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New Discovery! 2023 Hottest in over 120 Million Years 2024 and beyond in prophecy Questions Status: Not Logged In; Sign In Bible Study See other Bible Study Articles Title: Rapture of the Church Source: [None] URL Source: [None] Published: Jul 14, 2015 Author: Don Post Date: 2015-07-14 23:19:04 by Don Keywords: None Views: 12024 Comments: 65 Many people don't believe in the Rapture of the Christian Church, or even know just what the Church is. There are many differing opinions on all phases of the End Times. The only valid opinions come from what we read in the Holy Bible. I will post an article tomorrow that doesn't skimp on references giving chapter and verse. I believe in the Pre-Tribulation Rapture of the Church. More on that tomorrow. Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread   Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 38. #1. To: Don (#0) Many people don't believe in the Rapture of the Christian Church Because the rapture is bullshit. Pericles  posted on  2015-07-15   1:55:02 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #21. To: Pericles (#1) Well no...the actual word appears and we have discussed this before. When it happens in space and time is another matter of discussion. redleghunter  posted on  2015-07-16   13:40:09 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #24. To: redleghunter (#21) Well no...the actual word appears and we have discussed this before. When it happens in space and time is another matter of discussion. The Greek word appears. Funny how Greeks spent 2,000 years not knowing what the word meant until some 19th century British Protestant figured it out via a translated Bible. Pericles  posted on  2015-07-16   13:58:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #28. To: Pericles (#24) The Greek word appears. Funny how Greeks spent 2,000 years not knowing what the word meant until some 19th century British Protestant figured it out via a translated Bible. The word means what it means even within the Koine Greek. "Caught up." It was 'caught up' then and even now. redleghunter  posted on  2015-07-16   14:16:15 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   #38. To: redleghunter (#28) (Edited) The word means what it means even within the Koine Greek. "Caught up." It was 'caught up' then and even now. http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/articles/dogmatics/cozby_rapture1.htm It seems that some people believed that Christians who died before Christ’s return would somehow miss out on that glorious event. St. Paul seeks to calm their fears (vs. 13). He points out that as Christ returned from the dead at His Resurrection, so also, at the end of time, His followers who have died in the interim will be restored through resurrection (vs. 14). At the Second Coming, the Christian dead will be raised (vs. 16). Then they and the faithful who are still alive will be caught up into the clouds to welcome Christ as He descends (verses 15,17). Paul then discusses other matters relating to the Second Coming, beginning with the date it will occur. When we look at verse 17 in context, it is easy to see that is does not really support the doctrine of the Rapture. There is no reference to a Great Tribulation or to any other events preceding Christ’s Return. The verse refers to something that will happen as part of the Lord’s Coming. The course of events St. Paul presents is simple and straight-forward. At the time of the Second Coming, the dead will be raised, and all the faithful (the dead now restored and those still alive now transfigured) will ascend to be with Him as He comes down. This is the universal interpretation of the Fathers who see the verse as referring to the last days. Let us summarize what we have found so far. St. Paul does speak of a sort of rapture, in the sense of a carrying up into the sky of the righteous at the time of the Second Coming. The Fathers generally agree on that. But St. Paul and the Fathers see this as an event which accompanies Christ’s return and immediately precedes the Judgment and the establishment of the Kingdom. The Rapture which Darby and Scofield taught and which Lindsey, Walvoord, and others still teach, is different from that. They talk about it as a separate happening, part of a decades long program of events leading up to Christ’s Coming. The dispensationalists see the Rapture as the disappearance of the faithful from the earth before the Great Tribulation and many years before the Judgment. This is foreign to the Apostle and to the Tradition. St. Paul mentions no period of affliction and persecution following the Rapture. Pericles  posted on  2015-07-16   15:35:50 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   Replies to Comment # 38. #45. To: Pericles, Don, liberator (#38) St. Paul mentions no period of affliction and persecution following the Rapture. I think what you posted is a good explanation and no doubt has historical support with the early fathers. But not unanimous support as some differed from others. The important fact of the early church theologians was they did not speculate on matters not certain in scriptures. I noticed Irenaeus treat end times in such a way in Against Heresies book 5. Now on what I quoted from your piece above...If one continues to read 1 THESSALONIANS after the mention of caught up, there is discussion of end times. Such that a second letter was written, 2 Thessalonians detailing more. My personal observations is that each generation has there own theories on how things will unfold with yet to be fulfilled prophecy. The church in the early NT period were convinced, at first, that Christ would come again in their life time. In the 2nd century Irenaeus cautioned his generation of speculating the second coming was in their generation. The second Jewish revolt or Bar Kokhba revolt, convinced many of this. Later the Muslims were seen as the evil empire, and later the Turks. Then the Germans, and Russians. The list continues. What is different today and all the other eras? Not until 1948 was Israel recognized as a nation by the world. That does lend to some specific prophecies. The gathering and "sorting out" of Israel. Now before we go off on tangents of Zionism, I am not claiming the current government of Israel is a fulfillment of prophecy, but observe they have been gathering for some time. Yet to be "sorted out." And the sorting out could be Jews coming to Christ as Lord and Savior in significant numbers. Now that would be a miracle. redleghunter  posted on  2015-07-17 00:23:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply   End Trace Mode for Comment # 38. 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