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United States News
See other United States News Articles

Title: Poll: Farmers Support Tariffs On China
Source: [None]
URL Source: https://www.oann.com/poll-farmers-support-tariffs-on-china/
Published: Aug 15, 2019
Author: OAN Newsroom
Post Date: 2019-08-15 07:44:34 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 252
Comments: 41

A survey conducted by Iowa State University has found that farmers in Iowa, Minnesota, and Illinois support President Trump’s tariffs against China. According to the study, nearly 60-percent of respondents in those states expressed support for the ongoing trade war, while 14-percent had neutral feelings on the matter.

This comes after Beijing announced earlier this month it would be suspending purchases of all U.S. agricultural farm products in response to the Trump administration’s recent round of tariffs targeting $300 billion in Chinese imports.

Although the heightened trade tensions between Washington and Beijing has resulted in a near $10 billion decrease in U.S. agricultural exports to China, domestic farm exports have continued to rise. This suggests other countries have started buying products that China has dropped.

Nonetheless, farmers feel the tariffs have put pressure on their industry with nearly 80-percent of respondents saying they fear farmers will bear the brunt of the trade dispute. President Trump has been eager to address this fear.

“Again, they’ve said this many times, they’ve said they’re going to buy farm products, so far they’ve disappointed me with the truth,” he stated. “They haven’t been truthful or let’s say they have certainly delayed this decision, but it’s their intention to buy a lot of farm products and we did, we had a very good call with China.”

On Tuesday, the president announced he will be holding off on a number of tariffs scheduled for September, so consumers won’t be affected during the holiday season.

“We’re doing this for Christmas season, just in case some of the tariffs would have an impact on U.S. customers, but so far they’ve had virtually none,” explained President Trump. “The only impact has been that we’ve collected almost $60 billion from China, compliments of China, but just in case they might have an impact on people, what we’ve done is we’ve delayed it so that they won’t be relevant for the Christmas shopping season.”


Poster Comment:

Real Americans support Tariffs. Fake Americans don't.

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

#1. To: A K A Stone (#0) (Edited)

God bless Donald Trump as he continues to "Make America Great Again".

Gatlin  posted on  2019-08-15   7:50:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Gatlin (#1)

God bless Donald Trump as he continues to "Make America Great Again".

Yeah - for the rich farmers:

With farmers suffering from his trade policies, Trump has attempted to tamp down backlash with targeted aid packages—but, according to the Environmental Working Group (EWG), most of the assistance has gone to wealthy farmers.

Farmers Hit Back as USDA Chief Mocks Those Harmed by Trade War as “Whiners”

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:04:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: A K A Stone (#0)

Real Americans support Tariffs.

It's funny - seeing you pontificate on what a "real American" is.

I guess the farmers being screwed should just shut up and take it.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:06:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Deckard (#3)

I guess the farmers being screwed should just shut up and take it.

Nobody is being screwed. Not one person.

This is America support Americans not commies.

You are wrong so much of the time.

There is no right to buy made in China in the USA.

We should stop all trade with those commies you love so much.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:11:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: A K A Stone (#4) (Edited)

Nobody is being screwed. Not one person.

If you say so chump.

Farm income is way down, bankruptcies are way up, and farmers are relying on government payments to make ends meet.

So, of course, it’s the perfect time for Sonny Perdue to joke about “whining” farmers. #CantMakeThisUp https://t.co/Mj26XbKmPv

— Chris Lu (@ChrisLu44) August 13, 2019

Perdue’s characterization of struggling farmers as “whiners” came after the Trump administration announced it will impose a 10 percent tariff on $300 billion of Chinese goods starting Sept. 1, a significant escalation in the ongoing trade war between the two global powers.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:12:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Deckard (#5)

There is no right to buy from China. But American and support your fellow citizens.

You're like a bad cop.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:13:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: A K A Stone (#6)

There is no right to buy from China. Bu(y) American and support your fellow citizens.

U.S. farmers lost one of their biggest customers after China officially cancelled all purchases of U.S. agricultural products, a retaliatory move following President Donald Trump’s pledge to slap 10% tariffs on $300 billion of Chinese imports.

China’s exit piles on to a devastating year for farmers, who have struggled through record flooding and an extreme heat wave that destroyed crop yields, and trade war escalations that have lowered prices and profits this year.

“It’s really, really getting bad out here,” said Bob Kuylen, who’s farmed for 35 years in North Dakota.

“Trump is ruining our markets. No one is buying our product no more, and we have no markets no more.”

Agriculture exports to China dropped by more than half last year. In 2017, China imported $19.5 billion in agricultural goods, making it the second-largest buyer overall for American farmers. In 2018, that dropped to $9.2 billion as the trade war escalated, according to the United States Department of Agriculture.

Then there's this:

Rich farmers, not mom-and-pop farms, will collect most of Trump’s tariff bailout

The lone valiant farmer struggling to eke an existence from his hardscrabble farm — that’s the image President Trump wants you to think about when contemplating the $28 billion in bailouts he’s spending to cover farm losses from his trade war.

Think again. The vast majority of the dollars flowing to the agriculture industry via the bailouts is likely to go to farms with annual revenues of several million dollars. Most of them are major beneficiaries of federal crop support programs that steer billions in subsidies and low-priced crop insurance — including insurance that already covers some of their losses in the trade war.

The biggest payments will go to the wealthiest farmers, who need them the least.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:24:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Deckard (#7)

Go move to China asshole. See how they like your drug pushing. You will be killed.

You like trading with people who use slave labor.

Go fuck yourself again.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:27:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: A K A Stone (#8)

Go move to China asshole.

Go fuck yourself again.

Always a class act, aren't you?

Alternate text if image doesn't load

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:30:24 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Deckard (#7)

“Trump is ruining our markets. No one is buying our product no more, and we have no markets no more.”

Farners are still selling. I have relatives that own a farm in Jamestown Ohio. They are 100 percen for Trump unlike you anti Americans who prefer to sell out Americans so you can buy some slave laobr goods. This will help Trump as food prices will be better for Americans. Which you are probably not. Not a patriotic red white and blue one anyway.

Why do assholes like you prefer that Chinese have jobs instead of Americans.

Oh that is right America sucks according to you because we are not a narco state which is your wet jack off dream to make us.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:31:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Deckard (#9)

Always a class act, aren't you?

So says the drug pusher who hates America.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:32:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: A K A Stone (#10)

They are 100 percen for Trump unlike you anti Americans

Oh, so anyone who isn't 100% for trump is "anti-American"?

Your Hitlerian rhetoric is laughable.

This will help Trump as food prices will be better for Americans. Which you are probably not. Not a patriotic red white and blue one anyway.

And the delusional right-wing fascist gibberish continues.

I disagree with trump's policiy on this issue and I'm not a "patriotic red, white and blue 'mericun"?

Attaboy!

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:43:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: A K A Stone (#11)

So says the drug pusher who hates America.

I'm sick of your lies asshole.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:43:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Deckard (#12)

Oh, so anyone who isn't 100% for trump is "anti-American"?

No just some of you are.

You know the dumb drug pushers like yourself.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:45:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Deckard (#13) (Edited)

nevermind

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:45:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Deckard (#12)

And the delusional right-wing fascist gibberish continues.

I disagree with trump's policiy on this issue and I'm not a "patriotic red, white and blue 'mericun"?

Attaboy!

So being for tariffs like the founders were is fascist.

You must be a member of antifa.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:50:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Deckard (#13)

So says the drug pusher who hates America. I'm sick of your lies asshole.

It is not a lie that you push for legalization of harmful drugs. You claim the federal government has no right to limit any drugs. That makes you a supporter of walmart selling crack and heroin.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:51:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: A K A Stone (#14)

No just some of you are.

You know the dumb drug pushers like yourself.

Why can't you be honest about my views on how to deal with the drug issue?

The current plan is a massive failure - but you consider anyone who even thinks about trying a different approach as a "drug pusher".

Sam with trump's tariffs - reasonable people can RESPECTFULLY disagree.

Apparently, that's impossible for you.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:53:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: A K A Stone (#18)

That makes you a supporter of walmart selling crack and heroin.

Strawman: an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   8:55:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Deckard (#18)

Why can't you be honest about my views on how to deal with the drug issue?

I am. I've defined what I call a drug pusher many times. I try to make it clear that it means you champion legalizing harmful drugs. You say the government has no power to make harmful drugs illegal. That makes you a pusher of drugs.

I'm not claiming you sell drugs. Just that you push for them to be legal.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:55:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Deckard (#19)

That makes you a supporter of walmart selling crack and heroin. Strawman: an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.

No you are lying and you will dodge this question because if proves my point.

Does the federal government have the legitimate constitutional power to make marijuanna illegal?

If your answer is yes they do. Then quit complaining and saying they don't have that power. Well complain that you disagree if you want but don't say it is unconstitutional.

If you answer no they don't have that power. Then why would they have the power to make another drug illegal like heroin or crack if they can't make pot illegal?

Since your position has been that it is unconstitutional that would mean that you think it is illegal to prohibit walmart from selling crack or it would be illegal to prohibit someone from selling it in a vending machine.

Now go ahead and dodge again.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   8:59:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: A K A Stone (#20)

I'm not claiming you sell drugs. Just that you push for them to be legal.

I express my opinions. I belong to no group or organizations. I didn't vote to make pot legal in my state. I do not use any illegal drugs. I express my opinions - which offend you.

Deal with it like an adult, if that's possible.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   9:01:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Deckard (#18)

Sam with trump's tariffs - reasonable people can RESPECTFULLY disagree.

Apparently, that's impossible for you.

Yes reasonable people can disagree.

But you called me a right wing fascist for my position. Not so reasonable.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   9:02:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Deckard (#22)

Deal with it like an adult, if that's possible.

Ok I'll deal with it by calling you a pusher of harmful drugs on internet forums.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   9:02:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: Deckard (#22)

You're kind of like Cuomo who complained about being called Fredo. Now everyone wants to call him Fredo.

Pusher.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-08-15   9:05:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: A K A Stone (#21)

Wal-Mart selling crack and heroin, and selling it from vending machines?

I'd never endorse that - but you can't get that fact out of your thick skull.

Keep those strawmen coming - it's what you do best.

Does the federal government have the legitimate constitutional power to make marijuanna illegal?

An argument can be made that they don't.

Ten Ways the War On Drugs Violates the U.S. Constitution

Is the Drug War Constitutional?

Of course, you will ignore these pages, won't even bother to read them because it's easier for you to misrepresent my position and call me a "drug pusher".

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   9:10:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: A K A Stone (#25)

And once again, you've hijacked the thread to post your usual unprovoked attacks on me on an unrelated topic.

Way to go sport!

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   9:11:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: Deckard (#5)

and farmers are relying on government payments to make ends meet.

The Chinese government. We've collected $60 billion in tariffs from them them. Enough to go around.

misterwhite  posted on  2019-08-15   9:11:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: A K A Stone (#23)

But you called me a right wing fascist for my position.

Of course - that's so much worse than telling me to "fuck off".

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-08-15   9:12:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: A K A Stone (#0)

A survey conducted by Iowa State University has found that farmers in Iowa, Minnesota, and Illinois support President Trump’s tariffs against China. According to the study, nearly 60-percent of respondents in those states expressed support for the ongoing trade war, while 14-percent had neutral feelings on the matter.

Well, that only covers 74% of the farmers, assuming they were truthful and it was a representative sample. Trump should worry a little (or a lot) over that other 26% who would be hostile toward tariffs.

Real Americans support Tariffs. Fake Americans don't.

The Constitution contains tariffs as the primary lawful means of federal taxation. Not income taxes, not property taxes, and not sales taxes. The Founders believed only in tariffs so as to encourage domestic manufacture and prevent an outflow of capital to financial rivals.

Until they amended the Constitution in 1913 to institute a supposed very small and never-to-increase income tax paid mostly by the wealthy, there has been a steady expansion of all kinds of taxes and fees and such.

Wiki:

The Sixteenth Amendment (Amendment XVI) to the United States Constitution allows Congress to levy an income tax without apportioning it among the states on the basis of population. It was passed by Congress in 1909 in response to the 1895 Supreme Court case of Pollock v. Farmers' Loan & Trust Co. The Sixteenth Amendment was ratified by the requisite number of states on February 3, 1913, and effectively overruled the Supreme Court's ruling in Pollock.

Prior to the early 20th century, most federal revenue came from tariffs rather than taxes, although Congress had often imposed excise taxes on various goods. The Revenue Act of 1861 had introduced the first federal income tax, but that tax was repealed in 1872. During the late nineteenth century, various groups, including the Populist Party, favored the establishment of a progressive income tax at the federal level. These groups believed that tariffs unfairly taxed the poor, and they favored using the income tax to shift the tax burden onto wealthier individuals. The 1894 Wilson–Gorman Tariff Act contained an income tax provision, but the tax was struck down by the Supreme Court in the case of Pollock v. Farmers' Loan & Trust Co. In its ruling, the Supreme Court did not hold that all federal income taxes were unconstitutional, but rather held that income taxes on rents, dividends, and interest were direct taxes and thus had to be apportioned among the states on the basis of population.

For several years after Pollock, Congress did not attempt to implement another income tax, largely due to concerns that the Supreme Court would strike down any attempt to levy an income tax. In 1909, during the debate over the Payne–Aldrich Tariff Act, Congress proposed the Sixteenth Amendment to the states. Though conservative Republican leaders had initially expected that the amendment would not be ratified, a coalition of Democrats, progressive Republicans, and other groups ensured that the necessary number of states ratified the amendment. Shortly after the amendment was ratified, Congress imposed a federal income tax with the Revenue Act of 1913. The Supreme Court upheld that income tax in the 1916 case of Brushaber v. Union Pacific Railroad Co., and the federal government has continued to levy an income tax since 1913.

Notice that there was a temporary 1861 income tax which was repealed in 1872. Well, the Supreme Court was unlikely to tell Lincoln he couldn't have a federal income tax during a civil war when they'd already botched the Dred Scott case so badly. The Court would probably have otherwise struck that tax down too which they had a habit of doing.

As originally constituted, the federal income tax was supposed to be progressive, mostly paid by business and the investor class. It was supposed to alleviate the heavier burdens the poor faced in paying tariffs for vital goods and was supposedly more fair.

There is a genuine distortion in the modern application of the tax, particularly the tax deal that Republicans got Trump to pass. The new tax regime, unfortunately, undermines most of the fairness argument on income taxes to level the field mostly. But this was not a tax ever intended to be paid primarily by the middle class or working class. But since the states ratified the federal income tax, they have used that authority to run wild and run the rates through the roof or try to reduce them to almost nothing, depending on which party is controlling the Senate.

The real problem, I think, is the refusal of either party to ever permanently cut the size and scope of government including the military. Maybe especially the military, given that we spend more than the next half-dozen other countries spend on their military combined. And with so much money involved, there is a lot of fraud, a scandalously bad procurement and research system, a lot of money to produce rather mediocre weapon systems. And pay the men who staff the military and risk their lives for it no more than a stipend. Increase it a fraction if they have families because the pols are afraid to exploit them too nakedly for fear of public backlash.

We also need to limit income redistribution schemes far more. There are lot of people, maybe millions, on disability who aren't disabled at all. In fact, very large numbers of them have left their disability status and returned to work in the new Trump economy.

We need to end the corporate giveaways, the farm subsidies, all the tax breaks given to non-profits, the phony charities that are just tax deductions for the hobbies and social events of the rich, all that crap.

But who wants to elect pols who promise cuts and pain to various segments of the economy? No one except a few cranks like me. Our economy is so distorted by these various giveaways and protectionism that we scarcely know or can even understand the fairness of the system.

We need, more than anything, to take away Congress' checkbook for anything other than minimal defense needs and keeping the interstates maintained, probably spending about half of what we currently spend.

We have a real spending problem, not a taxation problem. Much as I like what Trump is trying to do, I'm not sure that his agreement to sign the GOP tax bill was wise. The deficits are high, even if the economy has responded. OTOH, he didn't get a 100 days of political honeymoon or the usual free rein that presidents get on spending. Hell, 0bama had no plan at all and was allowed to squander $1 trillion and almost double the federal debt in two terms. So I don't favor further expansions of debt as it is a hidden method of taxation that is extremely regressive and is only favorable ultimately to those institutions that are Too Big To Fail. It is otherwise extremely regressive, falling on working class and middle class families and the elderly and those without the means (or lobbyists) to get themselves exempted from the effects of such policies.

We also need for everyone to have more skin in the game. The rich, the upper class, the middle class, the working class, the disabled, everyone. No more voting for free riders who just plunder the system at will, knowing they'll never have to pay but they'll get a lot for essentially selling their votes for a greater return.

This is not what the Founders intended but I have to say that I think they expected it would happen. One of them called America "a democracy, if you can keep it". We've managed to live down to their worst fears, not their highest ambitions.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-15   9:58:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: A K A Stone (#24)

Ok I'll deal with it by calling you a pusher of harmful drugs on internet forums.

I disagree with Deckard plenty and have for a long time, as he can tell you. We've locked horns many times on things like bombing the sidebar - at LP and here at LF - for years on things like turning the whole sidebar into Ron Paul articles or anti-cop articles.

I made my complaints clearly known but I would never say that I think Deckard is advocating drug use.

He isn't a pusher, any more than you are. I can't even recall him ever posting articles about, for instance, the military now trying to use Psilocybin mushrooms to treat PTSD. The results have been promising for some. There have been other small studies that indicate that people taking as few as 1 small dose a month in a therapy session then going 3 weeks with weekly therapy, then another dose and 3 more weeks of therapy can show the highest rates of successfully quitting smoking with people who had tried and failed many times to quit.

Deckard is not a pusher. He's not even an advocate other than for decriminalization.

You can't seriously believe he's affecting public opinion by making some decriminalization posts here at LF, a quiet little forum of well-known and opinionated posters who greatly prefer to bash each other than to ever agree on anything. What kind of masochist would even do that?

If you're going to ban or restrict him, do it only because of something he has actually done or said.

The price of free speech is having to listen to some opinions you really disagree with.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-15   10:08:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: Deckard, watchman, Vicomte13 (#2)

With farmers suffering from his trade policies, Trump has attempted to tamp down backlash with targeted aid packages—but, according to the Environmental Working Group (EWG), most of the assistance has gone to wealthy farmers.

Farmers Hit Back as USDA Chief Mocks Those Harmed by Trade War as “Whiners”

If you want to hear the coldest silence you've ever heard, just recite the total amount of federal subsidies that some of the richest farmers in your local area have received from the feds.

EWG: EWG Farm Subsidy Database

Yeah, I really know how to be popular in a rural town when I feel like it.

For instance, I looked at my home county and found some fun results. These figures are only from 1995-2006. So some of these amounts are essentially doubled since 2006.

A classmate of mine leads the list with $1.5 million in farm subsidies from 1995-2006. His wife, a full-time teacher with high pay, signed up as well so she got $1.47M. Maybe it is petty of me to observe their struggling to avoid homelessness with only $300,000 a year federal subsidy. My cousin was next and got $1.3M but maybe he is mired in poverty because his wife only got $725K, leaving them with less than $200K per year to scrape by on. How can they make ends meet with only $200,000 a year in government checks? His buddy down the road got $1.3M. Another classmate of mine farms with his older brother and they each got only $830K each.

It really is a shame when these people suffer along, almost starving when they only get checks for $100K-$200K per year from the feds.

It really is a scandal. And these are most often some of the worst people in the county in real life. Despicable people and I have known them well my entire life. I've only scratched the surface of how worthless and greedy they are, how they destroy community life with their greed and their petty games.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-15   10:44:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: Deckard (#5)

So, of course, it’s the perfect time for Sonny Perdue to joke about “whining” farmers.

The farmers who are whining are the greediest assholes around who have lobbyists to make their displeasure known if they don't get $200,000 a year for free from the federal government. They think it is a constitutional right.

The farmers suffering most are the small farmers who get a pittance of the subsidies which really are designed and structured to favor the rich farmers over the poor farmers.

There should be a strict limit on how much subsidy any farmer can get. I'd put that at $25K, or $50K at the very most.

And eliminate the ethanol program entirely. It doesn't help the environment and may hurt it overall and we've got plenty of oil and gas here in the States through the end of the century.

You want to hear some real screaming from the "whining farmers"? Just suggest they should be capped on their subsidy payments and that it should be progressive so that the smaller farmers get the most aid. Then you'd hear some genuine panic.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-15   10:49:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: misterwhite, Vicomte13, A K A Stone, Deckard (#28)

The Chinese government. We've collected $60 billion in tariffs from them them.

Normally, we do agree with economists who say that the consumer ultimately pays for tariffs. And it is true.

So, if Apple chooses to produce iPhones in China, that is their choice and they need to plan to pay the tariff for using that cheap labor and high environmental costs. If Apple wants to produce its new Mac Pro computer and sell the base model in America, they need to make decisions. The base model of Mac Pro is $6,000. The price goes up rapidly. For a full-blown version, it's about $45,000. Then you can buy the $5,000 monitor. If you want a $10 aluminum stand for the monitor, that's another $1,000. But Apple just had to move production of the Mac Pro (last redesign in 2013) from America to China. Because, you know, Apple is so damned poor. We really need more subsidies so these precious geniuses don't just starve. There are barely 76,000 millionaires in the main county where Silicon Valley is located. How do they put food on the table for their waifs?

If you already thought that the Mac Pro was expensive, it may get even more pricy thanks to the US and China's ongoing trade war.

Apple filed a request with the Trump administration in July, asking that certain parts required for the Mac Pro would be exempt from Chinese trade tariffs. “There are no other sources for this proprietary, Apple-designed component,” Apple said in the filing.

The Mac Pro wasn’t mentioned in the filing but the following components, used in the Mac Pro were: a CPU heatsink, a graphics processing module, a computer frame and enclosure, as per a Bloomberg report.

Trump had promised relief to companies that can demonstrate that that parts can only be obtained in China. He has also tweeted that companies won’t face a tariffs if they make goods in the USA.

But Trump isn’t prepared to offer any such support to Apple. "Apple will not be given Tariff wavers, or relief, for Mac Pro parts that are made in China. Make them in the USA, no Tariffs!" wrote Trump at the end of July.

As a result Apple will be charged duties of 25 per cent in order to bring those parts into the US.

Where will the Mac Pro be built?

In its quarterly earnings call on 30 July, Apple’s CEO Tim Cook said that “We’ve been making the Mac Pro in the US. We want to continue to do that. So we’re working and investing currently in capacity to do so, because we want to continue to be here”.

The 2013 Mac Pro was built by Flex Ltd in Austin, Texas and was stamped with “Assembled in the USA”. An Apple spokesperson told the Wall Street Journal that the new Mac Pro is designed and engineered in the US and includes US-made components, emphasising that “Final assembly is only one part of the manufacturing process”.

There had been reports that the Mac Pro assembly would be moving to Quanta’s Shanghai factory in China, with the Austin, Texas factory closing, as per this Wall Street Journal report from June.

Yeah, I have Apple gear. That doesn't mean I don't recognize real assholes when I see them. I like Trump's demand that Apple build them here in the factory in Texas. Not dump their workers in Texas and move it all to China and whine about those bad Trump tariffs cutting into the earnings of the billionaires at the most valuable company in the world.

Currently, I've read articles about the big retail chains like Walmart and others trying to spread some of the tariff pain across their entire operation so the tariffs don't show up so much. It isn't clear exactly how that is going to work in the 2019 X-mas retail season.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-15   11:08:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: (#0)

In a war, you suffer short term pain for permanent gain.

The problem with China is that its predatory trading practices have allowed it to b to become an econo to b to become an economic leviathan, which has then embarked upon an ambitious mili military building program and aggression on every border.

Our continuing to trade with China as before, oblivious to the damage that the Ch Chinese are doin Ch Chinese are doing, is to literally be the capitalists selling the Communists th the rope with which to hang us, from Lenin's old trope.

To stop China cold, we must engage in some tariffs and protectionist practices. That WILL hurt our economy, but it will hurt China's more, just as the Smoot-Hawley tariffs hurt the US economy, but cratered the economies of our European competitors.

We know that these tariffs will hurt farmers and other parts of the economy. That is one of the reasons why Trump has pushed the Fed so hard to cut interest rates - to stimulate the economy to partly offset the effects o of the trade war. The other thing is to provide relief to farmers who have temporarily lost their Chinese markets.

It's a good strategy. Trump is right.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-08-15   13:59:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: Tooconservative (#34)

Normally, we do agree with economists who say that the consumer ultimately pays for tariffs. And it is true.

Unless China eats the tariffs to stay competitive. Which apparently they've been doing.

misterwhite  posted on  2019-08-15   14:50:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: misterwhite (#36)

Unless China eats the tariffs to stay competitive. Which apparently they've been doing.

If they do that, it's a direct wealth transfer from China to the US Treasury, r reducing the pressure on American taxpayers. If the Chinese go ahead and PAY t the tariffs, that's great!

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-08-15   16:09:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Vicomte13 (#35)

To stop China cold, we must engage in some tariffs and protectionist practices. That WILL hurt our economy, but it will hurt China's more, just as the Smoot-Hawley tariffs hurt the US economy, but cratered the economies of our European competitors.

The trade imbalance in China's favor almost dictates that they have to give ground.

Obviously, they are stalling Trump, repeatedly promising to buy more ag products and then finding a pretext not to. It sounds a lot like it does when we deal with their client state, North Korea.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-15   21:25:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Tooconservative (#38)

They'll stall until November next year. If Trump wins, they'll play ball because they'll have to.

Vicomte13  posted on  2019-08-15   22:20:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Vicomte13 (#39)

They'll stall until November next year. If Trump wins, they'll play ball because they'll have to.

I've thought of that. They may be hoping that Trump loses.

Or they could wait until next summer, pull their subsidies, and suddenly decide to let American retail prices rise sharply across the board, just in time for the election with Joe Biden leading the charge against tariffs that are ruining the economy.

Tariffs. They're bad for The Children. So Trump needs to go.

And I don't put it past the Dems to try to manipulate or crash the economy, just to defeat Trump. And prevent him from getting any more picks on the Supreme Court or to further deregulate.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-08-16   3:23:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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