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Title: The 'Birmingham Koran' fragment that could shake Islam after carbon-dating suggests it is OLDER than the Prophet Muhammad
Source:
Daily Mail Online
URL Source: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art ... het-Muhammad-scholars-say.html
Published: Aug 31, 2015
Author: Jennifer Newton
Post Date: 2015-08-31 07:29:52 by cranky
Keywords: None
Views: 7343
Comments: 35
Fragments of the world's oldest Koran, found in Birmingham last month, may predate the Prophet Muhammad and could even rewrite the early history of Islam, according to scholars. The pages, thought to be between 1,448 and 1,371 years old, were discovered bound within the pages of another Koran from the late seventh century at the library of the University of Birmingham. Written in ink in an early form of Arabic script on parchment made from animal skin, the pages contain parts of the Suras, or chapters, 18 to 20, which may have been written by someone who actually knew the Prophet Muhammad - founder of the Islamic faith. Scroll down for video Discovery: Fragments of what is believed to be the world's oldest Koran. Several historians have said it could even predate the Prophet Muhammad The pages were carbon-dated by experts at the University of Oxford, a process which showed the Islamic holy book manuscript could be the oldest Koran in the world. The discovery was said to be particularly significant as in the early years of Islam, the Koran was thought to have been memorised and passed down orally rather written. But now several historians have said that the parchment might even predate Muhammad. It is believed that the Birmingham Koran was produced between 568AD and 645AD, while the dates usually given for Muhammad are between 570AD and 632AD. Historian Tom Holland, told the Times: 'It destabilises, to put it mildly, the idea that we can know anything with certainty about how the Koran emerged - and that in turn has implications for the history of Muhammad and the Companions.' Keith Small, from the University of Oxford's Bodleian Library, added: 'This gives more ground to what have been peripheral views of the Koran's genesis, like that Muhammad and his early followers used a text that was already in existence and shaped it to fit their own political and theological agenda, rather than Muhammad receiving a revelation from heaven. The pages were carbon dated by experts at the University of Oxford, which showed it could be the oldest Koran in the world 
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#1. To: cranky (#0)
What it mostly does, is cast into doubt the accuracy of carbon dating. It is already known (among professionals) to be a relatively unreliable way to date things. This is merely an example of that.
Carbon dating is becoming more unreliable by the day. ArsTechnica: Our reliance on fossil fuel combustion is ruining carbon dating Unfortunately, humanity's reliance on fossil fuel combustion may ultimately mean that our species can’t have nice things like handy dating techniques. We’re releasing ancient carbon—in which the carbon-14 has long since undergone radioactive decay—into the atmosphere at such a rate that living organisms are absorbing less carbon-14, making them look old in the eyes of carbon dating. If we keep going at our current rate, we’ll hit a point in just 35 years where it’ll no longer be possible to tell the difference between modern objects and those that were on this fair Earth 1,000 years ago. In 85 years, we'll no longer be able to use radiocarbon dating to tell whether a sample is modern or from 2,000 years ago. The best case scenario, writes Heather Graven in this week’s issue of PNAS, is that we implement ambitious plans to reduce fossil fuel combustion, and slow the carbon ageing of the atmosphere, avoiding the most extreme effects (and, you know, solving that whole climate change thing). Even in this scenario, though, there are fields that use carbon dating to look at quite recent changes, meaning that they would still be rendered useless by the changing atmosphere. Given the expansion of dirty coal plants in China, India and the Third World, we should expect serious problems with the accuracy of carbon dating by 2030.
#7. To: TooConservative (#6)
I guess we have never had a massive world forest fire before or volcanoes that spew stuff into the air! LOL Carbon dating assumes alot things to make it work. Its been reasonably accurate up to 10k after that its been iffy. To me this kinda smells like more global warming one world government stuff. 8)
Maybe. But today, to professionals in the feld, it is an invaluable and accurate tool. I don't know what Gravin's track record as a prognosticator but I suspect carbon dating will be around long after Gravin is forgotten.
I knew there was a reason for the global warming hysteria!:)
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#6. To: Vicomte13, Justified, cranky (#1)
(Edited)
What it mostly does, is cast into doubt the accuracy of carbon dating. It is already known (among professionals) to be a relatively unreliable way to date things. This is merely an example of that.
The slippery slope of carbon dating in a coal-burning era. Radiocarbon dating is an incredibly useful technique. It has been used to date objects from within approximately the last 60,000 years, revolutionising archaeology and finding uses in everything from detecting fake wine vintages to identifying illegal ivory.
. . .
If we keep going at this rate, writes Graven, “by 2050, fresh organic material could have the same [carbon-14 levels] as samples from 1050, and thus be indistinguishable by radiocarbon dating.” By 2100, living organic material will have the same readings as items from 100 AD. That means, hypothetically, that any fraudster could stitch up a robe and claim it dates from the early days of Christianity, and radiocarbon dating wouldn’t be able to tell the difference.
. . .
Replies to Comment # 6.
#9. To: TooConservative (#6)
Carbon dating is becoming more unreliable by the day.
#19. To: TooConservative (#6)
The best case scenario, writes Heather Graven in this week’s issue of PNAS, is that we implement ambitious plans to reduce fossil fuel combustion, and slow the carbon ageing of the atmosphere, avoiding the most extreme effects (and, you know, solving that whole climate change thing). Even in this scenario, though, there are fields that use carbon dating to look at quite recent changes, meaning that they would still be rendered useless by the changing atmosphere.
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