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Religion
See other Religion Articles

Title: Obama Rips Bible, Praises Koran
Source: Breitbart
URL Source: http://www.breitbart.com/national-s ... bama-rips-bible-praises-koran/
Published: Feb 7, 2015
Author: Ben Shapiro
Post Date: 2015-02-07 06:32:22 by cranky
Keywords: None
Views: 205767
Comments: 433

On Thursday, at the National Prayer Breakfast in Washington, D.C., President Obama blithely informed his audience that Christians ought not get on their “high horse” about the problem of radical Islam:

Unless we get on our high horse and think that this is unique to some other place, remember that during the Crusades and Inquisition, people committed terrible deeds in the name of Christ. In our home country, slavery and Jim Crow all too often was justified in the name of Christ. So it is not unique to one group or one religion. There is a tendency in us, a simple tendency that can pervert and distort our faith.

This is historically and philosophically illiterate. Historically speaking, the Crusades were a response to Islamic aggression in Europe and the Middle East; the Inquisition, as Jonah Goldberg points out while quoting historian Thomas Madden, director of the Center for Medieval and Renaissance Studies at Saint Louis University, was designed to regularize executions rather than leaving them to the will of the masses. Christians undoubtedly pursued horrible brutalities against people, including innocent Jews. However, as Goldberg points out, “Christianity, even in its most terrible days, even under the most corrupt popes, even during the most unjustifiable wars, was indisputably a force for the improvement of man.”

Nowhere is that clearer than in Obama’s second example, slavery. Virtually all of the most ardent abolitionists were deeply religious Christians. Hundreds of thousands of American men marched to their deaths singing “The Battle Hymn of the Republic”: “In the beauty of the lilies Christ was born across the sea / With a glory in His bosom that transfigures you and me / As He died to make men holy, let us die to make men free / While God is marching on.” That was 150 years ago. It’s not exactly the modern Islamic slogan, “Death to the Jews.” Reverend Martin Luther King, Jr., was, as his name suggests, a reverend. He quoted old black Christian spirituals and the Biblical story of the exodus from Egypt. Christians obliterated slavery. Christians obliterated Jim Crow. Modern slavery is largely perpetrated by Muslims. Modern Jim Crow is certainly perpetrated by Muslims under shariah law.

There is a larger point, here, too: President Obama’s foolish argument suggests that because Christians were brutal a millennium ago, they should shut up about brutalities today. This is somewhat like saying that because someone’s great-great-grandfather held slaves in rural Alabama, that person should shut up about human trafficking in 2015. It’s asinine.

But Obama has a history of insulting Christianity and Judaism while upholding Islam. In 2006, Obama bashed the Bible and religious Christians and Jews in particular:

Which passages of Scripture should guide our public policy? Should we go with Leviticus, which suggests slavery is ok and that eating shellfish is abomination? How about Deuteronomy, which suggests stoning your child if he strays from the faith? Or should we just stick to the Sermon on the Mount – a passage that is so radical that it’s doubtful that our own Defense Department would survive its application? So before we get carried away, let’s read our bibles. Folks haven’t been reading their bibles.

He then concluded that religious leaders should not speak out against publicly-funded contraception or gay marriage.

We can get into President Obama’s pathetic Biblical commentary here – his interpretation of Leviticus on slavery is incorrect, Jews still avoid shellfish, the Talmud explains that no child has ever been stoned for rebelliousness, and the Sermon on the Mount is not a pacifist document. Obama’s not Biblically literate – he’s the same fellow who says, “I think the good book says don’t throw stones in glass houses.”

He said in The Audacity of Hope that he would define Biblical values however he chose, stating that he is not willing “to accept a reading of the Bible that considers an obscure line in Romans to be more defining of Christianity than the Sermon on the Mount.” Both are, in fact, parts of the Bible. Citing the Sermon on the Mount to justify civil unions for homosexuals, as Obama has done, is not in fact Biblical.

But more importantly, Obama’s scorn for the old-fashioned Bible is obvious. That became more obvious in 2008, when Obama told some of his buddies in San Francisco that unemployed idiots “cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.”

The Obama administration has routinely attacked religious organizations and people who violate Obama’s personal political predilections. They’ve attacked all trappings of Christianity as well. Whether they’re using Obamacare to force religious individuals to pay for others’ contraception or toning down the National Day of Prayer instead of holding a public ceremony, whether they’re covering a monogram of Jesus at Georgetown University during a presidential speech or objecting to adding FDR’s D-Day prayer to the WWII memorial, the Obama administration clearly isn’t fond of Christianity.

This contrasts strongly with President Obama’s romantic vision of Islam. He famously called the Muslim call to prayer “the sweetest sound I know.” He said in his first presidential interview, with Al-Arabiya, that his job was “to communicate to the American people that the Muslim world is filled with extraordinary people who simply want to live their lives and see their children live better lives.” Weeks later, he said in Turkey, “We will convey our deep appreciation for the Islamic faith, which has done so much over the centuries to shape the world — including in my own country.” A few months later, in a speech in Cairo to which he invited the Muslim Brotherhood, Obama said:

I have known Islam on three continents before coming to the region where it was first revealed. That experience guides my conviction that partnership between America and Islam must be based on what Islam is, not what it isn’t. And I consider it part of my responsibility as President of the United States to fight against negative stereotypes of Islam wherever they appear.

He added that Islam has a “proud tradition of tolerance,” explained, ‘Islam is not part of the problem in combating violent extremism – it is an important part of promoting peace,” and said, “America and Islam are not exclusive and need not be in competition. Instead, they overlap, and share common principles of justice and progress, tolerance and the dignity of all human beings.” He said in his Ramadan message in 2009 that Islam has played a key “role in advancing justice, progress, tolerance, and the dignity of all human beings.”

ISIS, Obama has said over and over again, is not Islamic. His administration maintains that America is not at war with radical Islam. He stated before the United Nations in 2012, just weeks after the murder of four Americans in Benghazi, Libya at the hands of Muslim terrorists, “The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam.” Hillary Clinton allegedly promised Charles Woods, father of one of the slain in Benghazi, that the administration would achieve the arrest of the YouTube filmmaker behind The Innocence of Muslims. The State Department issued taxpayer-funded commercials denouncing that YouTube video. President Obama variously called the video “crude and disgusting” and stated that “its message must be rejected by all who respect our common humanity.” At the UN in 2014, Obama lauded a Muslim cleric who backs Hamas. And, of course, Obama uses Islamic theology to promote his vision of world peace:

All of us have a responsibility to work for the day when the mothers of Israelis and Palestinians can see their children grow up without fear; when the Holy Land of the three great faiths is the place of peace that God intended it to be; when Jerusalem is a secure and lasting home for Jews and Christians and Muslims, and a place for all of the children of Abraham to mingle peacefully together as in the story of Isra, when Moses, Jesus, and Mohammed, peace be upon them, joined in prayer.

All three religions do have access to holy sites now, in Jewish-run Jerusalem. They did not when Muslims ruled Jerusalem. But facts have no bearing in the fantasy world of the president.

Perhaps one final contrast tells the tale. In 2012, according to the Washington Post. “U.S. troops tried to burn about 500 copies of the Koran as part of a badly bungled security sweep at an Afghan prison in February.” Two American soldiers were shot in the aftermath. This prompted President Obama to apologize profusely to Afghan President Hamid Karzai, writing him a letter stating, “We will take the appropriate steps to avoid any recurrence, including holding accountable those responsible.”

Three years earlier, members of the military burned Bibles printed in Pashto and Dari. CNN reported that they had been discarded “amid concern they would be used to try to convert Afghans.” The Bibles were burned rather than sent back to their source organization because the military worried they might be re-sent to another outlet in Afghanistan. There was no apology to the church that printed the Bibles, or to Christians more broadly.

Sure, radical Muslims around the world, supported by millions of their compatriots and friendly governments, are murdering innocents. But it’s Christian aggression that forces Muslims to burn other Muslims alive in Muslim countries. (1 image)

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#254. To: Pericles (#253)

STATS, please. Support your opinion with meaningful stats.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-08   13:58:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#255. To: Pericles, Murron, Gatlin, cranky, Stoner, Liberator, Pridie.Nones, Deckard, CZ82, GarySpFC, rlk, hondo68, Vicomte13, redleghunter, sneakypete (#237)

I am still waiting for evidence Obama made America more Islamic.

Try this, again.

""I ask again, what Muslim agenda has Obama enacted in the USA?"

The same agenda he has to destroy the white U.S. middle class. The same as his agenda to give cover to the racial pimps like Sharpton. It's the same old same old about calling a person a racist because they disagree with Obama. And more significantly naming an AG that doesn't mind breaking the rules, if not the law, to promote Obama's vision of fundamentally remaking America. It's the same agenda that leads Duke to allow the Muslim call to prayer from its Chapel tower. It's the same agenda that led to a Federal court to rule that barring Sharia law in the U.S. is unconstitutional.

And on the foreign policy side, his not so veiled hatred for Israel and willingness to allow Iran to acquire nuclear capabilities. Guess what the Arab nations in the region will want when Iran goes nuke? Guess who will give it to them?"

And this, again.

" In case you missed it.

"In its latest effort to protect followers of Islam in the U.S. the Obama Justice Department warns against using social media to spread information considered inflammatory against Muslims, threatening that it could constitute a violation of civil rights."

"Over the years the Obama administration has embarked on a fervent crusade to befriend Muslims by creating a variety of outreach programs at a number of key federal agencies. For instance the nation’s Homeland Security covertly met with a group of extremist Arab, Muslim and Sikh organizations to discuss national security matters and the State Department sent a controversial, anti- America Imam (Feisal Abdul Rauf) to the Middle East to foster greater understanding and outreach among Muslim majority communities.

The Obama Administration has also hired a special Homeland Security adviser (Mohamed Elibiary) who openly supports a radical Islamist theologian and renowned jihadist ideologue and a special Islam envoy that condemns U.S. prosecutions of terrorists as “politically motivated persecutions” and has close ties to radical extremist groups. The president has even ordered the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) to shift its mission from space exploration to Muslim diplomacy and the government started a special service that delivers halal meals, prepared according to Islamic law, to home-bound seniors in Detroit. Who could forget Hillary Clinton’s special order allowing the reentry of two radical Islamic academics whose terrorist ties have long banned them from the U.S.?"

потому что Бог хочет это тот путь

SOSO  posted on  2015-02-08   14:00:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#256. To: Pridie.Nones (#254)

STATS, please. Support your opinion with meaningful stats.

The immigration law is still the same so any future growth will be in the fact Muslims have more children than other religions - sort of like how Hasidic Jews have increased not from immigration but from population growth though immigration and conversions play a factor as well.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-08   14:28:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#257. To: Pericles (#233)

I hope you don't think that is some kind of revelation do you?

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-08   14:28:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#258. To: Pericles (#234)

According to those who are close to him and have been captured by him he is.

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-08   14:29:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#259. To: SOSO, Murron, Gatlin, cranky, Stoner, Liberator, Pridie.Nones, Deckard, CZ82, GarySpFC, rlk, hondo68, Vicomte13, redleghunter, sneakypete (#255)

""I ask again, what Muslim agenda has Obama enacted in the USA?"

The same agenda he has to destroy the white U.S. middle class.

So its just KKK like demagoguery? How is this any different than Bush allowing Saudis to be the only flights allowed to leave the USA after 9/11?

America has been Islam's bitch since that retard Reagan armed jihadis in Afghanistan. Carter armed natives of Afghanistan but Reagan authorized the CIA to bring in jihadis from around the world. Bush, Jr supported the Clinton war on Serbia in favor of Muslims. Bush, Jr made Kosovo an independent state in Europe - another Muslim nation born in Europe. So spare me that this is proof somehow America will become Islamic - it is a foreign policy tactic for the USA to be linked to jihadis.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-08   14:33:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#260. To: CZ82 (#258)

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Elections/Vox-News/2012/0309/Why-did-Rush- Limbaugh-defend-Joseph-Kony-and-Lord-s-Resistance-Army-video

Why did Rush Limbaugh defend Joseph Kony and Lord's Resistance Army (+video)?

Rush Limbaugh criticized Obama last October for sending US troops to kill Joseph Kony's 'Christian' fighters. When apprised by listeners of the LRA's record, he expressed surprise.

Last October, Rush Limbaugh on his radio show defended Joseph Kony’s Lord’s Resistance Army, the Uganda guerilla group that is now infamous around the world thanks to a viral video from the Invisible Children organization that has exposed Kony’s cruel and murderous ways.

Why in the world would Limbaugh do that? One reason is that he was not so much promoting the LRA as questioning the Obama administration’s decision to send 100 elite US troops to the area to help quell fighting.

“Lord’s Resistance Army are Christians. They are fighting the Muslims in Sudan. And Obama has sent troops, United States troops to remove them from the battlefield, which means kill them,” Limbaugh said last Oct. 14, according to a show transcript.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-08   14:35:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#261. To: Gatlin (#244)

You sure are being nice to him, kinda makes me wonder if you don't know him. Or are you going to stick with the story it's Izzy?

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-08   14:36:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#262. To: Pericles (#190)

Thomas Jefferson thinks otherwise and his thinking and that of his contemporaries was what held sway. You argue the point for someone who Jefferson was against because of modern American Fundie attempts to hold onto their modern myths of Protestant Fundie America's origins.

Jefferson was respected in his day, but his belief system was not.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   14:44:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#263. To: Pericles (#192)

Obama has killed more terrorist with drones than even Bush while depriving the terrorists of easy to target Americans on the ground.

Nonsense! Total nonsense!

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   14:46:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#264. To: CZ82 (#261)

Or are you going to stick with the story it's Izzy?

I am leaning towards "Bucky" fight now...Izzy has never displayed such intelligence, that caused me to pretty much rule him out.

Gatlin  posted on  2015-02-08   14:48:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#265. To: Pridie.Nones (#207)

There is no "god" as "god" is everything around us; however, there are great gods and those great gods are meaningful as they helped in some way promote the survival of someone.

That's Pantheism, which is just another form of atheism. In reality your god manifests himself in a mirror.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   14:52:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#266. To: Pridie.Nones (#252)

But you won't revive me. You shall relish in your own mind the day you elicted some sort of personal power about mircles for some little creature.

You misunderstand me completely.

I can't revive anybody. If I could, and you died and I knew about it, I would. I would, and after that you would know and you would become an ally of God forever.

I don't relish in the raising of those animals. I recount those stories because they are the TRUTH, and they were part of the in-my-face PROOF to me that God IS, the things that leave ME with no mental dodge, because I know. Hearing voices? I could be crazy. Seeing things? I could be crazy. Dead animals rising? That's not crazy. There it is. It's a fact, part of a fact pattern that I can't deny.

The external miracles, Shroud and Incorrupt and Lanciano - they confirm to ANYBODY these things are so.

What happened was a MIRACLE. That was the point: MIRACLES happen. Laws of physics are broken by a overarching mind that rules nature too. The point of studying them is to see it, to know it, and to bend the neck and the knee to reality.

I'm not a Catholic because I LIKE it. I don't, actually. There's plenty that I'd prefer not be so. I'm a Catholic because it's TRUE.

Vicomte13  posted on  2015-02-08   14:53:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#267. To: GarySpFC (#265)

That's Pantheism, which is just another form of atheism. In reality your god manifests himself in a mirror.

I have to disagree with you on this.

I myself was a scientific pantheist until God grabbed my face.

Pantheism is the belief that Nature is God. The physicist would express it that the laws of nature are God.

It isn't atheism, at least my form of it wasn't. Atheism is the belief that there is no god at all.

Pantheism is a form of paganism.

Vicomte13  posted on  2015-02-08   14:59:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#268. To: Pridie.Nones (#230)

there is no real god; there are only beliefs about a REAL GOD.

Prove it! Quite frankly if there is no God it follows good and evil are only relative terms. If there is no God, then a man shouldn't care if his mother is chased down the street like a bitch in heat by a pack of men or dogs. You really have no basis whatsoever for your morality.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   15:02:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#269. To: Pericles (#231)

Sir William Blackstone

Was not our Founding Father.

So? He was well known and studied by them. There wasn't a lawyer in the Colonies and later in the States who didn't have a copy of Blackstone on their desk.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   15:08:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#270. To: Vicomte13, GarySpFC (#267)

Pantheism is a form of paganism.

It is all perspective - I consider Islam a form of early protestant Christianity.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-08   15:10:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#271. To: Pericles (#260)

"What Limbaugh did not say was that the list of LRA objectives appeared to have come straight off Wikipedia, according to a contemporaneous New York Times account. Nor did Limbaugh mention that for years the group had been widely accused of torture, murder, looting, and wanton destruction.

Perhaps the other major reason Limbaugh made this faux pas was that he was just talking too fast about stuff of which he knew little. Today over 50 million people have seen the Invisible Children video, which documents such LRA abuses as its kidnapping of children for use as soldiers. But Limbaugh’s discussion of the group occurred long before it became so well known.

In fact, as his broadcast progressed last October, Limbaugh obviously began receiving reports from listeners of the LRA’s real nature.

Near the end of the show he said, “Is that right? The Lord’s Resistance Army is being accused of really bad stuff? ... Well, we just found out about this today. We’re gonna do, of course, our due diligence research on it. But nevertheless we got a hundred troops being sent over there to fight these guys – and they claim to be Christians.”

At the time, the broadcast created an uproar among those who knew of the LRA’s actions. The next day conservative Sen. James Inhofe (R) of Oklahoma went on the Senate floor to set the record straight, noting that Joseph Kony was in no way a Christian, and that he had been disavowed by the Ugandan Catholic Church".

The CSM also said the above.

BTA Sudan is backing Kony and Sudan is 97% Muslim. Hmmmmmmmmm.......

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-08   15:14:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#272. To: Gatlin (#264)

I seem to remember somebody trying to con me by claiming they were Bucky, you remember that?

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-08   15:15:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#273. To: GarySpFC (#268)

Pridie.Nones: "... there is no real god; there are only beliefs about a REAL GOD."

GarySpFC: Prove it! Quite frankly if there is no God it follows good and evil are only relative terms. If there is no God, then a man shouldn't care if his mother is chased down the street like a bitch in heat by a pack of men or dogs. You really have no basis whatsoever for your morality.

Gary, I hate to break my perspective to you but you can not second guess GOD. God is a mystery. The creation of all about us is a mystery. There is not much more than that perspective at this time in mankind's quest for knowledge to understand himself and the world around himself.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-08   15:15:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#274. To: Pridie.Nones (#205)

What piece of garbage?

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. " (Romans 1:16-17)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-08   15:39:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#275. To: Vicomte13 (#267)

It isn't atheism, at least my form of it wasn't. Atheism is the belief that there is no god at all.

Pantheism identifies the universe with God, but their God is "not a personal being", who involves Himself in the affairs of men. Deism admits there is a personal being, however he no longer has a relationship with man. Both are forms of atheism, and especially the former.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   15:40:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#276. To: Murron (#212)

OOPS! My bad. You already are, and doing a bang up job of it too, shoveling and spreading Obama's piles of sugar coated shite. But in the end, all you're going to be holding onto is a 'pile of Obama's/satan's Shite!~ jmho

Tell it lady. :)

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. " (Romans 1:16-17)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-08   15:41:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#277. To: redleghunter (#274)

What piece of garbage?

Your post @#195: The only myth is the leftist, atheist secular myth that the founders were deists.

Feel free to defend or argue or substantiate your own silly post. You are a damed liar.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-08   15:45:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#278. To: Pridie.Nones (#273)

Gary, I hate to break my perspective to you but you can not second guess GOD. God is a mystery. The creation of all about us is a mystery. There is not much more than that perspective at this time in mankind's quest for knowledge to understand himself and the world around himself.

Your God is a mystery. Better yet, you have an unknown God. Your faith is a leap into deep darkness.

The Christian faith is a walk with a God Who has revealed Himself in Scripture, and every day is a great adventure for Christians.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   15:58:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#279. To: CZ82 (#272)

Nope...

Gatlin  posted on  2015-02-08   15:59:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#280. To: GarySpFC (#278)

The Christian faith is a walk with a God Who has revealed Himself in Scripture, and every day is a great adventure for Christians.

Faith? Isn't that term nothing more than a literal or juxtaposed transition of "belief?" If so, you agree with me. If not, you and I are at great odds.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-08   16:05:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#281. To: Pridie.Nones (#277)

It gets so tiring listening to irreligious zealots claim that the United States was not founded as a Christian nation. The fact is that we were founded by a preponderance of men who had a clear and concise understanding of Christianity; and, who viewed the principles of Christianity as essential in forming a new government. This is not to imply that they wanted to form a theocracy. Our founding father new all too well what happens when a government is allowed to fall under man’s concept of religious control. Yet, our founding fathers were Christians and they wanted to live in a country where the government tempered man’s ambitions and desires with Christian principles. They did not, however, want to have a secular government which was subject to undo influence from any single Christian denomination. Therefore, it is imperative that when we highlight our founding fathers desire to separate religion and government it was separation of Christian denominations and government … it was not a desire to have an irreligious libertine government. Yes, our founding fathers wanted a secular government, but they also wanted a government that adhered to generic Christian values and principles.

We can say, without equivocation or mental reservation, that America was founded as a Christian nation. A close look at our founding fathers will reveal their Christian values and beliefs. A survey of 52 founding father’s statements about God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, Christianity, the gospel message, and the bible revealed them to be rather devout Christians. It was discovered that 77% of these founding fathers clearly acknowledged a belief in Christianity. Another 10% expressed a belief in God and Jesus but did not actually profess Jesus to be savior. In all probably we would be justified, however, in assuming that their acknowledgement of Jesus infers a belief in Jesus as savior. All of the remaining men expressed a belief in God but they did not come out and declare any belief that would led us to think they were a Christian. Thus, we can say with a great deal of certainty that over 80% of our founding fathers were Christians; and, we can say with a great deal of confidence that over 90% of our founding fathers were religious. In fact, if we restrict our survey to just the signers of the Declaration of Independence we will find that they all belonged to a major Christian denomination. So you see, it is absolutely ludicrous to believe that our founding fathers were not heavily influenced by Christian principles.

The next time you are confronted by an irreligious libertine, who claim that the United States was not founded as a Christian nation, tell them to examine the evidence. It is absolutely impossible to deny that the vast majority of our founding fathers were Christians. Based on the statements they have made, and the religious organizations they belonged to, it is obvious they were strongly influenced by Christianity. Even those who may not have had been very religious were influenced by Christian teachings. And, it is a fact that we Christians tend to weave Christian principle into the fabric of social and organizational governance. Yes, we were not founded as a theocracy, but we were founded as a nation anchored in Christian principles and teaching. We were founded as a Christian nation and we were blessed by God.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:05:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#282. To: Pericles, GarySpFc, liberator, Murron (#232)

The only people who claim this are Fundie revisionists trying to grasp at straws. Even if true (I Don't read Arabic) it matters not at all because the Senate ratified the English language treaty.

No. The entire article 11 is spurious in nature. Even if it was included in the English version before the Senate, eight years later when the treaty was renegotiated the language did not appear. So the revisionism of the secular muhammadan left in the US grasps at straws to include an article of a treaty, a spurious one at that, to conclude Americans were secular and the government somehow knew what that meant at the time.

We know whatever was put before Adams was signed. Yet Adams would be one of the last people to declare the USA did not hail from Christian roots. He was clear on this matter:

The general Principles, on which the Fathers Atchieved Independence, were the only Principles in which that beautiful Assembly of young Gentlemen could Unite, and these Principles only could be intended by them in their Address, or by me in my Answer. And what were these general Principles? I answer, the general Principles of Christianity, in which all those Sects were united: And the general Principles of English and American Liberty, in which all those young Men United, and which had United all Parties in America, in Majorities sufficient to assert and maintain her Independence.

Now I will avow, that I then believed, and now believe, that those general Principles of Christianity, are as eternal and immutable, as the Existence and Attributes of God; and that those Principles of Liberty, are as unalterable as human Nature and our terrestrial, mundane System. I could therefore safely say, consistently with all my then and present Information, that I believed they would never make Discoveries in contradiction to these general Principles. http://constitution.org/primarysources/adamsprinciples.html

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. " (Romans 1:16-17)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-08   16:08:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#283. To: Pridie.Nones (#280)

Faith? Isn't that term nothing more than a literal or juxtaposed transition of "belief?" If so, you agree with me. If not, you and I are at great odds.

The Christian faith is an action or a readiness to act based on the confidence one has is the object of their belief. Basically, faith is a verb. The Christian faith is based on a KNOWN God, and the idea of it being a leap into the dark is total nonsense.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:11:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#284. To: GarySpFC (#281)

we were founded as a nation anchored in Christian principles and teaching. We were founded as a Christian nation and we were blessed by God.

I can't see what difference it makes. Everyone sees what they want to see in the founders.

If you look at the peoples actions, there attitudes towards one another, it wasn't and isn't a christian nation.

Anyways, there probably isn't even such a thing. Certainly God never set out to have one.

Biff Tannen  posted on  2015-02-08   16:12:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#285. To: Pridie.Nones, Pericles (#280)

"The Hand of providence has been so conspicuous in all this, that he must be worse than an infidel that lacks faith, and more than wicked, that has not gratitude enough to acknowledge his obligations." George Washington's letter of August 20, 1778 to Brig. General Thomas Nelson

"Almighty and eternal Lord God, the great Creator of heaven and earth, and the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ; look down from heaven in pity and compassion upon me Thy servant, who humbly prorate myself before Thee." George Washington's prayer at Valley Forge

"No people can be bound to acknowledge and adore the invisible hand which conducts the affairs of men more than the people of the United States. Every step by which they have advanced to the character of an independent nation seems to have been distinguished by some token of providential agency...We ought to be no less persuaded that the propitious smiles of heaven cannot be expected on a nation that disregards the eternal rules of order and right, which heaven itself has ordained." -- George Washington in his Inaugural Address, April 30, 1789

"Such being the impressions under which I have, in obedience to the public summons, repaired to the present station, it would be peculiarly improper to omit in this first official act, my fervent supplications to that Almighty Being, who rules over the universe, who presides in the council of nations, and whose providential aids can supply every human defect, that His benediction may consecrate to the liberties and happiness of the people of the United States.." "...Every step by which they have advanced to the character of an independent nation, seems to have been distinguished by some token of providential agency" From President George Washington's Inaugural Address, April 30th, 1789, addressed to both Houses of Congress.

"Let us with caution indulge the supposition, that morality can be maintained without religion."--George Washington, ca. 1789, Maxims of Washington, ed. John F. Schroeder (Mt. Vernon: Mt. Vernon Ladies Association, 1942), p. 106.

"And now, Almighty Father, if it is Thy holy will that we shall we shall obtain a place and name among the nations of the Earth...:grant that we may be enabled to show our gratitude for Thy goodness by endeavors to fear and obey Thee." George Washington

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:17:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#286. To: Pridie.Nones (#280)

"The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: 'It connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity." President Adams, July 4, 1821

"The general principles, on which the Fathers achieved independence, were . . . the general principles of Christianity." John Adams, in a letter to Thomas Jefferson, June 28, 1813, The Adams-Jefferson Letters,ed. Lester J. Cappon (Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Press, 1959), vol 2, pp. 339-40.

"We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." John Adams from his Oct. 13, 1789 address to the military.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:19:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#287. To: Pridie.Nones (#280)

"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever; That a revolution of the wheel of fortune, a change of situation, is among possible events; that it may become probable by Supernatural influence! The Almighty has no attribute which can take side with us in that event." President Thomas Jefferson --Notes on the State of Virginia, Query XVIII, p. 237.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:23:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#288. To: Pericles (#259)

""I ask again, what Muslim agenda has Obama enacted in the USA?"

The same agenda he has to destroy the white U.S. middle class.

So its just KKK like demagoguery?

No,it is an actual fact. Basically,thanks to blacks being placed in the Dim Plantation after 1964 there are virtually no middle-class blacks left in this country that don't have AA jobs in government or corporations with government ties,so that leaves the whites. Which includes Jews as well as some His and Her Panics.

How is this any different than Bush allowing Saudis to be the only flights allowed to leave the USA after 9/11?

It's not. This is one reason why I call Obomber Bush 4.0.

America has been Islam's bitch since that retard Reagan armed jihadis in Afghanistan. >

Proving once again that you are educated beyond your ability to comprehend.

We have been Islams servants ever since Rockefeller and Kennedy got involved in the oil business. Poppy Bush and Boy Jorge Bush are just two more US functionaries in the long line of Muslim employees.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-08   16:26:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#289. To: All (#281)

At the Constitutional Convention of 1787, James Madison proposed the plan to divide the central government into three branches. He discovered this model of government from the Perfect Governor, as he read Isaiah 33:22; “For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; He will save us.” [Baron Charles Montesquieu, wrote in 1748; “Nor is there liberty if the power of judging is not separated from legislative power and from executive power. If it [the power of judging] were joined to legislative power, the power over life and liberty of the citizens would be arbitrary, for the judge would be the legislature if it were joined to the executive power, the judge could have the force of an oppressor. All would be lost if the same … body of principal men … exercised these three powers." Madison claimed Isaiah 33:22 as the source of division of power in government See also: pp.241-242 in Teaching and Learning America’s Christian History: The Principle approach by Rosalie Slater]

"Before any man can be considered as a member of civil society, he must be considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe. And to the same Divine Author of every good and perfect gift [James 1:17] we are indebted for all those privileges and advantages, religious as well as civil, which are so richly enjoyed in this favored land." James Madison

"Cursed be all that learning that is contrary to the cross of Christ." James Madison - America's Providential History p. 93.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:27:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#290. To: GarySpFC (#283)

The Christian faith is an action or a readiness to act based on the confidence one has is the object of their belief. Basically, faith is a verb.

A "verb" based on a belief. Thank you for clarifying the detail that I have been suggesting all along this thread.

Pridie.Nones  posted on  2015-02-08   16:27:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#291. To: Pericles (#260)

Why did Rush Limbaugh defend Joseph Kony and Lord's Resistance Army (+video)?

I have no idea who Joseph Kony is or why you care or pay attention to what Rush Limbaugh says.

Remind me again,what elective or cabinet office he holds in government.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-08   16:28:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#292. To: All (#281)

"When we view the blessings with which our country has been favored, those which we now enjoy, and the means which we possess of handing them down unimpaired to our latest posterity, our attention is irresistibly drawn to the source from whence they flow. Let us then, unite in offering our most grateful acknowledgments for these blessings to the Divine Author of All Good." --Monroe made this statement in his 2nd Annual Message to Congress, November 16, 1818.

"The liberty, prosperity, and the happiness of our country will always be the object of my most fervent prayers to the Supreme Author of All Good." March 5, 1821 in his Second Inaugural Address

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:30:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#293. To: Pridie.Nones (#280)

"The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence were.... the general principles of Christianity. President John Quincy Adams

"My custom is to read four or five chapters of the Bible every morning immediately after rising... It seems to me the most suitable manner of beginning the day... It is an invaluable and inexhaustible mine of knowledge and virtue." President John Quincy Adams

"The highest glory of the American Revolution was this; it connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity." - John Quincy Adams, July 4, 1821

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-08   16:31:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#294. To: Pridie.Nones (#277)

The majority of the founders were not deists. That's a leftist lie.

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. " (Romans 1:16-17)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-08   16:32:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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