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United States News Title: The Government Made Me a Litterbug Uncle has turned me into a litterbug. Ive chucked empty beer bottles out the window. I do not like doing this. I feel guilty about doing this. I never used to do this. So why do I do it now? Because having an open container or an empty one in ones car invites severe (and for me, a car journalist, life-altering) consequences. If one happens to be pulled over by a cop for any random reason (seatbelt violation, speeding, an out-of-date sticker) and he sees an open or empty in the car, you are in serious trouble. Better call Saul. Even if the empty has been empty for weeks. Even if all youve had is a sip and your BAC level is nowhere near the legal limit defining drunk driving. It doesnt matter. You still face the possibility of being charged with drinking while driving or driving under the influence whatever the verbiage and are subject to arrest and prosecution just as you would be if you blew a .08 or more on the Breathalyzer (see here for an interesting legal explanation/analysis) machine. Except you didnt. Not being drunk isnt a defense. All thats required to establish your guilt is the presence in the car of the open/empty container even if its not yours. Even if you didnt have so much as a sip. You are presumed guilty of drinking while driving by dint of the presence of the container and it being opened or empty. This is not unlike characterizing an 18-year-old as a sex offender because he had relations with his 17-year-old girlfriend. Sober drivers are subject to being arrested and convicted and their lives ruined for what amounts to the same offense in terms of what will happen to them as drivers whose BAC levels are at or beyond the legal threshold defining them as drunk. Even though theirs arent. Hence the motivation to throw any empties out the window. Littering is a small bust. Clovers (see here) will sniff that people simply ought not to drink alcohol while driving, ever, regardless of the amount. But the presence of a bottle in the car does not establish that the driver has been drinking. Only that someone did. At some point. Maybe a long time ago. But even if the driver was drinking, so what? Its ok legal for me to drive after having a meal with a beer to wash it down. I could walk up to a cop, tell him I am going over to that restaurant across the street to have a steak and plan to have a beer with that steak. And then drive home. The cop if he is a vengeful dick could perhaps pull me over to check whether Ive had more than one beer, but provided my BAC level is under the limit, provided he cannot fault my driving, he can do nothing to me, legally speaking. Why should it matter whether I drink the same beer on the way home? My BAC will be about the same well within the lawful range, either way. And if that BAC isnt at the drunk driving threshold (.08) whats the problem? Especially if its well below the threshold. Open container or not. Well, heres the problem: Clovers equate the presence of any alcohol whatever in ones system with drunk driving and are positively itching to imprison people for this offense. But they know its not yet politically palatable to cage people for having even trace amounts of alcohol in their systems, so they dont say this openly. Instead, they shriek about open containers. But isnt it the same thing? These victims and thats the right word arent being caged for drunkenness. They are being caged for drinking. Open container laws are in force in almost every state egged on by Uncle, who uses the bully stick of withholding federal highway monies to cage people who arent drunk (or even close to it) according to any of the current standards (BAC levels, roadside gymnastic exercises) by which impairment is measured; who have nil or practically nil BAC levels. Who dont even have to have been drinking to get convicted of drinking. They merely had an open container in the car. Doesnt matter whether they had just as sip. Five minutes ago or five weeks ago. Or not at all. Just that it is open. Or that it once contained alcohol. In other words, mere possession of the open alcohol container is the thing. This is what presumes impairment even if the driver isnt and the usual tests reveal him to be well within the law. The open container thing is simply a tactical tacit step toward outright Prohibition. Thats the end goal. The eventual criminalization of alcohol consumption in any amount within the nimbus of the operation of a motor vehicle. This objective has been openly stated by the uber Clovers at Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD). And they have succeeded with regard to drivers under the age of 21. It is already zero tolerance for them. Eventually, for us, too. Some may see this as a good thing, the usual mantras about safety wafting through the air. But were far from safe when the state can convict you of drinking while driving even when you havent been and can convict you of being a drunk when all youve had is a drink. Or even just a sip. Post Comment Private Reply Ignore Thread Top Page Up Full Thread Page Down Bottom/Latest Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 16.
#1. To: Deckard (#0)
(Edited)
What we have here is ... A case of being damned if you do something and again being damned if you do something else. You are damned for driving with an open container in your vehicle and you are damned if you litter. A seemingly complex problem where a moronic Paultard tries to avoid the violation of one law by violating another law has a very simple solution
do neither!
The Paultard's should just stick to smoking pot, that way they do not have the unsolvable riddle of what to do with the empty beer bottle. I'm surprised they're not touting this is another point in favor of marijuana.
#17. To: nativist nationalist (#16)
I can't help but laugh at your ignorant comment. So - I guess you agree with with the other statist twat posting on this thread that an empty bottle constitutes evidence of drunk driving. And you wonder why you are mocked by those of us who do not worship the police state like you and Gatslime apparently do.
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