obsolete forms were discarded/recycled. For most of the Government there is this and other regulations. https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/Handbook09.pdf STANDARD AND OPTIONAL FORMS PROCEDURAL HANDBOOK Forms Policy and Management Team GSA Office of Governmentwide Policy forms@gsa.gov July 2009 nolu chan  posted on  2019-09-30   12:57:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #9. To: nolu chan (#8) For most of the Government there is this and other regulations. https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/Handbook09.pdf I think the forms and process are rather different at intel agencies than they are at Commerce, or Agriculture, or Education. Some of the intel agency forms themselves are likely classified material. Because it is so useful to keep them confidential. So I'm not prepared to believe that a whistleblower form at the DNI's office is exactly the same as whistleblower forms at routine civilian federal agencies. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-30   16:46:22 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #10. To: Tooconservative (#9) So I'm not prepared to believe that a whistleblower form at the DNI's office is exactly the same as whistleblower forms at routine civilian federal agencies. I'm fairly certain that they are not. I just heard on Fox News that the whistleblower used the appropriate 2018 form with the associated August 212 complaint and, therein, claimed first hand knowledge. And Trump had directed the keeping of all forms, a timeline of the changes, and who signed off on the change. nolu chan  posted on  2019-09-30   18:24:57 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #12. To: nolu chan (#10) I just heard on Fox News that the whistleblower used the appropriate 2018 form with the associated August 212 complaint and, therein, claimed first hand knowledge.... I still don't have any other sites or news sources offering any confirmation of this news. It seems to me that going from a second-hand whistleblower to being a first-hand whistleblower would be Big News. And I see nothing anywhere on this. Can you provide any links to reporting on this that supports what you related that you heard on Fox News? The only info I found on the FNC front page on the web was this: FNC: Amid Ukraine complaint, GOP questions move to drop ‘first-hand’ info requirement in whistleblower form Needless to say, they are making no mention of any first-hand whistleblower story. You realize that such a story would be Breaking News everywhere on liberal and conservative sites and TV channels, that they had an accuser with first-hand testimony to bring to bear during impeachment proceedings. Yet, I can find no other reporting on this story other than your statement that you say you heard this reported on FNC just a few hours ago. Are you sure you heard the reporting accurately and in full? What show was it on? Maybe we could find a YouBoob upload of today's shows, like Baier's show or McCollum's show. Or even The Five (well, assuming they haven't finally shitcanned that waste of time). Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-30   20:44:32 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #13. To: Tooconservative (#12) (Edited) I just heard on Fox News that the whistleblower used the appropriate 2018 form with the associated August 212 complaint and, therein, claimed first hand knowledge. I still don't have any other sites or news sources offering any confirmation of this news. I watched a reporter show a copy of a document in her hand and say they had just received it and she proceeded to quote what I believe was the following from page 2 of this ICIG News Release of today: The Disclosure of Urgent Concern form the Complainant submitted on August 12, 2019 is the same form the ICIG has had in place since May 24, 2018, which went into effect before Inspector General Atkinson entered on duty as the Inspector General of the Intelligence Community on May 29, 2018, following his swearing in as the Inspector General of the Intelligence Community on May 17, 2018. The Release also states at 2: The Complainant on the form he or she submitted on August 12, 2019 in fact checked two relevant boxes: The first box stated that, “I have personal and/or direct knowledge of events or records involved”; and the second box stated that, “Other employees have told me about events or records involved.” The second part was not read, but it was stated that the whistleblower had check a box declaring personal and/or direct knowledge of events or records. I only caught it that one time and posted from memory, but it seems to me that the form the ICIG had in place in 2018 is not the same as the one with the Rev date of August 2019. Make of it what you will. https://www.scribd.com/document/428184513/ICIG-Statement-on-Processing-of-Whistleblower-Complaints-30-Sep-2019 nolu chan  posted on  2019-09-30   22:08:30 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   Replies to Comment # 13. #15. To: nolu chan (#13) (Edited) If the IGIC cannot and will not process any secondhand reports, what is the purpose of the portion of the form where the complainant indicates whether it is firsthand or secondhand knowledge? Just to catch people reporting hearsay? Wouldn't the IGIC just toss any complaint form where they checked off "secondhand info"? These people in the IC have turned into such blabbermouths that it's hard to take them seriously. Only a few decades back, you never learned the internal processes of these agencies until decades later because denying that information to your enemy counterparts narrows your defensive surface and helps you detect security leaks. The more we spend on the IC, especially CIA/NSA, the less they can keep even minor secrets. They can't stop talking, it seems. Looking at the Scribd document that you posted here, I can see that it was uploaded to Scribd by a nolu chan. I assume that you are he. Perhaps you should mention that you are the source of these documents at Scribd. Can you provide any independent news source that provides the same press release from our chatty ICIG? Can you provide any direct document link to the ICIG's office and their press releases? Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-30 23:49:15 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   End Trace Mode for Comment # 13. Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest

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