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Title: Should Christians Be Hospitable to Cult Members?
Source:
Grace to You
URL Source: http://www.gty.org/resources/bible- ... ble-to-cult-members?Term=cults
Published: Mar 11, 2015
Author: John MacArthur
Post Date: 2015-03-11 16:41:49 by redleghunter
Keywords: None
Views: 41167
Comments: 144
In verse 10 John sets out one practical application of how to defend the truth: If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house. Hospitality for traveling teachers was common in the culture (cf. Luke 9:1-6; 10:1-12). The prohibition here is not to turn away the ignorant; it does not mean that believers may not invite unbelievers—even those who belong to a cult or false religion—into their midst. That would make giving the truth to them difficult, if not impossible. The point is that believers are not to welcome and provide care for traveling false teachers, who seek to stay in their homes, thereby giving the appearance of affirming what they teach and lending them credibility John’s use of the conjunction ei (if) with an indicative verb indicates a condition that is likely true. Apparently, the lady to whom he wrote had for whatever reason, in the name of Christian fellowship, already welcomed false teachers into her home. It was just such compassionate, well-meaning people that the false teachers sought out (cf. 2 Tim. 3:6); since churches were supposed to be protected by elders who were skilled teachers of the Word (1 Tim. 3:2; Titus 1:9), they should have been less susceptible to the lies propagated by the deceivers. Having established themselves in homes, the false teachers hoped eventually to worm their way into the churches. It is much the same today, as false teaching insidiously invades Christian homes through television, radio, the Internet, and literature. So threatening are these emissaries of Satan that Jo[h]n went on to forbid even giving them a greeting; for the one who gives him a greeting participates in his evil deeds. Irenaeus relates that the church father Polycarp, when asked by the notorious heretic Marcion, “Do you know me?” replied, “I do know you—the firstborn of Satan” (Against Heresies, 3.3.4). John himself once encountered Cerinthus (another notorious heretic) in a public bathhouse in Ephesus. Instead of greeting him, however, John turned and fled, exclaiming to those with him, “Let us fly, lest even the bath-house fall down, because Cerinthus, the enemy of the truth, is within” (Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 3.3.4).
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#1. To: liberator, A K A Stone, GarySpFc, TooConservative, Don, BobCeleste, out damned spot (#0)
PING
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
The Amish and Mennonites never knock on my door.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
What about Quakers or Hare Krishna? Who is a cult?
Years ago, I had Jehovah's Witnesses come to my house, while my wife & I were carrying groceries in, while it was raining. They followed me up & down the stairs, back & forth from the front door to the car. I tried to be polite & cordial. But they would not leave. I told them we already belonged to a church. When they asked which one, I told them we were Jewish. They looked at me like I had told them I was satan, and left abruptly. I did this because of a story a State Trooper friend told me. he did the same thing, except he told them he was an atheist. The next day, got a call from Post to get home quick. When he got home, there were about 50 in his front yard, hold some kind of deal to save him. he had to threaten to take them all to jail to get them to leave, lol.
Si vis pacem, para bellum
Wow, pretty cultish.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
Oh you wanted a definition. A cult is a religious group (but do not have to be religious) that follows a particular theological system. From the view of Christianity a cult distorts the doctrines that affect salvation sufficiently to cause it to be unattainable. For example, it is an essential doctrine of Christianity that there is only one God (Isaiah 43:10; 44:6; 44:8; 45:5) and that believing in a false God brings judgment (Exodus 20:1-6). If a group were to affirm that there is more than one God (i.e., Mormonism), then it would violate an essential doctrine and be outside the Christian faith. Another essential would be that Jesus is God in flesh (John 1:1,14; Col. 2:9) and that to deny it means a person will die in his sins, John 8:24. The Jehovah's Witnesses deny Christ's deity and are, therefore, not Christian.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
Yikes.
Well without casting stones, the problem is that there's no consensus among the various mainstream Christian denominations as to what those doctrines are. Whenever you start discussing the differences between denominations, the battle lines are quickly drawn as to whose details are "true" and whose are heresy or apostasy.
I didn't know there were Amish were you lived, Southern Baptist yes, Amish no. :) Around me the Amish are only about 50 miles or so away.
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
What is your religion? That would be a cult. Any religion that denies christ is a cult.
When I was stationed in England I had them walk right in the side door without knocking or announcing their presence. Needless to say they didn't get a rousing welcome from me.
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
You do know he's a Leftard don't you?
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
I'm Roman Catholic. So what is your religion?
On three conditions. First that they are able articulate their faith, second that they prepare by getting familiar with the doctrine and errors of a particular cult. Third that they are ready to be charitable, respectful and humble.
Catholics pray to Mary. That is forbidden. They call the pope holy father. The Bible says not to do that. The Catholics took one of the commandments and threw it in trash. Then split another into two parts. There are Catholics that are saved. But it has a cult element to it.
So you're anti-Catholic... that doesn't surprise me at all.
The man did a fine job.
I'm not anti catholic. They just don't follow the Bible literally. Which is a problem. My religion is the Bible. Like King James for example.
Communists, Socialists, Progressives -- any belief system that views government employees as collectively smarter than everyone else is a cult.
It is also forbidden to pray out loud while making a spectacle of yourself in public. But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly. -- Mathew 6:6 PRAISE THE LORD PRAISE THE LORD, HALLELUJAH -- sinful...
Does that include prayer in church? Or just private prayer?
And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. -- Mathhew 6:5 It's pretty clear to me...
Question: "If Jesus condemned the Pharisees for praying out loud, should we pray aloud?" Answer: There are several references in the New Testament to public prayers that are unacceptable, and it is true that Jesus condemned the Pharisees’ manner of praying. But Jesus Himself prayed out loud on occasion (see John 17), as did the apostles (Acts 8:15; 16:25; 20:36). Acts 1:14 says, "They all joined together constantly in prayer, along with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brothers." Then in verse 24, the apostles prayed together to choose someone to fill Judas' spot among the twelve. They were clearly praying together and out loud. So, the sin was not in the public nature of the prayer or the fact that people could hear it. In Luke 18:10-14, Jesus gives this parable: “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people— robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’ But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’ I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.” Notice that the tax collector also prayed aloud, but his prayer was from a humble heart, and God accepted it. The sin of the Pharisees was not public prayer but a haughty spirit. Later, Jesus says, "Beware of the scribes, who like to walk around in long robes, and love greetings in the marketplaces and the best seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at feasts, who devour widows’ houses and for a pretense make long prayers. They will receive the greater condemnation" (Luke 20:46-47). Here the sin is not the audible nature of the prayer but its pretentiousness. Jesus condemns the hypocrisy of pretending to have a relationship with God while oppressing the very people He loves. Then in Matthew 6:5, Jesus says, "And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full." Again, Jesus is not condemning the fact that people prayed aloud, but that they were putting on a public display for their own benefit. Their motive—to be seen of men—was the problem. Such prayer is not real prayer, but empty words meant for the ears of other people (Hebrews 10:22). Proverbs 15:29 says, "The LORD is far from the wicked but he hears the prayer of the righteous." In Ephesians 5:20, Paul instructs the church to "give thanks always and for everything to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ." Communal prayer is one way a local church worships God and encourages one another. What Jesus condemns is arrogance and hypocrisy. For someone who is clearly disobedient to God to lead a public prayer as though he or she had much to brag about is the kind of hypocrisy that Jesus denounced. To use public prayer as a means of showing off or impressing others is wrong. But sincere prayer from a humble heart is always welcomed by God and can be an encouragement to those who hear it (Psalm 51:17). Read more: www.gotquestions.org/pray...t- loud.html#ixzz3U7fPa3lI
There are Christian cults that don't deny Christ. Most of the ancient heresies that pop up again and again are connected with whether Christ had one body or two or one spirit or two. A lot of mischief arose over the roles of the Persons of the Trinity in relation to each other. This is a nice page at ChurchHistory101.com that briefly describes the major ancient heresies. They make a short mention of Marcion. He became a teacher and produced the first major version of the bible that was widely available. It consisted only of Paul's epistles and the book of Luke. And no mentions of hell at all. It proved so popular at the time that it actually led to the church establishment of the era to adopt the canon of scripture we still use today following the list first circulated by Athanasius, a hero of the fight against Arianism heresy. (Arianism insisted that Christ was not eternal but was created by the Father.) Anyway, this is how we got the bibles we have because the bishops finally realized that someone had to produce an official recognized canon of books. Lots of heretical books were floating around at the time, phony religious texts like the Gospel of Judas and hundreds of others. Gary is a real expert at this stuff, has really impressive resources. It often surprises me that people don't find this stuff as fascinating as I do but I guess it's pretty ancient news so it's considered dull. Yet, these same heresies pop up century after century in one form or another.
Following the Bible literally is itself problematic and misleading if passages are interpreted out of context. Song of Soloman 4:1~2 (KJV): Hair like a flock of goats?
As Jesus clearly stated in Mathhew 6, people who pray in public are mostly showing off to impress others. Sincere prayer comes from deep private and personal reflection that leads to repentance. Screaming PRAISE THE LORD in a room full people at a mega-church with a slicked back preacher and a rock band is a modern version of the hypocrits that Jesus condemned.
John Gill offers this commentary. You really should understand that there is no taking literally any work of ancient poetry, especially translated from another ancient language. If you read poetic works literally, you've kinda missed the point from the get-go. "leading to water early in the morning;" the Vulgate Latin version is, "that ascend from Mount Gilead", from a lower to a higher part of it; which is approved of by Bochart (u). Translation: even in ancient times, blondes had more fun. that are even shorn; on which no wool is left, sticking out here and there; which is another good property of teeth, that are of equal size and bigness, do not stand out, nor rise up one above another; and are as if they had been "cut and planed, and made alike" (y), as some render the word: which may denote the equality of Gospel ministers in power and authority; one having no superiority over another; all having the same mission and commission, employed in the same work, preaching the same Gospel; and though their gifts are different, yet there is a harmony and agreement in the doctrines they preach; which came up from the washing; white and clean, which is another property of good teeth; as the teeth of sheep be, and they themselves are, when just come up out of the washing pit: this may signify the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost, which are necessary to ministers of the word, in order to preach it; and more especially the purity of their lives and conversations, in which they should be examples to the flock; whereof everyone bear twins, and none is barren among them; the figures are just and beautiful; it is common with sheep to bear twins, or more, in the eastern countries, as the philosopher observes (z); frequent mention is made of goats bearing twins (a): these may answer to the two rows of teeth, and the word for "teeth" is in the dual number; and when these are white and clean, and equal, are well set, and not one wanting, none rotten, nor shed, nor fallen out, look very beautiful. Translation: chicks with white, even, clean teeth and no missing teeth are totally hot. Poetry is most often a series of word-pictures, used to evoke feelings, to cast words in a visual sense (instead of mere dry description). Poetry goes beyond works of persuasion or rote knowledge or logic or storytelling narratives. BTW, I'm not a big fan of poetry at all. I like the KJV for this passage because the translation shows italics wherever the translators inserted words that are not literal, to make it read better in English. But some passages in the bible actually read better in the KJV and this is an example of that. Read it, omitting the italics. It does read rather poetically. To me, the KJV is far more desirable in some passages of scripture. It conveys somewhat better the sense of the language. The translators had considerable literary talents they brought to bear on their translation.
Yes you do. The verses you mentioned are obviously not talking about teeth being a flock of sheep. The meaning is clear. I'm talking about people who don't take Genesis literally for example. Like probably you.
Sincere prayer comes from deep private and personal reflection that leads to repentance. Here is an example of Jesus praying out loud. So you are wrong. These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. 3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. 4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. 6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word. 7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee. 8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me. 9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine. 10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them. 11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. 13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. 15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil. 16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. 18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth. 20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; 21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. 24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world. 25 O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me. 26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Oh I certainly agree... nor would I expect them to grasp Carl Sagan's Cosmos & the Big Bang Theory and the billions of years that it actually took God to create the Universe...
I am most curious what you base that nonsense of billions of years on. Can you explain it or is it something that was spoon fed to you and you never questioned it? The decisions you have made in life have led you to where you are at today. If you had believed the good book and not discounted its teachings you wouldn't be a leftist today. Modify your beliefs. You will then make different decisions. Which will lead you out of the fog that leftists are invariably in.
Jesus is the Son of God who died on the cross to pay for our sins. He was spreading his message of repentance and forgiveness. It's fine and dandy to teach people of Jesus. In fact, we are commanded to do so. But true prayer is not public. It's private and personal between you and God. Yelling PRAISE THE LORD means nothing. It's just showing off to the people in your community.
Yeah, well I'm not very evangelical about it, so I'm not gonna try to convert you to my beliefs, just as I doubt that you'll make much headway trying to convert me...
Yeah it is hard to change someones deeply held long term beliefs. I believe if you took another look with an open mind. If possible. You could change your mind about billions of years.
Sure there are Willie. I just gave you the Scriptural principles held by all Christians. If they don't meet the criteria stated and claim they are Christian then that group is a cult. Now different denominations may claim others are in error, but won't kick them out the door or deny fellowship.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
Yes he did.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
It's pretty clear to me... So they are faux Christians in your view?
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
Yes the big three heresies we see today with regards to the Nature of God are a form of Arianism with the JWs, Oneness and even a modern tritheism.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
Well yes in Scriptures there is the use of metaphorical language. Interpreting according to the grammatical, literal historical method is how the apostles approached interpreting Scriptures. When we do see metaphor used in Scriptures they are usually direct metaphors. That is "A" is like "B". For example Jesus saying He was the bread of life. We know Jesus did not mean He was a loaf of bread. The Living Water. We know Jesus is not literally a well full of water we physically drink. I am the door. Jesus is not a wooden door. These were direct metaphors used to teach a spiritual truth.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." (1 Peter 1:23)
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#2. To: redleghunter (#0)
So who are you calling a cult?
Mormons?
Scientologists?
Branch Davidians?
Jehovah Witnesses?
Amish or Mennonites?
#3. To: Willie Green (#2)
Amish or Mennonites?
#4. To: redleghunter (#3)
(Edited)
The Amish and Mennonites never knock on my door.
Christian Scientists, Salvation Army, Rosicrucians, Unitarians or Wiccans?
#5. To: redleghunter (#3)
" The Amish and Mennonites never knock on my door. "
#6. To: Stoner (#5)
When he got home, there were about 50 in his front yard, hold some kind of deal to save him. he had to threaten to take them all to jail to get them to leave, lol.
#7. To: Willie Green (#4)
(Edited)
#8. To: Stoner (#5)
#9. To: redleghunter (#7)
From the view of Christianity a cult distorts the doctrines that affect salvation sufficiently to cause it to be unattainable.
#10. To: redleghunter (#3)
#11. To: Willie Green (#4)
(Edited)
Who is a cult?
#12. To: Stoner (#5)
Years ago, I had Jehovah's Witnesses come to my house, while my wife & I were carrying groceries in, while it was raining.
#13. To: A K A Stone (#11)
What is your religion? That would be a cult. Any religion that denies christ is a cult.
#14. To: A K A Stone (#11)
(Edited)
What is your religion? That would be a cult. Any religion that denies christ is a cult.
We usually capitalize the "c" in Christ, to indicate that we recognize that He is the Lord our God & Savior.
If I'm not mistaken, that is common practice in protestant denominations also.
Is it a cult?
#15. To: redleghunter (#1)
#16. To: Willie Green (#14)
#17. To: A K A Stone (#16)
But you didn't answer my question: what is your religion? Is it a cult?
#18. To: redleghunter (#1)
#19. To: Willie Green (#17)
So you're anti-Catholic... that doesn't surprise me at all. But you didn't answer my question: what is your religion? Is it a cult?
#20. To: Willie Green (#4)
(Edited)
Who is a cult?
#21. To: A K A Stone (#16)
Catholics pray to Mary. That is forbidden.
#22. To: cranko (#21)
But thou, when thou prayest
#23. To: A K A Stone (#22)
Does that include prayer in church? Or just private prayer?
#24. To: cranko (#23)
#25. To: A K A Stone, GarySpFc (#11)
Any religion that denies christ is a cult.
#26. To: A K A Stone (#19)
They just don't follow the Bible literally. Which is a problem.
1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
2 Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them.
Teeth like a flock of sheep?
No, no, no, no, no.... we do not take every word of the Bible literally. It must be read in it's proper context to be understood. The nomadic tribes of the Middle East were very simple people 3 to 5 thousand years ago. The Lord revealed His Word to them in ways that THEY could understand, so we need to strive to understand the way that THEY would understand it, not the way that WE would take it literally.
#27. To: A K A Stone (#24)
(Edited)
To use public prayer as a means of showing off or impressing others is wrong.
#28. To: Willie Green, A K A Stone, redleghunter (#26)
Hair like a flock of goats? Teeth like a flock of sheep? No, no, no, no, no.... we do not take every word of the Bible literally.
thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
that appear from Mount Gilead; or rather "on Mount Gilead", as Noldius: Gilead was a mountain in the land of Israel, beyond Jordan, famous for pasturage for cattle, where flocks of goats were fed, as was usual on mountains (s); and, being well fed, their hair was long, smooth, neat, and glistering; and so to spectators, at a distance, looked very beautiful and lovely; especially in the morning at sun rising, and, glancing on them with its bright and glittering rays, were delightful. So R. Jonah, from the use of the word in the Arabic language, which signifies the morning, interprets it, which "rise early in the morning"; and which, as Schultens (t) observes, some render, Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them.
Son 4:2 - Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep,.... That is, like the teeth of a flock of sheep; as her eyes were like the eyes of doves, and her hair like the hair of goats: and Galen long ago observed, that human teeth are much like the teeth of sheep, in figure, order, and structure, as well as are small and white; neatly set, innocent and harmless, not ravenous and voracious, cropping herbs and grass only (w); the whiteness of the teeth is chiefly intended, in which the beauty of them lies, for which they are sometimes compared (x) to Parian marble for whiteness. The Targum interprets these teeth of the priests and Levites; but it is much better to understand them of the ministers of the Gospel: teeth are bony, solid, firm, and strong, sharp to cut and break the food, and prepare it for the stomach: all which well agree with ministers; who are strong in the Lord, and in his grace, to labour in the word and doctrine; to oppose gainsayers, withstand Satan's temptations; bear the reproaches of the world, and the infirmities of weaker saints; and remain firm and unmoved in their ministry; unshaken by all they meet with, from without and from within: they are sharp to rebuke such who are unsound in the faith, or corrupt in their morals, and to penetrate into Gospel truths; to cut and rightly divide the word of truth, and break the bread of life to others, and so chew and prepare spiritual food for souls; not raw and crude; not hard and difficult of digestion, but plain and easy to be understood. And they are like to a flock of sheep,
Look, Willie, it's a translation of ancient tribal Hebrew poetry. Much as you find this passage obscure, these ancient Jews would not really grasp the poetic allusions and devices in Shakespeare's work any more readily. Son 4:1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
Son 4:2 Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them.
#29. To: Willie Green (#26)
No, no, no, no, no.... we do not take every word of the Bible literally.
#30. To: cranko (#27)
As Jesus clearly stated in Mathhew 6, people who pray in public are mostly showing off to impress others.
#31. To: TooConservative (#28)
Look, Willie, it's a translation of ancient tribal Hebrew poetry. Much as you find this passage obscure, these ancient Jews would not really grasp the poetic allusions and devices in Shakespeare's work any more readily.
But that's why we don't read Genesis literally... the ancient Jews were simple people, and God explained Creation to them in terms that they could understand.
#32. To: Willie Green (#31)
Theory and the billions of years that it actually took God to create the Universe...
#33. To: A K A Stone (#30)
Here is an example of Jesus praying out loud. So you are wrong.
#34. To: A K A Stone (#29)
I'm talking about people who don't take Genesis literally for example. Like probably you.
So that's why I seldom discuss this topic and try to stick to more secular issues: energy, transportation, education, economy, etc. etc.
#35. To: Willie Green (#34)
Yeah, well I'm not very evangelical about it, so I'm not gonna try to convert you to my beliefs, just as I doubt that you'll make much headway trying to convert me... So that's why I seldom discuss this topic and try to stick to more secular issues: energy, transportation, education, economy, etc. etc.
#36. To: Willie Green (#9)
Well without casting stones, the problem is that there's no consensus among the various mainstream Christian denominations as to what those doctrines are.
#37. To: Don (#18)
#38. To: cranko (#23)
And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. -- Mathhew 6:5
#39. To: TooConservative (#25)
Yet, these same heresies pop up century after century in one form or another.
#40. To: Willie Green, A K A Stone (#26)
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