The Left's War On Christians
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Title: Pentagon Urged To Boot Chaplains Who Oppose 'Gay' Marriage
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URL Source: http://www.prophecynewswatch.com/2015/July02/024.html
Published: Jul 3, 2015
Author: July 02, 2015 | JACK MINOR
Post Date: 2015-07-03 23:06:14 by Don
Keywords: None
Views: 25091
Comments: 118
In the aftermath of the Supreme Court’s decision to redefine marriage in all 50 states, the Pentagon is now being urged to “cleanse itself” of chaplains who refuse to support same-sex marriage. Activist Mikey Weinstein, president of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation, is demanding the U.S. military conduct a purge of chaplains who holds to the traditional teaching of homosexuality and marriage espoused by the first commander in chief, George Washington. Weinstein claims chaplains who are “maintaining the state of antagonism between their religion and the sexual/gender identities of service members” have no business serving in the military. “Nobody is arguing that these losers don’t have a right to their religious beliefs,” wrote Weinstein in an op-ed. “At this stage, the only honorable thing that these losers can do is to fold up their uniforms, turn in their papers, and get the hell out of the American military chaplaincy. If they are unwilling or too cowardly to do so, then the Department of Defense must expeditiously cleanse itself of the intolerant filth that insists on lingering in the ranks of our armed forces.” While Weinstein frequently calls for the court-martialing of military members who attempt to share their faith with others, he is now calling for an entire class of chaplains to be fired regardless of whether their beliefs affect their job performance or not. Brig. Gen. Doug Lee, now chairman of the executive committee for the Chaplain Alliance for Religious Liberty, said Weinstein’s views are extreme, showing a lack of understanding of a chaplain’s mission. “His comments are so vitriolic and dividing that they are hardly worth responding to. He seems to feel the need to push his conspiracy theory about certain chaplains in the military,” Lee told WND. “In addition, I don’t think he understands that the job of chaplain exists in a pluralistic military so that people have religious support, and to do away with a certain group of chaplains in its entirety is just ridiculous. “It’s like he never learned a thing in law school about the Constitution and about why chaplains exist.” Lee contends one cannot say chaplains have no right to oppose homosexuality based on the teachings of their faith while also supporting their right to stand by other tenets, such as refusing to marry those outside of their faith. “A chaplain cannot do something against his faith tenet such as marrying someone who has different religious beliefs if that is a tenet of their faith. They cannot be asked to do it, and they cannot be required to do it.” Lee told WND that those who think a chaplain must affirm or support the beliefs of everyone who comes for counseling or teaching misunderstand the purpose of chaplains. “The job of a chaplain is to provide religious support or perform religious support. The ‘provide’ part is to help a person find someone who can meet the individual’s spiritual needs. For example, I would not prepare a Passover meal for a Jewish service member, but I will direct them to a rabbi who can address that area. But when I do perform religious support, whether it be to teach, preach or counsel, I do so from my faith perspective.” For his part, Weinstein said he’s looking forward to ending the conservative influence in the military. “What will become of their once-ironclad dominance of fundamentalist Christian privilege within the Department of Defense?” said Weinstein. Lee insists chaplains don’t use their pulpit and position to call on service members to disobey orders regarding the treatment of “gay” service members. “For the vast majority of chaplains in the military, their faith groups believe that homosexuality is a sin and so they believe marriage is between a man and a woman as Christians have believed for thousands of years,” Lee explained to WND. “But the chaplains are saying that if someone comes to them for counseling with the homosexual partner they won’t ignore that person’s concerns, instead they will refer them to someone who can help with their specific needs because that’s part of providing religious support.” WND reported how the military tried to silence opposition to repeal of the Revolutionary War ban on homosexuals serving in the military during a lame-duck session of Congress, after tea-party voters gave Republicans control of the House of Representatives in 2010. In 2013, soldiers were given a training brief stating evangelical Christians were the No. 1 extremist threat to America, ahead of groups such as the Muslim Brotherhood, Ku Klux Klan, Nation of Islam, al-Qaida and Hamas. Catholicism and ultra-orthodox Judaism were also on the list of religious extremist organizations. As WND reported, Larry Wilkerson, former chief of staff to Colin Powell, told the Washington Post in 2013 the biggest problems faced by the military were sexual assault and what he described as proselytizing by Christians. Wilkerson’s comments were made to Sally Quinn in an interview that also featured former ambassador Joe Wilson and Weinstein as they were on their way to a meeting at the Pentagon. Wilson told Quinn that if a chaplain would proselytize, it would be a workplace violation. Weinstein went even further and said it was a “national security threat” and amounted to “spiritual rape.” He said the chaplain’s role is to minister to spiritual needs. Weinstein said military leaders need to understand “there is systematic misogyny, anti-Semitism and Islamophobia in the military.” “What the Pentagon needs to understand is that it is sedition and treason. It should be punished.” Read more at http://www.prophecynewswatch.com/2015/July02/024.html#rAB6z7mffBjuVXm4.99
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#15. To: CZ82, sneakypete, redleghunter (#13)
CZ82: ("Here you go pete nothing more than another bunch of crackpots.") https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_Religious_Freedom_Foundation Wow. Good find: Yet....Weinstein has been dictating legal AND official military policy that's stood for hundreds of years?? MOREOVER: Weinstein describes the group's target as "a small subset of Fundamentalist Christianity that's called premilliennial, dispensational, reconstructionist, dominionist, fundamentalist, or just Dominionist Christianity. Weinstein also cites enforcement of the "Establishment Clause of the First Amendment" as his fascist, anti-constitiution cabal's "stated goal." CAN'T MAKE THIS UP. How has Weinstin's little Gestapo detail not been legally challenged??
Thanks,that explains it. The story was presented like it was an official military office,and I was wondering how the hell they figured they could get away with something like that. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Kinda makes you wonder why he doesn't go after Judaism,doesn't it? I think we know why he doesn't,don't we? The American left is filled with Jews with a chip on their shoulders and a hatred for Christianity and whites for the way they have been treated by Christian governments for the last couple of thousand years. They would happily destroy the world if it would destroy Christianity and whites. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
I think we know why he doesn't,don't we? Weinstein -- a rabid, obsessed anti-Christian -- doesn't persecute Jewish chaplains because they haven't represented the military nearly as much as fundamental Christians. You know that. As you've noted, Weinstein's only goal is power. And the power to destroy the military's establishment and traditional foundation of morale, spiritual support, and influence. He probably hates religious Jews as well. Weinstein's "religion" is hate (same as his boss, 0blabla.) Plus he is a nihilist. The American left is filled with Jews with a chip on their shoulders and a hatred for Christianity and whites for the way they have been treated by Christian governments for the last couple of thousand years. They would happily destroy the world if it would destroy Christianity and whites. By and large, your observation is likely true. Unfortunately. For sheer spite and revenge, they would rather take down America. The Jewish-American Left forgets, ignores, or just doesn't care that evangelical "fundies" are Israel's biggest supporters -- as well as ignoring the fact that it was the Vatican and Roman Catholic Church who marginalized and abused Jews for centuries. But then, many of them hate Israel as well.
What it means is freedom FROM religion.
Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)
Maybe. Many leftist Jews seem to hate religious Jews. It is purely a secondary hatred,though. They don't go after them like they do Christians. Or at least not in public. By and large, your observation is likely true. Unfortunately. For sheer spite and revenge, they would rather take down America. They see that as being one and the same. American is the most powerful and influential country that is generally considered to be a Christian nation (in terms of church membership if not actual thought and action) that is also majority white (soon to change),and the added bonus is we are,or were,the biggest threat to world-wide control by the left. I suspect a few of their heads may explode once America becomes a white-minority country,and is full of brown Catholics. The Jewish-American Left forgets, ignores, or just doesn't care that evangelical "fundies" are Israel's biggest supporters I honestly think they feel a mixture of jealousy and paranoia because fundie Christian Zionists outnumber Jewish Zionists. IMHO,they fear the possibility of ending up minor players in their own game instead of large and in charge. The history of Judaism and Christianity can only fuel their fears when comparing numbers. Also,the fundie Zionists mostly support Israel and Zionism because they want to see the "End Times" game being played. Jews who live in Israel are propably slightly less thrilled about that concept. Ever notice how it seems like the majority of the Zionists don't live in Israel?(G) as well as ignoring the fact that it was the Vatican and Roman Catholic Church who marginalized and abused Jews for centuries. You really can't blame them for playing the same game everybody plays. Every group seems to hate and fear every other group,and consider all of "them" to have the same negative qualities. It's human nature,and nothing changes human nature. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
I see Freeom OF Religion as being the same thing as Freedom FROM Religion. Otherwise everyone would have the same "right" to follow a state religion instead of no religion at all or the one you want to follow. If you don't have the freedom to not be religious,you don't have the freedom to refuse to follow religious beliefs you don't share so you CAN follow the religious beliefs you do share. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Freedom of gives an option. Freedom from is exclusive. Types like Weinstein want all religious activity expunged from public life. Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)
I disagree because freedom from is also an option. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
The intent and language can't be any clearer: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, OR prohibiting the free exercise thereof."
HUH?? There has been no, ZERO, zip cases challenged in any U.S. courts which back up your ludicrous azz-backwards theory.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, OR prohibiting the free exercise thereof." Yeah,that's why nobody disagrees about it,huh? Including you and I. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
HUH?? There has been no, ZERO, zip cases challenged in any U.S. courts which back up your ludicrous azz-backwards theory. I know this is personal for you,but that is no reason to have your head stuck up your ass about it. Or do you really think my only concern is US court cases,instead of comparing our system to the systems used all over the world where some of them have state religions and you can have your freaking head cut off for worshiping the same God "wrong"? Freedom OF religion also CLEARLY means freedom FROM religion because it bars the state from forcing us to adopt a state religion. We have a choice to worship how and who we choose,or even to not worship at all. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Or do you really think my only concern is US court cases,instead of comparing our system to the systems used all over the world where some of them have state religions and you can have your freaking head cut off for worshiping the same God "wrong"? You're projecting, because this case IS personal...FOR YOU. I get it -- when you were a kid, your relatives didn't give YOU the freedom of OR "from" religion. You were assigned a religion while in the Army without your concent; Maybe a CO tried to coerce you into "Gawd." Your anecdotal cases still don't rise to the federal case you're making it out to be or change the Founders' intent or meaning. Most of all, I'm sorry it ruined faith for you, that you've allowed these instances to alienate you from God. The 1st Amendment and writings of the Founders is crystal clear on the matter of freedom OF religion. It has nothing to do with you citing several irrelevant tangential red herrings.
NOBODY but Leftists, militant atheists, anarchists....in over 200 plus years. For the rest of America, the intent and definition has been a consensus.
And "freedom OF/FROM religion" is still freedom to worship as you please. Whether the religion of Atheism or Nihilism. We have a choice to worship how and who we choose,or even to not worship at all. So you DO understand the 1st Amendment as it pertains to "religion" after all?
It's personal for EVERYBODY. You were assigned a religion while in the Army without your concent; Not true. I had "Heathen" as my religious preference on my dog tags. Saved me from having to listen to the recruiting spiel when reporting in to a new Group that had a Chaplin that didn't know me. Maybe a CO tried to coerce you into "Gawd." Not even once. I did have a Chaplin or two try to convert me before I became a declared Heathen,though. Your anecdotal cases still don't rise to the federal case you're making it out to be I never claimed it was an actual federal case. My claim and fear is that it is a POTENTIAL federal case because so many fundies want to "bring God back to government". The 1st Amendment and writings of the Founders is crystal clear on the matter of freedom OF religion. You are exhibit A due to your insistence that no one in America has a Constitutionally-guaranteed Freedom FROM Religion. It tells me you would like to make a belief in God mandatory,and make religion a part of government. Deny this if you want,but there is no other reason for you to be so blind and stubborn on this issue. It is a FACT that you can NOT have freedom OF religion unless you have a guarantee of freedom FROM religion. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Absolutely! As well as the freedom to NOT be forced to worship if you don't want. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
"Bringing God back into government" vs. Let's see how Satan does? How's that working out for ya? Btw -- NO ONE has EVER been coerced via gubmint mandate into believing in God. There IS no such threat, never has been. Why so paranoid over a phantom bogeyman?
Because True Believers deny it,and fundies are required to spread the word of God. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Weinstein is an Obama hitman whose job is to war against the Christians in the military. He has the power to make commanders quake when chaplains under their command try to do their job mandated by their position in the military structure.
I think he knows quite well what the chaplains are required to do. I think he knows what he has been appointed to do as well. He sees these chaplains as the enemy.
Many Jews are faint from being observant.
Lets take a stab in the dark, is Weinstein a faggot?
But if devout, observant Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, and Muslim clerics are excluded from the chaplain corps, do you believe your or anyone else could sell an all Wiccan or Pagan chaplain corps to the American people? Challenging all who believe in one or both books of the Bible, or the Quran, might lead to quite a backlash.
Lemme guess. NY, FL, CA, DC.
I imagine an orthodox Jew who runs a bakery observing a Palestinian-American and a skinhead coming in to place special orders, the very first customers of the week.
The religion of the chaplain is not the point, a chaplain is there to serve the spiritual and emotional needs of others. Chaplains perform wedding or conduct funeral ceremonies, administer communion, deliver spiritual messages, offer prayer at public meetings, and provide regular counseling. Other chaplains meet the need of the moment, usually through listening and prayer. I was a Wicca practitioner while in the military, but when I was facing a special court martial I was interviewed and evaluated by a Protestant chaplain for additional evaluation. I eventually was found not guilty, but I was under immense stress and not handling it well and the Chaplain, named Major Peacock helped me put things into perspective. There will never likely ever be a 'pagan Chaplain Corp,' as there are not as meany Pagans in the military, or general society to draw on to have them in high numbers. The mix will likely always be with Christians in the majority, with a smaller number of Muslim, Jewish and members of other faiths like Wicca. Confronting people to try to challenge a service member's faith is something a Chaplain should never do. Lemme guess. NY, FL, CA, DC. Nope. They live in the Bible Belt in the south and the mid-west. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
I think it goes further than that. It can probably result in court-martial charges and at a minimum the loss of their commission. Military Chaplains MUST be "one size fits all" practitioners. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Like your ass buddy. You don't support the first amendment. You're AINO.
It's the ENTIRE point. Did you miss the thread title and subject at hand: Title: Pentagon Urged To Boot Chaplains Who Oppose 'Gay' Marriage Those targeted chaplains are FUNDMENTAL CHRISTIAN. Not only that, Mikey Weinstein has specifically persecuted AND called for the ouster of Christian chaplains who openly display the Bible. I was a Wicca practitioner while in the military, but when I was facing a special court martial I was interviewed and evaluated by a Protestant chaplain for additional evaluation. I eventually was found not guilty... Who other than a Prot-Christian chaplain is going to show you that kind of understanding and compassion? I've an interpretation to make about your icon and symbolism -- ostensibly in "honor" of the Grateful Dead.' It's an open skull (the symbol of death.) The surrounding the periphery are some confusing psychedelic patterns. Within the skull and space of the brain is a temptingly beautiful blue sea trailing into sunny horizon -- a giant "Peace Sign" stands as monument and goalpost. Pretty slick, seductive deception. What it DOESN'T show is...just beyond that sunny, promise of peace...is the Lake of Fire. And by that time it's too late to turn back. The "Peace Sign"? What does it mean? It depends on who is displaying it. What's its history? The Saracens in A.D. 711 used this symbol to alternately represent a broken cross, a raven's claw, or a witch's foot, all presumably satanic symbols. Under the reign of Roman Emperor Nero, infamous for his brutal persecution of Christians and Jews, this symbol was prominently used to represent a broken cross or broken Jew. Nero crucified the Apostle Peter upside down, and the horrific event resembled the downward-pointing fork. It was thereafter called the Neronic cross. Source: http://www.gotquestions.org/peace-sign.html
Link: Grateful Dead Symbols De-Coded Part 4: The Skull and Lightning Bolt "For the next leg of our journey on our search for the meanings behind the Grateful Dead's iconic symbols, let's take a look at one of my personal favorites: the skull and lightning bolt, or “Steal your Face” logo. This image of a skull, cracked and divided by a lightning bolt that divides the head into two hemispheres—most typically blue and red, with the lower portion of the skull in white. Designed in 1969, the logo was the collaborative work of Owsley Stanley and artist Bob Thomas. Owsley was inspired by a freeway sign he happened to pass by—a round shape divided by a bold white line into an orange half and a blue half. The general shape and colors stood out, and Owsley had the notion that a blue and red design with a lightning bolt with make a cool logo. He shared his idea with Bob Thomas, who then drew up plans of the design. Originally, there was no skull face—the logo was simply a circle divided with the lightning bolt. The skull face was added on a few days later, as a way to symbolize the “Grateful Dead.” The band first used the logo as an identifying mark on their musical equipment, and later the symbol appeared on the inside album jacket of the self-titled album The Grateful Dead. The logo later appeared on the cover of the album Steal your Face, and has been known as the Steal your Face symbol ever since. Perhaps its the lightning bolt that signifies transformation, enlightenment, and the raw powers of nature, juxtaposed with a skull image and striking, distinct colors that lends to the symbol's equation to the whole “steal your face” concept. Through the band's music and the scene and philosophy that the music inspired, people were transformed. Their everyday masks were “cracked” by the honesty, the openness and “realness” of the Grateful Dead culture, and their mundane, limited identities were left behind. The skull and lightning symbol just happens to perfectly symbolize and encapsulate this idea, even though it was created years before the song which eventually came to lend the iconic graphic it its name." How would you know? You think it only protects some speech. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
It's the ENTIRE point. Did you miss the thread title and subject at hand: Title: Pentagon Urged To Boot Chaplains Who Oppose 'Gay' Marriage Those targeted chaplains are FUNDMENTAL CHRISTIAN. WRONG! That is nothing more than the camel's nose under the tent,and the focus RIGHT NOW is on fundie Christians because they are the universal religious targets of ridicule right now,and it unites the far left and the ignorant masses as well as the devout Catholics (LOTS of overlap on that one!) that equate "religious fundies" with "KKK and militia members". I say it is the camel's nose under the tent because the goobers that support this will not only get what they ask for,but will get more than they expected. The precedent will have been established,and the Catholics,the Jews,and eventually (after they have served their role in destroying the Bill of Rights) the Muslims. In fact,NO religion will be safe other than the religion that worships the power of the government over the serfs. Make no mistake about it,total control of thoughts and actions is the ultimage goal. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Make no mistake about it,total control of thoughts and actions is the ultimage goal. On that we agree. There is an underlying subversive method to this madness. And it IS about absolute power and control. But what better way to achieve that than to cripple Christians and their values, which have undoubtedly provided America its traditional underpinnings? IT and its believers have been the foundation and glue that have held together this Republic since *before* we were a Republic. And THIS is why I've said for years -- so goes Christianity in America, so goes America and her ideals -- regardless of faith or lack thereof. Ergo, this is now a hot war between "Conserve-a-tism vs. "Progressive-ism." Ultimately, there are but these two horses to back.
Mike -- thanks for providing a different interpretation and your opinion of this "Grateful Dead" symbol. I realize that on its surface to you perhaps it represents...just another Grateful Dead symbol. I have nothing against GD fans, or their music. I respect your admiration of the band and nostalgia. That said -- in scraping below the surface, like many symbols -- a dual meaning is intended. In this case, occultist meanings and symbolism can be found. The skull has ALWAYS symbolized "death." The rest of your particular icon presents further problematic symbolism, as explained by the recognizable Peace Sign. In the context of the skull (and death), the peace sign is no longer. It is a "broken cross, a raven's claw, or a witch's foot" -- all can be presumed satanic symbols, and mockery of the Jews who believed in Christ's cross. I can't presume to know your heart -- whether this symbolism plays into your display of this particular "Grateful Dead" icon, or it's just simply a benign, favorite GD icon of yours. But for others...it is what it is.
That is a point I have argued on another thread about Chaplain Modder who is facing possible separation. http://www2.libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=40191&Disp=All&#C76 nolu chan at 2015-06-18 23:49:25 ET However, the express point of the article of this thread is aimed any any chaplain who opposes gay marriage. It would not be possible for a Catholic chaplain to perform a same-sex marriage and not get himself ex-communicated from his church. Similarly, I would expect fundamentalist Protestant, orthodox Jewish, or Muslim clerics to oppose same-sex marriage as inconsistent with their religion. It is one thing to perform the job of a chaplain and to provide spiritual and emotional support to all and another thing to require them to actively participate in, or to actively support, something their religion does not permit. I would have expected a chaplain of any faith to have comforted and assisted you, as you relate one did. I would not expect the chaplain to partake of a Wiccan ceremony or to speak acceptingly of Wiccan beliefs. SCOTUS has determined abortion is a constitutional right. Should the military kick out all doctors who oppose abortion? Somebody in the military opposes abortion as it is almost impossible for the military member to obtain one in a military hospital. Many or most civilian hospitals do not perform the procedure either. What does it mean to "oppose gay marriage?" Does it mean to morally or religiously oppose it? To refuse to perform or participate in a gay marriage? To refuse to offer positive reinforcement in counseling a prospective spouse about an intended gay marriage? How does a Catholic chaplain positively counsel someone about doing something his religion condemns? At what point does one person's fundamental right to marry someone of the same sex outweigh another person's freedom of religious expression? If all the chaplains who are morally opposed to gay marriage are booted out of the service, who would be left? If all the doctors opposed to performing an abortion were booted out, would there be enough left to perform other procedures?
You see Christians as the most important "block" of people. I see them as just one of a number of prominent groups,and the way to take over control is to fragment these groups and people to the point where they hate and fear each other more than they do the globalist government. Nothing at all new about this other than the names of the players. It's the old "divide and conquer" strategy at play,and most people get too wrapped up in their hatred of the people they see as their enemy to even notice the true enemy. Yeah,the government could go after Voo Doo believers or NBA fans instead,but what would it gain them and who would really care? Going after Christianity takes out a politically powerful group that might stand against them,as well as providing them with organized and powerful allies from other religions who are jealous of the influenes and power that Christianity has in this country,and want to divide up the Christians goods amongst themselves. They are so blinded by their jealousy and hatred that they are blind to the FACT they once Christianity is destroyed THEY will be the next ones with their heads on the chopping blocks. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)
Well reasoned. But we are not dealing with a reasonable man in Weinstein. He has an agenda and will keep pushing it until someone calls him on his pair of 2s. I'm sure a gay military couple will test the waters. They will come in to either a Baptist or Catholic chaplain and ask for marriage counseling. Both will point out that they do not advise such unions and will no doubt refer them to some chaplain who will. We will only hear about the refusal part and not the referral part. It will make "news" and the chaplains will be vilified but exonerated yet their career will be over. It will be a victory for the homosexual lobby. Future chaplains will be recruited based on the same sex marriage litmus test and another institution will be hijacked by the secular left. You can all bookmark this post and refer to it when it happens. Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestPete: ("OK, I'm confused. Is this Military Religious freedom Foundation part of a military branch or government office?")
The Military Religious Freedom Foundation (MRFF) is a watchdog group and advocacy organization founded in 2005 by Michael Weinstein.
#16. To: CZ82 (#13)
Here you go pete nothing more than another bunch of crackpots.
#17. To: Liberator (#15)
Weinstein describes the group's target as "a small subset of Fundamentalist Christianity that's called premilliennial, dispensational, reconstructionist, dominionist, fundamentalist, or just Dominionist Christianity.
#18. To: sneakypete (#17)
(Edited)
Kinda makes you wonder why he doesn't go after Judaism,doesn't it?
#19. To: Liberator (#14)
#20. To: Liberator (#18)
He probably hates religious Jews as well.
#21. To: redleghunter, Liberator (#19)
What it means is freedom FROM religion.
#22. To: sneakypete (#21)
#23. To: redleghunter (#22)
Freedom of gives an option. Freedom from is exclusive.
#24. To: redleghunter, sneakypete (#22)
Freedom of gives an option. Freedom from is exclusive.
#25. To: sneakypete, redleghunter (#21)
(Edited)
If you don't have the freedom to not be religious,you don't have the freedom to refuse to follow religious beliefs you don't share so you CAN follow the religious beliefs you do share.
#26. To: Liberator (#24)
The intent and language can't be any clearer:
#27. To: Liberator (#25)
If you don't have the freedom to not be religious,you don't have the freedom to refuse to follow religious beliefs you don't share so you CAN follow the religious beliefs you do share.
#28. To: sneakypete (#27)
(Edited)
I know this is personal for you,but that is no reason to have your head stuck up your ass about it.
#29. To: sneakypete (#26)
Yeah,that's why nobody disagrees about it,huh?
#30. To: sneakypete (#27)
Freedom OF religion also CLEARLY means freedom FROM religion because it bars the state from forcing us to adopt a state religion.
#31. To: Liberator (#28)
You're projecting, because this case IS personal...FOR YOU.
#32. To: Liberator (#30)
(Edited)
And "freedom OF/FROM religion" is still freedom to worship as you please.
#33. To: sneakypete (#31)
My claim and fear is that it is a POTENTIAL federal case because so many fundies want to "bring God back to government".
#34. To: Liberator (#33)
Btw -- NO ONE has EVER been coerced via gubmint mandate into believing in God. There IS no such threat, never has been. Why so paranoid over a phantom bogeyman?
#35. To: sneakypete (#9)
#36. To: redleghunter (#8)
#37. To: nolu chan (#4)
#38. To: Fred Mertz (#1)
Let me take a stab in the dark, is Weinstein a Jew?
#39. To: Ferret Mike (#12)
The U.S. Army Chaplains Guide to Wicca
#40. To: sneakypete, Liberator (#20)
Ever notice how it seems like the majority of the Zionists don't live in Israel?(G)
#41. To: Don (#37)
Many Jews are faint from being observant.
#42. To: nolu chan (#39)
#43. To: nolu chan (#40)
Ever notice how it seems like the majority of the Zionists don't live in Israel?(G)
#44. To: Ferret Mike (#42)
Confronting people to try to challenge a service member's faith is something a Chaplain should never do.
#45. To: sneakypete (#44)
#46. To: Ferret Mike, redleghunter, Bob Celeste, garyspfc, Don, Stoner (#42)
The religion of the chaplain is not the point...
#47. To: Liberator (#46)
(Edited)
I have long been a Deadhead. I have seen 171 concerts and collect Grateful Dead graphics and icons. The last shows of the Dead are occurring right now this weekend at Soldier's Field in Chicago. I also have worked for Ray Sewell at one of his 'Chez Ray's restaurants. Ray once was the chef that traveled with the band and prepared meals and food. I have gone to Ken Kesey's ranch in Pleasant Hill, Oregon with Ray and his family to two of Ken's New Year's Day parties, Ray and others in that community knew me from my near death from a forty-three foot fall from a tree cutting protest which made me well known in my area. I have also enjoyed the backstage scene of the group originally called the Warlocks and the Grateful Dead is one of my favorite groups. I just have this variation of a Steal Your Face up to honor the band and their family who's last shows are this weekend which also marks fifty years of the existence of the Grateful Dead.
#48. To: A K A Stone (#45)
Like your ass buddy. You don't support the first amendment.
#49. To: Liberator, Ferret Mike, redleghunter, Bob Celeste, garyspfc, Don, Stoner, *Religious History and Issues* (#46)
The religion of the chaplain is not the point...
#50. To: sneakypete, Ferret Mike, redleghunter, Bob Celeste, garyspfc, Don, Stoner (#49)
In fact,NO religion will be safe other than the religion that worships the power of the government over the serfs.
#51. To: Ferret Mike (#47)
#52. To: Ferret Mike (#42)
The religion of the chaplain is not the point, a chaplain is there to serve the spiritual and emotional needs of others.
His job as a chaplain, is to provide spiritual and emotional support. It is not to convert anyone to his personal religious beliefs. He is there to offer support, not to save them from perdition. A rabbi could offer support to a Catholic without condemning him for having bacon with his eggs. A single pregnant servicewoman does not seek the support of a chaplain to hear about the evils of pre-marital sex. A chaplain cannot counsel a muslim on the evils of Islam. A Christian might not take too kindly to a muslim chaplain counseling them on Sharia and halal. The chaplain must be able to offer comfort and support to all. It is not unChristian to comfort a gay person without confronting them with unwelcome condemnation of their lifestyle.
Title: Pentagon Urged To Boot Chaplains Who Oppose 'Gay' Marriage
#53. To: Liberator (#50)
But what better way to achieve that than to cripple Christians and their values, which have undoubtedly provided America its traditional underpinnings?
#54. To: Liberator, Ferret Mike (#51)
I can't presume to know your heart -- whether this symbolism plays into your display of this particular "Grateful Dead" icon, or it's just simply a benign, favorite GD icon of yours. But for others...it is what it is.
#55. To: nolu chan, Liberator, CZ82, GarySpFc (#52)
What does it mean to "oppose gay marriage?" Does it mean to morally or religiously oppose it? To refuse to perform or participate in a gay marriage? To refuse to offer positive reinforcement in counseling a prospective spouse about an intended gay marriage? How does a Catholic chaplain positively counsel someone about doing something his religion condemns?
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