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Title: If Congress does not immediately impeach and remove obama
Source: [None]
URL Source: [None]
Published: Feb 19, 2015
Author: Bob Celeste for
Post Date: 2015-02-19 11:06:38 by BobCeleste
Keywords: None
Views: 15144
Comments: 56

If Congress does not immediately impeach and remove obama, we, the people, should immediately impeach and remove Congress.

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bonds which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed.

But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Such has been the patient sufferance of these states; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the US congress, administration, and courts is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States.

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#1. To: All (#0)

To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

Shall we list the facts fellow LibertysFlamers?

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-19   11:08:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: BobCeleste (#0)

If Congress does not immediately impeach and remove 0bama, we, the people, should immediately impeach and remove Congress.

I agree....

But if Congress and the GOP, led by Mitch (Mr. Ovaries) McConnell, won't even censure Der Fuehrer, how will they impeach and remove him? Then evict themselves for malfeasance and treason?

We have one filthy hand washing the other here.

Liberator  posted on  2015-02-19   11:43:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: BobCeleste (#0)

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

Too bad the above statements either don't apply, aren't in effect, aren't even believed.

There IS no "consent of the governed." Tyranny and despotism has been endorsed by Congress. The USCON is just a "piece of paper," a "living breathing document." The People seem to be blinking. More than ever.

Liberator  posted on  2015-02-19   11:51:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: BobCeleste (#0)

Elections have consequences.

Most states lack statutory authority to recall a member of Congress for anything other than outright criminality. The House or the Senate might refuse to seat an elected member in their chamber (if you elected a David Duke type for instance) but that does not recall or impeach the rejected member; it just leaves the state/district unrepresented until the situation is corrected.

You have a lot of state laws to rewrite before you can impeach Congress.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-19   11:56:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: TooConservative (#4)

Elections have consequences.*

*unless conservatives win. Then elections can be ignored

Rufus T Firefly  posted on  2015-02-19   12:28:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Rufus T Firefly (#5)

*unless conservatives win.

Please define what you mean by "conservatives" for to the best of my knowledge there are none, if you define them as men who are ruled by the US Constitution, as it is written.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-19   13:36:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Rufus T Firefly (#5)

Elections have consequences.*

*unless conservatives win. Then elections can be ignored

Excellent post.

nativist nationalist  posted on  2015-02-19   13:36:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: BobCeleste (#6)

Please define what you mean by "conservatives" for to the best of my knowledge there are none, if you define them as men who are ruled by the US Constitution, as it is written.

Conservative to me means what you say - and they are extremely rare in DC and in gov't in general. Almost as extinct as the Dodo bird.

They do seem to greatly increase in numbers BEFORE elections however.

(And then go back to hiding under rocks AFTER)

Rufus T Firefly  posted on  2015-02-19   15:02:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Rufus T Firefly (#8)

Conservative to me means what you say - and they are extremely rare in DC and in gov't in general. Almost as extinct as the Dodo bird.

They do seem to greatly increase in numbers BEFORE elections however.

Yup, they know what we want to hear, what we are desperate for, but they, as it turns out, are all liars.

A man sat in my living room talking to a select group of Christians, this man made certain promises, if we supported him, one of the promises was that he would always take my calls on his cell, he got elected, he lied.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-19   17:03:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: BobCeleste (#0)

If Congress does not immediately impeach and remove obama, we, the people, should immediately impeach and remove Congress.

We can hold a revolution but neither the states nor the people can impeach or remove a congressman or senator. Only the members can throw out one of their own.

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-19   21:35:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Rufus T Firefly (#5)

*unless conservatives win. Then elections can be ignored

Regardless of who gets elected, you can't impeach or recall Congress if you don't have legal procedure in the states. Otherwise, you're just being lawless and seditious.

I don't think you can impeach a member of Congress, let alone the entire Congress. No laws support it.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-20   6:15:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: nolu chan (#10)

Only the members can throw out one of their own.

Even if they refuse to seat a legally elected congressman or senator (for criminality or morals), that person is still the legal congressional representative of his district or the senator of his state. You cannot, for instance, just replace them by a special election or by appointing a replacement. They have to resign from office first. Some states do have statutes to support declaring the office vacant if they're convicted of a major crime but it rarely comes to that. The party always pressures them heavily to resign first.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-20   6:19:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: BobCeleste (#0)

If Congress does not immediately impeach Obama…then they will be acting just like the GOP we've all come to know so well.

Vicomte13  posted on  2015-02-20   6:38:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: nolu chan (#10)

We can hold a revolution but neither the states nor the people can impeach or remove a congressman or senator.

That is very true.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-20   12:01:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Vicomte13 (#13)

If Congress does not immediately impeach Obama…then they will be acting just like the GOP we've all come to know so well.

How very, very true.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-20   12:01:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: BobCeleste (#15)

How very, very true.

You mentioned some Republican elected official who sat in a private meeting with you and other Christian leaders and promised you cell phone access, but who then did not give it.

You should out him by name. There is no reason to protect politicians who lie to you. He made a promise to induce voting on the part of a voting bloc. You were a leader of part of that bloc, and based on his blandishments, you encouraged others to vote for him.

He welched.

You should embarrass him by naming him, to warn everybody else - Christian or otherwise - about a PROVEN liar.

Vicomte13  posted on  2015-02-20   12:46:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: TooConservative (#12)

Even if they refuse to seat a legally elected congressman or senator (for criminality or morals), that person is still the legal congressional representative of his district or the senator of his state. You cannot, for instance, just replace them by a special election or by appointing a replacement. They have to resign from office first.

The elected congressman or senator is not the legal rep until he takes the oath. Once s/he is a member, s/he can be expelled.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articlei#section5

Article I, Section 5, clause 2

Each House may determine the rules of its proceedings, punish its members for disorderly behavior, and, with the concurrence of two thirds, expel a member.

https://www.senate.gov/CRSReports/crs-publish.cfm?pid='0E%2C*PL%5B%3A%230%20%20%0A

Congressional Research Service

Recall of Legislators and the Removal of Members of Congress from Office

Jack Maskell Legislative Attorney January 5, 2012

[excerpt from introductory summary]

Under Article I, Section 5, clause 2, of the Constitution, a Member of Congress may be removed from office before the normal expiration of his or her constitutional term by an “expulsion” from the Senate (if a Senator) or from the House of Representatives (if a Representative) upon a formal vote on a resolution agreed to by two-thirds of the Members of that body present and voting.

At page 1:

This report discusses the manner in which a Member of Congress may be removed from office by “expulsion,” and then examines the issue of “recall” of legislators.

The term of office established in the United States Constitution for a United States Senator is six years, and for a Representative in Congress, two years. Under the Constitution and congressional practice, Members of Congress may have their services ended prior to the normal expiration of their constitutional terms of office by their resignation, death, or by action of the house of Congress in which they sit by way of an expulsion, or by a finding that a subsequent public office accepted by a Member is “incompatible” with congressional office and that the Member has consequently vacated his seat in Congress. As noted in the rules and manual of the House of Representatives with respect to the way in which vacancies may be brought about: “Vacancies are caused by death, resignation, declination, withdrawal, or action of the House in declaring a vacancy as existing or causing one by expulsion.”

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-21   0:33:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: BobCeleste (#1) (Edited)

Time for governors to ban together and take control back from the US military of the State citizens currently taken from "National Guards" and put into the US full time military. Bring em home, and enforce the sovereignty of the States. I never understood how they took NG servicemen and made them serve overseas for extended tours in undeclared wars. Don't the States have any say over the men and women "pressed" into service when they should be at the beck, call and need of the local and State?

jeremiad  posted on  2015-02-21   2:48:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: jeremiad (#18)

I never understood how they took NG servicemen and made them serve overseas for extended tours in undeclared wars.

They are expendable.

Don't the States have any say over the men and women "pressed" into service when they should be at the beck, call and need of the local and State?

No.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-21   3:34:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Pridie.Nones (#19)

I recall the militia of Tennessee being convinced to enlist in a war against the enemy. The Tennessee brigade decided it was time to go home and they did, led by a man named Crockett. He asserted their right to join the fight, or leave the fight, and won. The NG people were recruited to a specific role. Training to be a back-up, weekend warriors and troops in case of war. There has been no declaration of war, and many of them have served years in oversea police action, or even rebuilding infrastructure in destroyed countries. They did not sign up for this duty, and I don't understand how and where the US President got the power to take them from the control of the State without a declaration of war and orders by Congress.

jeremiad  posted on  2015-02-21   11:35:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: BobCeleste (#1)

"Shall we list the facts fellow LibertysFlamers?"

Fact #1: We don't have the votes.

Fact #2: Well, if we don't have the votes, why go on?

misterwhite  posted on  2015-02-21   11:51:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: jeremiad (#18)

Don't the States have any say over the men and women "pressed" into service when they should be at the beck, call and need of the local and State?

Does a cowardly imbecile have any say in the running of the insylm?

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-21   12:53:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: misterwhite (#21)

act #1: We don't have the votes.

Fact #2: Well, if we don't have the votes, why go on?

no more than 17% ever openly supported the US Revolution.

We don't need votes, the voting booth is a joke, it worse than a joke, what we need is Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-21   12:55:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: BobCeleste (#23)

"We don't need votes ..."

Really. So the other side doesn't have a say.

Nice country you're running here. No different than some third-world hellhole -- the 30% with guns dictates to the 70% without?

Cool. If your side has the guns.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-02-21   13:34:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: misterwhite (#24)

What I said was "We don't need votes, the voting booth is a joke, it worse than a joke, what we need is Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty."

I'm guessing you'll be part of the 83% along with the rest of the democrats, rinos, and freedom haters.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-21   18:04:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: jeremiad (#20)

There has been no declaration of war, and many of them have served years in oversea police action, or even rebuilding infrastructure in destroyed countries. They did not sign up for this duty, and I don't understand how and where the US President got the power to take them from the control of the State without a declaration of war and orders by Congress.

Following WW2, the Congress literally gave away its authority for authorizing a war (any act of agression for foreign intrigue) to the POTUS. It is now written into each law and largely executed by the POTUS as he sees fit; there are no more declarations of war at all and/or any conditions restraining the POTUS other than a minor detail of money. So far, Congress has consistently approved ALL WARS of US hostility for (quite literally) infinite periods of time as the POTUS sees fit.

You might ask "why has Congress usurped its own US Constitutional authority?" One anser is WW2 changed the nature of the world and because of the rise of magnificent dominence of America after WW2, the social/cultural restraints of and about the US Constitutional authority was replaced with global euphoria. WW2 changed America and the world forever. And US Constitutional authority as was originally written and intended is a mere history record.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-21   22:39:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: jeremiad, BobCeleste (#18)

Time for governors to ban together and take control back from the US military of the State citizens currently taken from "National Guards" and put into the US full time military.

They should be the State Militia. Their original purpose was to protect states against a usurping Federal government.

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-21   23:58:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: BobCeleste, jeremiad (#22)

Does a cowardly imbecile have any say in the running of the insylm?

That sounds like a description of Washington.

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-22   0:00:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: nolu chan (#27)

From my slight understanding of the Constitution, each State could fund and raise a citizen militia, train and outfit them to be controlled only by the State. They could be pressed into service, but only for a specific length of time on a "loan" to the Federal troops, but under State command. Every move militarily the US has made in nearly a century has been to place US troops under multi-national jurisdictional command. . . . IMHO.

jeremiad  posted on  2015-02-22   3:34:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: BobCeleste (#23)

We don't need votes, the voting booth is a joke, it worse than a joke, what we need is Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty.

"...Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty...."

Ok - you go first - what are YOU going to do to "...water the tree of Liberty..."

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-22   7:58:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: BobCeleste (#25)

Right. You didn't mean violence. When you said "Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty", you literally meant watering a tree somewhere.

What a weasel.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-02-23   9:49:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: nolu chan (#28)

It is.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   11:08:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: Jameson (#30)

Ok - you go first - what are YOU going to do to "...water the tree of Liberty..."

Very good agent provocateur, you govt slugs have never been able to get proof enough to make an arrest so you try to bait me here.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   11:10:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: misterwhite (#31)

Right. You didn't mean violence. When you said "Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty", you literally meant watering a tree somewhere.

What a weasel.

No, I mean watering the Tree of Liberty with the blood of Patriots and tyrants.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   11:11:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: BobCeleste (#34)

"No, I mean watering the Tree of Liberty with the blood of Patriots and tyrants."

Right. Which was why I said, "So the other side doesn't have a say."

Meaning you're no different than some third-world hellhole -- the 30% with guns dictates to the 70% without.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-02-23   11:26:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: misterwhite says USA - 'No different than some third-world hellhole' (#24)

---- no more than 17% ever openly supported the US Revolution. ---- We don't need votes, the voting booth is a joke, it worse than a joke, what we need is Patriots willing to water the tree of Liberty. ---- BobCeleste

misterwhite --- Really. So the other side doesn't have a say.

Nice country you're running here. No different than some third-world hellhole -- the 30% with guns dictates to the 70% without?

Cool. If your side has the guns.

Gotta love that exchange, because misterwhite admits which 'side' hes really on..

The anti-gun side.... That thinks the USA is --- "No different than some third- world hellhole".

Well done Bob....

tpaine  posted on  2015-02-23   11:44:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: BobCeleste (#33)

you govt slugs have never been able to get proof enough to make an arrest so you try to bait me here.

HAHAHAHAHA!

Don't try to include me in your fantasy...

But seriously....armed revolution was improbable - but possible in the 18th century.........

It is impossible in the USA today.

So........just what do you suggest???

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   12:11:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Jameson, BobCeleste (#37)

To: BobCeleste

you govt slugs have never been able to get proof enough to make an arrest so you try to bait me here.

HAHAHAHAHA!

Don't try to include me in your fantasy...

But seriously....armed revolution was improbable - but possible in the 18th century.........

It is impossible in the USA today.

So........just what do you suggest???

I'm not "suggesting" this . . . but this is what may happen

1. Collapse

2. Anarchy

3. Google takes over

Rufus T Firefly  posted on  2015-02-23   12:16:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Rufus T Firefly (#38)

I'm not "suggesting" this . . . but this is what may happen

1. Collapse

2. Anarchy

3. Google takes over

What do mean by "collapse"? If you mean economic collapse... I don't think that would be allowed to happen. Far too many "elites" depend on the economic activity of the USA...

Anarchy - See above

Google takes over - I'm pretty sure this already happened.....

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   12:20:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: misterwhite (#35)

Nothing stopping you from getting a gun and fighting against freedom and for the masters of the oligarchy.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   12:40:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Jameson (#37)

It is impossible in the USA today.

really? Your crystal ball contradicts the teachings of the Bible.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   12:41:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: Rufus T Firefly (#38)

I'm not "suggesting" this . . . but this is what may happen

1. Collapse

2. Anarchy

3. Google takes over

Two out of three aint bad.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   12:45:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: BobCeleste (#41)

It is impossible in the USA today.

I'll stand by my opinion.

And while I'm no bible scholar.... I am skeptical that the bible predicts an armed revolution in the USA in the 21st century.

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   12:51:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: Jameson (#43)

Read Matthew 24.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   13:08:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: BobCeleste (#44)

Read Matthew 24.

Yeah, sorry Bob, No mention of a 21st century armed revolt, uprising, or revolution.

The defense department and the intelligence community have spent trillions on deadly technology that makes hunting down "evil doers" half a world away seem like a video game. Our police departments have been militarized and DHS has the ability to rapidly respond to just about any "crisis" in hours.

Jefferson's words just don't apply in 2015.

But good luck!

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   13:27:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: Jameson (#39)

1. Collapse

What do mean by "collapse"? If you mean economic collapse... I don't think that would be allowed to happen. Far too many "elites" depend on the economic activity of the USA...

Any collapse would only be felt by the peons.

The Ruling Class (i.e. elites) are World Citizens, doncha' know.

Rufus T Firefly  posted on  2015-02-23   14:00:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Rufus T Firefly (#46)

If you mean economic collapse... I don't think that would be allowed to happen.

Any collapse would only be felt by the peons.

The financial meltdown of 2008 would have been catastrophic had it not been for drastic actions by the FED....

The middle class and poor took the brunt of the beatings and the elites came away no worse for wear, and ultimately recovered nicely.

Common sense suggests that they would like for that sort of "crisis" to never happen again....prolonged prosperity is a far better option.

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   14:10:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: jeremiad (#29)

From my slight understanding of the Constitution, each State could fund and raise a citizen militia, train and outfit them to be controlled only by the State. They could be pressed into service, but only for a specific length of time on a "loan" to the Federal troops, but under State command. Every move militarily the US has made in nearly a century has been to place US troops under multi-national jurisdictional command. . . . IMHO.

http://law.justia.com/codes/us/2012/title-32/chapter-1/section-109/

ORGANIZATION - 32 U.S.C. § 109 (2012)

§109. Maintenance of other troops

(a) In time of peace, a State, the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, the District of Columbia, Guam, or the Virgin Islands may maintain no troops other than those of its National Guard and defense forces authorized by subsection (c).

(b) Nothing in this title limits the right of a State, the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, the District of Columbia, Guam, or the Virgin Islands to use its National Guard or its defense forces authorized by subsection (c) within its borders in time of peace, or prevents it from organizing and maintaining police or constabulary.

(c) In addition to its National Guard, if any, a State, the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, the District of Columbia, Guam, or the Virgin Islands may, as provided by its laws, organize and maintain defense forces. A defense force established under this section may be used within the jurisdiction concerned, as its chief executive (or commanding general in the case of the District of Columbia) considers necessary, but it may not be called, ordered, or drafted into the armed forces.

(d) A member of a defense force established under subsection (c) is not, because of that membership, exempt from service in the armed forces, nor is he entitled to pay, allowances, subsistence, transportation, or medical care or treatment, from funds of the United States.

(e) A person may not become a member of a defense force established under subsection (c) if he is a member of a reserve component of the armed forces.

(Aug. 10, 1956, ch. 1041, 70A Stat. 600; Pub. L. 85–861, §2(2), Sept. 2, 1958, 72 Stat. 1542; Pub. L. 100–456, div. A, title XII, §1234(b)(1), Sept. 29, 1988, 102 Stat. 2059; Pub. L. 109–163, div. A, title X, §1057(b)(3), Jan. 6, 2006, 119 Stat. 3441; Pub. L. 111–383, div. A, title X, §1075(h)(4)(B), Jan. 7, 2011, 124 Stat. 4377.)

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-23   14:19:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: Jameson (#45)

Read Matthew 24.

Yeah, sorry Bob, No mention of a 21st century armed revolt, uprising, or revolution.

You are really new at reading the Bible aren't you.

BobCeleste  posted on  2015-02-23   14:44:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: BobCeleste (#49) (Edited)

You are really new at reading the Bible aren't you.

Our disagreement has nothing to do with me.

Likewise the story you referenced has nothing to do with "watering the tree of liberty with blood" which is the topic of our discussion.

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   14:51:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: Jameson, BobCeleste (#37)

But seriously....armed revolution was improbable - but possible in the 18th century.........

It is impossible in the USA today.

Very difficult and unlikely, but not impossible in the future. The conditions for it are not there today, but could arise in the future.

Needed is a breakdown in control of the military. An element of the military would need to be part of the revolution. A state, or group of states, with control of any nuclear missile facility could secede or revolt.

The military power that prevents an outside armed revolution can execute a revolution.

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-23   15:10:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: nolu chan (#51)

Very difficult and unlikely, but not impossible in the future.

Perhaps impossible is an overstatement.

Needed is a breakdown in control of the military. An element of the military would need to be part of the revolution. A state, or group of states, with control of any nuclear missile facility could secede or revolt.

This point is conceded - however this unlikely scenario has always been present.

Lacking the irrational fanaticism of the likes of ISIS....this will never happen.

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   15:49:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: Jameson (#45)

The defense department and the intelligence community have spent trillions on deadly technology that makes hunting down "evil doers" half a world away seem like a video game. Our police departments have been militarized and DHS has the ability to rapidly respond to just about any "crisis" in hours.

And all this technology depends on an operating power grid. The grid is our most vulnerable point, and a manmade EMT bomb, or a Carrington event, could create a crisis for months, or even years.

Millions would die...

tpaine  posted on  2015-02-23   15:52:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: tpaine (#53)

a manmade EMT bomb, or a Carrington event, could create a crisis for months, or even years.

Yes.......

Also the zombie apocalypse or attack by space aliens would likewise create a crisis!

"You're telling me there's a chance?" - Lloyd Christmas :-]

"we are tartets from evil doers!!!" [ and ] U looked up birfer on the dcitionary. It isn't a movie.

Jameson  posted on  2015-02-23   16:08:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: Jameson (#54)

Yes....... Also the zombie apocalypse or attack by space aliens would likewise create a crisis! ---- "You're telling me there's a chance?" - Lloyd Christmas :-]

To quote a rather silly poster: --

"This point is conceded - however this unlikely scenario has always been present."

tpaine  posted on  2015-02-23   16:31:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: tpaine, Jameson (#53)

[tpaine #53] And all this technology depends on an operating power grid. The grid is our most vulnerable point, and a manmade EMT bomb, or a Carrington event, could create a crisis for months, or even years.

An eruption of the Yellowstone Caldera or Supervolcano could have the potential to cause civil breakdown. The last time it went off, it spewed "approximately 240 cubic miles (1,000 km3) of rock, dust and volcanic ash into the sky." The sky could be something like downtown Manhattan on 9/11, but worse and over a huge geographic area. The lack of sunlight and falling ash could wipe out vegetation. The waterways would be trashed. Wildlife would perish. Feed domestic livestock would run out. Animals breathing the ash would wreck their lungs.

A complete economic meltdown of the dollar is also possible. How long can the Federal government wildly spend borrowed money until something gives?

[Jameson #45] The defense department and the intelligence community have spent trillions on deadly technology that makes hunting down "evil doers" half a world away seem like a video game. Our police departments have been militarized and DHS has the ability to rapidly respond to just about any "crisis" in hours.

Introduce a large-scale catastrophe and we would see a replay, on a very large scale, showing that in an emergency, DHS can't deliver ice to a city. Expand Katrina New Orleans to a complete multi-state area, and as in New Orleans, police and other service givers will go to take care of their families. They will not wait for the feds to show up and then go to their families' funerals. When stores are not open and people need to eat, what is needed is not a militarized police to shoot looters. You will need more than one Lt. Gen. Russel Honoré to gain control. The local, state, and federal agencies (think DHS/FEMA) failed.

If the water is contaminated, and you need some, you will do what it takes to get some or perish. Under FEMA organization, ice was trucked by Mark Kostinec from Greenville, Pa., to Carthage, Mo; to Montgomery, Ala.; to Camp Shelby, Ms.; to Selma, Ala.; to Emporia, Va.; to Fremont, Neb.; making a 4,100 mile trip with various layovers only to wind up in a government rented freezer storage to await another disaster. Lots and lots of ice wound up in Nebraska. DHS can do a heck of a job on paper. WalMart found Louisiana.

DHS was formed in 2002. Katrina hit in 2005. That was a DHS cluster foxtrot.

When one very large group forces another very large group to accept abortion, gay marriage, and an unlimited influx of illegal aliens with work permits, all nature of welfare and taxes, and uncontrolled federal debt, eventually that may cause a rift big enough to renew serious interest in secession. Who would fight and die in a war to preserve abortion, gay marriage, illegal aliens, etc.? With today's weapons, what would such a war look like?

"The defense department and the intelligence community have spent trillions on deadly technology that makes" the Military Industrial Complex rich. Trillions have been spent to keep us safe from imaginary WMD and to ward off a unicorn stampede.

nolu chan  posted on  2015-02-23   19:34:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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