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Foreign Invaders crisis cost $150B in 2023, forcing some areas to cut police and fire services: report Israel kills head of Hezbollah Intelligence. Status: Not Logged In; Sign In New World Order See other New World Order Articles Title: The CIA’s Influence Over the Media: Use of the Conspiracy Theorist Slur Source: 911Truth.Org URL Source: https://911truth.org/conspiracy-theorist-slur-cia-propaganda/ Published: Sep 4, 2019 Author: Kevin Ryan Post Date: 2019-09-14 13:55:02 by Liberator Keywords: CT, Gatekeeper, Tools Views: 13190 Comments: 110 The CIA’s Influence Over the Media: Use of the Conspiracy Theorist Slur “Let us never tolerate outrageous conspiracy theories concerning the attacks of September the 11th.”—George W. Bush, November 10, 2001 By Kevin Ryan - September 4, 2019 In April of 1967, a CIA official sent a memorandum dispatch to agency chiefs and stations. This memo described a strategy for discrediting critics of the Warren Report, the official account for the assassination of President Kennedy released in 1964. At the time of the memo, polls showed that 46% of Americans did not think that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone, in contradiction to the official finding. To counter such criticisms, the memo proposed labeling critics as “conspiracy theorists” and proposed that the CIA’s “propaganda assets” in media begin to use the slur and other, related techniques to marginalize critics. Classified as Secret but finally released in 1998, the memo stated, “Conspiracy theories have frequently thrown suspicion on our organization, for example by falsely alleging that Lee Harvey Oswald worked for us. The aim of this dispatch is to provide material for countering and discrediting the claims of the conspiracy theorists, so as to inhibit circulation of such claims.” The memo instructed media assets to discredit those questioning government reports by saying the critics should be depicted as “wedded to theories adopted before the evidence was in, hasty or inaccurate in their research, or infatuated with their own theories.” Posted by Donna Cleveland on Flickr The approach laid out by the memo was adopted by many in the American media. That’s not a surprise given that Operation Mockingbird, a domestic propaganda campaign aimed at promoting the views of the CIA within the media, was in full swing at the time. And despite official claims that the CIA’s influence of American media was halted in 1976, after the Church Committee findings, the continued use of the terms “conspiracy theory” and “conspiracy theorist” indicates that the practice has continued. A few years ago, I tested this by checking how many times the phrase “conspiracy theory” had appeared in the Washington Post and the New York Times in the 45 years before and after the CIA memo. Before the memo was issued, “conspiracy theory” was a phrase used 50 times, or about once per year, in the Times or the Post. In the 45 years after the CIA memo, these newspapers used the term 2,630 times, or about once per week. Before the CIA memo came out, the Washington Post and New York Times had never used the phrase “conspiracy theorist.” After the CIA memo came out, they have used the phrase “conspiracy theorist” 1,118 times. The continued use of terms such as “conspiracy theorist” suggests that the CIA still controls the mainstream media. With regard to the crimes of 9/11, The New York Times has led the way in terms of support for official propaganda. Moreover, many “alternative” media sources use these slurs as frequently, or more, than mainstream media do. An example was in August 2011, when I was a guest on National Public Radio’s ‘On Point” talk show to discuss 9/11 skepticism. Interestingly, I was the only 9/11 skeptic invited to appear on this show about 9/11 skeptics. The other two guests were Jim Meigs from Popular Mechanics and dubious “truther expert” Jonathan Kay. During the show, I answered questions from the host for about 5 minutes, until it became clear that my skepticism of 9/11 sounded rational. After I was dismissed—for the remaining 42 minutes of the show—Meigs, Kay, and the substitute host rambled on about the evils of conspiracy theories, using some form of the phrase conspiracy theory a total of 85 times. That’s more than once every 30 seconds. The use of “conspiracy theory” to deter citizens from investigating historic events is paradoxical, to be sure. It suggests that those who commit criminal conspiracies can only be relatively powerless people who happen to live on the most strategically important lands, (and conspiracies among rich, powerful people are impossible or absurd.) It’s just that kind of doublethink mindset that has led us to where we are today as a nation. Of course, 9/11 was a conspiracy. The only question is was it a conspiracy of people who could not possibly pull it off and who would only suffer as a result.... OR ... Was it a conspiracy of the people who benefited and had the power to accomplish it? The first option presents many problems. Common sense suggests the latter. These days, it seems that you can tell who is working for the CIA simply by the way they use “conspiracy theory” and “conspiracy theorist” in attempts to belittle others. An example might be when a lawyer for gold mining companies was presented by the corporate media as a public servant/truth teller based on stolen documents that were never shared with the public. That lawyer and his colleagues at The Intercept use the conspiracy theorist slur as much as any other media source, and often when they are questioned about their dubious rise to fame. In any case, our entire legal system is based on the idea of conspiracy.... ...Yet despite this fact we have been conditioned by the government and the media to blindly accept official reports and to treat anyone questioning those reports as conspiracy theorists; THAT IS, YOU ARE A CONSPIRACY THEORIST IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE THE GOVERNMENT'S CONSPIRACY THEORY. This technique is easy to see. Next time you read an article that uses these slurs, look more closely at the author (or poster/gatekeeper/troll) and where he or she is trying to lead you. SOURCE: Published at Digwithin by Kevin Ryan on 7/31/2019 Poster Comment: Oh, the rich RICH irony. This same Alinsky "Rules For Radicals" technique that is used by Spooks, Gubmint & G00gle against "CT!!" to shut down legit discussion and truth without question WHILE discrediting their opponent: "Racist!!", "Anti-semite!!", "H0mophobe!!", "Xenophobe!!"(blank]tard!!), "Truther!!" etc!). This obvious semantic parlor-trick by a panicky unprincipled elite and its army of uninformed/ignorant gatekeepers are no longer able to dam-up 911 lies OR its a plethora of other ongoing accepted Big Lies. Perhaps it's time to re-examine and re-assess what and whose side you support....and Big Picture Agenda. (1 image) Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread   Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest #1. To: All (#0) As those paying attention have noticed, the very real cabal of assorted PTB (Masons-Illuminati-Vatican-Jesuits-Talmudics-Etal) have directed its covert muscle (CIA) to order its lackeys in DC and Media to literally criminalize discussions of "Conspiracy Theorists" online. BUT IT'S TOO LATE. The Cat(s) is out of the bag. Given PTB Cabal of One Worlders are rapidly losing complete control over several institutions (see Trump & Brexit & Orban & Putin) and several ongoing narratives, including it's deeper, darker secrets and under-belly exposed (as well as its ongoing hoaxes, thanks to the interweb's vast spread of previous hidden, buried, masked info), here' a question: What will be their next desperate Operation/Big Lie/Distraction/Red Flag/Step? Further Invasions of the West? (see "Kalergi Plan") War(s)? Disease & Epidemics? Gun Confiscation? Shutting down Internet Communications? Shutting down the Electric Grid? EMPs? De-Population? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-14   14:08:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #2. To: Liberator (#0) "Racist!!", "Anti-semite!!", "H0mophobe!!", "Xenophobe!!"(blank]tard!!), "Truther!!" etc!). You know, Deckard just posted a lovely thread yesterday from a site where you could really fit in. They hate Jews, Mexicans, blacks, gays and they embrace 9/11 kook theories and - to my surprise - they seem to support Flat Earth theory too. A veritable smorgasbord for all your preferred reading tastes. Here's where they dip their toes in Flat Earth waters. InfoStormer: India Fails to Land Spacecraft on the Moon As some of you may or may not know, I have a great deal of skepticism about any of this space program nonsense. This extends beyond NASA and the Apollo moon landing missions which I personally believed were all faked in a film studio. I know not everyone who reads this site agrees with this view, but that’s just how I feel. There’s just too much weird shit surrounding all of the space programs around the world for me to believe that any of this stuff is real. This includes this recent mission to the moon by India which allegedly ended in failure. CBS News: In a crushing disappointment, India’s unmanned Vikram lander — carrying a small rover and the pride of a nation — apparently crash landed near the moon’s south pole Friday toward the end of a seemingly smooth descent. With Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi looking on at the control center, the Indian Space Research Organization’s Vikram lander fired its braking rockets shortly after 4 p.m. ET, kicking off what was to have been a 15-minute descent to the surface. The Chandrayaan-2 lander, carrying eight science instruments and a small, six-wheel rover known as Pragyan, or “Wisdom,” was to have spent two weeks in lunar daylight studying the moon’s polar environment in a mission seen as a demonstration of India’s increasingly sophisticated space prowess. India is a country filled with millions of low IQ brown people many of who haven’t mastered the skill of shitting in a toilet. And we are expected to believe that they were able to launch a spacecraft that came close to landing on the moon but crashed at the last moment. I just don’t believe any of this. Call me a conspiracy theorist if you want. The whole thing seems like a charade to con people into thinking that these low IQ mud people are capable of achieving what White Europeans have been able to accomplish. Not buying any of this. My assumption is that there will be a bunch of people debunking this supposed space mission on YouTube. It's one-stop shopping for almost every kook theory you've ever heard of. You should go sign up. But even they have their downfalls. Look at how these ingrates criticize Prez Trump and his vape tweets. InfoStormer: Donald Trump Issues Clarification on Proposed Vaping Ban Donald Trump has issued a clarification on his proposed vaping ban. It looks as though he is okay with vaping as a cigarette alternative but just wants to get the unsafe counterfeit vaping shit off the market. While I like the Vaping alternative to Cigarettes, we need to make sure this alternative is SAFE for ALL! Let’s get counterfeits off the market, and keep young children from Vaping! — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) September 13, 2019 I personally find this totally unreasonable. As I’ve said before, many of my friends have died from vaping. They vaped for a single week and ended up dead. Vaping products should be totally banned in all 50 states. We need to wage a war on vaping and integrate it into the totally successful war on drugs that Ronald Reagan waged in the 1980s. People caught selling vaping products should be given the death penalty. People caught vaping should be put in prison for the of their lives. That is my official position on this. Children will die if we do not do this. Maybe you can persuade them to ease up on the vaping=murder stuff. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-14   14:34:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #3. To: Tooconservative (#2) Look at how these ingrates criticize Prez Trump Ingrates? That's putting it mildly. Infostormer is "a self- described “alt-right” website created by neo-Nazi Lee Rogers that features racist and anti-Semitic content." misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-15   9:25:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #4. To: misterwhite (#3) (Edited) Infostormer is "a self- described “alt-right” website created by neo-Nazi Alt-right? I just consider this nazi bullshit. The forum users for that site, feel that 70% of the prison population is made up by the 13% of the black population, because all blacks are niggers and worthless. This is not true, and most people that affix their opinions on a whole group, based on a unchangable factor, like just the color of their skin, is too fucking stupid to think deeper than they do. I happen to subscribe that 70% of the prison population is made from the black population that is only 13% of this countries population because of a multitude of reasons regarding living conditions (inner cities), lack of parental influence, care and teaching.... along with other factors that add in. Now, both will say the same shit, cause there are facts involved... that “blacks DO make up 70% of our prison pop”... and the left screams RACISM... and we conservatives are caught up with the nazi’s. The left has the same problem with ANTIFA. They won’t publicly disavow that group because they make up a good portion of the socialist vote. We need to be smarter. Make public statements that we don’t want the nazi vote... what harm would it cause? You think they’ll vote for any other? GrandIsland  posted on  2019-09-15   9:59:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #5. To: GrandIsland (#4) I happen to subscribe that 70% of the prison population is made from the black population that is only 13% of this countries population because of a multitude of reasons regarding living conditions (inner cities), lack of parental influence, care and teaching.... along with other factors that add in. I agree, but explaining the reasons doesn't change the fact that 70% of the prison population is made from the black population that is only 13% of this countries population. Blacks are 8X more likely than whites to commit a violent crime. (I imagine it's even higher for black teens.) That's not my fault. I had nothing to do with that statistic. So excuse me if I approach an encounter with a black person with a little more skepticism and caution. That's not racism. That's just common sense. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-15   11:02:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #6. To: GrandIsland (#4) The left has the same problem with ANTIFA. Not really. ANTIFA formed in 2017, so their behavior can be excused as "a few members misbehaving". Not like we've had decades of violence, riots, burning down cities, rapes, murders, mob actions, etc. That's hard to excuse and explain away as "a few bad apples". misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-15   11:10:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #7. To: Tool of Disinfo Derailing Threads, Guardian of Universe's Institional Lies, AKA, Tooconservative (#2) (Edited) TooConservative: "My greatest pleasure in life: Killing the Messengers of Truth as Gatekeeper of Institutional Lies." You're STILL fooling no one. Suggestion: Instead of your comically predictable-programmed and immediate panicky reaction of lamely attempting to derail threads and shilling for/kneeling on the altar of your masters at the Masonic Lodge, perhaps you can try ADDRESSING THE CHARGE (HINT: located IN the thread.) Until your usual antics are changed, your response merely reinforces your clear function as a cartoon-"conservative" (ha -- "TOO" Conservative??) , Thread-Troll, Forum Gatekeeper, and shill of institutional lies. Btw, your formatting is very pretty. It emphasizes your trademark posting of inter-forum gossip and the presentation of style over substance. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-15   12:28:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #8. To: Tooconservative (#2) Maybe you can persuade them to ease up on the vaping=murder stuff. Lame attempt at derailment of this thread. Even for you. Put down your 'Gatekeeper-Troll Monthly' magazine and 'Masonic Instructions' manual just for a second.... Have you any opinion on THIS claim: 'The CIA’s Influence Over the Media: Use of the Conspiracy Theorist Slur' Thought not. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-15   12:35:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #9. To: misterwhite (#3) Thread Title: The CIA’s Influence Over the Media: Use of the Conspiracy Theorist Slur Come on -- I know you can do it MW! Instead of taking TooMasonic's obvious derailment bait, can YOU weigh in on the sourced claim? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-15   12:38:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #10. To: GrandIsland (#4) I just consider this nazi bullshit....We need to be smarter. Being "smarter" starts with mental discipline and focusing on legit content -- NOT having your brain so easily manipulated by Gatekeepers of Lies (as well as those of the CIA.) We all may not like sources with which we disagree, but the truth-is-truth. WHAT OF ANY OF THE CLAIMS? Any opinions? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-15   12:42:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #11. To: All, A K A Stone (#10) If you folks want to know why this forum is stale and a sad shadow of its past self, look no further than this thread and how easily the subject matter was immediately derailed. As long as the forum Pied Piper/Troll of Thread Derailment and self-annointed Gatekeeper of Institutional Lies trolls and trashes any truth-discussion, this place will remain a cemetery of open exchange of discussion and dissemination of truth (outside the Institutional Lie Orthodoxy). If the consensus here is that you are content to discuss and debate any subject -- as long as it can be found at any MSM "approved" outlet, than good luck with that. *yawn* Liberator  posted on  2019-09-15   12:54:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #12. To: misterwhite (#5) So excuse me if I approach an encounter with a black person with a little more skepticism and caution. Dicktard doesn’t have a grasp on this concept... or he’d understand why the police don’t wait until they are getting shot at or stabbed... to shoot a Black Lies Matters scumbag that wasn’t raised to fucking LISTEN TO DIRECTION GrandIsland  posted on  2019-09-15   13:34:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #13. To: Liberator (#9) The lightweight article didn't interest me. Tooconservative's comment did. Had he not commented, I wouldn't have posted. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-15   13:40:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #14. To: GrandIsland (#4) Alt-right? I just consider this nazi bullshit. They ain't us and we ain't them. You can see why they want to blend in and be considered part of the Right. But, unlike Antifa and its many libmedia and lib defenders, the rest of us on the Right want nothing to do with these Nazi/KKK types. Never have, never will. I accept some of the alt-right types like Proud Boys as worth defending. But not Nazis/KKK. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-15   13:46:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #15. To: Liberator (#10) Where I disagree is this. Of course a small amount of content and a few accurate facts are contained in this forums articles.... BUT, those few favorable things are mixed with a slanted and bias journalistic styles, designed for a personal AGENDA... just like every article posted on YAHOO NEWS. There is absolutely NO need to post or spread AGENDA driven propaganda WHEN there are less bias articles, written on the same incident, available. An example, was the article Dicktard posted a few days ago regarding an Orange County Deputy that shot himself, while training”. His article had one purpose, to report police in a bad light... and it was empty of any detail or fact. Within seconds I found ten articles that had much more facts and content. Posting SHIT, will run off, people that don’t wanna be associated with shit. GrandIsland  posted on  2019-09-15   13:47:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #16. To: Tooconservative (#14) the rest of us on the Right want nothing to do with these Nazi/KKK types. Never have, never will. Those that represent the RIGHT, need to be louder and prouder about that message. Example, I’d love for Trump to announce at his next rally, if you are neo nazi or the KKK, I DON’T WANT YOUR FUCKING VOTE. Vote for the (D)’s. GrandIsland  posted on  2019-09-15   13:50:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #17. To: GrandIsland (#16) Example, I’d love for Trump to announce at his next rally, if you are neo nazi or the KKK, I DON’T WANT YOUR FUCKING VOTE. I understand the sentiment and other GOP nominees and candidates have gone in that direction. I think Ronald Reagan once stated emphatically that, "they may support me but I don't support them." I think Trump's messaging is just about right. Watching him has made me recalibrate my estimates on political messaging entirely. Trump has kinda rewritten the rule book in many ways. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-15   14:23:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #18. To: Liberator (#1) (Edited) About the Freemasons? Most are prior military. Most are respected family men. They rise through ranks by being active and learning lines in the LARP they engage in. Leadership is elected. The square and compass represent becoming better men. Now why......would any evil organization insist to join you need someone to vouch for your character, (they need to before you join.) then, want you to be better men, then, as your commitment to the organization gets rewarded assuming you also have leadership qualities, would you expect those people to become bad? And please, show me any evidence of any Mason in the last 100 years who’s done any nefarious stuff. Having a secretary embezzle some cash doesn’t count. I’m talking about any truly nefarious shit. The Masons leaders are just fellas who’ve been chosen by members to be leaders. There is NO other way to get there. This is NOT a recipe for evil, but rather, for good, given who becomes Masons. Going back 140 years and finding a group who took the LARP a little too seriously and disappeared a member is not proof of a vast criminal organization bent on creating evil in the world, but rather, an emotional appeal based on pretty much zip. I argue this all the time on VOAT, and to THAT audience, I always snarkily say it’s a way to say it’s whitey that’s behind all the evil in the world. That causes most there to question their beliefs, which are based on mostly just fantasy anyways. One would think, with all the shit they’re blamed for, there would be some Hillary, or Epstein level proof, instead of what is trotted forth as truth. But nah, it’s very thin. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-15   18:34:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #19. To: Dead Culture Watch (#18) And please, show me any evidence of any Mason in the last 100 years who’s done any nefarious stuff. Having a secretary embezzle some cash doesn’t count. I’m talking about any truly nefarious shit. I'd like to reply to your comment... In the truly nefarious shit category I'd like to nominate Billy Graham. Seen here extending the Masonic handshake to Harry Truman. https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/codex_magica/images/acodex_93.jpg There's plenty more on Graham where that came from. Do I believe the accusations of molestation made against Graham? Yes, I do. But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. 2 Peter 2:1 watchman  posted on  2019-09-16   12:36:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #20. To: watchman (#19) Ok. So, Billy Graham was exactly what in Masonry? And links to molestation from him please. This is exactly what I’m talking about. No evidence ever of anything. Just sliming people and then using that to ‘nudge, nudge, wink wink’ a whole agenda of world domination and evil. Ya, it’s always whitey at the top. Please don’t look at (((bankers.))) BTW, I believe operation mockingbird is alive and well. So, I’m on board the thrust of article. I do find it real odious to slime a group of people who don’t deserve it in the slightest though. Can you actually address the structure and the membership and how that completely destroys the argument they are evil? I do know one thing. If there is ever a EOTWAWKI happening, I’m bee lining straight to the Mason friends I have. Ones a retired LT Colonel, and almost all are prior military and have the nicest guns and huge supply of ammo. They’ve been Masons for many years, and are 32nd degreed. Hell, my brother is currently Worshipful Master of one of the oldest lodges in this state. He’s 20 years in military as well. The best people I know are Masons. Not exactly who I would want even remotely close to evil shit due to the absolutely fantastic morals they have. The argument makes zero sense if you knew them. It’s absurd. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-16   14:58:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #21. To: misterwhite (#13) (Edited) The lightweight article didn't interest me. Lol. Chyeah, right. CIA policy to subvert the truth through MSM propaganda and other American institutions it controls -- along with a hundred related tangents, is "lightweight" stuff? Yet it's TooCartoonitive's usual change of distraction and subject (and formatting of it in a pretty baby-blue box) is what *you* found "interesting." You're usually fearless on weighing in with your opinion. But if those kinds of shiny keys and soggy white-bread pab stimulate your intellect instead of meat, then it apparently speaks to both of you sharing a similar...er... mind-set. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-16   15:47:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #22. To: GrandIsland, Deckard (#15) Thanks for responding. Respect. Where I disagree is this. Of course a small amount of content and a few accurate facts are contained in this forums articles.... BUT, those few favorable things are mixed with a slanted and bias journalistic styles, designed for a personal AGENDA... just like every article posted on YAHOO NEWS. The old saying, "Don't toss out the baby with the bathwater" applies here... I get it, I am guilty of some of the same reactions when merely reading a title of sites or sources with which I suspect a subversive/Left agenda or having a personal axe to grind. Yes -- exactly like Yahoo. That said, one of the hardest things for us to do is just that; discipline ourselves from rejecting a knee-jerk instinct to immediately discard content because the source may have an over-riding agenda that we don't support and *instead* sift through the truth -- as you said you had. Truth = Truth. There happens to be a lot to unpack in this story because the Spooks have carte blanche to do whatever they want. Including Outlaw Stuff. So what do we do then? Maybe take those morsels of truth and build on them elsewhere. Few people or sources have ALL *the* truth. There is absolutely NO need to post or spread AGENDA driven propaganda WHEN there are less bias articles, written on the same incident, available. Are you referring to this one specifically? IF you are, I disagree whole-heartedly. I have seen very few articles which actually document an ongoing and very real and damning policy by the top of the CIA to seed lies in order to control the spread of truth. You're NOT going to hear about that even from Hannity. Why wouldn't the official 911 narrative still be suspicious? And why wouldn't the Main Alphabet Agency be Suspect #1? None of the kooky explanations make sense till this day. Not even the "Blue Ribbon Panel" bought the explanations. Isn't it the most powerful people on earth who simply do what they want? Their "currency" is power. It enables them to wield complete control including control the message. Most crimes have a motive. Some even have multiple motives. Here is just one regarding that day: An example, was the article Dicktard posted a few days ago regarding an Orange County Deputy that shot himself, while training”. His article had one purpose, to report police in a bad light... and it was empty of any detail or fact. Within seconds I found ten articles that had much more facts and content. GI, look -- you know, I know, and even Deckard knows our views are sometimes similar, then 180 degrees apart depending on the issue. On most Po-Po articles we don't agree. FWIW...I don't think that particular story is worthy or indicative of most LE at all. It's the exception. Posting SHIT, will run off, people that don’t wanna be associated with shit. That's because it's an isolated incident and an anecdotal outlier. It's not about LE policy or an institutional epidemic of incompetence. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-16   16:17:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #23. To: GrandIsland (#16) TooCartoonative: (..."the rest of us on the Right want nothing to do with these Nazi/KKK types. Never have, never will.") Those that represent the RIGHT, need to be louder and prouder about that message. Example, I’d love for Trump to announce at his next rally, if you are neo nazi or the KKK, I DON’T WANT YOUR FUCKING VOTE. Vote for the (D)’s. That's just BS another tangent TC just made up in order to distract you from thinking about the ACTUAL STORY and move you off the spot. Example: Onlookers outside a mall pointing to two mushroom clouds exploding on the horizon: "LOOK!! OMG!! WHO DID THIS?!! WHAT SHOULD WE DO??! WHERE SHOULD WE GO??" TC: "I HOPE OUR RESTAURANT'S EARLY-BIRD SPECIAL OF CHICKEN RISOTTO AND MUSHROOM ISN'T AFFECTED. (*yawn*) OH THE MUSHROOM CLOUD...MEH...IT'S PROBABLY JUST A BAR-B-Q GRILL PROBLEM...WHICH REMINDS ME -- DID YOU HEAR ABOUT BILL O'REILLY's NEW LAWSUIT?...." Btw -- "KKK"?? "Nazi-types"?? Lol...total and absolute phantom-bullshit story/issue that exists ONLY in the fevered CT minds of MSNBC, CNN, and...TooCartoonative. Here's a legit question that could be asked of TRUMP: "Can you please look into the un-regulated, un-questioned Black Spook Budget for cuts?" Liberator  posted on  2019-09-16   16:30:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #24. To: Dead Culture Watch (#20) No evidence ever of anything. The photograph is really all I need. The image of Graham/Truman caps off more than thirty years of listening to other Christians telling me that Graham is a mason. Those of us in the local churches have heard this for decades, and ignored it for just as long. The photograph, that ain't no lie. It's black and white. As for the molestation accusations, those come from Fiona Barnett, who lists Graham as one of her abusers when she was a child. I would normally take anything like Barnett's claims with a grain of salt. If she were ritualistically abused as a child she would naturally be messed up in her thinking. And, it is just her word against a famous preacher. However, the final straw for me concerning Billy Graham and his fraudulent ministry...was Franklin Graham's visit to Voodoo Donuts. This was real. Like father, like son. If you are unfamiliar with Voodoo Donuts you can find out more on Barnett's own website. https://pedophilesdownunder.com/2018/08/06/franklin-graham-supports-voodoo-doughnut-child-traffickers/ My goal is not to slime anyone, but simply show Graham (and son) for what he is... a false teacher who deliberately hid his masonic beliefs from us to become the highest leader of the evangelical church. All based on lies. watchman  posted on  2019-09-16   17:00:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #25. To: Dead Culture Watch (#18) Most are prior military. Most are respected family men. They rise through ranks by being active and learning lines in the LARP they engage in. Leadership is elected. The square and compass represent becoming better men. That's one perspective. I won't challenge your *personal* experience with the "brothers" and the purported exoteric image, goals, and benevolence. That is what it is. It's the esoteric that is darker. MUCH darker. Of those who take it and its "promotions" to higher degrees, the whole Masonic experience changes. The oaths and loyalty is to "The Light." And no, *this* "Light" is NOT God. Now why......would any evil organization insist to join you need someone to vouch for your character, (they need to before you join.) then, want you to be better men, then, as your commitment to the organization gets rewarded assuming you also have leadership qualities, would you expect those people to become bad? Few orgs are "evil" right out of the box; Who would join in that case? Trust and secrecy is of utmost importance for orgs with certain philosophies and agendas to mask or hide. Again, the exoteric or apparent-to-the-outside reputation and policy/agenda IS benevolent in most cases. Yup. Adult Boy-Scout stuff. It has to be. Lower-degree Masons are satisfied and even find fulfillment and respect from their accomplishments and good deeds.... But again -- as what happens with most agencies or organization with power (i.e. Military/LE/Feebs & Spooks/Govt/Business/Corporations/Churches/Synagogues//"Societies", the lower & level/grunts do all the heavy lifting, unaware of what's happening higher up the food-chain. It is the UPPER-ECHELON of control who direct the esoteric, mysterious/hidden agenda. You know this -- the grunts have NO idea what the General Staff, Presidents, Boards, Judiciaries (Yes ESPECIALLY judiciaries) and Czars are doing or planning. At the higher level of Freemasonry, the action supports what it is: A Mystery Religion whose goal is Ultimate Secret Knowledge; One that worships "The Light." The Sun. Lucifer. Look it up. Test everything yourself. Don't believe me, DCW. (*I* could have an "agenda.") And please, show me any evidence of any Mason in the last 100 years who’s done any nefarious stuff. Having a secretary embezzle some cash doesn’t count. I’m talking about any truly nefarious shit. Secretarial embezzlement -- we wish. Evidence? Up the wazoo out there. I'll submit stuff and links to you IF you really want to go there. Goes waaay back. Much further than just 100 years. The Masons leaders are just fellas who’ve been chosen by members to be leaders. There is NO other way to get there. This is NOT a recipe for evil, but rather, for good, given who becomes Masons. Yes, benevolent. At least exoterically speaking, from all appearances. I understand there's an election for leadership. As to possible abetting of nefarious activities or "evil" at any specific Lodge, I can't say. However, the Masonic agenda IS evolving nonetheless. And btw, ever wonder why so many of the rich and their Orgs always have their Foundations and Charities to help people? Some believe...it gives them public cover. Guess what? It does. If an org or individual gives a million dollars to a Children Hospital, who is gonna really to a forensic exam on their life? Robert Kraft (owner of the NE Patriots football team) took many of his players to Israel over the summer to walk The Holy Land. (Coincidence he did this just after he was busted THEN exonerated for soliciting prostitutes and possibly under-age girls?) Going back 140 years and finding a group who took the LARP a little too seriously and disappeared a member is not proof of a vast criminal organization bent on creating evil in the world, but rather, an emotional appeal based on pretty much zip. What's "LARP"? I argue this all the time on VOAT, and to THAT audience, I always snarkily say it’s a way to say it’s whitey that’s behind all the evil in the world. That causes most there to question their beliefs, which are based on mostly just fantasy anyways. ("VOAT"??)... "Whitey's Fault"; Whole different subject and issue I can weigh in on.... One would think, with all the shit they’re blamed for, there would be some Hillary, or Epstein level proof, instead of what is trotted forth as truth. But nah, it’s very thin. Remember -- What we see as "News" is controlled by just SIX corporations. Child's Play to control whatever narrative they want...which is exactly why THEY (The PTB cabals and their lackeys) DESPERATELY NEED TO DISCREDIT INTERNET SOURCES AS "CT!!" Fwiw, my favorite fearless MSM "Truther" is Tucker @ FNC. Lou Dobbs and Judge Jennine occasionally speak truth. But limited of course. Everybody else has yuge NO-GO News Zones or are controlled-oppo to various degrees. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-16   17:18:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #26. To: watchman (#24) Yup. Fiona Barrett. Amazing story and courage...AND research. Billy was a high-ranking Mason from what I've read. Graham's son is also badly tainted...sadly. I also can confirm Franklin's Voodoo Donut photo AND his sick tweets. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-16   17:23:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #27. To: Dead Culture Watch (#20) (Edited) BTW, I believe operation mockingbird is alive and well. So, I’m on board the thrust of article. I do find it real odious to slime a group of people who don’t deserve it in the slightest though. There IS big difference between members who are ignorant or oblivious of an Org's Agenda and acts. Once one does know what's supported at the top of the food chain, are they obligated morally to back out? Or instead consider themselves so far removed from "the action" while using membership out of making a living or group-friendship and helping others that it's ok? (just asking rhetorically). For proof of the difference between Grunts and "Brass," look no further than the varied way police depts are run in say Portland and...elsewhere. Same of the GOP. Same of the Court system. Same of the military "leadership", etc. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-16   17:30:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #28. To: Liberator (#21) CIA policy to subvert the truth through MSM propaganda Subvert the "truth" about 9/11? And what "truth" might that be? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-16   17:56:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #29. To: misterwhite, Liberator (#28) CIA policy to subvert the truth through MSM propaganda Subvert the "truth" about 9/11? And what "truth" might that be? Their policy is to subvert the truth about pretty much everything. (Former) CIA Director William Casey: "We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false". Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-16   19:00:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #30. To: Liberator (#26) Billy was a high-ranking Mason from what I've read. Graham and Ruth Bell were married on a Friday the 13th, at a night wedding service...bizarre. Graham's son is also badly tainted... There is something terribly wrong with that visit to the donut shop. The logo on Franklin's donut box states "Good things come in pink boxes" watchman  posted on  2019-09-16   19:36:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #31. To: watchman (#24) This is absolutely hilarious. Sorry for being rude, it’s my natural state. Ever see the episode of South Park with the underwear gnomes? That’s exactly what your thinking reminds me of. Step one: steal underwear. Step two: ? Step three: profit! What’s hilarious is you are equating one picture of two men, and a accusation, and using just that to put Masons on top of some ridiculous global conspiracy that is void of anything regarding any actual evidence of. Your step two is so obvious. Again, you deliberately avoid any discussion of any point I raise and instead serve up same old tired bullshit of, well, this guy was a Mason, and he did this, ergo, profit! Am I talking to a wall here? Wasting my time? It’s pretty much the reason I only post a couple posts a year for the last 7 years or so. If the damn Freemasons were so friggen evil, why don’t you, yes, you, infiltrate and expose this sinister world domination plan? Just become active, learn your lines, make friends, and make it known you want a larger role in organization. It’s NOT the Manhattan project. Jeez, they’re even running ads for members since their numbers are cratering. What an evil group! Seriously! But nah, all it ever is, is one person somewhere who was a Mason did something, or, in your case, was merely accused, and for you? That’s enough to flesh out crazytown. I need to start a crazy group and expose all those evil Episcopalians. Seriously, am sure there is just as much material to work with. You do realize there have been millions of Masons in this country, right? You’re bound to find a few things some have done that ain’t cool. But, take a good, solid look where that takes you. Ya, I get it, your brain is pozzed with this, and you will never admit this whole pile of shit is what it is. Pride is funny like that. Most times, all someone has to do to harden someone’s opinion is disagree with them. If they’ve been spouting this nonsense for years, it’s done. It’s like a terminal case. No coming back. When you can admit to yourself you have no step 2, we can talk. I’ve already given examples of conspiracies that have real legs to them in Hillary, and Epstein. Wish this place luck, hope that the improvements considered bring new faces. Would be nice for you guys. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-16   19:51:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #32. To: Liberator (#27) Dood. You entirely gloss over the “top of the foodchain”. Those guys? They are ALL ELECTED. By other members, first, within their lodges, and then district, etc. And don’t spout stuff about higher degrees. If you knew it was just about learning more lines in the LARP they put on once a week, you wouldn’t be saying that. It’s easy as hell to get to 32nd degree. My brother may one day be in charge of the district, he’s very well liked. Why? Well, he was instrumental in starting the lodges yearly ‘pirate degree’ where, the LARP takes on a pirate theme for one night, and also, getting guest speakers that carry a lot of weight within the community of theirs to discuss going back to tradition in the group. He also spends a lot of time at other lodges, and does a pilgrimage once a year to BFE in the eastern part of this state to the localized convention. THAT is how one rises to the ‘top’ and becomes the super nefarious puppet master. It’s THE ONLY WAY. They are ALL voted on to get there. And leadership changes constantly. It seems many just want to ignore their structure, the type of people in the group, what they try and do (become better men and give scholarships and to charities.) and cling to derp. They are very good men, on the whole, from top to bottom. Not a breeding ground for evil. That is simply a fact. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-16   20:08:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #33. To: All (#32) Edit: I hate coming across as ‘the voice of reason’, because to me, most of ‘those guys’ are full of shit and seek control over others, and dislike others freedom. Why? Probably because they’re miserable, and were not especially familiar or noticed by the fairer sex growing up. This thread is NOT in my wheelhouse, lol. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-16   20:29:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #34. To: watchman (#24) However, the final straw for me concerning Billy Graham and his fraudulent ministry...was Franklin Graham's visit to Voodoo Donuts. This was real. Like father, like son. If you are unfamiliar with Voodoo Donuts you can find out more on Barnett's own website. I'm not sure why Franklin Graham thought it was just fine to promote a donut shop with a witch-y sounding name that sells a lot of donuts with (allegedly humorous) names like Cock And Balls. Or Triple Chocolate Penetration, etc. Graham and Ruth Bell were married on a Friday the 13th, at a night wedding service...bizarre. Graham was America's most famous Baptist preacher. His wife was Presbyterian. When the children were born, they were baptized as infants. I was suspicious of Graham over that, just as I was when he joined the World Council of Churches and wandered around praising the pope as the greatest living evangelist. When Graham was passed leadership of the most conservative fundamentalist group in the country at the beginning of his career, he repudiated the pledges he had made to keep their public profile fundamentalist. This was the beginning of the rise of evangelicalism to eventually crush the fundamentalist churches. Graham was always a phony. He told quite a few major lies. He promoted himself by palling around with presidents, including the young alcoholic Bush Junior who he "saved" from alcoholism so he could become a good president like his daddy. Graham also planted his own volunteers in the audience of his televised rallies to come forward to be "saved", to make it look like his preaching was effective and that it was worthwhile for donors to continue sending him money to hold more rallies. Graham's preaching was strikingly weak and he had a noteworthy habit of chopping key doctrinal verses in half, leaving off the "bad half" that emphasized human guilt for sin and human responsibility to turn away from their own path of destruction. I called this "verse-chopping" and it characterizes Graham's preaching in my mind. I do think there is enough evidence and testimony against Graham to believe credibly that he was a 33rd degree Mason. And that he concealed that and lied about it for decades. I used to consider Graham more respectable than Falwell or Robertson. I've realized think that Falwell, an actual Baptist fundamentalist, was more honest about his positions and politics than Graham ever was. Robertson remains in the tank, another Benny Hinn type. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-17   5:35:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #35. To: Dead Culture Watch (#32) Those guys? They are ALL ELECTED. By other members, first, within their lodges, and then district, etc. You mean, elected by other Satanic pedophiles? Well, he was instrumental in starting the lodges yearly ‘pirate degree’ where, the LARP takes on a pirate theme for one night, and also, getting guest speakers that carry a lot of weight within the community of theirs to discuss going back to tradition in the group. Going back to tradition? There is nothing traditional about America and there hasn't been for many years. Tell me, is there anyone under 70 attending these meetings? He also spends a lot of time at other lodges, and does a pilgrimage once a year to BFE in the eastern part of this state to the localized convention. I thought the state and national conventions were where the Satanic/Masonic (same thing really) pedophiles worship Satan by sacrificing children to their master, Satan. They lure those children into their hands by offering them Voodoo Donuts™ with sexually suggestive names and shapes. Next thing you know, little Johnny is on an altar with donut crumbs around his mouth with the high priest/33rd degree Mason standing over him with a knife dripping with his blood. what they try and do (become better men and give scholarships and to charities. Hush money to silence their surviving victims and pay off local authorities to suppress prosecution of their criminal acts. Remember, kids, don't accept any donuts from a sleazy old dude with a funny little hat or strange costume. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-17   5:46:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #36. To: watchman, Liberator, Dead Culture Watch (#30) (Edited) I knew the Masons and other men's clubs and orgs like Kiwanis and KoC and such were in decline but hadn't seen any numbers in recent years. So I thought I'd look those up. I'll include a table of members by state so you can better determine how much of a threat these donut-munching Satanic/Masonic pedophiles pose to your children and grandchildren. Masonic Service Organization of North America: Masonic Membership Stats Membership Totals since 1924 The Masonic Service Association has compiled the following table of totals of Master Masons in the United Sates Grand Lodges for the fiscal years indicated. These figures are based upon M.S.A. records and do not necessarily correspond exactly with those published by other sources. YEAR U.S. TOTAL   YEAR U.S. TOTAL   YEAR U.S. TOTAL 1924 3,077,161   1956 4,053,323   1988 2,682,537 1925 3,157,566   1957 4,085,676   1989 2,608,935 1926 3,218,375   1958 4,099,928   1990 2,531,643 1927 3,267,241   1959** 4,103,161   1991 2,452,676 1928 3,295,872   1960 4,099,219   1992 2,371,863 1929 3,295,125   1961 4,086,499   1993 2,293,949 1930 3,279,778   1962 4,063,563   1994 2,225,611 1931 3,216,307   1963 4,034,020   1995 2,153,316 1932 3,069,645   1964 4,005,605   1996 2,089,578 1933 2,901,758   1965 3,987,690   1997 2,021,909 1934 2,760,451   1966 3,948,193   1998 1,967,208 1935 2,659,218   1967 3,910,509   1999 1,902,588 1936 2,591,309   1968 3,868,854   2000 1,841,169 1937 2,549,772   1969 3,817,846   2001 1,774,200 1938 2,514,595   1970 3,763,213   2002 1,727,505 1939 2,482,291   1971 3,718,718   2003 1,671,255 1940 2,457,263   1972 3,661,507   2004 1,617,032 1941 2,451,301   1973 3,611,448   2005 1,569,812 1942 2,478,892   1974 3,561,767   2006 1,525,131 1943 2,561,844   1975 3,512,628   2007 1,483,449 1944 2,719,607   1976 3,470,980   2008 1,444,823 1945 2,896,343   1977 3,418,844   2009 1,404,059 1946 3,097,713   1978 3,360,409   2010 1,373,453 1947 3,281,371   1979 3,304,334   2011 1,336,503 1948 3,426,155   1980 3,251,528   2012 1,306,539 1949 3,545,757   1981 3,188,175   2013 1,246,241 1950 3,644,634   1982 3121,746   2014 1,211,183 1951 3,726,744   1983 3,060,242   2015 1,157,987 1952 3,808,364   1984 2,992,389   2016 1,117,554 1953 3,893,530   1985 2,914,421   2017* 1,076,626 1954 3,964,118   1986 2,839,962       1955 4,009,925   1987 2,763,828       NOTE: * Indicates lowest point, ** Indicates highest total, ***indicates estimated U.S. Grand Lodges Membership STATE 2016 MEMBERSHIP 2017 MEMBERSHIP GAIN/(LOSS) ALABAMA 23,317 23,868 551 ALASKA 1,720 1,635 (85) ARIZONA 7,030 6,828 (202) ARKANSAS 13,753 13,048 (705) CALIFORNIA 50,694 48,196 (2,498) COLORADO 8,099 7,676 (423) CONNECTICUT 10,008 9,603 (405) DELAWARE 4,291 4,095 (196) DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA 4,266 4,144 (122) FLORIDA 36,777 35,494 (1,283) GEORGIA 36,975 33,799 (3,176) HAWAII 1,657 1,670 13 IDAHO 3,067 2,860 (207) ILLINOIS 57,197 55,210 (1,987) INDIANA 52,470 48,775 (3,695) IOWA 16,897 15,978 (919) KANSAS 17,304 16,427 (877) KENTUCKY 36,212 36,245 33 LOUISIANA 15,867 15,469 (398) MAINE 17,250 16,478 (772) MARYLAND 13,670 13,196 (474) MASSACHUSETTS 28,346 26,296 (737) MICHIGAN 28,860 27,383 (1,477) MINNESOTA 11,642 11,124 (518) MISSISSIPPI 15,747 15,257 (490) MISSOURI 36,100 34,012 (2,088) MONTANA 4,768 4,530*** (238) NEBRASKA 10,105 9,644 (461) NEVADA 3,695 3,584 (111) NEW HAMPSHIRE 5,321 5,088 (233) NEW JERSEY 17,935 17,278 (657) NEW MEXICO 4,094 3,551 (543) NEW YORK 35,394 33,595 (1,799) NORTH CAROLINA 39,312 38,173 (1,139) NORTH DAKOTA 2,774 2,752 (22) OHIO 82,958 80,602 (2,346) OKLAHOMA 20,641 19,594 (1,047) OREGON 7,712 7,347 (365) PENNSYLVANIA 99,245 97,822 (1,423) RHODE ISLAND 3,000 2,943 (57) SOUTH CAROLINA 33,694 32,191 (1,503) SOUTH DAKOTA 5,327 5,022 (305) TENNESSEE 35,930 34,858 (1,072) TEXAS 71,665 70,590 (1,075) UTAH 1,801 1,807 6 VERMONT 5,000 4,681 (319) VIRGINIA 33,762 32,473 (1,289) WASHINGTON 12,671 12,118 (553) WEST VIRGINIA 18,677 17,953 (724) WISCONSIN 11,155 10,796 (359) WYOMING 3,015 2,868 (147) TOTALS 1,117,554 1,076,626 (40,928) Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-17   6:41:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #37. To: Tooconservative (#34) I've realized think that Falwell, an actual Baptist fundamentalist, was more honest about his positions and politics than Graham ever was. Falwell's son is in hot water now. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/sex-and-self-dealing-welcome-to-jerry-falwell-jrs-liberty-university-2019-09-09 The thread has certainly wandered off topic. Just to nudge it back a little, the media did play a big role in Graham's popularity. From wiki... ...William Randolph Hearst sent a telegram to all his newspaper editors: "Puff Graham." As a result, within five days Graham gained national coverage.With such media attention, the crusade event ran for eight weeks—five weeks longer than planned. Graham became a national figure. Henry Luce also promoted Graham with coverage at this time, and by 1954 featured him on the cover of his magazine TIME. watchman  posted on  2019-09-17   7:38:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #38. To: watchman (#37) (Edited) The problems with Graham started at the very beginning of his rise. I see you are also focused on that. The rot with Billy Graham didn't start in the Eighties or Nineties. It was there at the very beginning. A lot of fundamentalist Baptists used to complain about Graham and his antics over the years, his claim to be a Baptist preacher (who had baptized his own children as infants), etc. The warning signs were there all along. And the endless praise for Graham from the libmedia, certainly enemies of Christendom, wasn't exactly an honor for Graham. He was never hated for being a Christian at all. Instead he was praised as the kind of wishy-washy Christian leader who could Judas Goat the rest of the sheep into being submissive and obedient to the State. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-17   8:34:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #39. To: misterwhite, Deckard, A K A Stone, Gatekeepers, ALL (#28) Subvert the "truth" about 9/11? And what "truth" might that be? Seriously?? Ok. Glad to be of service. Here is an extremely thorough overview (in only 5 minutes) of the EXTENDED "truth", sloppy deception, and attempted burial of several truths regarding 911 and its aftermath. If you or anyone else is still taking a "CT!!" position, please do go right ahead and try and refute ANY of this. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   11:32:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #40. To: All (#39) (1) “Let us never tolerate outrageous conspiracy theories concerning the attacks of September the 11th.”—George W. Bush, November 10, 2001 (2)...Classified as Secret but finally released in 1998, the memo stated, “Conspiracy theories have frequently thrown suspicion on our organization (@FOGGY BOTTOM), .... (3) The continued use of terms such as “conspiracy theorist” suggests that the CIA still controls the mainstream media [in a desperate attempt to quash all truth -- while continuing to advance the elites' Fake News, Hoaxes, and Paranoia.] The aim of this dispatch is to provide material for countering and discrediting the claims of the conspiracy theorists, so as to inhibit circulation of such claims [OF TRUTH].” (3) Please be reminded of the ORIGINAL genesis of the pejorative terms, "Conspiracy Theorist" OR "Truther." RIGHT FROM THE SOURCE. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   11:44:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #41. To: Dead Culture Watch (#32) They are very good men, on the whole, from top to bottom. Not a breeding ground for evil. That is simply a fact. Facts? Based on what? Who? As acknowledged, yes, outwardly or exotericaly "good deeds" are presented and even done on an individual basis. And maybe at individual lodges.... Your opinion is your opinion. Same of your definition of truth. Same of your definition of both "good" and "evil." And of course, your opinion is based on the extent of your knowledge on the subject and associations. The fact remains, the Freemasons stamped their own symbol on the Holy Bible and changed it; adhere to secret rules and secret ritual pledges, take loyalty oaths to and worship "A Higher Power," aka the Light/Lucifer and his "Knowledge." (no, nothing to do Jesus Christ or God. Or truth for that matter.) Since the late 1770s, the Freemasons have leveraged their influence and control over all matters of society ultimately NOT in the interest of benevolent motives. Their history and subversive goals go way back. I'm not going to belabor the actual history and knowledge on this org (And you certainly won't check out any links I could provide in any case.) Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   12:05:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #42. To: Liberator (#39) I watched half. All it does is snarkily question the report. It offer no alternative explanation. So I ask again. What is the supposed "truth" you're trying to claim is being suppressed? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-17   12:07:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #43. To: Tooconservative, Dead Culture Watch (#35) DCW: (Those guys? They are ALL ELECTED. By other members, first, within their lodges, and then district, etc.) TooCartoonative: "You mean, elected by other Satanic pedophiles?" What kind of person would leap immediately to that kind of bizarre conclusion? Oh, that's right -- The Forum Gatekeeper with the comically fake moniker of "Too Conservative." Bwaahaa! Still funny. TooConservative: "Remember, kids, don't accept any donuts from a sleazy old dude with a funny little hat or strange costume." Hmmm...You sure you haven't a extra window open? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   12:16:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #44. To: misterwhite (#42) (Edited) I watched half. I one-quarter believe you. All it does is snarkily question the report. It offer no alternative explanation. It's 5 MINUTES.. It offers bullet point definitive FACTS. You can't watch 5 minutes and you are about to watch 5 HOURS of detailed explanations? So I ask again. What is the supposed "truth" you're trying to claim is being suppressed? Try watching the OTHER 2 1/2 minutes and see if a bolt of lightning strikes a synapse. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   12:20:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #45. To: Deckard, misterwhite (#29) Their policy is to subvert the truth about pretty much everything. (Former) CIA Director William Casey: ****"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false"****. Amen, Deckard. MW -- how did you miss William Casey's own quote? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   12:48:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #46. To: TooConservative, Deckard, A K A Stone (#45) Well well... Your President is a "CT!!!" (Have you your butterfly net out for Trump? Or will simply declaring him a "danger" and "terrorist" suffice?) Liberator  posted on  2019-09-17   12:53:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #47. To: Liberator (#41) Sigh......it’s 2019. Don’t you have anything from the last 40 years at least? With as much evidence there is against a whole shit load of people. I still, see no evidence of the stuff you take on faith. (Talk about a religion, sheesh!) 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-17   13:40:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #48. To: All (#47) BTW, lemme make this easy. We all know the evidence against George Soros for what it is that you are EXACTLY accusing the Freemasons of doing. There are LOTS of money transfers to horrible groups that can be traced directly back to him. Show me one, just friggen one, instance like this with Masons. Can’t find that? Damn, they’re either piss poor evildoers of George Soros completely overlooked the cunning way they do this. But honestly, I don’t expect anyone to consider any of the things I’ve posted in this thread. It’s way too easy to tune out any such questions if they don’t comport to a belief hardwired in the brain. We used to call that being an NPC. It’s just programming from a non trad source. (Which is why many believe it.) I still haven’t had anyone address the structure in any meaningful way, so, I expect this question to be ignored as well. That which doesn’t fit the narrative is to be dismissed or not talked about at all. Instead, bring up with scary music in the background, something, anything from decades ago. Do powerful people conspire in private to increase power and wealth at the expense of the masses? Certainly. Do they need the structure of the Freemasons to do that? Hell no, in fact, that would be stupid, and that, they are not. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-17   16:06:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #49. To: Liberator (#45) MW -- how did you miss William Casey's own quote? Apparently a lot of people did, huh? Or they don't believe he said it. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-17   16:38:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #50. To: Liberator (#46) Your President is a "CT!!!" Nah. He's just yanking the chains of people like you, the real CTs. Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-17   19:28:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #51. To: Liberator (#44) (Edited) Try watching the OTHER 2 1/2 minutes and see if a bolt of li lightning strikes a synapse. Done. And it's exactly the same as the first 2 1/2 minutes -- a snarky summary of the events of 9/11 expecting us all to nod our heads and say, "Yeah, that couldn't have happened". Problem is, the video presents ZERO evidence of it happening any other way. A complete waste of time. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-18   11:40:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #52. To: misterwhite (#51) ....a snarky summary of the events of 9/11 expecting us all to nod our heads and say, "Yeah, that couldn't have happened". Problem is, the video presents ZERO evidence of it happening any other way. A complete waste of time. IS it possible your mind hasn't been hard-wired to reject ANY and EVERY notion of doubt? Just saying. Well... thanks for watching anyway. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   11:50:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #53. To: Tooconservative (#50) (Edited) He's just yanking the chains of people like you, the real CTs. Who is yanking WHO'S chain here? lol... There are none so blind who refuse to see (or hear.) Trump is OBVIOUSLY not yanking any chain with respect to describing the construction of WTC. HE KNOWS. WE KNOW. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   11:53:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #54. To: misterwhite, Liberator (#49) MW -- how did you miss William Casey's own quote? Apparently a lot of people did, huh? Or they don't believe he said it. Barbara Honegger, studied at Stanford University Originally Answered: Did William Casey (CIA Director) really say, "We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false."? I am the source for this quote, which was indeed said by CIA Director William Casey at an early February 1981 meeting of the newly elected President Reagan with his new cabinet secretaries to report to him on what they had learned about their agencies in the first couple of weeks of the administration.  The meeting was in the Roosevelt Room in the West Wing of the White House, not far from the Cabinet Room.  I was present at the meeting as Assistant to the chief domestic policy adviser to the President.  Casey       first told Reagan that he had been astonished to discover that over  80 percent of the 'intelligence' that the analysis side of the CIA produced was based on open public sources like newspapers and magazines.  As he did to all the other secretaries of their departments and agencies, Reagan asked what he saw as his goal as director for the CIA, to which he replied with this quote, which I recorded in my notes of the meeting as he said it.  Shortly thereafter I told Senior White House correspondent Sarah McClendon, who was a close friend and colleague, who in turn made it public.  Barbara Honegger  bshonegg@gmail.com Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-18   11:56:12 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #55. To: Dead Culture Watch (#47) Sigh......it’s 2019. Don’t you have anything from the last 40 years at least? With as much evidence there is against a whole shit load of people. Come on, man. It's a 5-minute overview that does some quick dot-connecting on the history and genesis of Freemasonry and worship of its cult and "god." NOT a documentary. (and again, those at and near the top of the Masonic priesthood are the ones who YOU should investigate. The grunts at lower levels have NO idea what's going on. All *I* can do is shine a tiny light on it.) I still, see no evidence of the stuff you take on faith. (Talk about a religion, sheesh!) Whole different issue. I realize and accept that you're locked into your own faith of non-faith, so I won't go there. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   12:00:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #56. To: Deckard (#54) So she says. But you would think that if the CIA Director did indeed say this we would have heard more about it over the last 40 years. I mean it's a pretty significant statement, no? Especially considering the source. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-18   12:19:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #57. To: Dead Culture Watch (#48) BTW, lemme make this easy. We all know the evidence against George Soros for what it is that you are EXACTLY accusing the Freemasons of doing. Really?? The Freemasons have officially been driving to the hoop as an organization for control of people and gubmint for abut 250 years. Under the radar (sorta.) Soros and his orgs are a relative wisp of smoke, acting on behalf of the LARGER cabal of Elites. IN THE OPEN. No comparison. There are LOTS of money transfers to horrible groups that can be traced directly back to him. Show me one, just friggen one, instance like this with Masons. Can’t find that? They run their organizations much differently. Apples and Watermelons. AND to much different long-range & personal goals. Honestly, I don’t expect anyone to consider any of the things I’ve posted in this thread. It’s way too easy to tune out any such questions if they don’t comport to a belief hardwired in the brain. Irony right there. *I* believe YOU believe you've figured it all out and laid out your supposed case. "Money Transfers"?? You believe THAT is a primary factor of comparing Masons vs. Soros agenda? Not even in the same universe. Soros isn't close to the high degree of control of people, politics, courts, business and organizations by Masons in the US. I still haven’t had anyone address the structure in any meaningful way... I haven't the time or motivation to post stuff you'll merely dismiss or not watch/read. And admit it; you're not interested in digging deeper than your pre-conceived notion of "Masons" other than at the benevolence achieved at the LOCAL local level -- which again is MUCH different than the agenda at the TOP of the food-chain. And expressly DESIGNED that way. It's actually ingenious. Do powerful people conspire in private to increase power and wealth at the expense of the masses? Certainly. Do they need the structure of the Freemasons to do that? Hell no, in fact, that would be stupid, and that, they are not. Not only "power and wealth" -- nearly EVERY org aspires for that. All I can say is...research it yourself. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   12:22:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #58. To: Liberator (#52) IS it possible your mind hasn't been hard-wired to reject ANY and EVERY notion of doubt? Just saying. Big difference between "I doubt it happened that way" and "It didn't happen that way". Moot point. In either case my response is, "OK. Fine. I can accept your doubt. But WHY do you doubt it and how DID it happen?" No response. People like you simply slink away and refuse to answer. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-18   12:27:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #59. To: misterwhite, Deckard (#56) You would think that if the CIA Director did indeed say this we would have heard more about it over the last 40 years. Aren't you forgetting about the unholy marriage between the MSM and CIA? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   12:30:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #60. To: misterwhite (#58) In either case my response is, "OK. Fine. I can accept your doubt. But WHY do you doubt it and how DID it happen?" No response. Come on, MW... Over the years theories on the WHYS and HOWS have been posted to death. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   12:32:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #61. To: misterwhite, Deckard (#58) People like you simply slink away and refuse to answer. You can't be serious. Ok, I'll bite... Be specific -- on which questions regarding 911 would you like answered? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-18   12:35:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #62. To: Liberator (#61) Be specific -- on which questions regarding 911 would you like answered? I'll make it easy plus give you your choice. A) If a fire didn't bring down WTC 7, what did and what is your evidence? -- or -- B) If a 757 didn't hit the Pentagon, what did and what is your evidence? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-18   15:27:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #63. To: Liberator (#57) Damn dood. Your fantasy world is built solid, I must say. The Masons at ‘the top’ are voted there. You fail, repeatedly, to grasp that. It’s truly amazing. There is no super secret squirrel level of masonry. And, you fail to provide a single iota of proof of anything sinister in last 50 years. Love ya man, but this thread isn’t a good look on you. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-19   0:50:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #64. To: Liberator (#61) Oh, and btw, it’s something I know about. Watching goofy videos with scary music talking about people who’ve been dead for hundreds of years doesn’t address a single thing about those questions and facts you just ignore. These retarded vids/stories have been on the interwebs for as long as it’s been a thing. And, I read, a lot. 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-19   0:54:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #65. To: Dead Culture Watch (#64) (Edited) Watching goofy videos with scary music talking about people who’ve been dead for hundreds of years doesn’t address a single thing about those questions and facts you just ignore. Such an astute observation shows a most perceptive insight of your understanding about how – rather watching goofy videos and spouting off what they others say - nice it would be to simply apply “critical thinking” to the thought process. This does not come naturally to some people, but fortunately, it’s something an individual can train himself to do. Regrettably, there will always remain among us, those who because of the high volume of information that carry so many varied opinions every day – it will always be really easy for them to remain afflicted with their cognitive bias. They are forever destined to continually get lost in the formative details that are being subtly channeled into their minds and taking complete control over their though process. Sad – so very sad … Salute, Gatlin Gatlin  posted on  2019-09-19   4:46:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #66. To: misterwhite (#62) A) If a fire didn't bring down WTC 7, what did and what is your evidence? Too easy. How about Larry Silverstein's own words? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-jPzAakHPpk "Fire"?? How can you be sure it wasn't purposely set as cover for...THE CONTROLLED DEMO?? Same pre-controlled demo as both towers. The "planes" were designed as cover as well. But I digress... Building 7 EVIDENCE (just a few bullet points): 1) Collapsed in its own footprint (yes, oddly, just like the two towers. A building MUST be pre-wired for such precision, taking far more time than a few hours.) 2) Corroborative testimony of people warned to get out of Building 7 (prior to the pulling of the building.) 3) A reporter announced on LIVE AIR that the building had collapsed. BEFORE IT ACTUALLY COLLAPSED. (Yes, even I watched this report in real time, live.) B) If a 757 didn't hit the Pentagon, what did and what is your evidence? The evidence from both perspectives of argument of exactly what hit the Pentagram is circumstantial. Your side cannot possibly cite any "evidence" that a 757 was actually what hit this building; Nor that a noob-pilot from Saudi Arabia expertly guided such an aircraft at near-ground level into the Pentagram (a direct hit into the General Accounting office, coincidently just a day after Rumsfeld public revelation of a missing $2 TRILLION.) As circumstantial evidence from the other side, there is absolutely ZERO video OR scientific, OR forensic evidence that ANY "plane" hit the Pentagram. Given ZERO video despite countless security cameras. I'm also going to discount the smattering of so-called "witnesses" (who happen to be gubmint employees) from afar who claim they "saw a plane." There isn't ONE shred of evidence to support the physics that such a large plane created such a small hole in the Pentagram. (a few lame props strewn around weren't convincing.) A mountain video and other documentation is out there, but why bother? If yu seek the truth you'll find it. Regarding the truth, this is yet another case of cognitive dissonance and, "We [blindly] accept the reality of the world with which we are presented." Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   8:45:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #67. To: Liberator (#66) A mountain video and other documentation is out there, but why bother? It amazes me that those who roundly criticize the MSM for lying unquestioningly believe they are telling the truth about paradigm-shifting events like this and others. Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   8:57:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #68. To: Dead Culture Watch (#63) Damn dood. Your fantasy world is built solid, I must say. There is no super secret squirrel level of masonry. Uh, ok. Love ya man, but this thread isn’t a good look on you. Same bro. Love you too. But in your case the adage, "we accept the reality of the world with which we are presented" also applies. If you seek the truth you'll find it. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   9:01:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #69. To: Deckard (#67) It amazes me that those who roundly criticize the MSM for lying unquestioningly believe they are telling the truth about paradigm-shifting events like this and others. Yup. Exactamundo. They want it BOTH ways. Letting any Goob "official report" and a pathologically lying MSM create their reality and truth makes no sense these days. That's called, "cognitive dissonance." Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   9:04:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #70. To: Dead Culture Watch (#64) Oh, and btw, it’s something I know about. Ok, I'll challenge you on this; That "something" is WHAT? Freemasonry? Watching goofy videos with scary music talking about people who’ve been dead for hundreds of years doesn’t address a single thing about those questions and facts you just ignore. What "questions and facts" have I ignored? I'll try and accommodate you. If that video were part of a meal at the Olive Garden, it'd be "The Breadsticks." These retarded vids/stories have been on the interwebs for as long as it’s been a thing. And, I read, a lot. With all due respect, if you're not looking into a certain area of knowledge to investigate it, you won't find it. Moreover, as quickly as many new (revealing) content hits youtube on a number of issues, it's taken down. Additionally, G00gle/Alphabet-Controlled algorithms are controlled and manipulated to bury such material as they deem "dangerous"...yeah, like "CTs" -- the thrust of this thread to begin with. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   9:14:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #71. To: Liberator, Dead Culture Watch, misterwhite (#70) Moreover, as quickly as many new (revealing) content hits youtube on a number of issues, it's taken down. Additionally, G00gle/Alphabet-Controlled algorithms are controlled and manipulated to bury such material as they deem "dangerous"...yeah, like "CTs" -- the thrust of this thread to begin with. There's an interesting comment HERE that might interest you. Scroll down to the comment made by Bill Bray, Former (Retired) Research Scientist at Central Intelligence Agency concerning Google algorithms. If you really want to take the Dr. Bill acid test, go into Google AdWords. That is where they sell key words to the highest bidder so that their site floats to the top (no it is not ‘free information highway,’ that’s how Google became a multi-billion organization). Watch the key words that are floating to the top. Then, look at tomorrow morning’s headlines in Google, Yahoo, MSN, etc. You will find that magically the minds of Americans predicted the next day’s news. This of course is not the case. The multi-trillion dollar surveillance of Americans that they told you is to ‘protect you from terrorists,’ and so on is not what they are doing. All cell phone calls (the verbal content, referred to as meta-data), emails, text, are monitored. Since the Patriot Act portion that allowed this to expire, they used the clause ‘on American soil,’ literally and monitor everything via the communications satellites. There are also an estimated 20,000 drones OVER (BUT NOT ON) US soil, monitoring verbal communications that are not electronic. This can be done via unidirectional microphone, or by bouncing a laser off your window. That includes car window. The Welcome to FBI.gov web site collects information, but is easier to access at Mass Shootings. In 2016 there were 384 mass shootings, almost 100 of which were listed as ‘terrorist motivated.’ So, the multi-trillion dollar surveillance network is not to ‘protect you.’ The system is designed to gather information on the ‘collective thinking,’ like the Borg, of the American public, and then design tomorrow’s news and media, literally overnight, to cattle herd you into a nice neat profile of behavior and commerce. Again, take the acid test. Look at what you have access to, AdWords, and then watch tomorrow’s headlines magically appear. At first you might think, well that’s what people are interested in so that’s what’s in the news. Then, as you look at the flow of headlines regarding international campaigns, what the President said yesterday, what the senators and congressmen are doing or being accused of, it starts to get a bit freaky. Do this for several days, and you will see. (More at the link) Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   9:37:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #72. To: Deckard (#67) It amazes me that those who roundly criticize the MSM for lying … Perhaps you will no longer be AMAZED after you read this – only one of many – article: Faith No More: America's Trust in Mainstream Media Hits Rock Bottom. People have reason and should roundly criticize the MSM – and they are doing that since polls show: 77 percent say major news outlets report 'fake news' Salute, Gatlin Gatlin  posted on  2019-09-19   9:41:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #73. To: Gatlin, Liberator (#72) People have reason and should roundly criticize the MSM – and they are doing that since polls show: 77 percent say major news outlets report 'fake news' Yet, people like you believe their lies about the 9/11 attacks. Liberator nailed it - cognitive dissonance. “Sometimes people hold a core belief that is very strong. When they are presented with evidence that works against that belief, the new evidence cannot be accepted. It would create a feeling that is extremely uncomfortable, called cognitive dissonance. And because it is so important to protect the core belief, they will rationalize, ignore and even deny anything that doesn’t fit in with the core belief.” - Frantz Fanon Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   9:47:18 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #74. To: Deckard (#71) There's an interesting comment HERE that might interest you. No, there isn't. You posted a link that led to an empty server page (a 404), here at LF. I kinda hate to admit that I do occasionally click one of your links. Too gratifying for you.     : ) Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-19   9:54:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #75. To: Liberator (#66) "Fire"?? How can you be sure it wasn't purposely set as cover for...THE CONTROLLED DEMO?? I'm not looking for questions. Anyone can ask questions. Questions are not proof that something else happened. What makes you think a fire was intentionally started in WTC 7 and not in any of the other buildings surrounding WTC 1 and WTC 2? Where's the evidence of your conspiracy theory? Similarly, where's your evidence of a CONTROLLED DEMO? You got ANY proof that explosives were used? No. All you have are questions. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   9:55:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #76. To: Tooconservative (#74) You posted a link that led to an empty server page (a 404), here at LF. Try this: Did CIA Director William Casey really say, "We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false"? Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   9:57:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #77. To: Deckard, Dead Culture Watch, misterwhite (#71) Outstanding info and reveal. Thanks... Watch the key words that are floating to the top. Then, look at tomorrow morning’s headlines in Google, Yahoo, MSN, etc. You will find that magically the minds of Americans predicted the next day’s news. Part of their simple programming. It's too easy for them. We are sheep led to the slaughter. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:01:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #78. To: Liberator (#66) The evidence from both perspectives of argument of exactly what hit the Pentagram is circumstantial. Where's the evidence from your perspective of argument that something other than a 757 hit the Pentagon? You got none. "Your side cannot possibly cite any "evidence" that a 757 was actually what hit this building" You mean other than the flight data recorder, the cockpit voice recorder, 757 landing gear, and personal effects from those on the plane? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:03:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #79. To: Deckard, Gatlin, TooConservative, dead Culture Watch, misterwhite (#73) “Sometimes people hold a core belief that is very strong. When they are presented with evidence that works against that belief, the new evidence cannot be accepted. It would create a feeling that is extremely uncomfortable, called cognitive dissonance. And because it is so important to protect the core belief, they will rationalize, ignore and even deny anything that doesn’t fit in with the core belief.” - Frantz Fanon Bears repeating. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:03:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #80. To: Deckard, Dead Culture Watch, misterwhite (#71) There's an interesting comment HERE that might interest you. No, there isn't. You posted a link that led to an empty server page (a 404), here at LF. Looking closer, you included a link to the intended page but failed to include a title for the link so it showed nothing at all. Then you inserted a blank link that resolves to the /URL page here at LF. IOW, an empty 404 page. Here is your intended link: Quora: Did CIA Director William Casey really say, "We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false"? I kinda hate to admit that I do occasionally click one of your links. Too gratifying for you to know that I read your posts, let alone inspect your HTML closely enough to detect your posting methodology. I hate the idea that you're sitting there, getting all puffed up with gratification that one of your posts was closely inspected.     : ) Tooconservative  posted on  2019-09-19   10:04:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #81. To: Tooconservative (#80) You posted a link that led to an empty server page (a 404), here at LF. Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   10:05:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #82. To: Liberator (#79) When they are presented with evidence that works against that belief ... Where's that evidence? You've presented none. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:07:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #83. To: misterwhite (#75) (Edited) What makes you think a fire was intentionally started in WTC 7 and not in any of the other buildings surrounding WTC 1 and WTC 2? Where's the evidence of your conspiracy theory? First of all, your original question was with respect to "Building 7." I answered you. I'll also repeat THIS: A building (nevermind THREE) does NOT fall into its footprint UNLESS it has been carefully and methodically rigged to do so. That also takes a lot more time than a few hours. "Evidence"? That would be Building 7 and the admission that IT was pulled; WTC 1 and 2 FELL IN THE EXACT SAME MANNER. Coincidence? Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:07:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #84. To: misterwhite (#82) Me: "When they are presented with evidence that works against that belief ..." You: "Where's that evidence? You've presented none." Checkmate. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:09:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #85. To: misterwhite (#78) Where's the evidence from your perspective of argument that something other than a 757 hit the Pentagon? You got none. I'll repeat this point; ALL the evidence from both sides of the argument are CIRCUMSTANTIAL. The side that supports a 757 hitting the Pentagram is weak. Especially given ALL video is either confiscated OR buried. There is not a single frame or photo OR video on the planet that shows a plane hitting the pentagram. Can you explain why that is? Can you explain why the hole that was created was a MUCH smaller width than the fuselage of that supposed pane? Can you explain the coincidence that the day before 911, Rumsfeld revealed that $2 tril was "missing"? Can you explain why the GAO that made that determination was the part of the Pentagram that was hit? Thanks. ...the flight data recorder, the cockpit voice recorder, 757 landing gear, and personal effects from those on the plane? 1) The flight data recorder. Did YOU hear the contents? 2) The cockpit recorder. (see above) 3) 757 landing gear. (but no wings, fusilage, etc.) 4) personal effects from those on the plane (you mean the strewn debris?) THAT'S the extent of your "evidence"?? A Hollywood set of obvious props and crime scene that's been tampered with and restricted from scrutiny?? Nope. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:22:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #86. To: Liberator (#83) First of all, your original question was with respect to "Building 7." Right. The building that was coincidentally hit by debris from WTC 1, starting the fires. You're saying that people knew ahead of time that debris would hit WTC 7, so they planted explosives in that building (and no other buildings) and started a fire when WTC 1 fell. Then, while everyone in the world was watching and recording, they triggered explosives to bring down an empty building that was going to collapse anyways. That's your conspiracy theory and and and you have zero proof. "A building (nevermind THREE) does NOT fall into its footprint UNLESS it has been carefully and methodically rigged to do so." These did. Where's your proof that explosives were used? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:28:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #87. To: Liberator (#84) Checkmate. Bullshit. You have no contrary evidence. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:30:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #88. To: Liberator (#85) Can you explain why the hole that was created was a MUCH smaller width than the fuselage of that supposed pane? Because the hole was created by the landing gear, not the fuselage. "Can you e yo you e you e you explain the coincidence that the day before 911, Rumsfeld revealed that $2 tril was "missing"?" He didn't say it was missing. He said, "According to some estimates, we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions." He meant that the DoD systems were so out of date and not compatible with each other that they can't track (by computer) transactions across departments. Your turn. If a 757 didn't hit the Pentagon, what did? And what makes you say that? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:41:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #89. To: misterwhite, Liberator (#86) "A building (nevermind THREE) does NOT fall into its footprint UNLESS it has been carefully and methodically rigged to do so." The Official Story of the Collapse of WTC Building 7 Lies in Ruins A research team at the University of Alaska’s Department of Civil and Environmental Engineering, led by Dr. Leroy Hulsey, Dr. Zhili Quan, and Professor Feng Xiao, Department of Civil Engineering, Nanjing University of Science and Technology, released on September 3, 2019, for public comment their findings from a four-year study of the collapse of World Trade Center Building 7 on September 11, 2001. This is the first scientific investigation of the collapse of the building. Here is the conclusion: “The principal conclusion of our study is that fire did not cause the collapse of WTC 7 on 9/11, contrary to the conclusions of NIST and private engineering firms that studied the collapse. The secondary conclusion of our study is that the collapse of WTC 7 was a global failure involving the near-simultaneous failure of every column in the building.” Notice three things: (1) it has taken 18 years to get a real investigation of the destruction of a building blamed on Muslim terrorists, (2) the only way “near-simultaneous failure of every column in the building” can occur is through controlled demolition, and (3) this remarkable finding is not reported in the presstitute media. In other words, the study is assigned to the Memory Hole. This is the way The Matrix operates. This is why you need this website. The only purpose of print and TV news is to program you so that you insouciantly go along with the agendas of those who rule you. Those who sit in front of TV news, listen to NPR, or read newspapers are programmed to be mindless automatons. ***** This was a 4-Year study. The NIST investigation was what, a couple of days at best? Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   10:42:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #90. To: misterwhite (#86) The building [7] that was coincidentally hit by debris from WTC 1, starting the fires. QUITE the coincidence. You're saying that people knew ahead of time that debris would hit WTC 7, so they planted explosives in that building (and no other buildings) and started a fire when WTC 1 fell. Then, while everyone in the world was watching and recording, they triggered explosives to bring down an empty building that was going to collapse anyways. Your first assumption is dismissed for insufficient evidence. HERE is what others have connected the dots and figured out (and I agree): ALL THREE were rigged with demo explosives in advance. This hasn't always been my position, but the evidence is convincing. If you want the details, do you own research. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:47:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #91. To: misterwhite (#88) the hole was created by the landing gear, not the fuselage. HUH?? Dismissed for HIGHLY insufficient evidence. He didn't say it was missing. He said, "According to some estimates, we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions." SAME THING. Let's not play semantic games. Rumsfeld was crystal clear. Your turn. If a 757 didn't hit the Pentagon, what did? And what makes you say that? You have still not provided any evidence that any "plane" hit the Pentagram. NONE. My explanation is already submitted. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:52:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #92. To: Deckard (#89) The secondary conclusion of our study is that the collapse of WTC 7 was a global failure involving the near-simultaneous failure of every column in the building ... … caused by … what? Faulty construction? Rust? Rats? They studied this for four years. So what caused the "global failure involving the near- simultaneous failure of every column in the building" and where's their proof? Nothing. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:53:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #93. To: Liberator (#91) You have still not provided any evidence that any "plane" hit the Pentagram. NONE. So? I'm merely asking you what DID hit the Pentagon? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   10:55:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #94. To: Deckard, misterwhite (#89) Notice three things: (1) it has taken 18 years to get a real investigation of the destruction of a building blamed on Muslim terrorists, (2) the only way “near-simultaneous failure of every column in the building” can occur is through controlled demolition, and (3) this remarkable finding is not reported in the presstitute media. Staggering. AND true. In other words, the study is assigned to the Memory Hole. This is the way The Matrix operates... The only purpose of print and TV news is to program you so that you insouciantly go along with the agendas of those who rule you. Those who sit in front of TV news, listen to NPR, or read newspapers are programmed to be mindless automatons. +2,300,000,000,000 ;-) Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:56:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #95. To: misterwhite (#93) I'm merely asking you what DID hit the Pentagon? We have no evidence exactly what it was; We can only speculate. But we do know what it was NOT. (a problem that can easily be sorted out by the release of countless video under lock & key.) Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   10:58:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #96. To: Liberator (#90) ALL THREE were rigged with demo explosives in advance. But how did they know debris was going to hit WTC 7? Let's say WTC 1 and WTC 2 collapsed and nothing hit WTC 7. How would you explain the collapse of WTC 7? Or are you saying the bad guys would go in and remove thousands of pounds of explosives? misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   11:02:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #97. To: Deckard (#89) This was a 4-Year study. The NIST investigation was what, a couple of days at best? Unbelievable, ain't it? Maybe it would be embraced by Congress, MSM and the public if that same little 13 year old girl who just presented her "Global Warming" case presented THIS study. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   11:02:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #98. To: Liberator (#95) We have no evidence exactly what it was But you know for sure it was NOT a 757 because shut up. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   11:04:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #99. To: misterwhite (#96) (Edited) How did they know debris was going to hit WTC 7? Debris hit everything within blocks. As to your other questions, they have already been addressed; There's no need to keep chasing our tail here. This is obviously a very dark chapter of history. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   11:06:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #100. To: Liberator, misterwhite (#95) (Edited) I'm merely asking you what DID hit the Pentagon? We have no evidence exactly what it was; We can only speculate. But we do know what it was NOT. (a problem that can easily be sorted out by the release of countless video under lock & key.) One reason for skepticism about the Pentagon plane is that the pilot, Hani Hanjour barely passed flight school. He was completely incompetent. Al Qaeda’s Top Gun In early 2001, he started training on a Boeing 737 simulator at Pan Am International Flight Academy in Mesa. An instructor there found his work well below standard and discouraged him from continuing. Hani Hanjour was in reality such a horrible pilot that he had trouble handling a light single-engine aircraft and even just one month before the attacks was rejected at two different schools because he was judged too incompetent to rent a plane and fly solo. Yet - a poor pilot was able to maneuver the plane in a downward spiral, turning almost a complete circle and dropping the last 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes? A pilot with a major carrier for over 30 years told CNN that “the hijackers must have been extremely knowledgeable and capable aviators”.[8] An air traffic controller from Dulles International Airport told ABC News, “The speed, the maneuverability, the way that he turned, we all thought in the radar room, all of us experienced air traffic controllers, that that was a military plane. You don’t fly a 757 in that manner. It’s unsafe.”[9] CBS News suggested that according to its sources, Flight 77, “flying at more than 400 mph, was too fast and too high when it neared the Pentagon at 9:35. The hijacker-pilots were then forced to execute a difficult high-speed descending turn. Radar shows Flight 77 did a downward spiral, turning almost a complete circle and dropping the last 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes. The steep turn was so smooth, the sources say, it’s clear there was no fight for control going on. And the complex maneuver suggests the hijackers had better flying skills than many investigators first believed. The jetliner disappeared from radar at 9:37 and less than a minute later it clipped the tops of street lights and plowed into the Pentagon at 460 mph.”[10] The Washington Post similarly noted that the plane “was flown with extraordinary skill, making it highly likely that a trained pilot was at the helm”. Hanjour was so skilled, in fact, that “just as the plane seemed to be on a suicide mission into the White House, the unidentified pilot” – later identified as Hanjour – “executed a pivot so tight it reminded observers of a fighter jet maneuver.”[11] The Post reported in another article that “After the attacks … aviation experts concluded that the final maneuvers of American Airlines Flight 77 – a tight turn followed by a steep, accurate descent into the Pentagon – was the work of ‘a great talent … virtually a textbook turn and landing,’”.[12] Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   11:22:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #101. To: Deckard (#100) Hani Hanjour was in reality such a horrible pilot that he had trouble handling a light single-engine aircraft... Yet - a poor pilot was able to maneuver the plane in a downward spiral, turning almost a complete circle and dropping the last 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes? No way. /Common sense. This is only one of countless laughable BS stories sold to the public in support of this dastardly hoax. Liberator  posted on  2019-09-19   11:26:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #102. To: misterwhite, Liberator (#89) “The principal conclusion of our study is that fire did not cause the collapse of WTC 7 on 9/11, contrary to the conclusions of NIST and private engineering firms that studied the collapse. The secondary conclusion of our study is that the collapse of WTC 7 was a global failure involving the near-simultaneous failure of every column in the building.” Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   11:33:38 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #103. To: Deckard (#100) One reason for skepticism about the Pentagon plane is that the pilot, Hani Hanjour barely passed flight school. He was completely incompetent. Nope. Flew that puppy right into the Pentagon. Yet - a poor pilot was able to maneuver the plane in a downward spiral, turning almost a complete circle and dropping the last 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes? Yep. Right there on the Flight Data Recorder. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   12:06:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #104. To: Deckard (#89) A 126-page report saying what happened couldn't have happened. Well, it did. And absent any other explanation, I'm going with that. misterwhite  posted on  2019-09-19   13:04:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #105. To: Deckard (#73) People have reason and should roundly criticize the MSM – and they are doing that since polls show: 77 percent say major news outlets report 'fake news' Yet, people like you believe their lies about the 9/11 attacks. The poll was not about the 9/11 attacks. Nice try at a diversion. Nothing CHANGES here. The polls STILL show people have reason and should roundly criticize the MSM – and they are doing that since polls show: 77 percent say major news outlets report 'fake news'. I have been given no reason not to believe the official report by the 9/11 Commission. And I have been given no sufficiently valid reasons to believe the fanatical adherents of the 9/11 Truth movement who are conspiracy theorists that dispute the official report by the 9/11 Commission. Until such time it can be factually proven that the official report by the 9/11 Commission is wrong and it is changed, I have no choice but to except those conclusions as the final authority. Salute, Gatlin Gatlin  posted on  2019-09-19   13:49:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #106. To: Gatlin, Liberator (#105) The polls STILL show people have reason and should roundly criticize the MSM – and they are doing that since polls show: 77 percent say major news outlets report 'fake news'. That was my point simpleton. You for example know that the MSM lies, yet when it comes to 9/11, you believe the official government narrative that they parrot. I have been given no reason not to believe the official report by the 9/11 Commission. As it has been pointed out before, even some of the commissioners believe the official 9/11 report was based on lies. The investigation was delayed, underfunded, set up to fail, a conflict of interest and a cover up from start to finish. It was based on testimony extracted through torture, the records of which were destroyed. It failed to mention the existence of WTC7, Able Danger, Ptech, Sibel Edmonds, OBL and the CIA, and the drills of hijacked aircraft being flown into buildings that were being simulated at the precise same time that those events were actually happening. It was lied to by the Pentagon, the CIA, the Bush Administration and as for Bush and Cheney…well, no one knows what they told it because they testified in secret, off the record, not under oath and behind closed doors. It didn’t bother to look at who funded the attacks because that question is of “little practical significance“. Still, the 9/11 Commission did brilliantly, answering all of the questions the public had (except most of the victims’ family members’ questions) and pinned blame on all the people responsible (although no one so much as lost their job), determining the attacks were “a failure of imagination” because “I don’t think anyone could envision flying airplanes into buildings ” except the Pentagon and FEMA and NORAD and the NRO. Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-19   19:45:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #107. To: Deckard (#71) No need to convince me Google is evil. I firmly believe it was given its boost to prominence by the CIA, which, I also view as evil. Look, I agree with most you you two on most things. When you’re wrong about something, I’ll say so. I am not in some sort of pact of intersectionality with any of this. I can believe the CIA is the worlds premier drug running organization, and that Rothschild connected banks are behind pretty much every war that’s happened for a few hundred years, and a myriad of other things. Doesn’t mean I need to believe Elvis is still alive because others who believe the same things about the CIA etc do too. I really wish you guys would look hard at what I’ve posted about the Masons. Theyre just LARPing. For shits and giggles.....imagine what you would be discussing had they played dungeons and dragons.....8-) 'What kind of man gives cigarettes to trees?' Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2019-09-19   22:54:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #108. To: Deckard (#106) Your conspiracy theories are indeed cause for lighthearted laughter. Thank you for sharing ... Salute, Gatlin Gatlin  posted on  2019-09-20   0:29:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #109. To: Gatlin (#108) Your conspiracy theories are indeed cause for lighthearted laughter. Of course you never looked at the links which provide evidence that the 9/11 Commission Report was a cover up - the 21st century version of the Warren Report. Oh wait - you're one of those kooks who believe, even after mountains of evidence proving otherwise, that Oswald acted alone and JFK was killed by a magic bullet. Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom. Deckard  posted on  2019-09-20   5:44:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #110. To: Deckard (#109) (Edited) Of course you never looked at the links which provide evidence that the 9/11 Commission Report was a cover up - I am not into conspiracy theories. Conspiracy theories are just for “dummies.” You don’t believe me? “Its true. It’s on the Internet.” Conspiracy Theories and Secret Societies For Dummies Salute, Gatlin Gatlin  posted on  2019-09-20   18:11:44 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply   Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest

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