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Title: Pentagon backs Turkey’s version of events, blames ‘incursion’ of Russian jet
Source: Washington Times
URL Source: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news ... s-version-accuses-russian-fig/
Published: Nov 24, 2015
Author: Staff
Post Date: 2015-11-24 11:42:22 by cranky
Keywords: None
Views: 6991
Comments: 52

The U.S. military on Tuesday labeled as an “incursion” the Russian fighter jet that was shot down by Turkish aircraft over the Syria-Turkey border.

Army Col. Steve Warren, the top military spokesman in Baghdad, confirmed the Turk’s version of events in saying they repeatedly warned the two Russian SU-24 pilots to back off.

Col. Warren used the word “incursion” to describe the Russian flight, but also said the command was studying radars and other data, such as radio chatter, to make a definite conclusion.

“The incident happened at the border,” Col. Warren said. “These things are not as clean as they are in the movies.”

Russian President Vladimir Putin in recent years has deployed his fighters and bombers close to the air space of NATO countries, such as Turkey and the U.S., as a way to try to rattle the allies.

This is the first time he has paid a price in having one of his jets shot down and perhaps the pilots killed.

Mr. Putin is backing Syrian President Bashar Assad, which is opposed by the Turkish government. Ankara is helping rebels opposed to the regime.

The U.S. sent F-15C air superiority jets to Turkey to help it patrol and defend its air space. Col. Warren said no F-15 was in the vicinity.

This “purely took place between the Russians and the Turks,” he said.

Col. Warren has made no secret of the U.S.’s displeasure with Russian bombing campaign in Syria. They assert Mr. Putin is mostly bombing moderate rebel groups opposed to Mr. Assad and devoting little time to the Islamic State terror army.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 41.

#2. To: cranky (#0)

The US-Mexican Border is not well marked, and we have a lot of military aircraft doing drills out in the desert at night, and a lot of law enforcement and border enforcement helicopters and planes out there that sometimes cross into Mexican airspace.

And if the Mexicans shot down an American fighter plane or a helicopter for crossing a mile into Mexico?

It is absurd to shoot down planes for a minor incursion. Absurd. Russia and Turkey are not at war. The Russians fly close to the border, or across it? Turkey complains diplomatically. But to just close in and shoot?

And if China shoots down a US Navy aircraft that flies over those disputed islands?

We have a naval base at Guantanamo, with a defined ingress and egress, and if an American warship loses its bearings - or its engine - and strays from the channel into Cuban waters, and the Cubans instantly hose off anti-ship missiles to blow it up?

It's absurd. Hairtriggers are absurd. Russia is not attacking Turkey.

So, the US is going to back the Turks? We are out of our minds. Our policy is stupid and our policymakers are morons. And they may very well get us all killed.

Vicomte13  posted on  2015-11-24   11:55:32 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Vicomte13, CZ82, TooConservative, tomder55 (#2)

The US-Mexican Border is not well marked, and we have a lot of military aircraft doing drills out in the desert at night, and a lot of law enforcement and border enforcement helicopters and planes out there that sometimes cross into Mexican airspace.

And if the Mexicans shot down an American fighter plane or a helicopter for crossing a mile into Mexico?

It is absurd to shoot down planes for a minor incursion. Absurd. Russia and Turkey are not at war. The Russians fly close to the border, or across it? Turkey complains diplomatically. But to just close in and shoot?

The US-Mexican border is not the greatest example.

There are joint air and ground centers on both sides of the border to announce airspace clearance. It is a side-by-side type of set up. Visited one before heading to Iraq on my 2nd tour.

But I agree, with all that is at stake, an incursion into airspace should be tracked, documented and then handled diplomatically if possible. Stern warning that if it happens again, the plane will be shot down without warning.

We will also have to see if the Russians were engaging their WLR to 'light up' any facilities or locations within Turkey. If they did then shooting before being shot upon is acceptable.

What we will probably find out is the Russians were targeting Turkmen rebels inside the Syrian border or right at the Syrian border and got caught in Turkish airspace. Then we will find out the Turks fired back knowing that was the intent of the Russians.

Welcome Russia to the mess that is the Middle East.

redleghunter  posted on  2015-11-24   15:10:14 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: redleghunter, Vicomte13, CZ82, TooConservative (#12)

What we will probably find out is the Russians were targeting Turkmen rebels inside the Syrian border or right at the Syrian border and got caught in Turkish airspace. Then we will find out the Turks fired back knowing that was the intent of the Russians.

Exactly ;if they were targeting IS ,as they say their mission is to do ,they would not have been anywhere near that area .

tomder55  posted on  2015-11-25   4:40:28 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: tomder55, Pericles (#33)

Exactly ;if they were targeting IS ,as they say their mission is to do ,they would not have been anywhere near that area .

Russia did not declare ISIS as their sole target. They are aiding the Assad regime against foreign terrorists and domestic rebels.

No one likes to mention how Turkey is the conduit for all these foreign jihadis from all over the world.

Turkey is a de facto ISIS ally. There is no denying it.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-11-25   5:33:55 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: tomder55, TooConservative (#35)

Why is DC not mentioning al-Qaeda in Syria aka al-Nusra?

Pericles  posted on  2015-11-26   21:18:12 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 41.

#42. To: Pericles, tomder55 (#41)

Why is DC not mentioning al-Qaeda in Syria aka al-Nusra?

As it becomes more obvious that Saddam's old spymasters who run ISIS have compromised FSA leadership at the top levels, they seem to be downplaying al-Nusra's well-established links to al-Qaeda.

If FSA becomes too obvious a front for ISIS, al-Nusra will become the new "democratic freedom fighters" who will save Iraq from Assad.

In truth, ISIS is the far more savage of the two groups. I still don't see how they sell anyone on the idea that al-Nusra is better than Assad. But at least they aren't a pack of foreign jihadis like ISIS is.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-11-27 07:39:26 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: Pericles (#41)

Why is DC not mentioning al-Nusra

You have to stay on message and not confuse the issue. Daesh is the target, we don't hear much about what the al-nasra front is doing so no milage in talking them up, in any case they may merge with Daesh again at any time.

DC needs to forget about fostering opposition in Syria and focus on destroying terrorism. Terrorists are not freedom fighters. The opposition in Syria has not succeeded in dislodging the regime so time for different tactics

paraclete  posted on  2015-11-28 19:56:46 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 41.

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