I AM A PROPHET and I prophesy
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Title: Geologists claim stats, science prove Jesus buried in Jerusalem with wife and supposed son
Source:
The Jerusalem Post
URL Source: http://www.jpost.com/Christian-News ... -with-wife-supposed-son-396262
Published: Apr 6, 2015
Author: ARIEL COHEN
Post Date: 2015-04-06 08:09:47 by Willie Green
Keywords: None
Views: 3194
Comments: 18
An Israeli geologist believes he has found the tomb of Jesus in Jerusalem, and this time, the tomb of his supposed son is buried along with him. Poster Comment:
After 150 chemical tests, Canadian-Israeli filmmaker-journalist Simcha Jacobovici and geoarcheologist Aryeh Shimron claim they’ve reached a scientific breakthrough with theological implications.
The finding has been over 35 years in the making, amid court cases, legal restrictions and scientific and biblical pushback. Through methodical scientific testing, Shimron and Jacobovici say that were able to connect the James ossuary – whose existence was announced in 2002 and containing inscriptions referencing the burial of Jesus – to the long disputed “Jesus Family tomb” in the capital’s East Talpiot neighborhood – thus archeologically and statistically proving the existence of Jesus. The discovery, according to the researchers, proves that Jesus was buried in Jerusalem along with nine other people, one being “Judah, son of Jesus,” another his supposed wife, “Mary” – an obvious affront to the common-knowledge New Testament theology. “He [Shimron] has made what I think is a huge discovery,” Jacobovici told The Jerusalem Post. “I have been following him and his work for the past seven years, this is not an overnight thing.”
Shimron’s work has linked together two findings that on their own hold less significance, but when put together they lead to what Jacobovici calls “an archeological slam dunk.” The story began with the 1980 discovery of the Talpiot tomb, otherwise known as the “Jesus Family Tomb.” At that time, the discovery was not considered controversial as more than 800 tombs were unearthed during the construction boom in Jerusalem at the time, most dating back to the Second Temple period and the time of Jesus.
The bones in the tomb were in boxes known as ossuaries, with multiple ossuaries in one tomb. Three thousand ossuaries from the Second Temple period have been found to date – 2,000 are in possession of the Antiquities Authority, but the rest are in private ownership, many sold by vendors in the Old City.
Around 20 percent of the ossuaries have inscriptions on them. In the tomb found in East Talpiot there were numerous inscriptions that fit the story of Jesus. One ossuary was a box with the inscription “Jesus son of Joseph.” Next to it there were “Maria,” “Joseph,” another “Mary,” “Yose” (a name associated in the New Testament with the brother of Jesus), “Matthew” and most controversially of all – “Judah, son of Jesus.” For 16 years the relics lay with the Antiquities Authority, unreported and disregarded due to the lack of proof backing its possible significance. After all, Joseph, Mary and Jesus were all common names at the time.
Jacobovici was producing a documentary on the artifact, and went to a statistician from the University of Toronto, who told him those names each separately composed approximately 8% of the population. But of that population who had the common names, a very small percentage had a mother named Mary and a brother named Joseph. Jacobovici was sure there was something more here. So he had the patinas of the tombs scraped and analyzed, searching for links proving or discounting the New Testament connection.
“But there was something here that becomes theologically upsetting to Christians,” Jacobovici said. “Many people that believe that Jesus spiritually rose to heaven. But many others believe that he stood up, left the tomb, and physically went up. But now there’s a bone box here with his tomb, thats not good.”
Work on the findings came to a halt in 2007 when archeologists deemed the chances too slim for the story to be real.
Jacobovici’s documentary The Lost Tomb of Jesus, produced by James Cameron (Titanic) was first broadcast on the Discovery Channel in 2007.
The second prong of the mystery emerged in 2002, with the discovery of a bone box in the private collection of Oded Golan, the largest collector of biblical ossuaries in the world.
While examining Golan’s collection, an academic from the Sorbonne found an ossuary with the inscription “James son of Joseph, brother of Jesus.” This is became known as the “James ossuary.” At the time it made headlines as the first archeological evidence that Jesus existed. The hype grew around the discovery, until the story came crashing down when Golan was accused of forging the inscription. Shimron and Jacobovici linked up on the project and began their search for more evidence. If the James ossuary originated from the “Jesus Family tomb,” it was possible that the ossuary held the bones of brother of Jesus. They knew chances were near statistically impossible, but continued pursuit.
The Antiquities Authority declared the “brother of Jesus” part of the inscription a forgery and pressed charges against Golan. After seven years, a Jerusalem court found him innocent.
Golan spent seven years on trial on charges of forging the inscription on the ossuary. He was found innocent in 2012.
Just two weeks ago, Shimron received access to the James ossuary, enabling him to cross reference findings between the two tombs.
Shimron said that testing the patina, as Jacobovici did, was not enough to prove the scientific connection, as the surface of patinas could be contaminated. He scraped underneath the patinas of the box to get into the ossuary itself. He ran approximately 200 tests on the chemistry of the samples from 25 different ossuaries. As Shimron did further tests, the results for magnesium, silicon and iron matched up. It seemed statistically too good to be true.
He found that the Talpiot tomb had a unique chemical signature and that the random samples did not match that signature, but that the James ossuary did. He also found that the soil that seeped inside the James ossuary perfectly matched the soil that seeped inside the Talpiot ossuaries, including the “Jesus Family tomb,” thus illustrating that the James ossuary spent most of its existence in the East Talpiot location.
“This find illustrates that the James ossuary is authentic and the Jesus Family tomb indeed belongs to the family of Jesus of Nazareth,” Jacobovici said.
Today the Talpiot tomb is sealed underground between apartment buildings in East Talpiot, and its ossuaries are back with the Antiquities Authority. The James ossuary is with its owner, Golan, who according to The New York Times, keeps the box in a secret location.
The findings of the James ossuary and the “Jesus Family tomb” have the ability to shake up the Christian debate, and Shimron and Jacobovici are well aware of that. They expect the Christian community to not take well to the findings, but they argue that their research is purely scientific, and not theological, in nature.
If true, not only do the findings prove Jesus’s existence and burial in Jerusalem, but they also lead scientists to believe he was buried with his supposed son, Judah. The case has already aroused international interest, after the Times devoted an Easter Sunday feature to the claims.
In response to the finding, Prof. James Tabor from the University of North Carolina at Charlotte said that scholars should take these kinds of findings as historical data. He believes that archeologists, geologists and scholars should remain in search of truth and fact. “If in fact Jesus’s tomb is found, the procedures would be no different than the discovery of any other tomb,” Tabor said. “But in the case of Jesus everything changes, because he is such a lightning rod figure for so many people – because if you find the bones of Jesus in a tomb then he did not rise from the dead.”
This discovery would be a concern for evangelicals, Protestants, Roman Catholics, even the Vatican, due to its contradiction of the faith.
“There are lots of more modern Christians who view the resurrection as more spiritual, and as a historical and scientific event that doesn’t threaten the faith,” Tabor said. “But for most it is very controversial, let’s face it. With the James [ossuary] added to the mix, it puts the likelihood the tomb is real up to 99%. The ossuary says ‘James son of Joseph brother of Jesus.’” “It doesn’t necessarily contradict biblical findings, but it contradicts faith more,” he said.
Ezekiel 37
(2 images)
The Valley of Dry Bones
1 The hand of the Lord was on me, and he brought me out by the Spirit of the Lord and set me in the middle of a valley; it was full of bones.
2 He led me back and forth among them, and I saw a great many bones on the floor of the valley, bones that were very dry.
3 He asked me, “Son of man, can these bones live?”
I said, “Sovereign Lord, you alone know.”
4 Then he said to me, “Prophesy to these bones and say to them, ‘Dry bones, hear the word of the Lord!
5 This is what the Sovereign Lord says to these bones: I will make breath[a] enter you, and you will come to life.
6 I will attach tendons to you and make flesh come upon you and cover you with skin; I will put breath in you, and you will come to life. Then you will know that I am the Lord.’”
7 So I prophesied as I was commanded. And as I was prophesying, there was a noise, a rattling sound, and the bones came together, bone to bone.
8 I looked, and tendons and flesh appeared on them and skin covered them, but there was no breath in them.
9 Then he said to me, “Prophesy to the breath; prophesy, son of man, and say to it, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Come, breath, from the four winds and breathe into these slain, that they may live.’”
10 So I prophesied as he commanded me, and breath entered them; they came to life and stood up on their feet—a vast army.
11 Then he said to me: “Son of man, these bones are the people of Israel. They say, ‘Our bones are dried up and our hope is gone; we are cut off.’
12 Therefore prophesy and say to them: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: My people, I am going to open your graves and bring you up from them; I will bring you back to the land of Israel.
13 Then you, my people, will know that I am the Lord, when I open your graves and bring you up from them.
14 I will put my Spirit in you and you will live, and I will settle you in your own land. Then you will know that I the Lord have spoken, and I have done it, declares the Lord.’”
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#1. To: Willie Green (#0)
The first clue. Leftists aren't christians. The second clue. Christians don't post articles that use lies to undermine their faith. Lukewarm.
So, on the one hand, there are bones and inscriptions containing some of the most common names in all of Judaism. And on the other hand, there's the image on the Shroud of Turin, whose properties are such that it cannot exist, but it does. Two sets of first century (maybe) artifacts. One's a miracle involving a crucified man. The other's a burial plot that could be anybody.
Hey Willie -- maybe for your next post you can find the scientist who claims discovery of Alfred E. Newman's tomb. As to you citing some scripture along with it? *spit* Idiot.
The second clue. Christians don't post articles that use lies to undermine their faith. “If any of you put a stumbling block before one of these little ones [the young and children] who believe in me [Jesus], it would be better for you if a great millstone were fastened around your neck and you were drowned in the depth of the sea” (Mt. 18: 6; Mk. 9:42-48; Lk. 17: 1-2).
This claim is not even published in peer reviewed journals - it's pseudo archeology - fit for the Discovery Channel and nothing more. Sadly, the poorly educated maybe swayed by this.
The yearly recycle of 'dem bones' is getting old...literally.
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live." (John 11:25)
Magician used to recycle this article every year. I asked him how could they prove it's Jesus if they can't compare His DNA with any living relative. No response.
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live." (John 11:25)
They could compare the DNA to the DNA on the Shroud, or the DNA in the Lanciano Eucharistic miracle.
Have they run DNA tests on the Shroud? If so, what do they show?
потому что Бог хочет это тот путь
I think the blood is too old. They've blood typed it as Type AB.
From whqat little I read of this there was limited testing that was mostly inconclusive as there appeared to be significant contamination of the samples taken. The origin of the Shroud remains very much in doubt. Not even the Vatican claims it to be the image of Jesus.
потому что Бог хочет это тот путь
You may be interested in this paper.
потому что Бог хочет это тот путь
That, and every time a carrier replaced another in the Mediterranean he's post an article from Debka about the US increasing its naval force in region. One carrier would relieve another like clockwork, and like clockwork Magician would post "breaking news" about the "build up."
Yes the 7th fleet is quite predictable:)
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live." (John 11:25)
The Shroud is a particularly interesting and important object, the most studied object in archaeological history, in fact. That is not surprising, considering what is on it, and what it means if it's real. To me, who has experienced miracles, miracles are the most persuasive thing, so I seek them out and study them. The pattern of divine miracles is itself fascinating. I have discovered that most people, who haven't experienced miracles, prefer legalism, texts and institutions over direct theophanies. In fact, there's a whole branch of theology that has developed to deny the significance of miracles and even their existence since the time of Christ. That's utter nonsense, of course - there are plenty of them; I've experienced a great number of miracles, not to mention visions and other things. But you know even back in the day they beat prophets to death and cut their heads off, and burnt people as witches, and every other damned thing. Why? Because when God intervenes with miracles, all of the authorities lose control. Consider what it was like for the English, a victorious power in the mop-up session of a long war. Their enemy, defeated again and again, with nothing left but a handful of rural castles. Their coffers, full. Their army, large, well-trained, well led. And then all of a sudden a teenage girl comes off the farm with visions from God who KNOWS THINGS that nobody can know. She knows exactly where their weaknesses are, at point after point. And when she is present, suddenly the French fight like lions and the English are unmanned and melt like butter, like in the days of Gideon. The theretofore victorious English find themselves defeated sometimes at ridiculous odds. Everybody's heard of Agincourt. Shakepeare wrote a play about it. But the English never speak of Patay. For, after the siege of Orleans was lifted, a force of French knights, many times outnumbered, rode upon an English army of longbowmen. It was as before. Except that this time Joan was in the rear, and the French with a few knights charged into the arrows and destroyed a whole English army. It was Agincourt in reverse - but with the same cavalry charge into arrows, and this time it was the French who were hopelessly outnumbered. It was supernatural, impossible. And so the English screamed: WITCHCRAFT! And demonic possession! That's what it HAD to be, right? It couldn't be that God had taken sides and decided that, at the end of it all, France would win. THAT was not just unthinkable, but UNACCEPTABLE. God is NOT ALLOWED to take the enemy's side! When he does, it must be witchcraft. Or the devil. Nowadays, it must be insanity. People do not like miracles. They prove too much. They prove everything. All of a sudden you have to decide, and you can't "hedge" any more. And people would rather close their eyes than lose what they perceive is their margin of maneuver. After all, prove God, and think how much greater that makes the GUILT for everything. Think of how much BRAVER one must be in the face of adversaries. Think of how one must stand fast and face ridicule, and give up sins, and do all those things that can be disregarded now and then by disbelieving. When you KNOW, you CAN'T disbelieve, so you KNOW you're consciously choosing to sin, against a real God, who is watching. And that sucks. Also, belief forces political and economic changes that are painful…so painful that people, again, don't want to give up their margin of maneuver. No no, better that it all be left with a question mark over it than that the point be proven with exquisite miracle. Consider the case of Lourdes and the Incorrupt. Bodies don't rot, and their all Catholic saints. Grumble. MARY shows up and talks to a girl in the 1830s. She digs and a spring pops up, and incredible healings take place, and continue to. Hysteria! Placebo! The healings are real enough, but the CAUSE? Surely not supernatural….surely… no matter how many. Then the girl dies and is buried in a French grave. about 30 years later the tomb is opened, and there she is, sitting there, undecided. Her clothes have rotted off and the crucifix has rusted to verdigris, but her dead body is still supple, fresh, as though sleeping. OH COME ON! But there she is. Miracles, incorrupt…and MARY. That's the thing that is probably the worst. For we have God doing healings of the sort Jesus said Satan can't do, and we have an unrolled body of a Catholic nun, and we have this all at a spot where MARY showed up. MARY, the BANE of all non-Catholics. All of these wonderful hearings - too good to be true, but true…and how eagerly the world of Christians would love to believe. But then we've got this Catholic girl undecided…that starts to look like favoritism for the Church by God… and then it's a MARIAN site, MARY, triple underline and highlight in red. In other words, God gives great miracles, through Mary, and the Catholics are right about all of the theological points in contention…or right enough for God to have showered such favors, perhaps to prove the point, to show the One that is the True One. See why nobody who is not a Catholic wants to hear about Lourdes, or Incorrupt, or Mary, or anything? La- la-la-la I can't HEAR you. Because if one looks, one discovers that the true religion of Jesus is Catholicism, and that the Marian adoration that is the hallmark of everybody else's criticism of Catholicism is THE WAY that God shoved it in everybody's face, by choosing the ONE DOCTRINE that nobody but Catholics accept, and then hammering it home with thousands of miracles and undecayed bodies. That's why people don't like miracles: they win wars. And people on the other sides of various wars don't want to lose…even if it's to the truth about God. That's the issue with the Shroud. There is a vast compendium of science, and it's startling. But there's also bad science and just screeching naysaying that isn't even scientific. There were errors made, perhaps intentionally, during a 1980s carbon dating that was trumpeted from the rooftops as "proving" the Shroud a forgery. But then when the tests themselves were found to erroneous, and the Shroud was definitively dated to before much earlier, was there a cover of Time Magazine? Of course not. Because then the science is proving what people don't want proven. So they close their eyes. That's the way it is. I know it. The miracles I've seen are powerful, but I no longer bother to talk much about them. They were for me, not for others. They did their job. And I'm not keen on being a punching bag for fools.
What does have to do with the origin of the Shroud? True miracles are verifiable through physical evidence. There is virtually no physical evidence to support the claim that the Shroud is Christ's burial cloth, much less bears His image. The state of the art science of today cannot even verify that it 2000 years old. And without familial DNA reference points there is no-way to verify that what appears to be blood stains is actually the blood of Christ. The issue is not if miracles have occured or will again but what can be verified about the origin of the Shroud. If you feel that you are being punched by fools perhaps you should take stock of exactly is being discussed. You are certainly entitled to believe anything you wish about the Shroud. But without proof of its true nature you should be more circumspect in calling others fools for not believing as you.
потому что Бог хочет это тот путь
Yes there is. Yes it does. Yes it can. Could you see it? Sure. Will you? No. The scientific facts are subtle and layered. They have to be viewed carefully completely to let their full implications unfold. And you're simply too eager to smash everything to ever see such things, or to be taught them. There's a line in Wisdom, I think, that says "Don't cross the desert with a quarrelsome man." Good advice. I'm going to take it. Good luck on your travels.
Facts are stubborn things. - Ronald Reagan Especially when you don't have them on your side. Bon voyage!
потому что Бог хочет это тот путь
#2. To: Willie Green (#0)
#3. To: Willie Green (#0)
(Edited)
An Israeli geologist believes he has found the tomb of Jesus in Jerusalem, and this time, the tomb of his supposed son is buried along with him.
#4. To: A K A Stone, Willie Green (#1)
The first clue. Leftists aren't christians.
#5. To: A K A Stone (#1)
#6. To: Willie Green (#0)
#7. To: Vicomte13 (#2)
The other's a burial plot that could be anybody.
#8. To: redleghunter (#7)
I asked him how could they prove it's Jesus if they can't compare His DNA with any living relative. No response.
#9. To: Vicomte13 (#8)
They could compare the DNA to the DNA on the Shroud,
#10. To: SOSO (#9)
Have they run DNA tests on the Shroud? If so, what do they show?
#11. To: Vicomte13 (#10)
I think the blood is too old. They've blood typed it as Type AB.
#12. To: Vicomte13 (#10)
#13. To: redleghunter (#7)
Magician used to recycle this article every year.
#14. To: nativist nationalist (#13)
#15. To: SOSO (#11)
#16. To: Vicomte13 (#15)
The miracles I've seen are powerful, but I no longer bother to talk much about them. They were for me, not for others. They did their job. And I'm not keen on being a punching bag for fools.
#17. To: SOSO (#16)
There is virtually no physical evidence to support the claim that the Shroud is Christ's burial cloth, much less bears His image. The state of the art science of today cannot even verify that it 2000 years old.
#18. To: Vicomte13 (#17)
Good luck on your travels.
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