[Home] [Headlines] [Latest Articles] [Latest Comments] [Post] [Mail] [Sign-in] [Setup] [Help] [Register]
|
Status: Not Logged In; Sign In
The Water Cooler Title: Jesse's Dangerous Game Jesse's Dangerous Game A former Navy SEAL commander questions Ventura's claim that he hunted man in Vietnam. by Bill Salisbury POSTED MAY 8, 2001--- MINNEAPOLIS-- A few weeks before the revelation that ex-Navy SEAL Bob Kerrey was involved in the death of civilians during the Vietnam War, Minnesota Governor Jesse Ventura had ignited a controversy of his own by boasting in a confrontational interview with a Minneapolis Star Tribune columnist that he had "hunted man" as a Navy SEAL in Vietnam. Resources: April 5, 2001 Mpls Star Tribune Transcript of "hunting man" interview April 5, 2001 Mpls Star Tribune Initial news story about interview April 7, 2001 Mpls Star Tribune Ventura apologizes to hunters December 2, 1999 San Diego Reader Jesse "The Great Pretender" Ventura December 21, 1999 Cursor.org Cursor researches Ventura's Navy SEAL quotes HomeOfHeroes.com Ribbon Awards of the U.S. Navy How to publicly post a DD 214 US Navy How to file a FOIA request with the U.S. Navy UDT/SEAL Operations in Vietnam, by T.L. Bosiljevac Navy SEAL Web site index Navy SEALs Vietnam memorial page Exposing fake Navy SEALs: Night Scribe Cyber Seals Wall of Shame Cursor home Initial press coverage focused on how Ventura's assertion that "until you hunted man, you haven't hunted yet," had riled many Minnesotans who hunt only non-human game. But more importantly, Ventura's claim invites a revisiting of long-standing questions about his military service, as it raises new ones about what the governor did, or didn't do, in Vietnam. In December, 1999, I wrote an article for the San Diego Reader titled, "Jesse (The Great Pretender) Ventura." The article challenged Ventura's claim that as James Janos he'd been a SEAL in Vietnam. I wrote that Janos had not been a SEAL but merely a member of Underwater Demolition Team (UDT) 12 who had been stationed in the Philippines and not Vietnam. The article relied on several interviews with real SEALS who had been in Nam and UDT men who had served with Janos. I also drew on my 16 years as a SEAL, that included a combat tour as officer-in-charge of SEAL Team 1, Detachment Golf, duty as executive officer of SEAL Team 2 during the war, and a stint as commanding officer of UDT 11 after the war. Before going to press I asked Ventura's spokesman, John Wodele, for the governor's comment. "We will have no comment on something so obviously false," said Wodele in an indignant, imperial tone. (In fairness to Wodele, I didn't tell him of my own SEAL and UDT credentials, but left him to assume I was just some West Coast "jackal" whining and snapping at his boss's heels.) Ventura continued to hide behind Wodele and his stone wall when I appeared on the Fox News Channel program "Hannity and Colmes" a few days after the Reader article appeared. When Fox asked Ventura to respond, Wodele wrote: "The only thing we have ever said is that the UDT and SEAL designation is interchangeable and we don't have any further comment." Why would Ventura - who loves to run his mouth about having been a SEAL - suddenly clam up when I publicly stated in so many words that he was, as my grandma used to say, full of more crap than a Christmas turkey? The governor could have silenced me and his growing pack of critics by simply producing his discharge certificate from active duty, called a DD 214. If he'd been one of America's roughest, toughest, meanest mothers, then that document would list Then there's your UDT buddy, Gary 'Bones' Bonnelli, who says you weren't in Nam with him, but that you were floating around the South China Sea, on a ship with the Amphibious Ready Group -- making ports of call in such high-threat areas as Hong Kong, Singapore, and Bangkok.the qualification for all the world to see. And if the SEAL/UDT designation were truly interchangeable, the form would reflect that. But I know it doesn't without even looking at it. The UDT designation, or Navy Enlisted Classification (NEC) - was 5321/22 and the SEAL designation was 5326. How do I know this? Because as the executive officer of SEAL Team 2, I recommended men for the 5326 designation after they had completed a six month probationary period. Many of these men came from UDTs as 5321/22s. As commanding officer of UDT 11, I awarded the 5321/22 designation to frogmen after their probationary period. Interchangeable designation my ass. If Jesse were a SEAL, his DD 214 would also list at least one "Presidential Unit Citation for service Nam." How do I know this? Because of my duty with both SEAL Teams during the war. Every SEAL who served with Teams 1 and 2 received at least one DD 214 (NOT Jesse's)of the five Presidential Unit Citations awarded those units. UDTs received none. So c'mon, Jesse, show us your DD 214. You can even do that without breaking your vow never to talk about what you did as a "SEAL" in Nam. But no fair relying on public pronouncements by your old toadies in the Teams, or a scrap of paper signed by some fawning Navy bureaucrat 30 years later, saying it's okay for you to call yourself a SEAL because UDTs were decommissioned in 1983. After all, you wouldn't want to be dismissed as a "Paper SEAL" would you? I mean it's okay for some pencil-necked sandcrab like George Plimpton to joke about being a "Paper Tiger" instead of a true major leaguer, but aren't you claiming to be the real deal: an ass-kicking, name-taking Navy SEAL? Of course if you're unwilling to share your DD 214, then your pet jackals in the Twin Cities might want to fire off a Freedom of Information Act request to the Navy. Or they could request a copy of the UDT 12 Command History for the years you were with that team (1971- 1974). They could read the "History" to see if you got any ink for combat exploits. Hell. if you truly saw combat with Team 12 - faced Charley or Clyde at a given time in a given place with the burnt smell of expended rounds in the air - that would be good enough for me. I wouldn't quibble over whether you were a Frog or a SEAL and you could lay this controversy to rest - give it a double tap, an ear shot. Another good resource is the Commander Naval Forces Vietnam monthly combat summaries that cover your time in the Western Pacific. Or the UDT 12 Cruise Book that chronicledCover of Jesse's UDT 12 Cruise Book your team's deployments. (SEALS didn't have time for such books.) You could even share your copy with them. One of your former commanding officers at UDT 12 shared his copy with me and said you'd never been in combat. Said he didn't remember you too well at all except as a guy who was good for morale because you had a great sense of humor. Your former CO was with me in Nam before he took over Team 12. He doesn't think the terms UDT and SEAL were interchangeable. Then there's your UDT buddy, Gary "Bones" Bonnelli, who was one of a very few UDT 12 frogmen stationed in Nam, at a place near the Nam Can Forest called Solid Anchor. Bonnelli says you weren't in Nam with him, but that you were floating around the South China Sea on a ship with the Amphibious Ready Group, making ports of call in such high-threat areas as Hong Kong, Singapore, and Bangkok. Continued at link with photos and more information Poster Comment: Someone sent me this URL and asked me to post it for them,so here it is. I vaguely remembered some of this information from the time when Ventura was running for Governor,but some of it is new to me.
Post Comment Private Reply Ignore Thread Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 4.
#1. To: All, *SOCOM*, *Hypocrisy and Hypocrites* (#0)
ping
The truth comes out. Kyle and Ventura had both been drinking too many beers.
#7. To: GarySpFC (#4)
To the best of my memory,back in my drinking days there were only two categories,one was "too many" and the other was "not enough".
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest |
|
[Home] [Headlines] [Latest Articles] [Latest Comments] [Post] [Mail] [Sign-in] [Setup] [Help] [Register]
|