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Title: Gatlins Stock tips and money advice
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Published: Feb 5, 2018
Author: Hopefully Gatlin
Post Date: 2018-02-05 18:32:47 by A K A Stone
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Views: 26079
Comments: 167
You wanna get rich? You just might if you follow this advice.
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#120. To: Vicomte13 (#119)
Colorado. I guess I should qualify "growing" as "not shriveled, dead and defoliated like everything else". It's not actively putting on mass, but it's still living and fresh - just like what these guys are showing: https://tinyfarmblog.com/kale-undersnow/ So rather that harvest it earlier and put it in the freezer... I just leave it out there.
That makes sense.
The end of this Series....with a Resolution and Summation of today’s market activity by me. There was a mistake made today during my first buy transaction. It was a long detailed process to discover the reason for the mistake and I narrowed it down to one of two distinct possibilities. However, it doesn’t matter HOW the mistake was made...it matters thathe mistake WAS made and I must live with the numbers. The Mistake – I intended to purchase 5 stocks today at $20,000 allocated to each purchase (or as close as I possibly could....I always overshoot for the high side when trying to get as close to $20,000). I wound up making 4 purchases for $20,000, but my initial order for 5880 shares of ERN totaling $20,000 was executed as 580 shares for $2,000 (again, all dollar amounts are in round numbers at this point). I must now live with mistake discovered after the market closed and I will purchase an additional $18,000 worth of ERN tomorrow morning at market opening. Verification is available for all these number at Barchart if requested. In fact, the links are in Post #9. I hope this series of informational posts on the inner workings for Swing Trading in the sotck market has been enlightening to those interested and I also hope it was what you were looking for, Stone....what you wanted me to do. This ends all commentary showing the activity during my daily trading. I repeat what I said in an earlier post: Swing Trading is nothing you learn to do overnight and nothing you can do part time...and you WILL pay a price for learning. Be prepared ... Okay, Stone. That’s it....the whole ball game for me. We will keep the thread active as a Financial Thread for anyone interested to participate and give or take information. Oh, I almost forgot to respond to the post from buckaroo, where he stated: In the midst of uncertainty, collect the data as an action plan to avoid further risk. Study the data. Use your little brain power, assuming you have any and cool the transactions until the market corrects itself. No, Bucky, I am in no way an emotional trader. I am a cool, calm, collected and methodical Swing Trader who definitely operates within a firmly defined set of rules....as explained and set forth in my Post #8 and Post #9 at the beginning of this thread. Which of course you obviously neglected to read. Furthermore: I never think “emotionally” and I never think I “can outwit the market.” There was no “uncertainty.” I was certain that the market moved down for two days. I needed to collect no data because it is always instantly available 24/7/365 to me on barchart.com with a mere lick on the mouse. Oh, I did plan, for about 3 hurs last evening and again this morning when I began my calculated moves. And I did use very little of my brain power....very little is all I ever need to use. Now, I did cool my transactions for 3 days and when according to my plan as outlined in the posts mentioned....I made my move as each stock under consideration showed an upward daily movement for 2 consecutive days and fulfilled the other perimeters of my buying plan as outlined in the posts above. So, Bucky boy, I must say I had a fair day....making a late start on 5 stock picks and taking in $418.55 which could have been $719.55 had not it been for an unknown glitch. And the fact that the stocks I picked through careful consideration and diligent study showed a paper gain of $2,243.85 for the entire day proved to show I have a tad bit of :market moxy”....ya think? BTW: Today’s activity was off of ONLY 5 stocks, Bucky. I normally maintain at least 20 stocks in my active portfolio and limit myself to no more than 30 at one time. I must admit that managing 30 stocks ar one time while Swing Trading is extremely taxing and I don’t normally go up to that amount unless indicators direct I do. I certainly do appreciate you taking time to give me some much needed advice on how I should invest in the stock market, Bucky, and above all....I will try to remember: I will not become emotional....I will not become emotional... DAMNIT, I will NOT become EMOTIONAL ...
Thank you Gatlin. Please don't leave the thread just yet. There is still, for me, a very important piece of what you do that I need to understand to get the complete picture. I understand that you select stocks based on certain pre-established criteria. I do not understand how you gained both $418.55 and had paper gains of $2243.85 for the day on the same stocks. Were those paper gains $2243.85 on your entire portfolio, or were they just on those stocks that generated $418.55? I am wondering how the $418.55 was a "real" gain, while the $2243.85 was a "paper gain". Did you sell those stocks and take the cash back out? Were those stocks heavy with dividend which paid after you bought them. PLEASE understand that I am not challenging your numbers. I just don't understand what the two different kinds of gain mean. The only two ways I know of to make a gain on stock are through capital gain - when you sell it (and there is no lingering paper gain after that, because because don't own it anymore), dividends paid on a stock when the company pays them. Stocks can split and there can be leveraged buyouts, but for tax purposes those things ultimately all wash down to capital gain. I'm just puzzled by the two types of gain you've discussed here. I don't know what they could be. Please explain. The other piece of information that I need to know to be able to make my style of analysis is the actual mechanics of how you bought and sold (if you did sell) the stocks. Was this done at a fixed price per share, at a fixed transaction price, based on a spread? What was the transaction cost. And where is the physical location of your property. Is it held by the broker-dealer from whom you purchased the stocks, in the B/D's street name at DTC? Is your broker-dealer your custodian, and what are your custodial fees? It does not seem possible that you could do short-swing trading if you take physical possession of shares book-registered in your name - that process is entirely too cumbersome to get in and out. Finally, you need data feeds of some sort to get the information on which you base your analysis. Full-up Bloomberg terminals cost $15,000 per person per month for the data feed, so obviously you're not doing THAT, but what are you doing? Do you have a subscription service that is providing you the feed? Are you using free online resources? As you saw with my discussion of growing spinach, I include the transaction costs in all of my analyses, because they are real and they determine the final dollars-in-pocket. This probably reads like a challenge, because that is the way of LibertysFlame. I promise you that it is not. I am trying to understand the components of what you have said above. It is intriguing, but it's a sort of black box with some confusing output numbers (confusing to me), and with unknown costs. I need to iron out those kinks to really understand it. Thanks.
zyeah, and while you are at it, quit the DAMN DRAMATICS.
Perhaps this will explain what I meant. The broker’s computer shows in one column the stocks daily gain/loss for the current day (continually updating throughout the day )in one column. In the next column, the computer shows your actual gain/loss updated (als continually updating). Those numbers were only for yesterday. So over a period of say five days, on the fifth day the daily gain fo those stocks may be $1,000....but my gain could show $3,000 (over the 5 day period). I always can see what the stocks are doing overall in any moment of time during the day....as well as I can see what my stocks are doing in that moment of time with a continuing computation. To try to simplify. That $2,000 number is what the stocks did that particular day, and it is continually updated during the day ....the $400 number is what my stocks did since I purchased them and it is continually updaed thoughout the day. That’s probably a better way of explaining it...I hope.
You make trading sound complicated. What is the name of the graphical user interface of the trading software you use?
BTW, some of the stocks I am in from time to time pay well over 20% APR in dividends. These numbers may not be in proper proportion, as an example. I may purchase a stock shortly before the “ex-div” date and sell it shortly after the dividend is paid. So, I can loose, say $100 on the buy/sell transaction and still make $150 from the paid dividend. I of course do not buy stocks for dividends. Some of those stocks occasionally fall into my buy plan.
To answer your question, I would say no for Swing Trading on the physical possession. Although I have never checked into it. I never own stock long enough to ask for the paper. I do no paper transactions with my broker, which by the way is USAA. Everything is electronic and I get notices of transactions and updates instantly. Their computer sometimes gets out of sync. Like yesterday, as I mentioned, It showed a loss on one stock of over $400 onone stock and I knew at a glance that was not possible. So I did the math and the loss was $200. The computer continually checks and updates itself. I have faith in it. The type of “glitches” I just mentioned has happened before, but they are always corrected the computer’s midnight reconciliation final update. Sorry, I am going to miss addressing some of your points....I will try to keep coming back and picking up on them.
ROTFL.
The time it took me years ago to research and trade 3 to 5 stocks a day....I can now trade up to 30 in that same amount of restricted time using Barchart. I am going to have to leave you shortly for a few hours....I will be busy. I only have 3 stocks lined up for today’s buy and I want at least 5 to add to yesterday. I am again building up to 20. Probably lots of mistakes in these last posts....sorry, I am in a hurry and I do enjoy trading comments with you. Have a great morning ...
ROTFL. I laugh to, sometimes...."all the way to the bank." I am a stickler to reconcile my transactions to the penny. Every error that occasionally showed up during the day was always corrected by the computer at midnight. My Money....My Faith. Your Bad Computers....Your Problems. And that is the way the cookie crumbles ...
I know that ...
Again, as opposed to evading a question pertinent to your "genius" for day trading, what graphical user interface do you use? Since you are a high power user making HUGE profits, you have an obligation to the channel to let us know how you collect the data in order to make buy/sell decisions. As an example, I use TD Ameritrade software. What do you use?
I am a just a low power, old country boy with a high school education, making MANY little profits....over and over, time and time again. And that is the way the cookie crumbles ...
I use no software....I have a brain and I use it. Barchart has all the graphs,charts and background data I ever need ... Geeze, man...look at my results yesterday. The numbers were verifable. I generally do 4 times that activity. Just stop and admit that you are exchanging comments with someone much smarter you .
YET ON POST #128: The computer continually checks and updates itself. I have faith in it. ROTFL
To try to simplify. That $2,000 number is what the stocks did that particular day, and it is continually updated during the day ....the $400 number is what my stocks did since I purchased them and it is continually updaed thoughout the day. That’s probably a better way of explaining it...I hope. I get it. Thanks. The way I would describe it is that as of close yesterday, you had a nominal (paper), unrealized gain of $418.55. You will have realized gains when you sell your securities. You may also earn dividend income if you hold the security on the dividend date. That all makes sense. Could you discuss the transaction costs - what it costs to buy and sell, and custodial fees? Also, could you discuss the fees for the data you use? Thanks!
Two different aspects. My Brain..Their Computer to do what I tell it to do. EDIT: I still use NO software.
Probably lots of mistakes in these last posts....sorry, I am in a hurry and I do enjoy trading comments with you. Have a great morning ... You too. Let's talk after 4 PM. I am enjoying this discussion.
It’s $5.95 per trade in the amounts I normally deal. Higher number of stocks or higher dollar amounts = higher trade costs. No custodial fees....no membership dues.
If this old country boy with only a high school and the highest math course being ninth grade general math can do it....then, anyone who possesses logic and common sense can also do it. If it sounds complicated, then I am ether not explaining it properly or you have a comprehension problem. In either case, the simplest thing for you to do if you don’t understand someting ....is to ask me a question. I think I have addressed this at least twice before and I will do it again. I don't use any software.. I simply log on the Website, then start monitoring the activity and begin to buy, sell or both.
Then you admittedly don't collect relevant information and you don't perform any analysis of and about the data. That means you are a fuckin' idiot, as you already admit: If that's the SECRET to any majiick you posses, you are out of your phuckin' mind.
You are a liar, a thief and have no personal honour. I have not lied, I have not stolen and I have shown no place that I have no personal honor. Stone established this thread and asked me to share what knowledge I have about trading...I am doing that. He did not establish this thread for you to come here and attack me personally or challenge my integrity. If you have something intelligent to ask or contribute to the purpose of this thread....then, “I’m your huckleberry.” Otherwise, I will again starting doing what I did until recently. That is, after the next personal attack you make on me, I will scroll past your posts and neither read or respond to them. I trust I have made myself perfectly clear to you.
Then you admittedly don't collect relevant information and you don't perform any analysis of and about the data. No, you don’t understand...I did not admit that. I log in to barchart.com where I stay all day and off and on I do research to use their data there. At the same time, I am also logged in to usaa.com where I take that information I use from Barchart to execute trades. Maybe you were thinking those were the one and the same and that is why you are confused....maybe.
Yes. I reiterate, you are a liar, a thief and a clown. You are an an absolute collapse of reason towards objective thinking and risk analysis towards investment strategies. You are the antithesis of risk based thinking; moreover, you lack opportunity based thinking; not just for yourself but because your advice clearly delivers on a chit-chat channel a result of failure while delivering singularly based pure emotion and BY-GOLLY or otherwise known as "seat of the pants" analysis.
If that's the SECRET to any majiick you posses, you are out of your phuckin' mind. Well, that is not the ONLY secret....because:
Now, that was really inspiring...you must listen to Jim sing it again.
OK. You are a complete failure in life offering BULLSHITE on a chit-chat channel. So now, you want to move the topic towards your slant of religious values because you can not confront the problem about your own Wall Street Genius. You are evasive and dirty about your own posts, pal.
By my calculations, based on the data you have given, and making the following assumptions: (1) You sold and realized your gain (2) Transaction costs are 5.95 to buy, and 5.95 to sell. (3) You have no other source of income, so your taxable income is what is produced solely by investment. (4) A trading year of 251 days (days that the market is open). (5) You make comparable trades, with comparable profits, every day of the year, and close out of each position at the end of each day. (6) Yesterday, on your initial investment of $82,473.4, you had a net return after transaction costs (but before taxes) of $356.05, which is a .43171% one-day rate of return. (7) That you were able to do the same on each of the other 251 days in the trading year. (8) You are married, and you live in a state with an average income tax rate of 5%. (9) Your sole source of income is your return on investment. (10) 2018 tax laws are in effect. Your pre-tax earnings on investment would be $89,368.55, on an initial investment of 82,473.40. This is a pre-tax rate of return on investment of 108.36%. After taxes (all of which is short term capital gain), your return on investment was 75,436.89, which is a 91.467% Other than the blind luck of the lottery, I know of no investment that produces anything close to those returns. Of course, those numbers do not accurately reflect your actual rates of return, because the assumptions are not all true. For example: you still hold those securities, which means that those gains are notional, not real. You would need to sell and then reinvest your principal to be that successul. I have not considered the effect of reinvesting all of your gains. So, if you are able to consistently pick stocks with those assumptions and success rates on an ongoing basis, this would appear to be a very attractive investment strategy.
The obvious corollary to the above would be to ask you point blank the profit data from your last year's trading activity, on a before tax and after tax basis. I am dying to know that. But I recognize that it is a direct personal question, and very aggressive, so I won't ask it. I myself generally answer anything asked of me, even by aggressive people who obviously dislike me, because that's just the way I am - straightforward and fearless, and frighteningly open. But that's not the American way at all. I like the Swedish model of company operations, whereby everybody salary, bonuses and benefits are public knowledge, and everybody's income tax returns are matters of public record. However, this thread is not about a reveal of personal data, but about investment. From what you have described, your strategy could be profitable indeed, provided you pick the right stocks and make many successful trades. When you sell is likewise key. I assume you pick based on certain factors after seeing certain market behaviors, and I assume your sell discipline is based on the same things. I'm sure you're not making 91% returns, but I would imagine that with experience returns in the mid-teens are eminently possible. Could you share your last year's pre-tax return percentage? Thanks!
I think you may be getting some wrong ideas from what I am posting any may be mentally formulating some plan for the future. I am by no means a professional Swing Trader. If I had to label, I would call myself a hobbyist who does Swing Trading for the thill of the challenge and for entertainment. There are professional Swing Traders like say Evan Medeiros. He is a full-time professional swing trader and the founder of TheTradeRisk.com . I see where you are going with your questions on commission structure. That probably is the first door to unlock if you’re working towards being a professional Swing Trader. If you are actively paying $5.95 per transaction with a $1000 trading account....then the math is perfectly setup for failure. If you are a Professional Swing Trader looking to make lots of money, then use a trading organization like Robinhood and pay $0 commission...then you can be more successful with any size account. I don’t compute my transaction fees, I pay no attention to no attention to them. If I pay $7,735 in transactions fees (which I did one year and it was the only year the accountant had to compute those for some reason) and I am content with making, say only $6,000 net....then I am a content “Hobbyist Swing Trader.” I thnk I just coined a new term For what I am doing, and will continue to do, Barchart provides all the data, charts, projections and everything else I need to do. If I wanted to start doing Swing Trading for living and make a bunch of money, then I sould look into any number of Swing Trading software programs that are available on the Internet and test a few of their programs with a small amount of capital while I was paying $0 commission. There are also a number of sources on the Internet where you can get free newsletters and others with paid membership to look into. I however have always been leary about these paid type sources and stayed away from them. I always figured if they were any good, they could hire a bunch of people to work directly for them and clean up on making money and forget about selling advice. I have no specifics to share with you....but maybe this basket of rambling information will be of some benefit to you.
I am by no means a professional Swing Trader. If I had to label, I would call myself a hobbyist who does Swing Trading for the thill of the challenge and for entertainment. There are professional Swing Traders like say Evan Medeiros. He is a full-time professional swing trader and the founder of TheTradeRisk.com . I see where you are going with your questions on commission structure. That probably is the first door to unlock if you’re working towards being a professional Swing Trader. If you are actively paying $5.95 per transaction with a $1000 trading account....then the math is perfectly setup for failure. If you are a Professional Swing Trader looking to make lots of money, then use a trading organization like Robinhood and pay $0 commission...then you can be more successful with any size account. I don’t compute my transaction fees, I pay no attention to no attention to them. If I pay $7,735 in transactions fees (which I did one year and it was the only year the accountant had to compute those for some reason) and I am content with making, say only $6,000 net....then I am a content “Hobbyist Swing Trader.” I thnk I just coined a new term For what I am doing, and will continue to do, Barchart provides all the data, charts, projections and everything else I need to do. If I wanted to start doing Swing Trading for living and make a bunch of money, then I sould look into any number of Swing Trading software programs that are available on the Internet and test a few of their programs with a small amount of capital while I was paying $0 commission. There are also a number of sources on the Internet where you can get free newsletters and others with paid membership to look into. I however have always been leary about these paid type sources and stayed away from them. I always figured if they were any good, they could hire a bunch of people to work directly for them and clean up on making money and forget about selling advice. I have no specifics to share with you....but maybe this basket of rambling information will be of some benefit to you. No, I am not looking to be a Swing Trader. My own investment approach is this (and reflects all that I have written before): I already am in the job that I expect to be terminal, so there's no "Upward mobility" for me in employment prospects. I can, by and large, track out the rough shape of my income and benefits from now until retirement, which will probably not be before age 67 in any case (to maximize Social Security). My wife still has some upward mobility in her prospects (after many years off raising a child) by punching through the hurdles of being certified as a teacher in our state. So I expect some income increase on her part, in the $10k to $30k range over the years. I expect we will both retire about the same time. I expect that Social Security and Medicare will both be in operation when we retire, because I believe that the United States would have had to have literally ended for those programs to have disappeared. I believe that Social Security and Medicare are so fundamentally vital to the structure of the US economy, and so necessary to 95% of the population, that it is politically impossible to strike down either of those programs. I believe that the US will print money, borrow money, engage in forced nationalization of retirement assets, cut non-essential services, sell resources, raise taxes - whatever is necessary - to maintain those two programs in place. I do not believe that it is politically possible to touch those programs, and that attempts to do so will be blocked by the judiciary until the next election cycle wipes out the party that attempts to do so. I say this because Social Security and Medicare are part of my retirement plan. I hope to not need them, but I expect that I will, and that my other efforts will augment my income, but will not replace either program. Currently, my wife and I are putting our purse into our daughter's head, and the results are good. She has a straight-A average, will be attending an Ivy League university, and is on track to make the US Olympic Team in 2020 or 2024. We plan to fully finance her education through law school, so there will be no student debt to burden her, and to provide the necessary downpayment for her primary residence when the time comes, so that she is able to gain the security of home ownership and the growth of equity in that primary expense, as opposed to spending years pissing money down the drain in rent. At that point, barring unforeseen emergencies, she will be launched and independent and we will have done our job to position her in life as well as we can, as parents, certainly far ahead of where we started. I agree with Buffett one more time, when he said "Give your kids enough so they can do anything, but not so much that they can do nothing." I don't have enough to give her for her to be able to do nothing anyway, and I think we have prepared her to be able to literally do anything, and in particular to let her pursue the course she has chosen for herself, with as good a chance as anybody in the world of being the best in the world at her chosen field. No American has ever won Olympic gold in women's foil. I expect my daughter will be the first, and she herself is training and preparing to do exactly that. So, that covers parental duties. When grandchildren come, I expect to be able to assist in their private education, if needed. Turning, then, to my wife and myself, the greatest variable of future expense is health, and the greatest single factors influencing health that are under human control are nutrition, sleep and stress levels. Exercise ranks fourth in this regard, though it certainly helps. Eat, sleep, stress and exercise largely determine whether one will face lengthy periods of expensive health care that will exhaust one's final resources, or good health that will not. We all die of something, of course, but the conditions under which it happens are largely (though by no means completely) under our control. Therefore, proper investment in good, healthy food is important. Food is not a place to economize. Luxurious food is not good for us when eaten often, but merely HEALTHY food - organic, skewed towards fresh seafood, prepared with high quality ingredients: to eat right essentially doubles the cost of nutrition above the standard American diet, and that doubling of cost means fewer resources to invest in the earlier years, and much lower medical expenses in the latter years, probably. So that is the next investment, and it is a substantial one: the decision to CONSUME an extra $20,000 per year, between two people, to eat the healthiest foods on a continuous basis. To do so in the belief that this will prevent later cancers and heart and liver conditions that will entirely deplete an estate before death is a choice based on faith in my own understanding of the science of health and biology. Between now and age 70 is 15 years, so this is a $300,000 decision - to invest in health through food INSTEAD OF economizing on food and investing that same cash in money-producing investments. Then we move to the next investment, which is in the proper repair and arrangement of our living space, and in particular beautifying our half-acre garden. This is a stress reducer - once against reducing the eventual cost of a health care, and a property value enhancer - improving the value of the property - it is an important improvement to quality of life. To fully landscape the property would probably cost $25,000 up from, and $5000 per year to maintain, and to upgrade the house (saving on future energy and repair costs) would probably cost $100,000. So, once again, over that 15 year period, another $200,000 will not be available to invest in securities to produce a cash flow. Only now do we come to the point of investing excess income. Transaction costs and taxation of gains mark me. Like Buffett, my holding period - of houses, of wives, of securities - even of cars to the extent possible - is "forever". I have determined that, given my tax bracket, federal and state, and given transaction costs, the benchmark investment for me is tax free municipal bonds, bought and held to maturity, with reinvestment of the interest. Bonds that yield 5% untaxable at the federal, state and local level are available. My Connecticut tax bracket is 6.5%, and my federal tax bracket in 2018 is 35%. Given the new tax law's elimination of the personal exemption and restriction of deductions on state income and property taxes, my effective tax rate is 41.5% on investment returns. So, a safe 5% return on tax-free municipal bonds for someone in the 41.5% aggregate tax bracket, is the equivalent of a 7.05% taxable return. One can obtain that sort of return on junk bonds, which are not safe. It appears as though your equity investing techniques may produce a greater return than that. I am interested in seeing the real return numbers you have had over time, pre-tax, so that I can apply tax rates and transaction costs to get an apples-to-apples comparison. Assuming that I am able to invest $50,000 per year in my munis for the next 12 years, and $100,000 per year after that for the remaining 3 years until earliest practical retirement, my total invested principal of $900,000 should have grown, at 5% tax free, interest paid semiannually, with full reinvestment, by 5.0625% per year, with compounding, to 1,599,727.63 (to the penny). Left alone, that corpus will generate $80,986.21 per year in tax-free income, which will be augmented by Social Security at very nearly the maximum rate for me of about $3538 per month ($42,456 per year), plus my wife's benefit of about half that ($21,228 per year), for a total family income of $144,670 per year of retirement income, secure and essentially guaranteed for life. This will allow us to assist in the funding of our grandchildren's private school and college educations and allow us to continue to invest a portion to stay even with inflation. I recognize that you are going about it a very different way, and that's fine. From my perspective, the "number to beat" in investments is a very safe return of 7.05%, taxable, per year. An investment that can exceed that if equally safe, is better, an investment that is below that level is worse (there is nothing that is really safer than a general obligation bond of a state except for federal bonds, but they are taxable). So, that's what I'm asking for. I'm offering a way to compare your approach, the real, after tax returns, to mine. From the numbers you've given, yours seems to produce better returns than mine. I would never do it the way you do: it requires too much reliance on my analytical abilities. I want to buy and hold and forget and reinvest the interest, and not pay taxes on it, and focus on family and health and enjoying my garden.
Exactly! I have the same view about gold hoarding. If these companies advertising for people to buy their gold because of the imminent meltdown of the economy and hyperinflation of the dollar really believed their own hype, why are they selling the gold in exchange for those soon-to-be-worthless dollars? They sure want dollars rather than holding onto their piles of gold, so THEY obviously don't believe what they say.
If these stocks are so wonderful why aren't they holding on to them to keep getting richer? They might be selling them and buying gold, because they have correctly deduced that the ponzi FRN's are about to become virtually worthless. At least they have enough sense enough to get out while the getting's good. Invest in gold, silver, ammo, cigars, coffee, and toilet paper. They all have real value, as opposed to being worthless paper like stocks and FRN's! Bees sound good too.
Because the purpose of issuing stock is to raise money to permit a business to fund its operations. A business is founded and raises money because its owners believe in the future of themselves, their enterprise, their country, and the monetary system in which they will operate. Stocks only have value BECAUSE the company has value as a going operation. This is an utterly different mindset than the goldbugs. Gold has no intrinsic value at all, other than the same appeal that brass buttons have to crows and rats: "Oooh, shiny!" Gold is inert. It produces nothing, It employs nobody. It generates no income at all, quite unlike a business whose stock issuance gave it its start. The stock has value because that business, as a going concern generating dollars, will continue to do so into the future. Gold generates nothing and does nothing. People buy it because the vendors of gold tell them that the dollar is going to inflate as the economy melts down. It's a bet against the survival of the country. It has value because of "oooh, shiny", but it's not marketed to investors on the basis of its inherent beauty to our eyes. It is marketed as a hedge against economic Armageddon. It's not an effective hedge against Armageddon, really.
Gold and silver have many industrial uses, it's not just so you can have gold teef like Trayvon. Gold is highly corrosion resistant is is used in many critical electrical and medical applications. Gold and Silver must have great practical value to have achieved such widespread use in manufacturing in spite of their high price. I've had a dental gold bridge in my mouth for decades. No you can't see the gold, it's covered in ceramic.
Nobody can dispute the industrial uses of gold, and gold is just as legitimate an investment as any other commodity. If one wishes to invest in gold, and feels more secure in doing so, there is no very good reason not to do it. As an asset class, it is taxed at a higher rate than other assets. Long term capital gains on securities are taxed at 20%, gold is taxed at up to 28%. But that in an of itself is not a reason to invest in it. Gold carries with it certain uncertainties and security issues: if you take it in physical, you have to secure it or insure it, both of which carry additional costs or risks: if a gang knows you own stocks you are not at any particular risk, but if they know you have gold they have an incentive to attack YOUR home. If it's stolen, you're out of luck unless you insure it, and the thing about insuring it is that gold produces no interest or dividends, only (potential) capital gains, but insurance does cost money on a regular basis. Gold is not as easily transported as currency within the system, which is available everywhere electronically. Physical gold is heavy, has to be carried, and given the confiscatory predations of many police forces in the US, may well end up impounded as "instrumentalities of a crime", and civilly forfeited, if you drive around with it. Transaction costs diminish any investment, and you can't buy food and gas with gold, you have to convert it to dollars, and you pay a premium, and taxes, every time you make the conversion. Of course this is true of every other security or investment, and is not unique to gold. As a simple investment, gold is like any other. And it is satisfying to have and to hold. Gains on it are taxed more highly, and it has other inconveniences to it already discussed, but there's nothing wrong with owning gold as an investment. Where things go queer with regards to gold is when paranoia takes over and men start stacking gold bars and hoarding guns in preparation for the apocalypse. At this point, rational economic activity has ceased and those men are on an occluded orbit that is unlikely to leave them personally wealthier, and is far more likely to cause them to get themselves into the sort of trouble that religious fanatics with 13 kids chained in a house get themselves into. But as a rational investment strategy, dollar cost averaging in gold is a modestly suboptimal way to store value. Gold does tend to keep up with inflation. It generally doesn't do better than that over time, and it doesn't produce a current return. Still, if the cost of purchase is kept low and the sale of the asset is timed for large market upswings in the gold price, good money can be made. The particular inconveniences of the asset class - it's physical weight and security issues - are always there. It's a choice to bear them. There is nothing WRONG with investing in gold. There is plenty wrong in buying gold to fend off impending Armageddon, mainly because that won't work, and the whole mindset that the world is ending is neurotic - the world isn't ending, and if it is, gold isn't going to save you, Neither will guns and cigarettes. Want to REALLY prep? Buy land far away and grow vegetables on it. Trouble is, far away means that you can't engage in meaningful economic activity with other people, and 99.9% of people have their greatest returns, by far, in the form of wages, not investment income.
U.S. stock index futures were higher ahead of Friday's open, as investors kept abreast of the volatile trading seen in markets worldwide. Around 7 a.m. ET, stock futures were pointing to the Dow opening up more than 150 points. The Nasdaq and S&P 500 futures also indicated a positive open. The movements seen in U.S. futures come on the back of a sharply lower finish to Thursday's trade. In the previous session, U.S. stocks finished deep in the red as higher interest rates continued to weigh on sentiment. The Dow Jones industrial average finished the session down 1,032.89 points at 23,860.46 — entering correction territory. In addition, investors have been on edge, as developments in the political space surface. Late Thursday, it became apparent that parts of the U.S. government would be entering a shutdown, after the Senate failed to secure the passing of a spending bill by the midnight deadline. During Friday's early hours, however, the Senate managed to pass a short-term funding bill, paving the way to boosting military and domestic spending. The measure then headed to the House, where resistance was expected. Before the U.S. market open, however, the House voted to approve the bill and send it to President Donald Trump for it to be signed — helping end the brief government shutdown. On Friday, earnings and economic data will continue to trickle in as the trading week draws to a close. In corporate news, Moody's, PG&E and CBOE are set to publish earnings ahead of the bell. Wholesale trade data is due to come out at 10 a.m. ET. No speeches by U.S. Federal Reserve officials are scheduled to take place Friday.
That is....except during the entire month of August. I miss it then, because August is when my next door neighbor who helps me on and off goes on vacation. LOL
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#121. To: VxH (#120)
#122. To: buckeroo, A K A Stone, ALL (#78)
(Edited)
Resolution for the activity today -
Symbol – Buy / Close /// Day % Change /// Buy $ Amount - Close $ Amount – Day’s Gain/Loss from opening – My gain/loss with later buy in - Underlined
GOOS – 37.76 / 38,12 /// +2.78% /// 20,013.40 - 20,203.60 /// +545.90 – +190.20
DECK – 96.03 / 95.69 /// +0.73% /// 20,082.17 - 19,807.83 /// +142.83 - -274.34
ERN – 3.40 / +7.35 /// 7.35% /// 2,041.75 - 2,117.00 /// +145.00 - +75.25
HAE – 68.17 / +5.02 /// +5.02% /// 20,030.29 - 20,500.62 /// +979.20 – +470.33
TPR – 30.20 / +2.20 /// +2.20% /// 20,035.79 – 19,989.90 /// +430.92 - -45.89 Summation for the activity today -
Had I purchased all of the 5 stocks immediately at opening, I would have made $2,243.85.
Because I had to research and follow my plan, I bought in later in the morning and I made $418.55.
Had the buy error on ERN not have happened, I would have made $719.55. You are an emotional trader, tater, and operate without rules. You have lost money in a market that is on a downward plunge because you "think" emotionally; you think you can outwit the market.
#123. To: Gatlin (#122)
#124. To: Gatlin (#122)
.. DAMNIT, I will NOT become EMOTIONAL ...
#125. To: Vicomte13 (#123)
(Edited)
I do not understand how you gained both $418.55 and had paper gains of $2243.85 for the day on the same stocks. Were those paper gains $2243.85 on your entire portfolio, or were they just on those stocks that generated $418.55?
I obviously used a misnomer, I should not have used the term “paper gain.” I see the confusion I caused. I should have tried to find a different term.
#126. To: Gatlin (#125)
The broker’s computer shows in one column the stocks daily gain/loss for the current day (continually updating throughout the day )in one column. In the next column, the computer shows your actual gain/loss updated (als continually updating). Those numbers were only for yesterday. So over a period of say five days, on the fifth day the daily gain fo those stocks may be $1,000....but my gain could show $3,000 (over the 5 day period). I always can see what the stocks are doing overall in any moment of time during the day....as well as I can see what my stocks are doing in that moment of time with a continuing computation.
#127. To: Vicomte13 (#123)
(Edited)
The only two ways I know of to make a gain on stock are through capital gain - when you sell it
Had I sold those stock yesterday exactly at the split second the market closed....my capital gain would have been $418.55. Had any dividends been paid on any of those stocks yesterday, they would have been deposited in my cash account from which I trade. [Footnore: I no long use a margin account because I could not do an instantons profit/loss to the penny as the margin interest always showed up much later. Besides, why should I pay them interest on margin money when I have an abundance of capital in the case account]. The capital gains and dividends are of course as you know, reported differently to me at year’s end.
#128. To: Vicomte13 (#123)
It does not seem possible that you could do short-swing trading if you take physical possession of shares book-registered in your name - that process is entirely too cumbersome to get in and out.
I am jumping all around because I am doing market research at the same time. I think I am good at multi-tasking but that cost me to not make $301 yesterday by not paying closer attention to what I was doing.
#129. To: Gatlin (#128)
The computer continually checks and updates itself. I have faith in it.
#130. To: Vicomte13 (#123)
Finally, you need data feeds of some sort to get the information on which you base your analysis. Full-up Bloomberg terminals cost $15,000 per person per month for the data feed, so obviously you're not doing THAT, but what are you doing? Do you have a subscription service that is providing you the feed? Are you using free online resources?
I use barchart.com. They have different service levels for all needs. The free data provides ALL that I ever need for what I do. I tried to make a donation once, I did not want to or need to subscribe to one of their services. It blew their mind because that obviously had never happened. I finally gave up after 3 or so email exchanges trying to explain that all I wanted to do was to show my gratitude for using their free service.
#131. To: buckeroo (#129)
The computer continually checks and updates itself. I have faith in it.
#132. To: Vicomte13 (#123)
This probably reads like a challenge, because that is the way of LibertysFlame. I promise you that it is not.
#133. To: Gatlin (#131)
(Edited)
#134. To: buckeroo, A K A Stone (#133)
Since you are a high power user making HUGE profits
I am not a high power making HUGE profits. ... you have an obligation to the channel to let us know how you collect the data in order to make buy/sell decisions.
I have no obligation to do shit for you....and I never would. Stone asked me to do this thread, and I am because I like him. Keep you ass off the thread if it holds no interest for you and take your snippy remarks elsewhere.
#135. To: buckeroo (#133)
(Edited)
I use TD Ameritrade software. What do you use?
#136. To: Gatlin (#135)
I use no software....I have a brain and I use it.
#137. To: Gatlin (#125)
I obviously used a misnomer, I should not have used the term “paper gain.” I see the confusion I caused. I should have tried to find a different term. Perhaps this will explain what I meant. The broker’s computer shows in one column the stocks daily gain/loss for the current day (continually updating throughout the day )in one column. In the next column, the computer shows your actual gain/loss updated (als continually updating). Those numbers were only for yesterday. So over a period of say five days, on the fifth day the daily gain fo those stocks may be $1,000....but my gain could show $3,000 (over the 5 day period). I always can see what the stocks are doing overall in any moment of time during the day....as well as I can see what my stocks are doing in that moment of time with a continuing computation.
#138. To: buckeroo (#136)
(Edited)
#139. To: Gatlin (#130)
I am going to have to leave you shortly for a few hours....I will be busy. I only have 3 stocks lined up for today’s buy and I want at least 5 to add to yesterday. I am again building up to 20.
#140. To: Vicomte13 (#137)
#141. To: Gatlin (#138)
#142. To: buckeroo (#126)
You make trading sound complicated.
There is nothing complicated about how I trade. What is the name of the graphical user interface of the trading software you use?
#143. To: Gatlin (#142)
I simply log on the Website, then start monitoring the activity and begin to buy, sell or both.
If this old country boy with only a high school and the highest math course being ninth grade general math can do it....then, anyone who possesses logic and common sense can also do it.
#144. To: buckeroo, A K A Stone (#141)
You are an absolute liar.
#145. To: buckeroo (#143)
I simply log on the Website, then start monitoring the activity and begin to buy, sell or both.
#146. To: Gatlin, A K A Stone (#144)
(Edited)
I trust I have made myself perfectly clear to you.
#147. To: buckeroo (#143)
If this old country boy with only a high school and the highest math course being ninth grade general math can do it....then, anyone who possesses logic and common sense can also do it.
#148. To: buckeroo (#147)
(Edited)
#149. To: Gatlin (#148)
Now, that was really inspiring...you must listen to Jim sing it again.
#150. To: Gatlin (#140)
#151. To: Gatlin (#150)
#152. To: Vicomte13 (#151)
#153. To: Gatlin (#152)
(Edited)
I think you may be getting some wrong ideas from what I am posting any may be mentally formulating some plan for the future.
#154. To: Gatlin (#152)
I always figured if they were any good, they could hire a bunch of people to work directly for them and clean up on making money and forget about selling advice.
#155. To: Vicomte13, gatlin, A K A Stone, VxH, buckeroo (#154)
why are they selling
#156. To: hondo68 (#155)
If these stocks are so wonderful why aren't they holding on to them to keep getting richer?
#157. To: Vicomte13 (#156)
#158. To: hondo68 (#157)
(Edited)
#159. To: All (#158)
(Edited)
Stocks are set for a rebound after Dow plummets 1,000 points, entering correction territory 
Traders work on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange (NYSE) on January 6, 2016 in New York City - Spencer Platt | Getty Images News | Getty Images
#160. To: Gatlin (#85)
But at age 84, I know that I still do enjoy having sex with my wife every day of the year.
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