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Title: Salt Lake County DA requests FBI assistance in Nurse Alex Wubbels investigation
Source:
Fox 13 Now
URL Source: http://fox13now.com/2017/09/07/salt ... se-alex-wubbels-investigation/
Published: Sep 7, 2017
Author: Mark Green
Post Date: 2017-09-07 18:28:30 by kenh
Keywords: None
Views: 20314
Comments: 105
SALT LAKE CITY — Salt Lake County District Attorney Sim Gill has requested the FBI’s assistance in the investigation into the arrest of a Utah nurse who refused to allow a blood draw from an unconscious patient without following proper procedure. In a statement released Thursday, Gill said his office officially requested the FBI investigate: “any and all individuals involved in the chain of conduct arising from the incident at the University of Utah Hospital on July 26, 2017 for any Civil Rights Violations under the color of authority.” Gill said he requested the FBI’s help due to events beyond a mere criminal investigation.
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#23. To: nolu chan (#10)
In the case of Wubbels, it appears she is a TRUE public servant and at least hesitant to file any civil lawsuit over the event, instead choosing the high road of using her experience to make the world a better place. Perhaps an unintended consequence of that is the potential for her to sue would hang over the city until the legal deadline passes (years, I imagine), during which time the city would be walking on eggshells with the entire medical community. The city might prefer a lawsuit that would be either settled out of court quickly or litigated almost as quickly, after which the matter would be legally and irrevocably settled and it's civic life and business as usual could return.
This involves a lot more than one cop. It involves... “any and all individuals involved in the chain of conduct arising from the incident at the University of Utah Hospital on July 26, 2017 for any Civil Rights Violations under the color of authority.”
But if the trail leads to a conspiracy to deprive the trucker and/or nurse of their civil rights, they couldn't just refer this to the Utah AG. And the Logan PD and Utah highway patrol are mostly beyond their jurisdiction as SLC prosecutors. So the FBI would be needed for a scenario like that. Once again, who wanted this blood? Who was Rotten Cop going to deliver it to? Rotten Cop said his supervisor ordered him to get it and that the request came from the Logan PD. He also said "I've never gone this far before." And he said, "I'm leaving here with those blood vials or a body in tow." Which sounds a lot like he was told that exactly. Rotten Cop does not seem imaginative enough to dream much of this up on his own. He was echoing what his supervisor told him. I'd love to be a fly on the wall when he tries to explain to the FBI how they were just trying to "protect" the trucker by violating his 4th Amendment rights. They'll eat him alive.
What?? He was acting under departmental procedure and the State of Utah law as written. She obstructed and then resisted arrest. This is insane.
So far. I'll mark your "high road" post for reference later.
Didn't one of those decisions concern exigent circumstances? How is that relevant to this case? It isn't. So why are you citing it?
Yes, it did. And thank you for asking. But it downplayed the use of exigent circumstances which was routinely offered as an excuse for warrantless blood draws. I think it was Sotomayor who wrote the majority opinion on that particular point. So that hurts your entire argument.
What for? She's completely within her legal and moral right to sue and use the money she wins for her own personal enjoyment (though it wouldn't surprise me if she instead donates it to a real charity).
So I can cite your stupid "She's taking the high road to make the world a better place" and rub it in your f**king face. "(though it wouldn't surprise me if she instead donates it to a real charity)." I'll mark this one for later reference also. What for? Same reason.
Did law enforcement cite exigent circumstances is this case as their legal reason to draw blood? No. Yet you reference a USSC ruling on exigent circumstances. Why? Other than you're an idiot.
You've got a rotating power source, why go electric? Belt drive from the engine crankshaft to the agitator/wringer gearbox and pump. I was like maybe 4 or 5 years old at the time we had that washing machine in the mid '50s. I remember the side loading electric one we had later much better. It had a door on top to add the detergent, and you could see the side of the tub turning down there. WoooHoo!!! This is a vintage 1920's Maytag washing machine with wringer powered by a 2-stroke engine. In rural America where there was no electricity, this made cleaning clothes a lot easier that it had been before. Another Maytag engine is running on the ground, and a "hit and miss" engine is running next to the washer. Taken August 27, 2011 at the Shelby Iron Works Engine Show in Shelby, Alabama (near Birmingham). So I can cite your stupid "She's taking the high road to make the world a better place" and rub it in your f**king face. hahahaa You are so cute when you're angry. I didn't say she wouldn't sue. I said she was at least hesitant to sue. If she does decide to sue, then it won't invalidate that observation. I said "it wouldn't surprise me" if she donated any damage awards to charity. She may decide instead to throw a big party for all her medical friends featuring a cop pinata that strongly resembles Payne. If so, more power too her.
And therein lies the nobility.
I agree with that assessment, but it may inevitably go beyond Wubbels to a class action. The extent of the violation is not yet clear. The FBI was not called in for help with one misdeed by one cop. He was acting unlawfully in violation of the U.S. Constitution, and U.S. Supreme Court precedent which had struck down, as null and void, all State laws and regulations or procedures repugnant to that precedential opinion. The officer's actions were unconstitutional and resort to null and void law, regulations or procedures offer no help to make his actions lawful. A directive from his lieutenant may mitigate his problems, but amplify the problems of the municipality of Salt Lake City. In addition, the officer's demands appear clearly in violation of HIIPA laws. If this has occured in multiple past cases, SLC could be facing a class action civil suit, appeals of criminal convictions, and more criminal complaints. Recall that TWO officers have been placed on administrative leave. Officer Payne did the arrest. Lieutenant Anonymous apparently called for the arrest. September 2, 2017 Another cop was placed on administrative leave with pay in the handcuffing of a Utah hospital nurse who refused to take blood from an unconscious patient. Salt Lake City’s mayor and police chief apologized Friday to Utah Hospital nurse, Alex Wubbels, who is seen in body cam video screaming “help me” after Detective Jeff Payne handcuffed and dragged her out of the hospital over her refusal to take the blood sample from the patient, a car-crash victim, on July 26. The video has caused outrage since it was released Thursday. Payne was placed on paid leave and prosecutors on Friday announced a a criminal investigation. Police said Friday a second officer was also placed on paid leave. That officer has not been formally identified, but officials have said they also were reviewing the conduct of Payne's boss, a lieutenant who reportedly called for the arrest if Wubbels kept interfering. [snip]
The FBI investigates. The Justice Department prosecutes. Salt Lake City Lieutenant James Tracy, who reportedly called for the arrest was placed on administrative leave, in addition to Salt Lake City Detective Jeff Payne. It was the Salt Lake City mayor who apologized, not Logan. The Logan PD is not on the hook for this, and they are not volunteering to climb on board. Logan called the SLC police to request a blood draw. Logan did not request or demand that any law be disregarded in the taking. That is Logan's story and they are sticking with it. SLC owns this mess. The nurse showed the Salt Lake City detective a copy of the agreement between the police and the hospital that such involuntary blood draws would not happen. Based on the existence of such an agreement, I will bet a cookie that this has happened before, and the agreement was used to avoid legal catastrophe. It appears that Lt. Troglodyte and Deputy Dawg did not get the word, or they are just free thinkers with a badge. By Stephen Hunt and Luke Ramseth The police officer who arrested a University Hospital nurse during a July 26 dispute over getting blood from a patient should immediately have been placed on administrative leave, according to Salt Lake City Mayor Jackie Biskupski. Instead, Salt Lake City police Detective Jeff Payne was allowed to stay on the job until Sept. 1, a day after the nurse’s attorney publicly released police body camera footage of the arrest. Another officer — believed to be Payne’s watch commander, Lt. James Tracy — was placed on leave the same day. [...] Logan Police Chief Gary Jensen told CNN on Wednesday that Payne had called a Logan detective to say that he was having a tough time getting the blood. According to Jensen, the detective told Payne not to worry about it, because Logan could get the blood through other means. “He didn’t tell him you must cease and desist; he simply said, ‘Don’t worry about it, we’ll go another way,’” Jensen said in the CNN interview. “I just don’t believe [Payne’s] actions were in the best interest of the patient, the nurses or law enforcement, quite frankly. He could have just packed up and gone home.” [snip]
Isn't that standard in these types of cases? Or do you read something sinister into it? "The FBI was not called in for help with one misdeed by one cop." It's possible they're simply investigating a federal violation of her civil rights. Or it could be Russian interference.
Did you happen to notice one is a Lieutenant? Read: Salt Lake City liability. They could be investigating Keckistan, but I doubt it.
“He didn’t tell him you must cease and desist; he simply said, ‘Don’t worry about it, we’ll go another way,’” Jensen said in the CNN interview. “I just don’t believe [Payne’s] actions were in the best interest of the patient, the nurses or law enforcement, quite frankly. He could have just packed up and gone home.” Damn, that's cold. : ) They do have incentive to try to keep their hands clean. You have to wonder if they did eventually find a way to get the blood via other means.
I wonder if there is any other legal means to do it. Even if there were a medical draw, I don't see how he legally gets it without a warrant.
So they BOTH thought the law and police department policy were on their side. WTF is going on here? Why are these two being blamed for acting within accepted protocol? FIRE THEM!! TAKE THEIR HOUSES!! THROW THEM IN JAIL!! That's what I'm reading.
Don't get hysterical, misterwhite. We need you performing your otherwise cool, collected unmistakable love for the UBER AMRERICA POLICE STATE! It is what you do best to ensure I have lots of laffs.
Yeah. Sorry. I know you're all counting on me.
Your apologies are accepted. Listen to me, it is important; this is critical stuff here and within the chit-chat channel that I am about reveal to you. If it weren't for you consistently begging for a POLICE STATE w/ UBER CAPABILITIES TO FUCK AMERICA UP EVEN MORE, there would be no point of viewing your posts.
A jackass in power "authorizing" an unconstitutional act does not make it constitutional. It just leads to a criminal act. Deputy Dawg can always say he was just following orders, as that excuse has always worked well in the past. If SLC wants to accept that unconstitutional searches were accepted protocol, then they should get ready to open their wallet very wide.
Then shouldn't that jackass be blamed? And we're not talking about some isolated "act". This is Utah law and police department policy that's been used many times before without a problem. "If SLC wants to accept that unconstitutional searches were accepted protocol, then they should get ready to open their wallet very wide." Why SLC? Why not the State of Utah? It's their statute.
The Utah statute is legal and constitutional. The brain dead misreading of the statute by the SLC lieutenant, the detective, and yourself yields an unconstitutional, criminal result. And, of course, massive liability for Salt Lake City who employs those two blockheads. SLC should consider hiring the nurse to babysit them.
You have to wonder why they went so far over the line for an accident that occurred in Logan, UT, 81 miles outside their jurisdiction. Their only involvement was trying to get blood for Logan (or UHP in my conspiracy theory). I can't really imagine how or why they went so far in this case when it wasn't even their case to begin with.
You still gnawin' on that old bone?
The one that said they can draw blood from an unconscious driver?
Why do you almost always side with evil?
I am citing the law which explains the behavior. Nothing evil in that. You, on the other hand, have contributed zilch to these threads. Your posts consist of name-calling, lies, innuendos and incoherent ramblings. Look around in your head and find two functioning brain cells to rub together and create a relevant thought. If you can't find them -- which, obviously you haven't so far -- stop embarrassing yourself with your stupid posts.
I don't want to debate you. You're not worth the time as you wouldn't learn a thing. You're stuck where you are and will never change. So it is a better use of my time to let you know you are behaving in a bad way. Makes you seem like a horrible person. When someone is an idiot I will tell them that is what I think of them. Besides Chan and tooconservative and even Vic alreadyndestroyed you. You're just to stuck where you are to admit or realize it.
You mean the old bone that an SLC detective and his supervisor violated a nurse's rights and placed her under false arrest while trying to violate an accident victim's 4th Amendment rights, all for an accident that didn't occur in SLC jurisdiction and when the there was no probable cause that the victim was an impaired driver? Yes, that "old bone" is going to jump up and bite an SLC detective and his supervisor in the ass, real hard.
No. Your relentless pursuit of why things happened the way they did. It could be that police departmental policy is that any vehicular accident involving a fatality gives probable cause to draw blood from an unconscious or dead driver. Perhaps that's the policy that's now changed. Can't blame the cop for that.
Yes we can lamer.
You're just making shit up out of thin air.
I'm stating possibilities, using words like "could be" and "perhaps". You're the one making shit up with your "the detective and his supervisor violated a nurse's rights" and "placed her under false arrest" and "while trying to violate an accident victim's 4th Amendment rights" and "when the there was no probable cause that the victim was an impaired driver". What's your plan -- to apologize later when the truth comes out or temporarily disappear from the forum?
We'll see how it turns out. I say the nurse wins, pretty much across the board. Including if she files a lawsuit for a fat settlement from SLC PD.
Not if it goes to court. Not if we abide by the rule of law. Not if we instituted loser pays. But *sigh*, none of that will happen. The police department and the city will cave under political correctness and social pressure which people like you will incorrectly interpret as an admission of malfeasance rather than what it really is -- a bribe to just shut up and go away.
They'll cave because their city attorney will tell them they're going to lose badly on the merits. They don't pay out of fear of the public backlash. So they'll settle out of court, assuming the nurse decides to sue.
Merits schmerits. They might lose on the optics or on the emotional aspects, but legal merits? No. I'm sure the police department will be able to point to dozens of prior instances where they drew blood without incident. They can point to state law. They can point to departmental policy. Both Detective Jeff Payne and his supervisor believed they were operating within legal parameters, even to the point where Payne's supervisor ordered the nurse arrested for obstruction. The nurse didn't have the legal power to obstruct a police investigation. She exceeded her authority. For that she was briefly arrested. Briefly. Had SHE not resisted that arrest, things would have gone smoothly. Afterwards, things could have been straightened out. If the state and the city and the police department and the supervisor and the detective were all wrong, the blood evidence couldn't be used at trial -- assuming there ever was one. Keep in mind, that is the intent of fourth amendment protections -- to prevent evidence being used against you in a court of law. Plenty of time to sort this out.
Comments (64 - 105) not displayed.
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest Monstrous punitive damages in civil litigation. The municipality is on the hook, big time. Consider the possibility of looking back to find cases where the nurse did not say NO.
#24. To: nolu chan (#21)
They do not need the FBI to sort out the one cop.
#25. To: nolu chan (#21)
The employing municipality is required to insure that all its police officers know the law that they are enforcing. Blowing it off, or gun decking it, can be expensive. So can giving bass ackwards instructions. They do not need the FBI to sort out the one cop.
#26. To: Tooconservative (#9)
Salt Lake district attorney asks FBI to investigate confrontation between cop and nurse for potential civil-rights violations
#27. To: Pinguinite (#23)
In the case of Wubbels, it appears she is a TRUE public servant and at least hesitant to file any civil lawsuit over the event, instead choosing the high road of using her experience to make the world a better place.
#28. To: Tooconservative (#5)
overruling the two major decisions of the Supreme Court over the last 4 years.
#29. To: misterwhite (#28)
Didn't one of those decisions concern exigent circumstances?
#30. To: misterwhite (#27)
So far. I'll mark your "high road" post for reference later.
#31. To: Pinguinite (#30)
What for?
#32. To: Tooconservative (#29)
But it downplayed the use of exigent circumstances
#33. To: Tooconservative (#20)
(Edited)
Surely it didn't run the agitator or the wringer directly.
Maytag gear jammer... 
#34. To: misterwhite (#31)
I'll mark this one for later reference also. What for? Same reason.
#35. To: Pinguinite (#34)
I didn't say she wouldn't sue. I said she was at least hesitant to sue.
#36. To: misterwhite, Toooconservative, Pinguinite (#26)
[Pinguinite #23] In the case of Wubbels, it appears she is a TRUE public servant and at least hesitant to file any civil lawsuit over the event, instead choosing the high road of using her experience to make the world a better place.
[misterwhite #25] He was acting under departmental procedure and the State of Utah law as written. She obstructed and then resisted arrest. This is insane.
2nd Utah police officer put on administrative duty over nurse arrest
Fox News
#37. To: Tooconservative (#25)
But if the trail leads to a conspiracy to deprive the trucker and/or nurse of their civil rights, they couldn't just refer this to the Utah AG. And the Logan PD and Utah highway patrol are mostly beyond their jurisdiction as SLC prosecutors. So the FBI would be needed for a scenario like that.
Logan police didn’t push for blood draw, chief tells CNN after SLC mayor rebukes handling of officer’s leave
St. Louis Tribune
September 7, 2017
#38. To: nolu chan (#36)
Recall that TWO officers have been placed on administrative leave (with pay).
#39. To: misterwhite (#38)
Isn't that standard in these types of cases? Or do you read something sinister into it?
#40. To: nolu chan (#37)
Logan Police Chief Gary Jensen told CNN on Wednesday that Payne had called a Logan detective to say that he was having a tough time getting the blood. According to Jensen, the detective told Payne not to worry about it, because Logan could get the blood through other means.
#41. To: Tooconservative (#40)
You have to wonder if they did eventually find a way to get the blood via other means.
#42. To: nolu chan (#39)
Did you happen to notice one is a Lieutenant? Read: Salt Lake City liability.
#43. To: misterwhite (#42)
FIRE THEM!! TAKE THEIR HOUSES!! THROW THEM IN JAIL!!
#44. To: buckeroo (#43)
We need you performing your otherwise cool, collected unmistakable love for the UBER AMRERICA POLICE STATE!
#45. To: misterwhite (#44)
I know you're all counting on me.
#46. To: misterwhite (#42)
So they BOTH thought the law and police department policy were on their side. WTF is going on here? Why are these two being blamed for acting within accepted protocol?
#47. To: nolu chan (#46)
A jackass in power "authorizing" an unconstitutional act does not make it constitutional.
#48. To: misterwhite (#47)
Why SLC? hy not the State of Utah? It's their statute.
#49. To: nolu chan (#48)
The brain dead misreading of the statute by the SLC lieutenant, the detective, and yourself yields an unconstitutional, criminal result. And, of course, massive liability for Salt Lake City who employs those two blockheads. SLC should consider hiring the nurse to babysit them.
#50. To: Tooconservative (#49)
:You have to wonder why they went so far over the line for an accident that occurred in Logan ..."
#51. To: nolu chan (#48)
The Utah statute is legal and constitutional.
#52. To: misterwhite (#51)
#53. To: A K A Stone (#52)
Why do you almost always side with evil?
#54. To: misterwhite (#53)
#55. To: misterwhite (#50)
You still gnawin' on that old bone?
#56. To: Tooconservative (#55)
You mean the old bone that an SLC detective and his supervisor violated a nurse's rights and placed her under false arrest while trying to violate an accident victim's 4th Amendment rights, all for an accident that didn't occur in SLC jurisdiction and when the there was no probable cause that the victim was an impaired driver?
#57. To: misterwhite (#56)
Can't blame the cop for that.
#58. To: misterwhite (#56)
It could be that police departmental policy is that any vehicular accident involving a fatality gives probable cause to draw blood from an unconscious or dead driver. Perhaps that's the policy that's now changed.
#59. To: Tooconservative (#58)
You're just making shit up out of thin air.
#60. To: misterwhite (#59)
#61. To: Tooconservative (#60)
I say the nurse wins, pretty much across the board. Including if she files a lawsuit for a fat settlement from SLC PD.
#62. To: misterwhite (#61)
#63. To: Tooconservative (#62)
They'll cave because their city attorney will tell them they're going to lose badly on the merits.
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