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Title: Putin: Russia will not tolerate such crimes as attack against its Sukhoi-24 plane
Source:
Tass
URL Source: http://tass.ru/en/politics/838825un
Published: Nov 24, 2015
Author: Uncredited
Post Date: 2015-11-24 08:28:10 by cranky
Keywords: None
Views: 12272
Comments: 72
According to the president, the attack against Su-24 plane in Syria goes beyond normal struggle against terrorism, and it is "a stab in Russia’s back" delivered by "terrorism accomplices" SOCHI, November 24. /TASS/. Russia's Sukhoi Su-24 attack aircraft was downed with an air-to-air missile launched from a Turkish F-16 fighter, Russian President Vladimir Putin said Monday. The Russian leader stressed that the Russian Su-24 fighter-bomber was posing no threat to Turkey. "Anyway, our pilots and jet posed no threat to the Turkish Republic. This is obvious. They were conducting an operation against ISIL," Putin said at the meeting with King Abdallah II of Jordan. Putin called the attack a crime and stressed that Russia would not tolerate it. According to the president, the Su-24 plane crash in Syria goes beyond normal struggle against terrorism, and it is "a stab in Russia’s back delivered by terrorist accomplices." "Today’s loss is linked with a stab in our back delivered by terrorism accomplices. I can’t characterize otherwise what has happened today," the Russian leader said. The Russian bomber was shot down over Syria by an air-to-air surface fired from a Turkish F-16 plane when the bomber was at an altitude of 6,000 meters at a distance of 1 km from the Turkish bomber." Putin said. The president said the attack on the Russian jet will have tragic consequences to Russia-Turkey ties. Turkey's military attache in Russia has been summoned to the Russian Defense Ministry. 
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#1. To: cranky, redleghunter, tomder55, sneakypete, Pericles (#0)
Turkey's military attache in Russia has been summoned to the Russian Defense Ministry. NATO's members have also summoned the Turks. I would guess they have some very pointed questions and will demand more evidence than just allegations by Turkey. It was unwise to extend NATO membership to Turkey to begin with. As members, if they start a war with Russia by shooting down their warplanes who did not attack anything or anyone in Turkey, NATO will still be obligated by Article Five to follow Turkey into warfare with Russia. I'm thinking NATO will make it clear they are not starting WW III with Russia even if a Russian plane strayed over the Turkish border, considering that no Turks or Turkish territory was attacked. There is a proportionality to any response.
#2. To: TooConservative (#1)
A turkey picking a fight with a bear, does not seem wise.
Not exactly. Rather, Turkey can invoke Article V, and that obliges the NATO governments to MEET, to DISCUSS what to do. The invocation of Article V does not act as a declaration of war for all of NATO. It acts as a trumpet to call a meeting. The parties to the treaty are bound, in theory, by the results of the meeting. So, Turkey invokes Article V. NATO chiefs meet. The French say "Are you out of your MINDS?" The Greeks say "The Russians are our friends." The Spanish say: "We have no money for such an adventure", to which the Portuguese add "...nor any interest in it." The British say "We're with the French on this one" (and the Eurosceptics say "See! Europe is going to drag us into some crazy war!" The Canadians say "We're with the British." Obama says "Wake me up when November ends." And like the cheese, the Turks stand alone, the Turks stand alone (Hi Ho the dairy-o, the Turks stand alone...) No war.
von Bismarck described pre-WWI Europe as "a powder keg and the leaders are like men smoking in an arsenal … A single spark will set off an explosion that will consume us all … I cannot tell you when that explosion will occur, but I can tell you where … Some damned foolish thing in the Balkans will set it off."
I disagree... when Turkey joined NATO in 1952, it was a different world...
It was unwise to extend NATO membership to Turkey to begin with. As members, if they start a war with Russia by shooting down their warplanes who did not attack anything or anyone in Turkey, NATO will still be obligated by Article Five to follow Turkey into warfare with Russia. I'm thinking NATO will make it clear they are not starting WW III with Russia even if a Russian plane strayed over the Turkish border, considering that no Turks or Turkish territory was attacked. There is a proportionality to any response. Turkey was a Cold War 'necessity.' They have not been much help to NATO or the US since the end of the Cold War, other than 'allowing' us to have bases there. The entire snafu with Turkey not allowing us their ports for a northern option for OIF was the cherry on top.
No. The agreement only requires a member to provide such assistance as it sees fit, when a member is the victim of an armed attack. The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area. Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security.
It seems to me the Turk downing was an ambush at the same day the French president is meeting with Obama and before he goes to Moscow to meet with Putin. Was this the CIA involved? Having France buck NATO to join up with Russia in Syria is a big deal and Turkey pretty much took a shit in the party's punchbowl and soured the potential hook up.
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest The president said the attack on the Russian jet will have tragic consequences to Russia-Turkey ties.
Replies to Comment # 1.
#3. To: TooConservative (#1)
(Edited)
NATO will still be obligated by Article Five to follow Turkey into warfare with Russia.
#5. To: TooConservative, cranky, redleghunter, , sneakypete, Pericles (#1)
#7. To: TooConservative (#1)
It was unwise to extend NATO membership to Turkey to begin with.
If there was a mistake that was made, it was allowing NATO to justify its existance and redefine its mission after the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union collapsed. THAT was when NATO should've been disbanded as an unnecessary anachronism.
#17. To: TooConservative, tomder55, CZ82, liberator (#1)
NATO's members have also summoned the Turks. I would guess they have some very pointed questions and will demand more evidence than just allegations by Turkey.
#27. To: TooConservative, cranky, redleghunter, tomder55, sneakypete, Pericles (#1)
It was unwise to extend NATO membership to Turkey to begin with. As members, if they start a war with Russia by shooting down their warplanes who did not attack anything or anyone in Turkey, NATO will still be obligated by Article Five to follow Turkey into warfare with Russia.
Article 5
#43. To: TooConservative, cranky, redleghunter, tomder55, sneakypete (#1)
End Trace Mode for Comment # 1.
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