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Title: State Trooper Facing Murder Charges After Tasing A Teen Riding An ATV
Source: TechDirt
URL Source: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/2 ... r-tasing-teen-riding-atv.shtml
Published: Apr 25, 2018
Author: Tim Cushing
Post Date: 2018-04-27 09:52:30 by Deckard
Keywords: None
Views: 20251
Comments: 104

from the height-of-unreasonableness dept

More than two dozen hours of recordings and 600 pages of documents obtained by the Detroit Free Press have uncovered disturbing details of the senseless killing of 15-year-old Damon Grimes by Michigan State Trooper Mark Bessner last fall.

Lots of killings are senseless, including many of those committed by officers authorized to use deadly force. But this one was especially senseless. Trooper Bessner decided against all policy and reason to fire his Taser at Grimes while both he and Grimes -- riding an ATV -- were traveling at 35 mph down a residential street. To add to the insanity of his act, Bessner was the passenger in the cruiser. Having initiated the pursuit, Bessner decided to end it by tasing Grimes. The result was the complete, gruesome destruction of a human being.

Grimes had been driving about 35 mph on an ATV when Bessner — a passenger in a moving patrol car — fired his stun gun at the teen during a chase on Detroit’s east side.

Grimes slammed into the back of a parked truck and flew off his ATV. The impact of the crash ripped gashes into his forehead, both cheeks and upper lip and dislocated his skull. Doctors pronounced him dead on arrival at St. John Hospital.

Bessner is now facing murder charges. There's a good chance Grimes never knew he was being pursued. Earbuds were photographed at the scene of the fatal crash. No one involved in the pursuit has been willing to go on record as to whether they appeared to be in use at the time of death. Additionally, obtained footage shows the cruiser's emergency lights weren't activated until 24 seconds after the fatal crash.

What the Free Press has uncovered with this mountain of public records is staggering. Officers arriving at the scene expressed their disgust at Bessner's actions. One officer in particular registered her disbelief at what she was witnessing.

“His pulse is weakening because he was on that fuckin' thing, and you chased his ass,” Detroit Police officer Kimberly Buckner muttered to herself as she stepped out of her vehicle, her body camera recording every step and word.

As she walked toward Grimes, an unidentified Detroit police officer reached out his hand to cover the lens of Buckner's body camera quietly saying: "They fuckin' tased his ass while he was cruisin'."

Buckner showed more compassion than other officers, though. The unidentified officer she spoke with later stated police escorts for ambulances were reserved for injured officers not "bad-ass 15 [year olds]" who ran from the cops. The officer went on to state he had "no sympathy" for the dead teenager. Another unidentified officer is captured saying, "Don't run from the State Police. You'll get fucked up."

Unbelievably, Detroit PD officials had no idea this officer -- still unidentified -- had criticized the cooling corpse of a teen shot by an officer with a Taser while riding an ATV at 35 mph. Only at the prompting of the Free Press was an investigation instigated. The officer has been pulled from patrol duty while the investigation is underway.

The Michigan State Police have a lot to answer for, and reps aren't talking. A pending lawsuit is only part of the reason for its silence. The other part is likely due to its refusal to deal with a problem trooper until he was charged with murder.

Bessner has a history of using excessive force and has been reprimanded before for using his Taser inappropriately, including using the device on handcuffed suspects. The investigation into Bessner's conduct shows that over a four-year span ending in 2017, he had 40 use of force incidents, 17 pursuits and five car accidents.

If the Michigan State Police could be bothered to police themselves, this may have been prevented. Bessner was -- at best -- a lawsuit waiting to happen. This isn't normal behavior, no matter how his lawyer spins it. It appears Bessner is going to lean hard on the Supreme Court's Graham decision, if his lawyer's statements are any indication.

Bessner's attorney, Richard Convertino, agreed to an interview, but then didn't respond to requests to schedule it.

Convertino previously called Grimes' death tragic, noting the teen drove the ATV “recklessly and dangerously” and “actively resisted and evaded arrest.”

“During the pursuit, Trooper Bessner was forced to make a split-second decision under circumstances on the scene and at the moment which was tense, uncertain and rapidly evolving,” Convertino told the Free Press in the email, shortly after the crash.

If the wording in that last paragraph seems familiar, it's because it directly quotes a Supreme Court justice.

The calculus of reasonableness must embody allowance for the fact that police officers are often forced to make split-second judgments - in circumstances that are tense, uncertain, and rapidly evolving - about the amount of force that is necessary in a particular situation.

That statement in defense of Bessner's reckless actions is a bit too much on the nose. There was no need for this to be a 'tense, uncertain, and rapidly evolving" situation. A teen was riding an ATV and the cops were in cruisers. If the teen posed a risk to others, the solution was not to fire a Taser from a moving vehicle at an unprotected body traveling at 35 mph. That's just a good way to seriously injure someone. In this case, the injuries were fatal and the trooper whose best call under pressure was to commit an act almost every cop would find unreasonable is now behind bars awaiting trial. I'll bet he wishes he'd responded a bit more reasonably.

The State Police gave him every chance to show them what kind of officer he could be. And in the end, he showed them he could be even worse than he was in the four years leading up to his murder rap.

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#65. To: misterwhite (#56)

But the law says each case stands on it's own.

Unless, of course, there is an exception to the general rule. And the applicability of exceptions is within the discretion of the judge.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-29   23:01:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: misterwhite (#58)

Well, yes and no. If you or I were driving along some road on a sunny Sunday afternoon and fired a taser at some kid on an ATV just for the hell of it, yeah, we'd be charged with that.

But a State Trooper doing the same thing while enforcing the law and in an attempt to prevent injury? Maybe not.

Should be. State troopers should not be empowered to cause certain injury to prevent a very theoretical injury. 35 mph on a 25 mph street simply is not that fast or that dangerous. There's no indication that it was a crowded street.

Truth is, the troopers were pissed that the guy did not stop, so they stopped him, in a manner that anybody could foresee would cause serious injury or death. And it did.

Our society has indeed empowered them to do things like this, but as the incidents pile up, our society may decide that it is time to start taking some of that power back. And the place where that power is most logically taken back (given political realities) is the courts.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   6:47:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: misterwhite (#64)

From another article:

"Witnesses said the trooper pulled close to the ATV and fired his Taser during the chase, and they believe it might have caused Grimes to crash. Witnesses said the teen was trying to get onto the sidewalk when he hit the pickup truck."

Reasonable doubt?

Up to the jury in Detroit.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   6:48:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: Vicomte13, misterwhite, GrandIsland (#66) (Edited)

Should be. State troopers should not be empowered to cause certain injury to prevent a very theoretical injury. 35 mph on a 25 mph street simply is not that fast or that dangerous. There's no indication that it was a crowded street.

I can see why you don't practice criminal law. You'd be a disaster.

Maybe you can cite some evidence that:

  1. The officer did fire his taser, something only alleged by some cop-hating witnesses.
  2. The Holy Child on the ATV has electrode penetration injuries and electrical tissue damage to demonstrate that he did receive a taser shock.

You're making a self-righteous argument assuming facts not in evidence, at least not yet.

The witnesses and the accident scene evidence indicates that the yout' had slowed down to try to get on the sidewalk and that he flipped his ATV by trying to corner too fast, throwing him into the back of the pickup and his ATV striking another part of the pickup tailgate and ending up flipped over in the middle of the street.

Maybe young Mr. Potatohead didn't even get hit with the taser at all and just rolled his ATV trying to take the corner too fast. At this point, we don't know.

But even the witnesses (Detroit residents of a high-crime cop-hating neighborhood) say that the yout' had slowed down and was not going 35mph at the time of the crash.

And was Mr. Potatohead even wearing a helmet? The only photo we have of him (so far) on the ATV is this one:

He may be dead only because he tried to corner too fast and wasn't wearing a helmet.

There's a lot of dumbass counties and towns that are relaxing laws against running ATVs on public roads. There are now more people getting killed riding ATVs on paved roads than off-road. And the ATV manufacturers specifically oppose allowing ATVs to be ridden on public roads, saying they are inherently unsafe and unlicensed and not equipped or designed for public roads.

The real murderers of this kid are his own parents, giving a young idiot such a dangerous vehicle and then failing to supervise him in any way.

All I can say is "God bless Saint Darwin", the patron saint of dumbass helmetless riders.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-04-30   8:27:14 ET  (2 images) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: Vicomte13 (#66)

35 mph on a 25 mph street simply is not that fast or that dangerous.

a) It was illegal for him to drive his ATV on the street.
b) He was doing wheelies and driving recklessly.
c) 35 may not be fast in a car, but it is on an ATV.
d) 35 is dangerous. It killed him, didn't it?

misterwhite  posted on  2018-04-30   9:24:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: Vicomte13 (#66)

There's no indication that it was a crowded street.

All it took was one parked truck, didn't it?

misterwhite  posted on  2018-04-30   9:26:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#71. To: Tooconservative (#68)

I can see why you don't practice criminal law.

I can see why your political activism is unsuccessful.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   9:26:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: misterwhite (#69)

35 mph on a 25 mph street simply is not that fast or that dangerous. a) It was illegal for him to drive his ATV on the street. b) He was doing wheelies and driving recklessly. c) 35 may not be fast in a car, but it is on an ATV. d) 35 is dangerous. It killed him, didn't it?

Not dangerous enough to kill him in order to keep him from getting injured.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   9:27:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#73. To: Vicomte13 (#67)

Up to the jury in Detroit.

Do we have to wait or can we express our opinion before the verdict?

misterwhite  posted on  2018-04-30   9:29:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#74. To: misterwhite (#70)

All it took was one parked truck, didn't it?

In Red China, the cops used to pull speeders out of their vehicles and summarily execute them at the roadside.

I've never wanted to live in Red China.

The facts of the case will be for the Detroit jury to decide.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   9:29:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: Vicomte13 (#72)

Not dangerous enough to kill him in order to keep him from getting injured.

Well, that wasn't the intent, was it? I mean if the cop wanted to kill him he would have simply shot him.

misterwhite  posted on  2018-04-30   9:30:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#76. To: misterwhite (#73)

Do we have to wait or can we express our opinion before the verdict?

We can express our opinions all we like. And we do.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   9:44:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#77. To: misterwhite (#75) (Edited)

Well, that wasn't the intent, was it? I mean if the cop wanted to kill him he would have simply shot him.

I think it was unreasonable, with a foreseeably tragic result, and I don't believe that the police should have a different standard applied to them in such circumstances.

So it's a simple and straightforward difference of opinion.

I don't know if a Detroit jury will agree with me or with you, so we'll see. If they agree with me, I will be pleased. If they agree with you, I'll just shrug my shoulders and chalk it up, once again, to the dysfunction of our justice system.

Vicomte13  posted on  2018-04-30   9:46:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#78. To: misterwhite, Vicomte13, GrandIsland (#69)

b) He was doing wheelies and driving recklessly.

But is that a matter of public safety, even for some white Mr. Potatohead who does it? Surely this is not within the purview of the highway patrol (who was requested by the city of Detroit to help law enforcement in high-crime areas of Detroit)?

Of course, it is no business of those racist MHP cops to interfere with the right of minors to operate unlicensed vehicles dangerously on public streets.

It's downright racis' to even suggest that the Potatohead clan should wear a damned helmet.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-04-30   10:06:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#79. To: Tooconservative (#78)

it is no business of those racist MHP cops to interfere with the right of minors to operate unlicensed vehicles dangerously on public streets.

Oh, I can see the headlines had law enforcement not intervened and the kid was killed in a head-on accident.

"Why didn't they stop him?? He was wasn't supposed to be on the street! The cops watched him go by and din do nuffin. If he be white they'd stop him."

misterwhite  posted on  2018-04-30   13:15:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#80. To: misterwhite, Vicomte13, GrandIsland (#79)

And take a look at Idiot Helmetless Redneck on his ATV, popping wheelies while endangering traffic on his unlicensed ATV (leaving aside whether Mr. Dumbass had a drivers license, any insurance on his ATV or personal health insurance). Not to mention whether someone who is already breaking so many traffic laws isn't also driving under the influence as well.

Didn't the driver who he hit head-on, entirely his fault, have a right to peaceable and lawful use of the public roads without some moron crashing into him?

But, nooooooooo, no one can disrespect the rights of lawless ATV/scooter/unicycle/dirtbike riders to do any damned thing they want on any roadway, whatever the known and easily anticipated consequences of operating ATVs dangerously on public roadways is. Because some bleeding hearts wanna feel righteous about shedding their crocodile tears over Mr. Potatohead in Detroit eating the bumper of a Ford F-150.

Licenses, licensed vehicles and insurance of all kinds be damned! These laws don't mean a thing! How dare the police actually enforce them?

Because that is exactly the lawlessness on the public roadways that the majority of asshole posters on this thread are advocating. Some, like Vic, enjoy morally preening over their lawless philosophy, at least as it applies to black teenagers.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-04-30   13:31:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#81. To: misterwhite, Vicomte13, GrandIsland (#79)

More times these Precious Children were popping wheelies in traffic at 80mph in a 45mph zone on unlicensed vehicles, wrecking all over the roadway.

And here are helmetless black teens on ATVs operating in a pack to defy the cops chasing them. Traybon, Traybon!

And this is exactly the kind of situation that the MHP was in that neighborhood to stop.

A few days after Sambo ate the Ford bumper in Detroit, cops were driving around the neighborhood, encountering crowds of 100 or so black teens with a dozen illegal dirtbikes and ATVs. I doubt they had the courage to arrest them either.

No wonder Detroit has been such a lawless shithole for the last 50 years. They deserve what they've made of it.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-04-30   13:53:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#82. To: Tooconservative (#80)

That's the philosophy -- all activity is allowed unless or until it injures another. Only then will the individual be held liable.

But, increasingly, society is picking up the tab for these incidents. Meaning it's only fair that society minimizes cost by limiting the underlying reckless behavior.

misterwhite  posted on  2018-04-30   13:55:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#83. To: misterwhite (#82)

That's the philosophy -- all activity is allowed unless or until it injures another. Only then will the individual be held liable.

No, that's when you blame the cops for failing to protec' da public!

You can look on YouBoob to see the competition among these on-road ATV/dirtbike scumbags as they break traffic laws outrageously and evade cops. It's a Real Thing in urban America.

Not to mention how many backyards and acreages these lawless bikers ride across willy-nilly with no respect at all for property rights.

And God forbid their bikes have mufflers. No, they're noise nuisances as well, night and day in some areas.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-04-30   14:08:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#84. To: Tooconservative (#68)

As a general rule, shooting at drivers or tires of vehicles, is typically a big no-no UNLESS the vehicle operator is currently running people over, menacing officers with the vehicle or attempting to do so.

Vic isn’t very smart. Shooting at a vehicle or it’s operator with a firearm or taser is DEADLY physical force. Officers must justify the use of it.

I'm the infidel... Allah warned you about. كافر المسلح

GrandIsland  posted on  2018-04-30   20:50:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#85. To: GrandIsland (#84)

Shooting at a vehicle or it’s operator with a firearm or taser is DEADLY physical force.

One is deliberately lethal, the other is designed to never be lethal (supposedly).

Various PDs have their own policies but those two things are not the same.

Tasing someone is simply not the same as shooting them with any gun.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-01   1:03:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#86. To: GrandIsland, misterwhite (#84)

This vid is the source for most of these articles about the incident. Notice the female officers are a major source of trouble.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-01   2:21:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#87. To: All, Vicomte13, misterwhite, GrandIsland (#85)

Let's follow up with some coverage of a 15yo yout' in Bridgeport CT who got shot while trying to run down a cop.

Of course, the cops get blamed. Apparently, it's their job to let people run them down in the street and never shoot back.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-01   2:25:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#88. To: Tooconservative (#86)

On the video: "He's Damon Grimes. Damon Grimes? Sounds familiar."

I bet he does. But given that he's 15, they'll never release his record or the number of encounters with the police.

misterwhite  posted on  2018-05-01   10:08:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#89. To: misterwhite (#88)

I bet he does. But given that he's 15, they'll never release his record or the number of encounters with the police.

I've seen no photos at all of the yout' actually using this ATV off-road.

I think his parents bought it, knowing he would be using it illegally to ride on city streets without license/license plates/insurance.

You can bet his lawyer will be looking at that.

Look at that last vid I posted. You'll hear a neighbor saying that he was constantly riding that ATV through the neighborhood dangerously.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-01   10:27:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#90. To: Tooconservative (#89)

You'll hear a neighbor saying that he was constantly riding that ATV through the neighborhood dangerously.

Just a matter of time before he killed hisself. I agree with the black Detroit police officer on the scene: "No sympathy at all for bullshit. Mother fucker wanna be grown, ya' act grown, ya' gotta fucking deal with it."

Could be a Samuel Jackson scene in Pulp Fiction.

misterwhite  posted on  2018-05-01   10:50:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#91. To: misterwhite (#90)

Could be a Samuel Jackson scene in Pulp Fiction.

Maybe more so, his character as Zeus in that Die Hard With A Vengeance movie. Kinda dated now but it was a good franchise movie, certainly no worse than these awful Star Wars and Marvel superhero movies.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-01   11:19:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#92. To: misterwhite, GrandSphincter, Tooconservative, copsuckers, sneakypete (#40)

What a shock - the thug's partner was fired for lying and trying to cover up this heinous act.

Cop Fired After Video Showed He Lied to Protect His Partner Who Tasered Teen on ATV, Killing Him

According to the IA report, dated March 19, the department directly accused the officer, saying:

You knew the other trooper committed criminal offenses for which he was later charged…You drafted a false police report with the intent of assisting the other trooper with avoiding discovery, arrest, trial, or punishment after the crime occurred.

The scathing rebuke of the officer continued:

Your report intentionally contained significant deviations from the truth and what is shown on the videos, and your report was a clear attempt to justify your and the other trooper’s actions during the pursuit.

Do these badged assholes ever tell the truth about anything?

“Truth is treason in the empire of lies.” - Ron Paul

Those who most loudly denounce Fake News are typically those most aggressively disseminating it.

Deckard  posted on  2018-05-18   19:53:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#93. To: Deckard (#92)

Do these badged assholes ever tell the truth about anything?

I doubt it. They must be trained in cop school the finer points of lying.

Fred Mertz  posted on  2018-05-18   23:14:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#94. To: Deckard (#92)

What a shock - the thug's partner was fired for lying and trying to cover up this heinous act.

Unless you have desk jobs available at the PD or meter maid jobs or such, a cop with a record of lying in reports or in courtroom testimony is useless. They can't be called as witnesses against defendants. Anything they say or did, the defense attorney just says, "Are you lying to the court again just like you did in Case Blah-blah-blah"? Game over for the prosecution.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-19   3:59:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#95. To: Tooconservative (#50)

And it does seems likely that a kid who flees cops in an extended chase on an ATV at 35mph in an urban area is going to have some kind of record for other behavior.

Maybe not at that age. It is as likely to be a case of a kid using his big brother or fathers ATV without permission,and is more worried of being punished by his mom when he gets home than he is about getting punished by the police.

It's ain't like the one thing male teenagers are known for is good judgement.

In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2018-05-19   10:20:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#96. To: Tooconservative (#68)

And the ATV manufacturers specifically oppose allowing ATVs to be ridden on public roads, saying they are inherently unsafe and unlicensed

And they are right. I had never even ridden an ATV when I first read this news story,but have since bought a 572CC 44 hp 4X4 one to use to pull a tow-behind 48 inch rough cut mower to cut tall field grass. Let me tell ya,25 MPH with nothing hooked to it is a little scary. Short wheelbase,elevated seating position,and quick steering.

Yet some of them are now being made that have 90 HP. Yeah,most of them are the "bench seat" models with a wide track that gives them MUCH better stability,but WTF does anyone need 90 hp for in one of those things? I can see and understand mega torque,but high horsepower?

In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2018-05-19   10:31:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#97. To: Tooconservative (#68)

I can see why fat boy was only going 35 MPH. I doubt that little ATV would carry that much weight any faster.

In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2018-05-19   10:33:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#98. To: Tooconservative (#68)

All I can say is "God bless Saint Darwin", the patron saint of dumbass helmetless riders.

Speaking as a motorcycle rider since 1965,I can tell you that you are a lot LESS likely to get into a accident if you are not wearing a helmet because you can hear and see better.

In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2018-05-19   10:34:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#99. To: Tooconservative (#68)

The real murderers ......

"Murderers"??????

Being a drama queen on this one,ain't ya. I can see a manslaughter charge being appropriate,but murder? Do you REALLY believe the cop and his parents WANTED to see him dead?

In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2018-05-19   10:38:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#100. To: Deckard (#92)

According to the IA report, dated March 19, the department directly accused the officer, saying: You knew the other trooper committed criminal offenses for which he was later charged…

No he didn't. He was driving the police car in pursuit of the ATV. He was closing in and was focused on not crashing into it. He didn't see the taser deployed outside the passenger window. He reported on what saw.

Sure, after the fact and supported by video what he reported was incorrect. But that doesn't make it a lie or a coverup. It means he didn't see it.

By the way, how do you cover up the incident when you have taser wires dangling from the kid's back?

misterwhite  posted on  2018-05-19   10:39:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#101. To: Tooconservative (#68)

that the yout' had slowed down to try to get on the sidewalk

Supported by the fact that there was a driveway behind the pickup that he tried to access.

misterwhite  posted on  2018-05-19   10:47:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#102. To: sneakypete (#96)

And they are right. I had never even ridden an ATV when I first read this news story,but have since bought a 572CC 44 hp 4X4 one to use to pull a tow-behind 48 inch rough cut mower to cut tall field grass. Let me tell ya,25 MPH with nothing hooked to it is a little scary. Short wheelbase,elevated seating position,and quick steering.

Hey, what happened to that little Tyan tractor you bought last fall for these mowing jobs? I thought that was the final answer to your mowing problems.

You must have a hell of a lot of mowing to do.

Did you dump the Tyan and just buy a tiny tractor like John Deere's 4044? They're called 4x4 and have 44HP/572cc but are very large compared to ATVs. If so, that is not the kind of ATV that the pickaninnie in the article crashed in Detroit.

Anyway, have fun and be safe on your new ride.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-19   11:24:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#103. To: Tooconservative (#102) (Edited)

Hey, what happened to that little Tyan tractor you bought last fall for these mowing jobs? I thought that was the final answer to your mowing problems.

I decided to try something lighter ("Little" is a relative word when speaking of tractors. It weighs almost 3,000 lbs.) that was less likely to get stuck and tear up the grass while spinning the tires trying to get out. I did a test run with it one day last week,and drove it right through a couple of hundred feet of marsh grass with enough standing water on it I would have gotten my feet wet if I had tried to walk across it,and it didn't spin a wheel on dig a track,despite me leaving it in 2 wheel drive. Of course,when I am pulling the tow behind mower I am going to have to be in 4x4 mode and going a lot slower,but it still looked promising.

Havn't tried to cut that section with it yet,though. It's been raining the last several days in a row,and the wind has blown in more water. Going to wait for it to dry out a little first,

BTW,that day was the first official day of the summer. I shot my first poisonous snake of the year,and the AC unit in my house died. If that doesn't make summer officially here,I don't know what does. My new AC is supposed to be in Monday,and I will be a happy camper when it shows up!

Still have the TYM (not Tyan) 4x4 and use it for pulling engines,moving cars around,grading,etc,etc,etc.

I also like to park it close to where I am working if I am doing anything in the yard so that if I get too hot I can jump in it and enjoy the chilled air in the air-conditioned cab while listening to tunes on the stereo.

I have never been one to abuse my equipment. If I can get the same job done using something that cost 8 grand instead of 28 grand,and save wear and tear on the 28 grand tractor,that's the way I will be going.

The ATV is useless for the other yard jobs,of course.

You must have a hell of a lot of mowing to do.

Not really. Only 8 acres,but I am old and have COPD,so my days of cutting even a acre of it with a bush hook are OVER. On a typical day I am good for maybe 4 hours of work before running out of air and energy,and there are other things more important for me to be spending my limited time on than cutting wild grasses.

Plus,I hope to pull in a couple of jobs mowing small fields for locals who don't own tractors. If I can make enough money to make the payments on the tractor,I will be happy, Hell,I'll be happy with it if I don't make a dime cutting fields for anyone else. I need it for the other things mentioned,and it's kinda nice to have a tractor I don't have to spend time working on every time I need to use it. I was using a 1957 Ford 645 tractor that was 2wd,and on top of it not really running slow enough to get a good cut (no double low first gear) it is 2 wd and would sometimes get stuck.

Do NOT make the mistake of buying an industrial tractor if you plan on running a bush hog. You just can't go slow enough to get a good cut because they only have 3 speed transmissions instead of the 4 speed with the double low 1st gear. Since the PTO's spin at a fixed speed,you have to go really slow to get a good cut.

Did you dump the Tyan and just buy a tiny tractor like John Deere's 4044? They're called 4x4 and have 44HP/572cc but are very large compared to ATVs.

No,my ATV is a 2018 Polaris Sportsman 570 EPS Utility Edition. Basically a typical work-model 4x4 ATV.

atv.polaris.com/en-us/spo...AEgLs4fD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Ironically enough,it has 44 HP,while my tractor only has 39 hp. I have no idea why a ATV would need 40+ hp,but some now have more than 90 hp.

In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2018-05-19   18:20:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#104. To: sneakypete (#103)

BTW,that day was the first official day of the summer. I shot my first poisonous snake of the year,and the AC unit in my house died.

Sounds like a great start.     : )

No,my ATV is a 2018 Polaris Sportsman 570 EPS Utility Edition. Basically a typical work-model 4x4 ATV.

Nice.

Tooconservative  posted on  2018-05-19   23:51:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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