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Title: Windows 10 = Maze of Slow, Intrusive Garbage. Need Help in Un-Bloating and Speeding Up
Source:
Me
URL Source: [None]
Published: Jan 2, 2018
Author: Me
Post Date: 2018-01-02 11:15:46 by Liberator
Keywords: Windows 10, Intrusive, Garbage
Views: 21407
Comments: 92
To you Computer tech-heads, just got a Win 10 HP piece of crap that is running in quicksand. It's not a brand new machine... Firefox is running, but preventing the LF page from opening without permission. Took forever to load youtube as well as all other pages. Have loaded CCleaner and Avast. There seems to be a mountain of bloatware and intrusive programs running in the background. I'm a Win 7 guy, so this is all Greek to me. It's like a selfish Monster has hijacked the machine. The Settings are nothing like the simplicity of Win 7. Very convoluted. How do I take back this machine? And stop the intrusive stuff and updates? Any constructive suggestions are appreciated. Thanks...
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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 48.
#12. To: Liberator (#0)
A decent downgrade guide, covers the issues pretty well. How to Downgrade Preinstalled or Upgraded Windows 10 Installation to Windows 7/8.1
How would Liberator downgrade when he bought a used computer with Win-doze 10 pre-installed? There is no traceability to a license agreement with Microsoft and therefore no warranty per your dumb ass suggestion.
He only needs an existing Win7 Pro license to install an old version. Since he is mourning the loss of his old OS, he has a good chance of already owning a Win7 that he could install on this Win10 Hellmachine. I never suggested he had any warranty. You made that up. Dumb ass.
With the Win7 PRO that I know of (fully licensed of course) from the original install, it will read the CPU registration and lock to the machine. Win 7 is not transferable to other boxes is what I am suggesting. You are simplifying the issues into silliness.
You get stupider by the day. Win7 and others never lock to a CPU. The OEM versions of newer versions of Windows will lock to a particular motherboard and its components. For these, you must stay with the same computer or at least a motherboard with the same components. However, you can install different CPUs with no problem. For OEM versions, the OS is locked to the first computer (motherboard configuration) you install it on and you cannot upgrade previous versions of Windows with it. If you have a full licensed copy of Win7, you can install it where you like and it can upgrade old versions of Windows (and it has direct support from Microsoft, not the OEM). It does "lock" to a particular configuration of motherboard/RAM/drives/video cards during the registration process with Microsoft. This can temporarily inhibit any component changes, even while still using a computer with the same CPU/mobo/video card. Microsoft will accept new configurations but it takes a little more fuss. In no case is the OS ever locked to a particular CPU or hardware configuration or motherboard. You don't seem to know much about Windows OEM vs. full versions. You shouldn't be offering advice to anyone. Liberator might be better off just trying to clean up his Win10 machine to make it usable. The presence of creepy bloated spyware is discouraging but with some effort, he should be able to get a clean Win10. And keep in mind that this Win7-Forever thing is going to turn out just like the WinXP-Forever did. When the manufacturers of the components and Microsoft stop building drivers for new components and motherboards for an old OS like WinXP or Win7, that OS's days are numbered. Microsoft ended all non-subscribed (paid corporate) support for Win7 in January 2015, two years ago. Even the paid corporate bigwigs will receive support only through January of 2020, only two years from now. And even the subscribed support corporate types get only security patches and minor updates. Microsoft is not producing any new device driver support for these corporate machines so they lack the ability to use many newer components appearing on the market due to lack of drivers. You may want to reconsider making much effort or incurring expense to make a Win10 HP into a Win7 HP with only two years left in the Win7 support cycle. I know this isn't happy advice for you to hear but you need to be coldblooded about it and recognize the reality of what happens when Microsoft sunsets and then drops support for one of its OSes. Ignore buckwheat's advice.
One of your most perspicacious observations here at LF. : ) Going back to my #19 and the performance hits that older Intel CPU-based systems will incur to fix the CPU flaw in these older systems (under Linux/Windoze/MacOS), there are those within the industry who are saying this benefits AMD. AMD's new generation of CPUs do not have this deep security flaw found in the Intel CPUs. These AMD CPUs, the Ryzen line for desktops/workstations and AMD's big multicore server CPUs do not incur these speed penalties that are being enacted now on all the Intel-based machines that are a few years old. So suddenly those old Windows machines are going to get noticeably slower. People that just got screwed by Intel are going to be looking hard at buying AMD if they feel they have to upgrade their machines due to this security flaw. Why would anyone want to reward a company that just screwed them by buying another of their products? Nobody wants to do that. And it does give AMD a food in the door, just as their powerful new chip designs have matured and come to market in sizable quantities. Intel issued a patch to essentially slow down all machines running Linux/Windoze and close the security hole caused by the flawed CPU design. Now that has apparently been pulled back and the AMD machines sail on running at full speed and the Intel-based machines are stuck with worse performance if they patch this severe security hole. Apple will have to do the same, I think. Apple's Mach micro-kernel would seem to be just as vulnerable from what I'm reading. The most recent Intel CPUs are far less impacted by the performance hit incurred by patching this CPU flaw. This indicates that Intel knew for some time that they were producing extremely flawed CPU designs and chose not to fix that problem and then issued a patch to fix and, therefore, greatly slow down those CPUs. It brings to mind the Apple iPhone scandal of stealthily trying to downgrade their performance to save their battery life (warranted for 3 years for AppleCare customers to retain over 50% of battery life, no matter how many times the battery cycled). So I would expect some class action lawsuits against Intel for this. Among others, thing of all the cloud providers with hundreds of thousands of these CPUs who will, as a direct result of Intel's actions, lose 20%-50% of the performance they paid Intel's premium prices to obtain. This will not end well for Intel in court. Then think of all the damage from class action lawsuits by ordinary consumers. For the first time in a long time, this might be the time to consider buying some AMD stock. They really do have some good new hardware in their latest CPU designs. There are also some of the latest Intel CPUs that are containing fairly powerful AMD Radeon graphics instead of the various Intel embedded 3d graphics capabilities, an implicit admission that AMD has progressed faster and cheaper than Intel has. Intel wouldn't license AMD's Radeon silicon for its own chips if it could economically provide the same performance in-house. I welcome the competition, across the board. The rise of AMD against Intel has always been a net bonanza for the consumer, it seems.
What about processors in phones/tablets? ARM, Qualcomm etc. etc.? Android OS?
Apparently, some of the ARM CPUs suffer a comparable defect, the bigger 64-bit ones. So many of these are customized CPU cores, like Apple's A8/A9/A10 CPUs in its iPhones/iPads, that it is hard to make a comprehensive statement about all the ARM CPU variants. But I suspect the high-end ARM CPUs will suffer some performance penalty as well. Most prominent suspects: Windows 10 tablets with ARM and Google's own Chromebook and its clones (like the ASUS Chromebook). The units most likely to be adversely affected will be the most pricey models produced in recent years for Windows ARM tablets and Chromebook hardware. That'll leave a bad taste in the mouths of buyers and summon a parade of class-action lawyers hungry for a payoff. I think people haven't quite realized just how bad this is for Intel and, to a lesser extent, ARM.
Is the defect actually being criminally exploited by malicious hackers? Or is it just a theoretical flaw that MAYBE they might find out about someday?
In the link above to The Register, they have a very complete explanation of the exact nature of the flaw in handling kernel requests and why they have to move the virtual kernel to its own separate address space (incurring a major speed penalty). They mention this at the end: So, that answers some of your question about ARM systems. And I am already safely slowed down on my Intel i7 Mac as I am now running MacOS 10.13.2.
Hey, I gotta Win 10 question that maybe you can answer for me... I have a cheapie HP Stream 11-y010wm notebook computer that I use on very rare occasion when I need to use HP scanner/printer software on my printer... Anyway, the damn Win10 upgrade wizard tells me that my CPU is OK & my RAM is OK, but I don't have enough space on the 32GB built-in hard disk. Well I've run the damn disk cleaning utility and I've removed all the damn programs except Windows itself (plus a few HP programs I need for the Wifi, mousepad & crap like that) and the frigging bloatware STILL tells me I need more room... I'm at wits end... what else can I safely remove so the damn upgrade will work? Even if I have to remove system files that it'll reinstall when it upgrades... Any advice/help would be appreciated.
Maybe you should check what your disk free space is. Go to My Computer, right-click the hard drive icon, select Properties from the pop-up menu. You should see how much space is used and free with a pie chart. You might check to see whether you're running the 32-bit or the 64-bit version of Win10.
After I offered up advice that you solicited, you don't even bother to reply.
Sorry... I've been struggling with that damn bloatware, trying to get the upgrade to work... I have the 64-bit... and the suggestions you gave helped quite a bit... I can clean out a LOT of crap that the clean-up wizard misses, giving me 17.0 GB used on C:/ and 10.8 GB available... and did a "reset this PC" taking it all back to square one with no reset point to revert back to... And delete ALL other programs it will let me delete... I don't have NOTHING on there except the fucking Windows... And I made sure the recylce bin is empty too... And when I start the Win 10 upgrade assistant, IT TELLS ME EVERYTHING IS OK... And then I sit there and wait while it downloads... And then I sit there and wait while it installs... And I sit and wait some more because it's slower than molasses in January... And then I get pissed-off & start cussing a blue streak because it mother-fucking bombs out after being 80% installed... And it has the mother-fucking AUDACITY to tell me that it's because there's not enough disk space after telling me there WAS enough space when I started. GODDAM BLOATWARE Fuck Bill Gates... Fuck Microsoft Fuck Redmond Washington The world would've been a much nicer place to live if they had just called it quits after DOS 6.0... Gates has NEVER made a version of Windows that didn't SUCK.
Yes, it's never good when your OS takes up more than half of your storage media. Is there any way that you can download the update you need on to a USB drive? Those are very cheap now for 16GB or 32GB. I'm not sure you could even update that laptop's internal drive. An EMMC drive is unusual, not really an SSD, just a MMC data card soldiered to the motherboard. I suppose you could try to ask HP support or search around their forum to see if anyone else has the same problem or found a solution. I went to look at the HP forum and found this thread: HP: I am runnin W 10 ver.1511 and wish to upgrade to 1607, but it is no go , 12/15/16 HP is saying that the drive cannot be upgraded, it seems. They suggest wiping the drive entirely, installing Win10 fully from a USB drive. That's a lot of downloading and fussing. That is just an insanely small boot drive. I suppose it must have made some sense to HP when they built it.
I was about to ask you the same thing... or at least a similar question.. I have a 32GB microSDHC inserted as drive D:/, and found a way to use it as default for any apps I download plus docs, pictures, music, etc... but don't know how to divert any system crap to it.. I can't remember... is there some kind of windows swap file that I can change the path for? I found a way to disable the recycle bin, so anything that I delete actually gets deleted... What about "temp" files... I vaguely recall something about using environmental variables to divert them somewhere too.... But my memory is getting faulty in my old age... I also have a 16GB USB stick plugged in as drive E:/, but it's just sitting there not doing anything... Is there any way to "merge" or "append" drives D:/ or E:/ with C:/ so the system thinks it's all just one big drive? Or is that just wishful thinking on my part? That's another vague memory I have from somewhere that I don't know if it's real or not... Maybe I'm getting confused with linux...
That should be plenty to be able to download a current Win10 install file, wipe your drive in the BIOS utility, and then install. Just be certain that you have created a bootable USB drive with the Win10 OS on it. You can limit its size or you can divert it to another drive. I doubt that will solve your problem. You should be able to download a full Win10 installer to it and use it to install to a blank C: drive. There are utilities that have come and gone over the years but I wouldn't recommend them. That works okay on Linux and MacOS, not as well for Windows machines. Microsoft: Windows 10 ISO download Make sure you have your OEM licensing info handy before you try any of this stuff. Also make sure you can boot with that USB flash drive before you erase anything on the C: drive.
is that stored on my computer somewhere?
You might read this HP thread: HP: How I was able to install Windows 10 on HP Stream 13 (32GB SSD) HP's forums do have some info from others that had problems, mostly getting from Win8.1 to Win10. HP has an upgrades page that could help. HP: HP PCs - How to Reset Your Computer to Factory Settings (Windows 10, 8, 7)
OK... thanks... I DID at least manage to download & do an HP bios update a couple days ago, so I'm pretty sure that change is permanent no matter what I wipe from the drive... But it's gonna take a few days for me to check out that other stuff because I have other commitments to take care of... So be patient & I'll get back to you then... Thanks again!
When you download the fresh Win10, try to use the Win10 Media Creation edition. That will help you prepare the USB drive and make it bootable. That plain ISO file download I pointed you to earlier requires you to create your own bootable USB setup with other utilities. So the other Media Creation version should be more straightforward and reliable.
I assume I can download the iso to my linux PC & use UNetbooten to make it into a bootable USB... That's what I usually use when I need to do a fresh install of linux on something... (although I've been pretty happy with Mint for a while & will have to refamiliarize myself with UNetbootin details in case somethings changed) Annyway, I assume it will work with a Win10 iso... as long as it's the same as the OEM installed and not some exta fancy professional edition they want you to pay extra for...
Just verify it is bootable before you wipe stuff. Any embedded license/serial info should be stored in protected NVRAM and not able to be wiped by an ordinary BIOS update. Some of these machines do have a hidden recovery partition. It sounds like yours doesn't, given what you're telling us about your disk free space.
Finally! After purging temp files & old window versions over and over and over and over and over again.... it slowly but FINALLY began accepting the upgrades, little by little until AT LONG LAST, I'm up-to-date! OK... so now what? I forget why I started doing this (other than it needed upgrading) But why did I want to mess with it anyway? Well hopefully it'll come to me... But in the mean time, are there any "must have" applications and/or utilities that you'd recommend? Is the MS Edge browser good enough? Or should I download Firefox or Chrome for familiarity? Is MS Bitdefender good enough for virus protection? Or should I download Norton? (or is there some other virus protection that's better but I never heard of because I haven done Windows in a dozen years? BTW, where's a good place to download software? Is CNET OK? Or is there a better place for shareware? What about adblocking and crap like that? I worked my butt off to get this damn little notebook up to date... might as well give it a shot & see if I like it any better than my obsolete Android tablet. (at least it has a real keyboard LOL!)
OK... so now what? I forget why I started doing this (other than it needed upgrading) But why did I want to mess with it anyway? Well, well. Congrats on sheer persistence. Up in your #27, you indicated it was for an HP printer and/or scanner thing that is highly important to your happiness. Anyway, that's what I thought the upgrade was about. Your mileage may vary but you should make sure that you have working print/copy/scan capability. Then check your free space on that really tiny 32GB hard drive and see if you have enough space for any more stuff. Maybe you can put documents and stuff on a flash drive or external USB drive but you need space on your main hard drive for basic apps and for virtual memory and system hibernate disk space too. If you don't use it much for internet, you can probably get by with MS Bitdefender. I wouldn't install Chrome or Firefox unless you're sure you have enough free space for it. Although I use Firefox myself, Chrome just completed their transition to support all their different versions of Chrome with clang replacing cc and Microsoft's compilers across the board. So all versions are now synchronized, regardless of OS. And now they'll switch the linkers and use LLVM across all those platforms as well. So I would recommend Chrome just for that reason: works the same on all platforms, all features will be available on all platforms. And no proprietary compilers now. Firefox will be updating as well but Chrome is definitely in the lead.
#49. To: Tooconservative (#48)
Oh, I got plenty space now... and I reinstalled all my HP printer/scanner software too Drive C:/ shows 21.3 GB used, 7.8 GB free... But I also installed a 32 GB SDHC as drive D: which shows 2.41 GB used, 27.2 GB free... And I found a place where I can set the default for new apps, music, downloads & crap like that all goes to D: So I assume that as long as I don't have to do any more MAJOR Win10 updates, I should be OK with the OS on C: and everything else on D: Does that make sense?
Thanks for the advice. We tend not to want to be out of our comfort zone. It's been Firefox for as long as I remember. But it has become far too intrusive and pretentious -- I mean what platform thinks it has the right to control your very computer?
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#13. To: Tooconservative, Liberator (#12)
#15. To: buckeroo (#13)
How would Liberator downgrade when he bought a used computer with Win-doze 10 pre-installed? There is no traceability to a license agreement with Microsoft and therefore no warranty per your dumb ass suggestion.
#17. To: Tooconservative (#15)
He only needs an existing Win7 Pro license to install an old version. Since he is mourning the loss of his old OS, he has a good chance of already owning a Win7 that he could install on this Win10 Hellmachine.
#18. To: buckeroo, Liberator (#17)
With the Win7 PRO that I know of (fully licensed of course) from the original install, it will read the CPU registration and lock to the machine. Win 7 is not transferable to other boxes is what I am suggesting.
#20. To: Tooconservative, buckeroo (#18)
You get stupider by the day.
Yep, and every time I break wind from the
beans the sound it makes is: "Buckeroo."
#21. To: Willie Green, buckeroo, Liberator (#20)
Yep, and every time I break wind from the beans the sound it makes is: "Buckeroo."
#22. To: Tooconservative (#21)
#23. To: Willie Green (#22)
What about processors in phones/tablets? ARM, Qualcomm etc. etc.? Android OS?
#24. To: Tooconservative (#23)
#26. To: Willie Green (#24)
Finally, macOS has been patched to counter the chip design blunder since version 10.13.2, according to operating system kernel expert Alex Ionescu. And it appears 64-bit ARM Linux kernels will also get a set of KAISER patches, completely splitting the kernel and user spaces, to block attempts to defeat KASLR. We'll be following up this week.
#27. To: Tooconservative (#26)
#29. To: Willie Green (#27)
#30. To: All (#29)
#35. To: Tooconservative, VxH (#30)
After I offered up advice that you solicited, you don't even bother to reply.
The CPU is OK and the RAM is OK and the hard drive space (10.8 GB available) is OK...
#36. To: Willie Green (#35)
And it has the mother-fucking AUDACITY to tell me that it's because there's not enough disk space after telling me there WAS enough space when I started.
#37. To: Tooconservative (#36)
Is there any way that you can download the update you need on to a USB drive? Those are very cheap now for 16GB or 32GB.
#38. To: Willie Green (#37)
I have a 32GB microSDHC inserted as drive D:/, and found a way to use it as default for any apps I download plus docs, pictures, music, etc... but don't know how to divert any system crap to it..
I can't remember... is there some kind of windows swap file that I can change the path for?
I also have a 16GB USB stick plugged in as drive E:/, but it's just sitting there not doing anything...
Is there any way to "merge" or "append" drives D:/ or E:/ with C:/ so the system thinks it's all just one big drive? Or is that just wishful thinking on my part? That's another vague memory I have from somewhere that I don't know if it's real or not... Maybe I'm getting confused with linux...
#39. To: Tooconservative (#38)
Make sure you have your OEM licensing info handy before you try any of this stuff.
#41. To: Willie Green (#39)
(Edited)
#42. To: Tooconservative (#41)
#43. To: Willie Green (#42)
#44. To: Tooconservative (#43)
#45. To: Willie Green (#44)
#47. To: Tooconservative (#45)
#48. To: Willie Green, Liberator, VxH (#47)
(Edited)
Finally! After purging temp files & old window versions over and over and over and over and over again.... it slowly but FINALLY began accepting the upgrades, little by little until AT LONG LAST, I'm up-to-date!
But in the mean time, are there any "must have" applications and/or utilities that you'd recommend? Is the MS Edge browser good enough? Or should I download Firefox or Chrome for familiarity? Is MS Bitdefender good enough for virus protection? Or should I download Norton? (or is there some other virus protection that's better but I never heard of because I haven done Windows in a dozen years?
Replies to Comment # 48.
#52. To: Tooconservative (#48)
I would recommend Chrome just for that reason: works the same on all platforms, all features will be available on all platforms. And no proprietary compilers now. Firefox will be updating as well but Chrome is definitely in the lead.
End Trace Mode for Comment # 48.
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