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Title: *One-Stop Complete Resource Directory For Flat-Earth EvidenceHERE*
Source: Flat Earth Science And The Bible
URL Source: https://flatearthscienceandbible.co ... t-works-and-why-we-believe-it/
Published: Mar 31, 2019
Author: Flat Earth Science and the Bible
Post Date: 2019-03-31 15:02:34 by Liberator
Keywords: FLAT-EARTH, RESOURCE, DIRECTORY
Views: 5734
Comments: 78

How it Works

Introduction to the Flat Earth, How it Works, and Why We Believe It 

If this is your first time hearing about the flat earth, your first reaction may be like most people: shock, laughter, scoffing, and avoidance. But the Flat Earth Movement is exploding like wildfire and it’s not because it’s just cool or a good distraction. Surprisingly the Flat Earth belief is backed by solid science and undeniable visual evidence. 
So what is the Flat Earth all about and how does it work? 

INTRODUCING THE FLAT EARTH:

The Earth

The Flat Earth is set on a flat non-moving stationary foundation (1 Samuel 2:8; 1 Chronicles 16:30; Psalms 93:1; Psalms 96: 9-11). All the continents center around the North Pole and are surrounded by Ocean. Surrounding the flat earth 360 degrees on all sides is Antarctica. It is also known as the Antarctic ice wall and has been measured at 200 ft high and and thousands of miles long. Captain Cook sailed along the ice wall for 60,000 miles and never found an inlet. Bet you never heard about that in your history books.
The "South Pole" does not exist.

The Dome

There are different opinions on what is above the flat earth, but the general flat earth belief is that the earth’s sky is surrounded by a sky dome the holds in the air and protects us. The Bible says it is made of glass (Job 37:18). The Bible clearly describes a firm dome (firmament) IN which the sun and moon were placed (Genesis 1:14-19).

(Below are typical "Planetariums, which coincidentally utilize their own respective "Dome" which precisely mirrors the Firmament as described in the Bible, along with its depiction of the stars, Moon, Sun, and planets.):

The Sun and Moon The sun and moon are close and small and are located inside the dome/Firmament. They circle around and above the flat earth creating day and night and the seasons.


Poster Comment:

This is the most spectacularly extensive and comprehensive online site I've seen with respect to Flat Earth. Categorized and sub-categorized neatly, Flat Earth issues are addressed, examined, explained both scientifically and Biblically.

1) FLAT EARTH PROOF
2) HOW IT WORKS
3) GLOBE DECEPTION
4) BIBLICAL PROOF
FLAT EARTH FAQ:

http://flatearthscienceandbible.com/2016/02/10/flat-earth-frequently-asked-questions/

Many links are available -- although many have been purged and are still being removed as Flat Earth information is considered dangerous to the Powers That Be.

Bookmark the site for present/future reference. We don't know when this site or others which are deemed "dangerous conspiracy theories" may suddenly be erased.

"And the teachers and those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament, and those who turn many to righteousness shall give forth light like the stars forever and ever.

But you, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the Book until the time of the end. Then many shall run to and fro and search anxiously through the Book, and knowledge of God's purposes as revealed by His prophets shall be increased and become great. ~ Daniel 12:3-4

Shall we rely on Man for Truth? Or shall we rely on The Almighty? (8 images)

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#2. To: Liberator (#0) (Edited)

See any other flat planets out there?
Ever see the edge-on view of ours from the ISS? (You can watch it in realtime with any browser.)
How does the physics work to keep a flat planet from tearing itself apart?

Hank Rearden  posted on  2019-03-31   15:37:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Liberator (#0)
(Edited)

I went to your link and spent a few minutes.
Now I get it. It's a joke. A complicated one, but nonetheless a joke.

P.S. I've worked on designing and building satellites and have been to launches and in Mission Control. Later on I had a career designing and working on their tracking stations.
It's going to be tough to convince me that satellites don't exist. Scientifically-illiterate poli-sci types can be convinced of any bullshit, though, so there's an audience for this.

Hank Rearden  posted on  2019-03-31   15:42:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Hank Rearden (#2)

Ever see the edge-on view of ours from the ISS?

Yes.

I watched it. AND I've watched the entire case discredited.

This may p*ss you off AND make you think I'm even crazier, but unfortunately from the International Space Station footage I've seen it's included sloppy CGI, stunts, and smoke & mirror theater. The web is chock full of what's below:

The whole Mars "lander" shtick is also not real. Then again NASA must keep on justifying it's budget of $52 mil. ( I'd better stop now before you believe I'm a CTer. Oh wait...)

How does the physics work to keep a flat planet from tearing itself apart?

The "planets" aren't according the Flat Earth/Bible-based doctrine. The stars, planets, Moon and Sun are not 3D contructs; They are contained within the Firmament/Dome. (Just as depicted in a typical Planetarium if you've ever been in one.)

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:04:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Hank Rearden (#3)

I went to your link and spent a few minutes.

Now I get it. It's a joke. A complicated one, but nonetheless a joke.

A few minutes is all it took, eh?

There's that.

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:05:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Hank Rearden (#3)

It's going to be tough to convince me that satellites don't exist.

Satellites DO exist; In low, very temporary orbits.

You gotta believe what ya gotta believe. No prob.

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:06:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Hank Rearden (#3)

Scientifically-illiterate poli-sci types can be convinced of any bullshit, though, so there's an audience for this.

The irony is...THE most dogmatic people and cult in the world are...SCIENTISTS.

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:07:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Liberator (#4)

Occam's Razor, my friend. It makes no sense to declare everything we can see with our lying eyes and our machines is fake and we shouldn't believe our own lying eyes. To do that is to denigrate the brains God gave us.

I figure the men who wrote that stuff (assuming it wasn't mistranslated somewhere along the way) were grossly ignorant, extremely gullible or fundamentally idiots to have done so.

Isn't it a lot more sensible to believe that the writings have been faked a few generations ago rather than that the Universe has been faked?
Like Hitler's diary or Hillary Milhous Felon speeches, it's all bullshit.

Hank Rearden  posted on  2019-03-31   16:09:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Liberator (#1)

You've done it now and gone full blown kook.

A K A Stone  posted on  2019-03-31   16:10:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Liberator (#6) (Edited)

Satellites DO exist; In low, very temporary orbits.

Do you believe in gravity? How about the other basic laws of Newtonian (to keep it simple) physics?

If so, how does the flat-earth gibberish account for geostationary satellites? You know, the ones the provide DirecTV, phone calls, weather photos and launch-warnings for the commies? They can exist in exactly only one orbit, approximately 22,236 miles up. That's not "low". Low orbit is where the ISS, GPS and spy satellites play.

And yeah, I worked on synchronous, asychronous and even interplanetary vehicles; have held in my hands stuff that's now sitting on Venus and my father polluted the Moon, Venus and Jupiter with his machines. Or was all that faked as well?

I'm still wondering how we can gaze through our telescopes (including the ones orbiting our flat Earth somehow) and not spot a single other flat-bodied planet. We're just special that way?
And don't get me started on the perversions of orbital mechanics needed to get the sun to orbit a flat earth.

There's unlimited wonderment to gaze at, study and speculate about without having to make crap up.

Here's a thought experiment: why WOULDN'T the Earth be round? It would cause observations to look exactly the same and wouldn't require magic-physics to make it work.

Hank Rearden  posted on  2019-03-31   16:44:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Hank Rearden (#8)

Occam's Razor, my friend...

...we shouldn't believe our own lying eyes.

I agree, brutha.

Occam's Razor, more or less is defined as, "simpler solutions are more likely to be correct than complex ones." I have always seen a flat earth. So had the rest of the world until Galileo suggested it 500 years ago. The maps were all flat.

Did you check out the green screen NASA was using, caught accidentally as Poppy was wheeled through> And the others?

Of course not EVERYTHING is fake. The problem now must be conceded by all of us: Our "reality" CAN be manipulated visually. So our eyes CAN really lie to us, can't they? There's no way to discern between CGI in many cases and the real thing. Once NASA and "science" established their "Global" dogma = along with public ostracizing through controlled media and academia, it's easy to see how difficult it would be to ever discredit them.

Isn't it a lot more sensible to believe that the writings have been faked a few generations ago rather than that the Universe has been faked?

The Universe thought to be geocentric until 300-500 years ago. (yeah, along with the writings" of Science's "Global Warming," "Evolution," etc.

Like Hitler's diary or Hillary Milhous Felon speeches, it's all bullshit.

Ha, right -- and don't forget FDR, MLK, and Dubya.

I'm repeating myself here but I expect NONE of these possibilities to be acceptable immediately. MAYBE a few of people would investigate it and consider the whole NASA/Flat Earth quagmire. It's info I'd never seen until fairly recent myself and had never considered.

Fwiw I haven't believed in NASA or Moon landings in at least 20 years. Occam's Razor (the other side) applied ;-)

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:45:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: A K A Stone (#9) (Edited)

Thank you.

But...

I find it absolutely kooky that many who absolutely distrust gummint as total liars, see their agenda, note their propaganda, and acknowledge they are purposely ruining of the country....but happen to believe in NASA, the same members of "Science" shoving "Global Warming" and "Evolution" down our throat without a shred of evidence.

I'll give you a month to REALLY look things over.

At least that would prove you're just one more obedient zombie nodding his/her head at the same old dogmatic BS "knowledge" the corrupt, lying Public School system, colleges, politicians and Hollywood

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:53:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Liberator (#11) (Edited)

MAYBE a few of people would investigate it and consider the whole NASA/Flat Earth quagmire.

In addition to Magic Physics, that would require a decades-long conspiracy involving at least hundreds of thousands of people "in on it", with nobody leaking the scam or offering deathbed revelations. I don't trust most of Big Stupid Government, but I also believe most of them are to dumb to even conceive of such a hoax, much less maintain one.

Unlikely, to say the least.

It's probably easier to believe the Scientology crap about DC-8s flying around in space hauling clams or whatever their insanity preaches.

By the way, did you know God created Scientologists so the Mooslums would have someone to laugh at, and vice versa?

Hank Rearden  posted on  2019-03-31   16:54:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Hank Rearden (#13) (Edited)

[It] would require a decades-long conspiracy involving at least hundreds of thousands of people "in on it", with nobody leaking the scam or offering deathbed revelations.

I hear ya.

Then again, who knew the truth about Pearl Harbor, JFK, 911, and 0bama's entire life would ALL also be quashed for so long? Secrets *can* apparently be kept (or officially sealed.) For a loooong time.

For most people, exposing the truth is too expensive.

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   16:58:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Hank Rearden (#13) (Edited)

It's probably easier to believe the Scientology crap about DC-8s flying around in space hauling clams or whatever their insanity preaches.

"Beliefs" require examining the data.

That requires opening a door outside the usual paradigm of belief. The "payoff" is risky and costly; Financially AND socially. It requires surrendering an entire Belief System. And being called a "kook" or being ostracized and alienated from family. It's why many people in the world won't convert religion, their political party, and won't even dare consider challlenging established history and science issues.

By the way, did you know God created Scientologists so the Mooslums would have someone to laugh at, and vice versa?

Used to be the case. Till criticism ANF laughing at Mooses in public (or on TV) were considered VERBOTEN. Just ask Judge Jeanne, right?

Btw, who are those bald chanters who used to hang out at airports? I thought they were #1?

Liberator  posted on  2019-03-31   17:04:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Liberator (#0)

Oh my! This shit will kill your brain cells!

From a 2 dimensional mind everything looks flat!

This kinda of stuff gives good Christians a bad rap!

"Socialism corrupts and Democratic Socialism corrupts Absolutely"!

Justified  posted on  2019-03-31   18:04:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Liberator (#0) (Edited)

Let us just shoot down one or two "facts" in your article.

1. look at the map Africa is not thousands of miles away from South America, one part of Antartica is not thousands of miles away from another on the other side of the world

2. Cook did not follow the coast of Antartica for 60,000 miles. In a vessel of the type he had he would still be sailing.

3. the volume of the ocean has been calculated, and your map would make it massively larger

paraclete  posted on  2019-03-31   18:07:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Liberator (#4)

I've seen it's included sloppy CGI, stunts, and smoke & mirror theater. The web is chock full of what's below:

Typically, the "chromaky" screens (that term is new to me, I admit) are a single solid color, usually green as that's the color people are least likely to wear. They are often used for weather reporters as they have full size maps they want people to see in the backdrop.

I'm uncertain of the specifics but it seems a grid pattern screen would be less useful as a backdrop for chromaky purposes. I would speculate the grid pattern to be useful in being able to visually measure the distances things move in a zero G environment. That's assuming it wouldn't have a more mundane purose of simply acting as a curtain of sorts.

Another thought looking at the flat earth map... is the distance from Chile to New Zealand. It seems I can book a flight from Santiago Chile to Auckland New Zealand that is about a 13 hour flight non stop. The shortest route on that flat earth map would take that flight up the US west coast and Alaska, and roughly using the width of the USA as a 3000 mile measure, it would seem that distance would be about 18,000 miles, give or take.

Covering that distance in 13 hours would require a speed of about 1380 MPH, close to mach 2, which is far above the speeds conventional airline aircraft are capable of.

I'm sure you are aware of the enormity of contradictions that a flat earth model must explain. What ever information is on that comprehensive web site, I'm sure it will need much more.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-03-31   19:04:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: Liberator, Make Earth Round Agin, MERA (#15)

Make Earth Round Again!


Hondo68  posted on  2019-03-31   22:25:54 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Liberator (#0)

Shall we rely on Man for Truth? Or shall we rely on The Almighty?

let me give you this answer from God

Job 38:1-7 1 . He said: 2 “Who is this that darkens my counsel with words without knowledge? 3 Brace yourself like a man; I will question you, and you shall answer me. 4 “Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you understand. 5 Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who stretched a measuring line across it? 6 On what were its footings set, or who laid its cornerstone—7 while the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy?

paraclete  posted on  2019-03-31   23:45:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Liberator, Hank Rearden, hondo68, Pinguinite, A K A Stone (#4)

This may p*ss you off AND make you think I'm even crazier, but unfortunately from the International Space Station footage I've seen it's included sloppy CGI, stunts, and smoke & mirror theater. The web is chock full of what's below:

Tim Peake did not appear in front of a chromakey screen. It has been entirely debunked and didn't make any sense to begin with (to anyone who understands chromakey video).

Despite this, there are a pile of YouBoob trolls making these endless videos about NASA being a big fraud. Some of them are flat-earth idiots like Liberator, others subscribe to or promote other kookeries.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-03-31   23:52:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Liberator, Pinguinite (#4) (Edited)

unfortunately from the International Space Station footage I've seen it's included sloppy CGI

That checkerboard/grid pattern shown it the video is NOT a chroma-key green screen.

The guy who claims this in this video has absolutely no idea what he's talking about.

I work with one of those every day.

Alternate text
if image doesn't load

There have been instances of CGI fakery, most notably a few years a go when CNN used the technique to claim a reporter was somewhere far away when they were actually right outside the building.

This video is laughable - I noticed the comments at YouTube were closed - guess the guy couldn't defend his ridiculous claim.

Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen.
The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning.
Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom.

Deckard  posted on  2019-04-01   9:44:57 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Deckard, Pinguinite (#22)

That checkerboard/grid pattern shown it the video is NOT a chroma-key green screen.

I tried to find a YT vid that is 5 minutes or less that proves a point. Without context and technical explanation, it's a difficult task.

This singular video wasn't posted as a stand-alone deterrence for those who believe NASA, the ISS, and the images projected. It does however pose questions.

To your point -- ok, so it's not technically "green screen." (How do we know the blue-screen grid isn't a backdrop for *other* Virtual Reality programs? Sure. It is possible "astronaut" Tim Peake is just hanging out in front of a stationary blue grid screen for a perfectly good reason. MAYBE.

At the 1:30-1:40 Tim Peake is standing in front of a blue grid. He's also *simultaneously* also seen in front of typical NASA innards of a supposed ISS interior shot. (Note he is playing with a green tennis ball. YT link explains below)

Deckard, as someone who works in a studio, yes, CGI and older Green Screen tech *is* essential used by MSM for whether shots and background shots. But does your studio possess the latest greatest VR technology? CNN used available 20 old-tech CGI to fake onsite real-time "news." How often and to what extent is GI/VR tech being used to create illusions within "news" stories? (Mind-boggling proposition): To what extent have CGI/Virtual Reality technology evolve these days?)

In THIS context: Would a logical extension of thought be: WOULD NASA USE THE LATEST VIRTUAL REALITY/CGI TO DECEIVE US?

Here are some overlying legit questions and concerns:

To what extent has VR technology advanced??

Would the PTB allow THE citizenry THE most advanced Virtual Realty? OR... would they restrict this technology? We have to assume VR technology is far beyond what we're told to begin with.

WHO are "Virtual Reality's" biggest clients? Turns out it is NASA. NASA has contracts with Apple, Microsoft, etal.

If you'd prefer to an "accredited" person to examine Virtual Reality and contemporary SFX advancements and capabilities, here's a guy you might respect; He is quite familiar with "Virtual Reality," CGI, Photo Shop and the like.

Both of you will find meat on this bone. I realize 13 minutes is pushing the envelope, but...

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   11:58:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Deckard, TooConservative (#22)

This video is laughable - I noticed the comments at YouTube were closed - guess the guy couldn't defend his ridiculous claim.

The problem is TROLLS, shills, and pigeons who crap on the chess board, making civilized exchanges impossible.

These are the same trolls whose sole job is to distract, deflect from truth and make jokes of "CTs" and its adherents on subjects like 911, Dubya and his "Religion of Peace," gummint hoaxs, False Flags, Chemtrails, "Moon Landings," Vaccines, 0bama's fake BC and ZERO docs, etc. Yes, like TooConservative.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   12:05:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: Justified (#16) (Edited)

From a 2 dimensional mind everything looks flat!

This kinda of stuff gives good Christians a bad rap!

With which parts of Genesis, God's account of Creation, and reinforcement from the Bible do you disagree?

You might be surprised by scripture that even many Christians have totally overlooked.

Btw -- If the TRUTH "gives good Christians a bad rap," guilty as charged.

(Moreover, to WHOM are "good Christians" supposed to be "looking bad" TO?? The same Atheist/Pagan "Science" world that insists "Evolution" was man was created? That the "Big Bang" started the process of life? That a growing baby in the womb, heart-beating is NOT "life"?)

Either one believes the word God or word of Man. We have been conditioned to believe Man.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   12:15:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: paraclete, Pinguinite (#17)

Let us just shoot down one or two "facts" in your article.

1. look at the map Africa is not thousands of miles away from South America, one part of Antartica is not thousands of miles away from another on the other side of the world

2. Cook did not follow the coast of Antartica for 60,000 miles. In a vessel of the type he had he would still be sailing.

1) It's NOT my map; NOR am I representing it is intended to be to scale.

2) At a website with thousands of facts, I have not scientifically vetted all of them. I will also concede that not all of them will be correct. (SAME of most "history" and "science" books, and public school/University teachings and knowledge)

3) Captain Cook's "60,000 mile" journey is just one singular incidental point/issue addressed at that site. Some sources do cite that 60,0000 number (technically, 63,000 miles), but that number of miles apparently included his TOTAL sailing mileage.

Cook simply did NOT circumnavigate Antarctica because he could not. NOR does a supposed "Antarctica yacht race."

4) This singular incidental point can nor does not discredit the entire voluminous amount of data at the site. Just like one fatty piece of T-Bone doesn't taint the entire steak

5) I posted the first part of the introduction page. It might be helpful and informative to access the other categories and sub-categories.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   12:28:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: Pinguinite (#18)

Typically, the "chromaky" screens (that term is new to me, I admit) are a single solid color, usually green as that's the color people are least likely to wear. They are often used for weather reporters as they have full size maps they want people to see in the backdrop.

I'm uncertain of the specifics but it seems a grid pattern screen would be less useful as a backdrop for chromaky purposes. I would speculate the grid pattern to be useful in being able to visually measure the distances things move in a zero G environment. That's assuming it wouldn't have a more mundane purose of simply acting as a curtain of sorts.

I've never heard the term either FWIW...

Yes, many of us have been familiar with the Green Screen for what? 20 years plus? Yup, routinely used as the backdrop for news reporters and weather.

Your theory that the blue grid is used for measurements and precision in a Zero G environment is both logical and sensible.

The reason and function for it can be explained far more precisely and specifically by someone far more familiar with the technology at Post #23. IMO its an excellent rebuttal to "It's fake!!"

Another thought looking at the flat earth map... is the distance from Chile to New Zealand. It seems I can book a flight from Santiago Chile to Auckland New Zealand that is about a 13 hour flight non stop. The shortest route on that flat earth map would take that flight up the US west coast and Alaska, and roughly using the width of the USA as a 3000 mile measure, it would seem that distance would be about 18,000 miles, give or take.

Covering that distance in 13 hours would require a speed of about 1380 MPH, close to mach 2, which is far above the speeds conventional airline aircraft are capable of.

I agree with your assessment of that particular map and how it would drastically distort time/distance as the crow flies. But again, the map is not to scale.

I'm sure you are aware of the enormity of contradictions that a flat earth model must explain. What ever information is on that comprehensive web site, I'm sure it will need much more.

I am aware.

The site is as "comprehensive" as I've seen thus far in that it categorizes subjects, issues, and FAQ more than any thus far. Only the patient or those with sufficient interest will access it.

There is a vast expanse of new knowledge and information on the Flat earth subject. I am still digesting the logical, probable, plausible and proven. At the same time I have been trying to vet, discard, and sift through the opposites. I've also had to be discerning about disinfo/misinfo sites and its individuals.

Two main observations:

1) The Earth is NOT whirling at 1,000 MPH at all from the air.

2) We are stationary.

3) The Earth IS flat.

I see no appreciable curvature from the air (high altitude balloon with no convex lens (The rebuttal is obvious that "from Space" the earth appears curved/round. The author and source of all those photos are one and the same: NASA.)

I will say (from my honest perspective) that the more I research the subject, stronger the evidence for Flat Earth becomes. In one video, the subject addressed was your forte: "Geometry."

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   12:58:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: paraclete (#20)

let me give you this answer from God

Job 38:1-7 1 . He said: 2 “Who is this that darkens my counsel with words without knowledge? 3 Brace yourself like a man; I will question you, and you shall answer me. 4 “Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you understand. 5 Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who stretched a measuring line across it? 6 On what were its footings set, or who laid its cornerstone—7 while the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy?

Thank you for some great scripture. I agree with it in its entirety.

Do you believe God's Word should be believed literally? (It's not a trick-question.)

God in addressing Job's complaints actually become one of the Bible's best sources describing His earth. (Examine Genesis more closely, "The Firmament", etc.) Regarding The Almighty's "Foundation," His measurements and "stretching" lines, "marked" off "dimensions," earth's "footings" and "cornerstone" -- does all of that describe a "Globe"? Notice the footings, pillars, Firmament and respective location of Shoel or "The Abyss"or Pit of "Hell" -- often described as a location BELOW us.

This entire model of our earth and universe is especially extremely difficult to embrace after a lifetime of instiutional "science" conditioning from birth.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   13:25:20 ET  (2 images) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: Tooconservative (#21)

You've found the most ridiculous video you could find. Chyeah -- big surprise.

Either you believe EVERY single morsel and crumb you're told by the gummint and every institution available. OR, you've been trolling us.

Btw, the BIGGEST "troll"-job has been using the moniker "TooConservative".

You have NEVER fooled me.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-01   13:29:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: Liberator (#23)

At the 1:30-1:40 Tim Peake is standing in front of a blue grid. He's also *simultaneously* also seen in front of typical NASA innards of a supposed ISS interior shot. (Note he is playing with a green tennis ball. YT link explains below)

Looking at it, there's no indication I get it was simultaneous. Same guy, same shirt, same object on the left possibly, but it certainly was at a different time, and looks to be a different angle. Like after they took the blue curtain down. There's nothing amiss there.

I watched about half the 13 min vid, but all it is doing is making a case for how things could have been faked. But that's far below the threshold required to prove the earth is flat.

One Bible verse I will quote to you, as it's very applicable here: "Seek and ye shall find". Though I'd append: "even if it's not there". If you look for evidence that NASA has faked everything, you WILL find lots of it. If you look for evidence the world is flat, you will find that too. But... evidence is not proof.

The challenge for flat earth advocates is to prove the world is flat. Not to prove that it's not round or to show how NASA could have, might have, maybe faked all their videos and pictures. It is impossible for NASA to prove the video footage of the ISS station or the moon landings were NOT faked, as that's proving a negative and no one can do that. So if you want to prove the world is flat, you need to leave NASA completely out of the picture in your arguments.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-04-01   22:26:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Liberator (#27)

I agree with your assessment of that particular map and how it would drastically distort time/distance as the crow flies. But again, the map is not to scale.

I accept that it may not be to scale. However, my estimate of the distance would have to be off by more than double in order to bring the required speed down to what conventional airline jets are reputed to be capable of flying. And if the distance from Santiago to Auckland is only 9000 miles via the northern Pacific ocean, then it means the distance of everything else is also, more or less, halved.

I would press you on this particular contradiction as to me it's a glaring clear fact that seems to singlehandedly destroy the flat earth theory. I searched for an airline ticket from Santiago, Chile to Auckland, New Zealand. and found one advertising a 13 hour flight, non stop.

This site, which presumably bases this distance on a spherical earth, claims the distance as 6010 miles. Covering that distance in 13 hours (I recall the time being 12:55 but 13 is close enough) would yield a speed of about 462 MPH, well within the speed a standard airline is reputed to be capable.

www.prokerala.com/travel/...ckland/to-santiago-chile/

So I challenge you to show me how this can work in a flat earth world.

Maybe the site I found lied about the flight time required.

Maybe the properly scaled flat earth map shows these 2 cities far closer than I estimated.

Maybe commercial airlines are secretly capable of mach 2 speeds (and also have enough fuel to sustain that speed for 13 hours).

Whatever. Take your pick, but no more posts about NASA being a fake entity. That is immaterial to your flat earth case.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-04-01   22:49:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: Pinguinite (#31)

You've hit paydirt with your circumnavigation examples. Nicely done. For obvious reasons, the flat earthers won't ever tell us exactly where the "seam" is that we allegedly use to join together the edges of the flat earth into our phony Globe Of Deception.

I hope you're not expecting a gracious concession 'cause that ain't gonna happen. You're obviously debating a known cultic personality.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-04-02   10:12:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: Tooconservative, Liberator (#32)

I hope you're not expecting a gracious concession 'cause that ain't gonna happen. You're obviously debating a known cultic personality.

I have had many serious, in-depth and thoughtful discussions with Liberator, so much so that I will vouch for his honesty and integrity in spite of our disagreements, unlike the several here I have on bozo. While I am honestly surprised to see him take this position, I had already come to appreciate the incredible and very underrated ability of the human mind to believe things that are not true. In that way, it could be said that someone believing in a flat earth is not demonstrating anything any more unusual than someone honestly believing socialism would lead to economic utopia for all, or a Muslim jihadist honestly believing that an all powerful God would need help in destroying people who don't believe in Allah.

A look around here on LF shows just how abundantly diverse beliefs systems are on all manner of topics whether related to religion, law, politics, Trump, evolution, health... you name it. You and I disagree on what is proper US foreign policy too. This is normal and natural. We all think we are right, and I respect someone not because of what they believe but how they treat others. And so far as I've seen Liberator treats others very, very well.

As a proponent of reincarnation, I can empathize a little bit with Liberator's predicament of convincing others of a perceived reality that others don't give the time of day (though there is little to no evidence against reincarnation as -- I contend -- there is in abundance against flat earth).

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-04-02   11:02:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Pinguinite (#33)

And so far as I've seen Liberator treats others very, very well.

Moonies and other cult members also treat their potential recruits very, very well. It only proves that cultists find it easier to recruit people that they are lovebombing.

The nice thing about science is that it is true even if the scientist is a complete asshole. As long as he has the evidence required to prove his theory.

Would we have a higher opinion of Hitler or Stalin or Mao just because they treated others "very, very well"? I think not. Nor should we.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-04-02   11:28:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: Pinguinite (#31)

I accept that it may not be to scale. However, my estimate of the distance would have to be off by more than double in order to bring the required speed down to what conventional airline jets are reputed to be capable of flying. And if the distance from Santiago to Auckland is only 9000 miles via the northern Pacific ocean, then it means the distance of everything else is also, more or less, halved.

I would press you on this particular contradiction as to me it's a glaring clear fact that seems to singlehandedly destroy the flat earth theory.

Ping, I would absolutely concede that I don't possess nearly all of the technical knowledge and answers to questions that Flat Earth presents; By the same token, I can also say the same of explaining much this world and its geography (not to mention explaining the physics and mechanics of "Space Travel"/"Moon Landing.")

Our lower Southern Hemisphere, especially the entire continent of Antarctica remains mysterious. But I digress.

It should be noted that many contemporary scientists and astro-physicists still cannot either understand nor explain technical dynamics of say...dealing space travel, landing a man on the moon, then somehow returning him to earth a half-century ago. That knowledge, THAT "technology" was literally said to have been "lost." HOW can THAT be explained rationally??

As usual, you are contemplating and analyzing the subject at hand and issues you see as the biggest problems in the implausibility of Flat Earth. As well as it should be scrutinized as much as any theory.

At simple, conceptual geometry, I'm adequate; But it's not my forte as it is with you. I can not explain these types of flight measurements, distance/time you've presented.

It's still my opinion having considered countless information and my own eyes (I'm repeating myself, but the earth is demonstratively absolutely flat as seen from high-altitude balloons.) I'd like to present a lot more information, but it's an imposition and not considerate to spam LF with a hundred posts on this subject to make points and other reinforcement.

Again -- I readily concede I cannot answer your question and provide you a sliver-bullet answer. Because I can not, it nor any single issue should relegates Flat Earth into the trash heap. If for some reason things can't be explained, we don't deep six them, do we? That said, your point/questions can't be ignored either.

Many scientists and geo-physicists count themselves at Flat Earthers. So it's not as though they are ignore legit concerns as your flight/distance conundrum and other inconsistencies.

Three thoughts/possibilities:

1) Earth is round-ish.

2) The mapping/measurement data that's been established and presumed as an empirical geographical base-line is somehow different and/or erroneous in a mostly oceanic Southern Hemisphere and SW Pacific.

*Thorough investigation of the continent of Antarctica just doesn't exist. Exploration of the Northern Hemisphere and entire area surrounding the North Pole *has* been been thoroughly investigated.

3) We don't know. (I can't answer your queries, which are legitimate.)

(We haven't even access to validating exactly what lies within the inaccessible interior of 5,000,000+ sq mi of inaccessible continent Antarctica.)

At a discussion board link below, the subject you raised is hashed out on both sides of the flight/distance argument, titled 'Flight Time On Flat Earth'. If ever you carve out a few minutes:

http://serendipitous.boards.net/thread/67/flight-times-flat-earth-map

Take your pick, but no more posts about NASA being a fake entity. That is immaterial to your flat earth case.

I beg to differ strongly, Hoss. NASA is more de-legitimized the closer it's scrutinized. NASA actually *is* material to Flat Earth in that it's the biggest *active* advocate of the Globe and geocentric system we've all been taught. It's supposed "photos" depicting a round globe, images that serve as constant reminders and reinforced mental imprinting. It's inculcated pop-culture, history books, mapping, geography, "space-culture."

Btw, the following phenomena is curious, isn't it?

Flights over the Antarctica that shorten flights appreciably are FULLY RESTRICTED. Reason: "Weather is too cold."

Flights over the North Pole are ACCEPTABLE. (Isn't it just as "cold" there?)

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-02   13:35:11 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: Tooconservative (#32) (Edited)

Flat earthers won't ever tell us exactly where the "seam" is that we allegedly use to join together the edges of the flat earth into our phony Globe Of Deception.

Lol...

Proving as usual you write/think WITHOUT researching the subject and truth at hand.

("Seam"?? It's not a baseball.)

The "EDGE" according to Flat Earth mapping is the entire Antarctic wall.

"Phony Globe Of Deception."

Yes we DO indeed dwell in a realm of "Global of Deception." And Lies.

That you infer or imply that this world is about the Truth says everything about you and your worldview.

It's sad. And frankly, pathetic.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-02   13:44:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: Liberator (#35)

Many scientists and geo-physicists count themselves at Flat Earthers.

Really? Then you'll have no problem naming these recognized Flat Earth scientists.

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-04-02   14:24:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Liberator, Pinguinte (#36)

The "EDGE" according to Flat Earth mapping is the entire Antarctic wall.

At least we now know which of the Kook theories of a flat earth you subscribe to.

You are trying to map a sphere to a flat circle. And that has implications mathematically. None of which will help your Kook theory of a flat earth.

Let's see a map of your choosing which shows the actual layout of the flat earth as you understand it. All these kooks that you're following produce maps. Which one is the one you're willing to show us?

Tooconservative  posted on  2019-04-02   14:28:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Tooconservative (#34)

I submit that if those three had truly treated others "very, very well" we would already have higher opinions of them.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-04-02   18:31:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Pinguinite, tooconservative (#33)

I will vouch for his honesty and integrity in spite of our disagreements, unlike the several here I have on bozo...

While I am honestly surprised to see him take this position, I had already come to appreciate the incredible and very underrated ability of the human mind to believe things that are not true.

Thank you again for your respect and integrity and manner in which you routinely conduct our respective exchange of ideas and conversation.

As you note, though we may not agree with one another on points or perspective, there is still value and mutual respect in our exchange as we share respective information. It also takes a patience and consideration that many struggle to have due to lack of interest or time to begin with.

Yes, I concur when you speak of our inherent ability to believe things that are un-true. Or even unlikely, improbable, and...even impossible. How *does* that happen? What processes are involved? Are these opinions developed as a matter of systematic conditioning and imprinting from an early age? Are they developed over time as we process accumulated data? Do we believe what Mom and Dad believed? (ll is true, isn't it?) If not critical to living day to day, how important actually are our "systems of beliefs"?

All challenged dogma -- whether scientific, religious, historical, political, cultural -- WILL naturally be met with visceral emotional objection. That is a given. (This is why we are often warned, "NEVER discuss religion or politics" in a social setting.)

At the periphery of most dogmas however lie some hazy, un-clarified, cloudy areas. Some will declare themselves "Gate Keepers" or "Defenders of the Faith." It is *my* opinion that the most susceptible of these dogmas to challenge is "Science," a definition that literally changes often.

In that way, it could be said that someone believing in a flat earth is not demonstrating anything any more unusual than someone honestly believing socialism would lead to economic utopia for all, or a Muslim jihadist honestly believing that an all powerful God would need help in destroying people who don't believe in Allah.

Technically your statement is true....

... Except "Flat Earth" is not a religious or philosophical dogma. It's a theory that at its foundation is the Bible's account of Creation in Genesis (reinforced by several chapters and verses within scripture), supported by circumstantial scientific evidence, observation, and speculation. It can't be dis-proven nor can it be proven.

A look around here on LF shows just how abundantly diverse beliefs systems are on all manner of topics whether related to religion, law, politics, Trump, evolution, health... you name it. You and I disagree on what is proper US foreign policy too. This is normal and natural. We all think we are right, and I respect someone not because of what they believe but how they treat others.

Well stated and honorable ethic regarding "respect" we'd all do well to learn by.

Your additional observations are patently true; We may well find consensus on some subjects and opinion, partial agreement and quibbling; then full divergence of opinion on other matters.

As a proponent of reincarnation, I can empathize a little bit with Liberator's predicament of convincing others of a perceived reality that others don't give the time of day (though there is little to no evidence against reincarnation as -- I contend -- there is in abundance against flat earth).

To be honest, my "Flat Earth" discussion was never intended as a case to convince others of its validity; It has been presented as a case that warrants further (Read: ANY) investigation. It provides a possible alternative reality to explore for the first time as its bits and pieces are considered.

Admittedly, the recent and historical blatant rash of lies and censorship from all manners of governance and its depts, its obvious un-holy "marriage" to Mainstream Media/Social Media, the Academe, together with and coercive bureaucracy had been the facilitator of such exploration and skepticism of previous etched-in-stone government "truths."

As to a belief, the philosophy or theory of reincarnation as a matter of addressing and resolving a system of eternal justice is a compelling concept. I've presume many Christians at one time may have not only examined but considered.

In the final analysis for me personally during the first go-round many years ago, its possibility was examined and back then, those kinds of philosophies and it's various angles were shared and discussed by many.

I'd also taken a solid look as well into Newtonian Model, which is an adjusted model of reincarnation, relying first on deep hypnoses and past life regression as validation of as its underpinnings -- as well as truth as presented.

Imperfect man naturally wants and needs a second chance. Like reincarnation, The Newton Model accommodates in this respect. But maybe its too much of a good thing with little to no downside including an eternally patient "self-salvation." It's short on details, but necessarily so.

The Christ-God model is complete. It indeed *does* give second, third, tenth chances to learn the truth. His Laws. Our Responsibility. Our Free Will. His Judgement.

It begins with explaining Creation, the basis and purpose of life and wisdom, encouragement, the need for salvation outside of ourselves and explanation of attaining this goal, world history, prophecies fulfilled and yet to be fulfilled, and finally the explanation of eternal justice, eternal Salvation, eternal Judgment, and eternal Authority/Arbiter/Creator, and eternal Final Resolution/Home (Heaven/Hell.)

Again, let me reinforce "Flat Earth"; It is NOT a Religion. It is a Theory. Just like all other theories which have NOT been "proven by scientific methods."

Geocentricity is a theory. Creationism is technically a Theory.

The above theories are fully dismissed as "scientifically proven," which IS true.

Heliocentricity is a theory. Evolution is a theory. "Space Travel" is theory. A spherical global is theory. Global Warming is a theory. "Black Holes" are theory. "Outer Space" is theory. The Big Bang" and 13 billion year old universe are theories. NONE are "scientifically" proven.

The above theories are NOT SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN. (should we redefine "Science"?)

We currently are not allowed to independently venture anywhere *near* Antarctica. Air travel is restricted. People are restricted from exploring Antarctica proper.

If no one but international governments, military, and "scientists" are allowed access, we must either rely on said governments for the "truth" of what comprises the 5,000,000 sq mi (and beyond); Rely SOLELY on recent "maps" (ancient mapping displays flat earth); And rely on artists renderings and "satellite" photos) to validate exactly what lies within the interior and beyond of the Antarctica. Fact is, 5 million square miles of ANTARCTICA IS UN-SURVEYED. UN-EXPLORED. UN-DISCUSSED.

"We accept the reality of the world with which we are presented."

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-03   18:05:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Pinguinite, tooconservative (#39)

TooConservative:

" Moonies and other [Flat Earth] cult members also treat their potential recruits very, very well. It only proves that [Flat Earth] cultists find it easier to recruit people that they are lovebombing....Would we have a higher opinion of Hitler or Stalin or Mao just because they treated others "very, very well"? I think not. Nor should we...

Pinguinite: "I submit that if those three had truly treated others "very, very well" we would already have higher opinions of them."

OUCH.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-03   18:09:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: Tooconservative (#37)

You'll have no problem naming these recognized Flat Earth scientists.

Sure...

Right after you admit you chose the "too conservative" moniker to begin with as a trolling device.

Liberator  posted on  2019-04-03   19:04:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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