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Title: Full Out War? US, China Relentless In South China Sea
Source:
Morning News USA
URL Source: http://www.morningnewsusa.com/full- ... s-south-china-sea-2363165.html
Published: Mar 9, 2016
Author: staff
Post Date: 2016-03-09 20:50:49 by buckeroo
Keywords: None
Views: 7271
Comments: 59
The United States has started its routine operations in the South China Sea in light of Beijing’s threats to its allies and the entire disputed region. According to reports, US Navy’s John C Stennis Strike Group (JCSSG), the core of the Great Green fleet, started the operations. Its strike group includes Nimitz-class aircraft carrier USS John C Stennis (CVN 74), USS Chung-Hoon (DDG 93), USS Stockdale (DDG 106) and USS Mobile Bay (CG 53). The said group was positioned in the eastern half of the sea for four days following transit via the Luzon Strait, according to Naval Technology. This is not the only move that the United States has up its sleeves. The West is also in talks with Australia about hosting its long-range strike bombers. “It gives us the opportunity to strengthen the ties we already have with the Royal Australian Air Force and it gives us the opportunity to train our pilots and understand the theater,” News.com.au quoted Commander of the US Pacific Air Forces General Lori Robinson. She confirmed that there have been ongoing talks to rotate tankers and bombers across northern Australia. The move as noted is also part of the rising concerns of Chinese military activities in the region. “We’ve watched the increased military capability on those islands, whether it’s the fighters, whether it’s the missiles or the 10,000-foot runways. We will continue to do as we’ve always done, and that is fly and sail in international airspace in accordance to international rules and norms,” added General Robinson. She also urged other countries to explore or exercise their rights over international waters so as not to risk losing it throughout the region” in relation to China. As for China’s take on the matter, Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi has this to say: “China was the earliest to explore, name, develop and administer various South China Sea islands. Our ancestors worked diligently here for generations.” “History will prove who is the visitor and who is the genuine host,” Reuters quoted the official. Don't panic, Trump shall save the day; he will probably negotiate with China in some bizarre place called Jupitor, FL. South China Sea tensions continue to build up as the United States started mobilizing its troops in the region. The move has not registered well with China and now the country just declared that it will stand its ground in the region regardless. Will tensions go as high to spark a full out war?
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#1. To: buckeroo (#0)
It is called the "South China Sea" not the "South Yankee Sea". You neocon scum always want war. I hope Trump lets the Chinese have it. Tells Vietnam to go fuck themselves.
Well, I am satisfied that we got your well "reasoned" post out of the way today. Did you have any other comments to make about my personal neocon perturbation?
We don't want war over a few reefs the Chinese have dredged and created islands. Yes they are close to the Phillipines but if the Phillipines were really interested in them they should have taken possession or at least taken the matter to an international court What america has its nose out of joint over is the chinese move effectively blocks US companies from exploiting the resources. It seems noone cared about any of this until China took an interest
Relax. Unlike Oz, America has the TRUMPINATOR card to be played in Jupitor, FL, once his emminence gets the keys to the oral office. Yes, it is all negotiation, now. So, step aside and let the US do the work for you as you hide your head in the sand like an ostrich. Got it?
Trump will claim the islands for his golf course, eminent domain! you know very well the strategic importance of the region as far as the transit of international trade. Each year, $5.3 trillion of trade passes through the South China Sea.About $1.2 trillion of it is U.S.traded goods.And yes ,a blockade of the route would tremendously impact Australia . That is much more important than mineral rights . The Chinese have proven that they do not respect the territorial integrity of any of their neighbors .We have strategic treaties with The Philippines ,Taiwan ,and Japan . Why should we allow them to create artificial islands in the SCS ,and build military bases on them ,claiming so called 'disputed 'territory for themselves well beyond their right under international law ? But if you are timid about it ,and don't want US forces flying out of Aussie ,then perhaps it's time we negotiate with the Philippines to reopen Subic Bay and Clark AFB to the US military. Thankfully your nation has more common sense and has joined us in joint freedom of navigation exercises ,including flying your RAAF P-3 Orions over the disputed "islands" . "If you do not take an interest in the affairs of your government, then you are doomed to live under the rule of fools." Plato
Can you tell me of any international incident concerning a commercial vessel, the only incident has been the transit of a US warship in a deliberately provacative manner. You claim they are in contravention of international law, so take them to court and prove your preeminent right to the reef. As to bases in the Phillipines this is all your fault, the Chinese would not have pulled this if you were still there and they are making sure you don't come back I don't want US forces flying out of Australia to intimidate the Chinese. You know I don't like the idea of US bases on Australian soil. We have debated this previously. We don't have bases on your soil. You don't understand that this rabid attitude of the US is very concerning to other nations. This is our region, not yours. We arn't interested in a standoff with the chinese over a couple of reefs. You have aircraft carriers, they have reefs. We have large commercial interests in the region and they arn't enhanced by your behaviour as we are seen as your sidekick. If my governemnt is stupid and slavishly follows you, I don't have to fall in line, it is a free country so long as we keep you out of it. We recently had one of your air force generals making what I consider a politial speech on our soil urging us to be confrontational to the Chinese. The ugly side of yankee imperialism is on display again. We don't need your serving senior officers giving us paternalistic advice. Personally I think we have helped you out once too often
they don't laugh at trump like the silly people here do, they deal with him all the time.
These countries and China are dividing step by step islands in question, without war. No need for an outside intervention:
If you look at that map you might want to ask what Vietnam is doing in Phillipine waters and why the US isn't up in arms about that and sailing gunboats up the Mekong, Oh I understand, been there done that. I could see that the Chinese might be countering Vietnamese aggression and couldn't care less about the US. when did the US become a Vietnamese ally?
I think Far East people follow their bargaining methods. They are pushing one another to find the right balance. Once they divvy up, they will make a treaty. Of course for the West it is unacceptable and outrageous. Only a true war and ruin like Opium War could be satisfactory.
It's all about drilling for gas & oil.
They are building islands in international waters. Screw the Chinese. I hope Trump blows up the islands and kills all the Chinks on the island. Then point 78 petcent of our nukes at China. Screw theose commies. Shut off trade with them 100 percetn. Or 1000 percent tariffs. No food to the slant eyes.
Fuck international court. Screw your new world order. China is our enemy. They are slanted eye commies.
Every area of the earth is our area. It is international waters. Don't be a pussy. You're afraid of the evil Chinese. Go hide under your bed.
Without America your island of former prisoners would be slaves to the Chinese. Are you a communist?
Go hide under your bed. I think the problem is you
Yes it is all my fault.
don't come crying to me when the Chinese pulverize coral reef in the Coral Sea and claim territory there . If they can't be stopped well beyond their legitimate territorial claim ,then why would they stop there ?
"If you do not take an interest in the affairs of your government, then you are doomed to live under the rule of fools." Plato
Japan and Taiwan have the means to defend their interests . Philippines do not on their own. It's called the 9 Dash -line . It is the real territorial claim that the Chinese make on the South China Sea .It goes out 100s of miles in all directions beyond their legitimate claim. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/9_dotted_line.png If unchecked they would make the South China Sea ,the Yellow Sea , and the East China Sea Chinese lakes . It is the equivalent as if we drew a big line around the Gulf of Mexico and claimed it all as our own. "If you do not take an interest in the affairs of your government, then you are doomed to live under the rule of fools." Plato
Do you want war against China to promote Vietnamese interests? Yes, you do.
The funny thing is that if we show strength China will back down and there will be peace . You think it a coincidence that China is flexing while the emperor backs away from one red line after another ?
"If you do not take an interest in the affairs of your government, then you are doomed to live under the rule of fools." Plato
Yeah, since your an Israel Firster it means you cannot be for an America First policy. That's why you guys are so against Pat Buchanan. Scratch a neocon and you'll find a traitor. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
You mean you haven't done that? Tom, frankly I don't care if China makes the South China sea a chinese lake, noooneelse seems to have had an interest in it and now that they are interested we have a turf war going on
Seems to me that a Chinese fleet may have dropped anchor in Darwin 5 or 6 hundred years ago. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
You are another fuckin' nutcase.
The Phillipines kicked us out of there. Now we should fight a potential war for them? Fuck that, neocon scum.
Where has China closed transit or threatened to do so?
Disputed waters and not America's problem and I say this as a Trump supporter who wants to end free trade with China. The USA will fight a war to secure Communist Vietnam's claim over Red China's claim? Over the kick out the USA Philippines claim? What is wrong with you war mongers?
That is what people thought in 1914 also.............
That is what people thought in 1914 also............. I wonder if some people yearn for the war, for the great world war. But they are afraid to admit it before themselves. Before 1914 Germans dreamed dreams about Siegfried and his sword Nothung.
"The funny thing is that if we show strength China will back down and there will be peace ." That is what people thought in 1914 also............. I wonder if some people yearn for the war, for the great world war. But they are afraid to admit it before themselves. Before 1914 Germans dreamed dreams about Siegfried and his sword Nothung. I don't get the mentality for Americans. I can understand why Europeans would be like this. But Americans? It comes from American imperialist ideology.
What is wrong with you war mongers? Who cares about Viet nam. Those are waters that we use for trade. That the world uses for trade. They want it to be considered part of China and to keep everyone out of the area. How about we build islands across the ocean every 24 miles. We can drop cables to anchor to the bottom. Then have some kind of "net" if you will to dump stuff in. Then we can claim the Atlantic Ocean then later the Pacific Ocean is ours and to keep out. Because we have expanded our territory with artificial islands. Sounds like a good ideal. Lets claim the Atlantic, Pacific and Gulf of Mexico.
I was exaggerating on that comment.
Yes they currently have a lease on the port of Darwin and no doubt they visited the west coast of america. We are frequently visited by american ships, should we be concerned?
I thought you had already done that, Hawaii, Midway, Guam, Okinawa, Japan to name a few. becuase you have these islands you think of the Pacific as your pond
We need them to be every 24 miles. That way we can claim the entire ocean. We don't have islands every 24 miles right now.
I was exaggerating on that comment. Nonetheless, you've hit upon their Achilles heel. A trade war is better than a shooting war, it will actually bring in tariff revenue. Our recent shooting wars involve flushing a trillion dollars down the toilet so Iran can control Iraq. Best thing would be to get China embroiled in the Middle East, if they have all this military energy let them work it off over there. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
Every 400 nautical miles would allow you to enlarge your EEZ. We could also encourage nations like Peru and Chile to expand their EEZ to 500 nautical miles, recognize their claim, and then based upon that precedent establish our own 500 nautical mile EEZ. That would be an America First foreign policy, rather than all this good nonsense we do now like keeping the trade routes open for other nations. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
and if you do that you reinforce China's claim on the South China Sea
They want to control the natural resources not block traffic. So you are wrong.
and it would give us control over half of Indonesia. You see you don't understand how impractiable such ideas are
So what? China gets the cow tongue, and we get exclusive control over our territorial seas stretching from Alaska to Hawaii and over to California, with a slice for Canada. And we don't even have dog in the South China Sea dispute anyway. If Australia is so worked up over the cow tongue perhaps you can do something about it, but leave us out of your disputes. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
and it would give us control over half of Indonesia. You see you don't understand how impractiable such ideas are Or visa versa. But that is your problem, not ours. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
The problem with your argument is that we aren't going to claim that territory. They are.
For now, yes. But China would be establishing the precedent we could use at a later date. Even the prospect that we might follow their precedent may motivate other nations to challenge them. A military confrontation with them is a bad idea. They would have chosen the place of battle, and battle should not be accepted on the enemies terms. The response to China should be asymmetrical in the diplomatic or economic realm. Go for an economic Aegospotami, and the best place to do that is our own ports, we wield the power but lack the will at present. Economic nationalism is the weapon. P.S. Hope you enjoy the Trump rally, I remember shaking Reagan's hand back in 1976 at a rally. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
What about cooperation instead of the confrontation?
That is exactly what I say to the USA leave us out of your disputes. it is the USA that is worked up about it, not us We arn't interested in the South China Sea, not our pond we have millions of square miles of the Indian, Pacific and Southern Oceans to be concerned about and frankly I don't think we need any more of it
We're been doing that, we've lost millions of job as a result, with thousands of shuttered factories. How about we put American workers first by putting America first? Beats your free trade global wealth scheme, or as you call it "cooperation." Your beloved "cooperation" has us running a billion dollar per tay trade deficit with China. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
I wish your empire had had that same philosophy when you pulled every trick in the book to drag us into your power struggles with Germany, all so you guys could loot the German and Ottoman empires. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
Australia was dragged into the conflict just as much as you were and like yourselves made a big difference in the fight, but you loose the bigger picture, we were not the aggressor, but without our victories in Palestine, establishment of Israel later in the twentieth century would not have been possible, we beat the Turks, not you. It was obvious the US could care less about Hitler and Mussolini they just used it as an opportunity to profit and dominate, and they support the Turkish proxy war against Syria and Iraq. There was no loot in the german and ottoman empires and you got more than your fair share benefiting from german technology. All we got was sand, but the French still receive us gratefully which is more than I can say for you
Let's hope he doesn't because China owns most of American assets these days. And they're just as equally bad as Vietnam. Just look how they treat their own people. In other words, be careful of who you are negotiating with. Know your allies and know your enemies. Friend or Foe.
Yes sound advice, you have put you manufacturing capacity in the hands of an enemy, if you wanted to do it some place else you should have given it to us, but then we don't make cheap shoddy goods for the trailer park market
The U.S. has already turned into a trailer park market thanks to https://www.whitehouse.gov/issues/economy/trade
...There was no loot in the german and ottoman empires... That's right, you guys are the ones to thank for bringing down the Ottoman Empire and creating the present day Middle East. You ended up with Turkish loot in the form of Iraq, Trans-Jordan and Palestine, which you and France carved up secretly in the Sykes-Picot agreement. Your empire ended up with German loot also; Namibia, Tanganyika, Nauru, Upper New Guinea, Bismarck Archipelago, Bougainville and Western Samoa. You guys lied us into war and reneged on your debts, and then you think we owe you some sort of gratitude. That was a turf war between 2 gangs of thieves, we had no dog in your fight. Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
you are talking about the British empire, something that has ceased to exist. You destabilised the middle east, messing with what the Brits and French had done, thinking you could play the great game. It was you who invaded Iraq, you who interferred with Iran, you who backed Saddam to invade Iran and then discovered he was uncontrollable. The interferrence of the inexperienced americans all over the world has caused instability and war and you haven't won any wars in 50 years, your enemies have imploded from their own stupidity and now you are doing the same. The problem is your nation is full of all the peasants from Europe and the americas and there isn't a brain among the lot of them
Gallipoli is no where near Australia, what were you diggers doing all the way over there? Why did you guys send troops to invade the Boer nations, murder POW's and missionaries; and then make the murderer a national hero?
Non auro, sed ferro, recuperando est patria
I think you understand the concept of being allied to another nation and our action at Gallipoli, however ill advised, was part of that. At the time of the Boer war Australia was a colony, subject to the rule of others and a pert of Britain. If soldiers behave in the wrong way they are treated as criminals, they are not immune from prosecution. I also note that you don't understand being part of something larger than your own nation, you are more frequently the aggressor than the saviour and yet you think that you can judge history. look first to the atrocities committed on your own soil and in various parts of the world
#2. To: Pericles (#1)
You neocon scum always want war ...
#3. To: buckeroo (#0)
#4. To: paraclete (#3)
We don't want war over a few reefs the Chinese have dredged and created islands.
#5. To: buckeroo (#4)
America has the TRUMPINATOR card to be played
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#6. To: paraclete (#3)
(Edited)
#7. To: tomder55 (#6)
(Edited)
you know very well the strategic importance of the region as far as the transit of international trade.
#8. To: hondo68 (#5)
#9. To: tomder55, paraclete (#6)
We have strategic treaties with The Philippines ,Taiwan ,and Japan .
#10. To: A Pole (#9)
#11. To: paraclete (#10)
I could see that the Chinese might be countering Vietnamese aggression
#12. To: A Pole (#11)
#13. To: Pericles (#1)
(Edited)
It is called the "South China Sea" not the "South Yankee Sea". You neocon scum always want war. I hope Trump lets the Chinese have it. Tells Vietnam to go fuck themselves.
#14. To: paraclete (#3)
matter to an international court
#15. To: paraclete (#7)
This is our region, not yours.
#16. To: paraclete (#7)
I think we have helped you out once too often
#17. To: A K A Stone (#15)
Every area of the earth is our area. It is international waters. Don't be a pussy. You're afraid of the evil Chinese.
#18. To: A Pole (#17)
I think the problem is you
#19. To: paraclete (#7)
#20. To: A Pole, paraclete, AKA Stone, redleghunter (#9)
We have strategic treaties with The Philippines ,Taiwan ,and Japan . These countries and China are dividing step by step islands in question, without war. No need for an outside intervention
#21. To: tomder55 (#20)
#22. To: A Pole (#21)
#23. To: buckeroo (#2)
Did you have any other comments to make about my personal neocon perturbation?
#24. To: A K A Stone (#13)
Shut off trade with them 100 percent. Or 1000 percent tariffs.
#25. To: tomder55 (#20)
It is the equivalent as if we drew a big line around the Gulf of Mexico and claimed it all as our own.
#26. To: tomder55 (#19)
don't come crying to me when the Chinese pulverize coral reef in the Coral Sea and claim territory there . If they can't be stopped well beyond their legitimate territorial claim ,then why would they stop there ?
#27. To: nativist nationalist (#23)
That's why you guys are so against Pat Buchanan.
#28. To: paraclete, buckeroo (#3)
#29. To: tomder55, paraclete (#6)
you know very well the strategic importance of the region as far as the transit of international trade. Each year, $5.3 trillion of trade passes through the South China Sea.
#30. To: A K A Stone (#13)
They are building islands in international waters. Screw the Chinese.
#31. To: tomder55, A Pole (#22)
The funny thing is that if we show strength China will back down and there will be peace .
#32. To: Pericles, tomder55 (#31)
(Edited)
"The funny thing is that if we show strength China will back down and there will be peace ."
#33. To: A Pole, , tomder55 (#32)
#34. To: Pericles (#30)
Disputed waters and not America's problem and I say this as a Trump supporter who wants to end free trade with China. The USA will fight a war to secure Communist Vietnam's claim over Red China's claim? Over the kick out the USA Philippines claim?
#35. To: nativist nationalist (#24)
hut off trade with them 100 percent. Or 1000 percent tariffs.
#36. To: nativist nationalist (#26)
Seems to me that a Chinese fleet may have dropped anchor in Darwin 5 or 6 hundred years ago
#37. To: A K A Stone (#34)
How about we build islands across the ocean every 24 miles. We can drop cables to anchor to the bottom. Then have some kind of "net" if you will to dump stuff in. Then we can claim the Atlantic Ocean then later the Pacific Ocean is ours and to keep out. Because we have expanded our territory with artificial islands. Sounds like a good ideal. Lets claim the Atlantic, Pacific and Gulf of Mexico.
#38. To: paraclete (#37)
I thought you had already done that, Hawaii, Midway, Guam, Okinawa, Japan to name a few. becuase you have these islands you think of the Pacific as your pond
#39. To: A K A Stone (#35)
shut off trade with them 100 percent. Or 1000 percent tariffs.
#40. To: A K A Stone (#34)
How about we build islands across the ocean every 24 miles.
#41. To: nativist nationalist (#40)
#42. To: A K A Stone (#34)
They want it to be considered part of China and to keep everyone out of the area.
#43. To: All (#41)
and if you do that you reinforce China's claim on the South China Sea
#44. To: paraclete (#41)
and if you do that you reinforce China's claim on the South China Sea
#45. To: paraclete (#43)
and if you do that you reinforce China's claim on the South China Sea
#46. To: nativist nationalist (#44)
China gets the cow tongue, and we get exclusive control over our territorial seas stretching from Alaska to Hawaii and over to California, with a slice for Canada. And we don't even have dog in the South China Sea dispute anyway. If Australia is so worked up over the cow tongue perhaps you can do something about it, but leave us out of your disputes.
#47. To: A K A Stone (#46)
The problem with your argument is that we aren't going to claim that territory. They are.
#48. To: nativist nationalist (#47)
A military confrontation with them is a bad idea.
#49. To: nativist nationalist (#44)
If Australia is so worked up over the cow tongue perhaps you can do something about it, but leave us out of your disputes.
#50. To: A Pole (#48)
What about cooperation instead of the confrontation?
#51. To: paraclete (#49)
That is exactly what I say to the USA leave us out of your disputes.
#52. To: nativist nationalist (#51)
#53. To: Pericles (#1)
(Edited)
..."I hope Trump lets the Chinese have it..."
#54. To: goldilucky (#53)
#55. To: paraclete (#54)
#56. To: paraclete (#52)
...we beat the Turks, not you...
#57. To: nativist nationalist (#56)
(Edited)
#58. To: paraclete (#57)
#59. To: nativist nationalist (#58)
(Edited)
To: paraclete Gallipoli is no where near Australia, what were you diggers doing all the way over there? Why did you guys send troops to invade the Boer nations, murder POW's and missionaries; and then make the murderer a national hero?
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