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Bang / Guns Title: Oregon activists picked the wrong battle, militia leaders say EUGENE, Jan 5 — Self-styled militia members who seized federal property in rural Oregon in an effort to galvanize opposition to the US government appear to have made a tactical error - potential allies say they picked the wrong battle. As armed anti-government activists occupied a snowy wildlife refuge for a third day to call attention to a land-use dispute, militia leaders from similar groups across the country criticized the seizure of federal land and a building. The protesters have said they aim “to restore and defend the Constitution” to protect the rights of ranchers and ignite a national debate about states’ rights and federal land-use policy they hope could ultimately force the federal government to release tracts of Western land. Their occupation of the headquarters of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge comes as the number of paramilitary groups is on the rise in the United States, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, a legal advocacy group that tracks their numbers. But the latest call to arms appears to have failed to resonate with like-minded groups whose support would be crucial for creating a coalition of armed militia members substantial enough to thwart a law enforcement operation. “There’s a better way to go about things,” said Brandon Curtiss, president of Three Per cent of Idaho, a militia group that has been involved in the dispute. “If you want to make a change like that, you need to get the county citizens behind you to go through the proper channels.” The protesters have rallied behind Oregon ranchers Dwight Hammond Jr. and Steven Hammond, who were found guilty of arson on public land near their property. They were initially sentenced to 12 months in prison, below the federal minimum for arson, but a US judge raised the sentences to five years. The Hammonds, who turned themselves in as planned yesterday at a federal prison in California, have said they do not support the protesters or their leader, Ammon Bundy, whose father, Cliven Bundy, was at the centre of a 2014 standoff with the government over grazing rights in Nevada that ended with federal agents backing down in the face of about 1,000 armed militiamen, many on horseback. The Pacific Patriot Network, an umbrella group for militias in the region, said it did not support seizing federal property even if it understood the underlying frustration with the federal government. “This land use issue is decades old and it’s boiling up in frustration. That’s what you’re seeing,” spokesman Joseph Rice said. The Oath Keepers, another paramilitary group that participated in the 2014 Bundy ranch dispute in Nevada, also distanced itself from the latest standoff. ‘Wish to hell he hadn't done this’ Some militia leaders said Bundy was using the dispute to provoke the federal government with little regard for the local community. “Here you have a guy who believes he’s on a mission from God. What the Hammonds want and what the community wants is immaterial,” said Mike Vanderboegh, a founder of the III Per cent Movement, which draws its name from the notion that only 3 per cent of Americans actively participated in the Revolutionary War. Vanderboegh and other leaders said they worried Bundy would provoke a violent response from the US government similar to the 1993 siege of the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, that ended in the deaths of 76 people. Three Obama administration officials said federal authorities had been told to avoid a violent confrontation, in line with official US policy after the deadly clashes at Waco and in 1992 at Ruby Ridge, Idaho Armed US paramilitary groups, which had been on the wane since the September 11, 2001, attacks, have seen their ranks swell in recent years, driven by fears among the far right that President Barack Obama will threaten gun ownership and erode local rights. The movement has also been energized by confrontations between ranchers, miners and federal regulators in the Western United States, where the government owns vast stretches of land. The Southern Poverty Law Centre estimates there are 276 active militia groups today, one-third more than before last year’s standoff. The latest incident began after militia groups from Oregon and Idaho staged a peaceful march in the nearby city of Burns on Saturday to protest what they see as heavy-handed management by bureaucrats with little interest in local concerns. Other militia leaders declined to question Bundy’s motives but said he stood little chance of getting the federal government to back down. “If you want me to demonise this guy, I won’t do it,” said Bob Wright, a commander of the New Mexico Militia. “But I wish to hell he hadn’t done this,” he said. Poster Comment: LOL! Even the other militia whacknuts want to steer clear of the Bundy Rebellion... The Bundy's are gonna go down in flames, just like David Koresh! Post Comment Private Reply Ignore Thread Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 4.
#2. To: Willie Green (#0)
I have news for you, Curtiss. Try your idea and you'll find there are no proper channels. More people in power have more to gain by stonewalling you and deception than by pursueing justice. As for that bad man Koresh of the Branch Davidians at Waco, He could have been picked up at a local barber shop where he went for a haircut every two weeks, or at the sheriff's office where he regularly stopped in for visits. It wasn't necessary to kill 80 people to get him.
100% right.
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