Title: Love Source:
[None] URL Source:[None] Published:May 7, 2015 Author:A K A Stone Post Date:2015-05-07 20:54:34 by A K A Stone Keywords:None Views:26365 Comments:69
Well .. let me tell ya 'bout love. The Christians hate the Jews for murdering Jesus Christ & the Jews hate the Muslims & the Muslims hate the Christians. Oh and the Christians hate the Muslims and the Jews hate the Christians. And the Muslims hate the Jews. And the world is on the brink of WW3 because everyone is just "lovey-dovey."
Basically there isn't much love beyond American politicians running for President or any other federal, state or local office giving all of us: the best days of our lives, or so they say as our taxes keep climbing while the fed prints all the money they want to cover the TRILLIONS of debt that has done nothing.
Well .. let me tell ya 'bout love. The Christians hate the Jews for murdering Jesus Christ & the Jews hate the Muslims & the Muslims hate the Christians. Oh and the Christians hate the Muslims and the Jews hate the Christians. And the Muslims hate the Jews. And the world is on the brink of WW3 because everyone is just "lovey-dovey."
Not entirely accurate. There are some self proclaimed Christians who blame the Jews for Christ's sentence and death. But those that do so should read the part where Christ forgives them for those actions. Jesus Christ on the cross put an end to any hatred or animosity by saying those Words. Christians should follow His example. Jesus Christ put into action the words He spoke. So should those who follow Him.
"For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb.” (Psalm 139:13)
Well, I'm a Christian. I don't hate the Jews, or the Muslims. I don't hate the seculars either, or the Hindus. I think that Wiccans are odd, but I don't hate them.
Well, I'm a Christian. I don't hate the Jews, or the Muslims. I don't hate the seculars either, or the Hindus. I think that Wiccans are odd, but I don't hate them.
Hate is a strong word. I don't hate much.
But you don't "love" the folks you describe otherwise; you could have suggested that you do but denied the personal perspective. So, you are just a normal fear mongering "hater" denying your position in time & space because of indifference or fear. You could be the worst kind, too. The US government calls your affiliation, "Meaningless & rambling TERRORIST." Be careful, the NSA is watching.
The guy you mention is long gone & ain't comin' back. All these other, "self-proclaimed Christians" you discuss follow the example as they see fit; it varies all over the map of individual interpretations.
Yes hate is a strong word especially in what specifically it applies. One can hate those things which are an abomination or sin against God. Some people love those abominations. Yet Jesus Christ came to save sinners from bondage to sin. The very act of His crucifixion, death and resurrection is the Greatest act of Love.
Hate the sin, pray for the sinner.
"For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb.” (Psalm 139:13)
ut you don't "love" the folks you describe otherwise; you could have suggested that you do but denied the personal perspective. So, you are just a normal fear mongering "hater" denying your position in time & space because of indifference or fear. You could be the worst kind, too. The US government calls your affiliation, "Meaningless & rambling TERRORIST." Be careful, the NSA is watching.
Depends on what "love" means, I suppose.
To me, the word "love" means an intense emotional bond with somebody. "I love you" is a powerful set of words, to me. And that level of attachment is not only not common, for me, but it is not something I can "choose" if I wanted to. I can find worthwhile qualities in most people, if I look hard enough, but love, in the standard, English meaning of that word, as I myself use it, has never been anything that I've been able to will into existence, or out of existence in that matter.
The Greek in which Jesus' words are recorded have several words that are translated as "love" in English. And that is confusing.
The "love" I spoke of above is some combination of eros and agape. The love to which you're referring is more like "philadelphos" - brotherly love. And THAT I certainly do feel for some Jews and Muslims in my acquaintance. I'm related by marriage to several Muslims, and I probably know more Muslims and Jews personally than you've ever met in your life.
It is fair to say that I love, in the sense of philadelphos, them more than I love you, yes. God may judge people by their religion in the end, by I'm not God and I don't.
What I wrote to you, and what I'm writing here again to you, is moderate and measured. What you're writing is dripping with venom. I don't know why.
It is fair to say that you make yourself difficult to love, and that I would tend to keep my distance from you on account of that. You seem to have a head full of sharp edges and angles that cause you to lash out at people.
It's not pleasant to be lashed out at, so wise people stay back and stay away. That doesn't mean I wouldn't pull you out of a river or a burning plane - I would. It does mean that I'd probably prefer to have dinner with my Muslim friends and relatives, or the Jewish ones or Chinese ones or atheists or Democrats, than with you.
The Christians hate the Jews for murdering Jesus Christ & the Jews hate the Muslims & the Muslims hate the Christians. Oh and the Christians hate the Muslims and the Jews hate the Christians. And the Muslims hate the Jews.
As a Christian, I hate only those whom God has first hated. For as His slave, His bond servant, I not only serve Him I take on His loves and hates as well.
As an example, In the book of the prophecy of Jesus Christ, we read: Re 2:6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate. and again in Revelation 2:15 So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.
There are more, but these are a clear example of who God hates, and should open a nice discussion on who the Nicolaitins are.
Bob, are you really capable of hating somebody because somebody else (including God) does, or loving somebody because somebody else does?
I'm not.
Love and hate are emotions. I am capable of mastering my actions regardless of my emotions. I am not, however, capable of creating emotions that I don't have. Nor am I capable of making emotions I do have vanish. I can control my actions, but I do not control my feelings.
Which is why I have some sympathy for gays. After all, I've had powerful crushes on certain girls that have lasted for years. I was not capable of creating a crush; nor was I capable of dispelling one. These things just ARE.
I've never had a crush like that on a male. But suppose I did? It's not impossible for me to imagine that happening. Apparently it does happen with gays. And when it does, why would I expect them to be any more capable of changing their emotions than I am? Obviously they can't. This is why I don't hate the gays for what they are - I can't help having crushes on whom I have crushes, and I would think they're no different...they're just crushing on- side, so to speak. I don't think they should be allowed to MARRY, because marriage is a specific thing with specific sacramental meaning. But I don't think gays should be abused either, or treated as subhuman. And I think it's silly to scream at them that they should change. How does one change one's emotions? I can't. How can I ask somebody else to do what I cannot do?
Likewise with this who notion of belief. I can't just "believe" something. I don't think that it's possible to just decide to "believe" something. I can reason things out. I can logically prefer one outcome over another. But BELIEF is like an intellectual emotion: the mind has emotionally accepted something as so. Demanding that people "Believe" - Muslims do that, so do some Christians. It strikes me as an idiotic thing to say. Put a plate full of liver in front of most children. You can make them eat it, perhaps. But you can't make people LIKE food they don't like. You might be able to make somebody SAY that he likes something, or loves somebody, or believes something, but saying it doesn't mean it's true. How can somebody be MADE to like a food he doesn't like, or be attracted to someone he doesn't find attractive, or believe that which he doesn't? It can't be done.
I don't know what the deeds of the Nicolaitans are. Nobody does. Scripture doesn't say. Lots of people use that as the opportunity to engage in adding to Scripture - by supplying the list of things they personally hate, and ascribing that list to God. That's nice, but it's not honest.
Whoever the Nicolaitans are, and whatever they were doing that was hateful to Christ, we don't know. All we know from this that Christ hates, and that he hates certain works, and that he hates certain doctrines.
What, exactly, those doctrines were, we can't know.
#25. To: tpaine, rlk, soso, buckeroo, redleghunter (#24)(Edited)
One way to avoid the above is to look at what the scriptures say. -- redleghunter
"Not this sh*t again? Pa................leazzzzzzzzzze." - soso
"One of the few times I have ever agreed with you on anything." --- rlk
"That makes three of us,--- a trinity of doubting Thomas's." - tpaine
Do you all three FOUR doubt:
1) The veracity of "authority" that are the Words and actions of Jesus Christ and God?
2) The veracity of the authority that *is* the entire Holy Bible? Either/or the Old Testament/New Testament?
3) The veracity of entire precept and acceptance that *any* "word of God" would be inspired or "transcribed" via God's spirit *to* man?
Or...
4)The Creator of the Universe -- God -- is incapable of doing so.
5) "God? I see no evidence He even exists. We live. We die. Period. There is no rhyme or reason or purpose to our existence."
So what is the nature of the disbelief or disconnect here with the Bible or God?
Is it merely a matter of rejecting "God," period? Have "hypocritical" Christians or "hateful" Christians deterred you from seeking faith? God's Word is all that should matter to you...and personal relationship.
John 10:27 "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me"
Matthew 7:7-8 "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: 8For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened."
This is why I don't hate the gays for what they are - I can't help having crushes on whom I have crushes, and I would think they're no different...they're just crushing on- side, so to speak.
No, you're right; The scenario you've entertained *isn't* a reason to hate this kind of "homosexual."
But when once they begin promoting the lifestyle as righteous and normal, teaching and corrupt others to engage in that sin, coercing and bullying others to accept their sin, it become...many things according to the Lord that *are* "hated."
#30. To: Liberator, rlk, buckeroo, redleghunter (#25)
Do you all three FOUR doubt:
The thing I doubt is the fidelity of man scribes translating the Word Of God into mutilpe languages from a language of over two thousand years old and several hundread years removed (thousands in the case of the OT) from the events being described. God is perfect, man is not.
SO not this sh*t again. We have had lenghty discussions about this on a number of different threads here. So I will just say again, God is perfect, man is flawed. God is perfect, chruches are flawed. God is perfect, man organized and administered relions are flawed.
And let me make this perfectly clear to you, I have an abiding belief in God and Jesus. I do not have any belief in any man that claims to know the mind of God or knows the one true understanding of God's words. Over and out for me on this subject. You will find a sympatheic ear in redleghunter.
The thing I doubt is the fidelity of man scribes translating the Word Of God into mutilpe languages from a language of over two thousand years old and several hundread years removed (thousands in the case of the OT) from the events being described. God is perfect, man is not.
And let me make this perfectly clear to you, I have an abiding belief in God and Jesus.
Thanks for the honest, candid assessment and explanation.
In short it's the fidelity and survivability of translation of the events and of THE word of God over the many centuries that gives you pause...
Can you accept the notion that absolute nothing is impossible for God -- and everything *possible*? Then why harbor doubts of a Scripture inspired from God Himself and so transcribed exactly as He intended it be preserved? Yes, man is a liar, imperfect, and flawed. Yet man transcribed the Word. Perfectly. Moreover, as far as you or anyone can tell from scripture, does it appear that God is a liar? That is the true test of "fidelity."
You concede that you are a Believer. Despite your reservations over "fidelity" issues, there must be a convincing measure of intellectual and spiritual surety of faith within your own heart that the Gospel IS the word of God.
I don't know what the deeds of the Nicolaitans are. Nobody does. Scripture doesn't say. Lots of people use that as the opportunity to engage in adding to Scripture - by supplying the list of things they personally hate, and ascribing that list to God. That's nice, but it's not honest.
Whoever the Nicolaitans are, and whatever they were doing that was hateful to Christ, we don't know. All we know from this that Christ hates, and that he hates certain works, and that he hates certain doctrines.
What, exactly, those doctrines were, we can't know.
Perhaps this may help;
These were, as is commonly supposed, a sect of the Gnostics, who taught the most impure doctrines, and followed the most impure practices. They are also supposed to have derived their origin from Nicolas, one of the seven deacons mentioned Ac 6:5, where see the note. The Nicolaitanes taught the community of wives, that adultery and fornication were things indifferent, that eating meats offered to idols was quite lawful; and mixed several pagan rites with the Christian ceremonies. Augustine, Irenaeus, Clemens Alexandrinus, and Tertullian, have spoken largely concerning them
#34. To: Liberator, rlk, buckeroo, redleghunter (#31)
In short it's the fidelity and survivability of translation of the events and of THE word of God over the many centuries that gives you pause...
Let's try this one more time.
In short it's the fidelity and survivability of translationS of the events pertaining to man's representation of the word of God that gives me pause.
Languages from 2,000+ years ago are either dead or do not have the same meaning of words and idioms, etc. as they do today or 500 years ago or 1,000 years ago or 1,500 years ago. Every language changes over time. Just look at the English language as spoken and written in the U.S. over the past 200 years, even just 50 years (e.g. - the word gay used to mean happy, light hearted). Why do you think that there are so many versions of the NT and so many sects of Chrisianity that think that it they and only they have the true understanding of God's words?
I hope this clarifies my position for you. I really do not want to rehash this over and over again.
The thing I doubt is the fidelity of man scribes translating the Word Of God into mutilpe languages from a language of over two thousand years old and several hundread years removed (thousands in the case of the OT) from the events being described. God is perfect, man is not.
So you don't think God can preserve His own words, gospel and commands? That man is sovereign over the acts of Diety?
"For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb.” (Psalm 139:13)
