Watching The Cops
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Title: Watch Montana Officer Shoot Man to Death, Then Yell Orders at Him, Then Call in Medical a Minute Later [UPDATED]
Source:
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URL Source: http://reason.com/blog/2015/01/08/w ... ana-officer-in-his-second-exon
Published: Jan 11, 2015
Author: Brian Doherty
Post Date: 2015-01-11 01:41:18 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 3169
Comments: 8
Montana officer Grant Morrison was found not culpable for shooting Richard Ramirez to death during a traffic stop last April, claiming he feared for his life because he thought Ramirez' hand was reaching for a nonexistent weapon. After much testimony from police officers about what a bad guy Ramirez was and how he was high on meth, despite video evidence (below) that provides no evidence for Morrison's assertion other than that he was aggressive and high strung and hostile, but does show him continuing to shout bullying orders after opening fire and taking nearly a minute to call for medical help, Morrison was not charged. AP account from KOAA, excerpt: A jury at a coroner's inquest determined Wednesday that a Montana police officer was justified in shooting and killing an unarmed man high on methamphetamine during a traffic stop.... The seven-person jury deliberated about an hour before delivering its decision. Yellowstone County Attorney Scott Twito said he does not expect to file any charges given the jury's decision... Billings Police Chief Rich St. John said it was the fifth officer-involved shooting in his eight years as head of the department. Each shooting was ruled to be justified, he said. "That tells us we're doing the right thing in the right way," St. John said... This was Morrison second killing of a citizen in the line of duty; he also faced no charges in that case, also because he said the murdered Jason Shaw was reaching for a BB gun. Morrison was placed on paid leave after the Ramirez killing and is now investigating, wait for it, prescription drug crimes. There is nothing in the video by the way, or in anything that the officer said to the four people in the car he pulled over in it, that shows any obvious legitimate reason for the stop to have occurred in the first place. (All the press reports merely blandly refer to a "traffic stop," no reason given or apparently necessary. You are in motion through the world, you are open season for a cop to hassle you, and given the vagueness of so much traffic law and the Whren v. U.S. decision, that's pretty much true. [UPDATE: Thanks to commenter Notorious GKC for pointing out something I shamefully missed: while not clear from the video, and not mentioned in most of the press accounts which refer to "traffic stop" and not "shooting investigation stop," the Daily Inter Lake clip I link below does quote authority's claiming that the officer thought Ramirez had been involved in a shooting earlier that day. Apologies for missing that. More about that in this Missoulian clip, again from when the shooting occurred and not this week, which says that Morrison had already identified Ramirez as being in the car before he pulled it over. You can decide whether any larger point about the dangers of traffic stops remains.] UPDATE UPDATE: Now this more detailed account of Morrison's testimony from Billings Gazette says he did not identify Ramirez as being in the car til after he'd pulled it over, so perhaps there is a polemical point about traffic stops to be made after all. You decide!] It bears repeating: the more bullshit reasons police have to even initiate an encounter with a citizen, the more both citizen and even cop are at risk; and that the pettiest of traffic and other rules that give police a chance to initiate a confrontation with citizens at their will deserve more serious thought than people tend to give them. The Montana News Association excoriates local police's attitude toward citizens in traffic stops that can lead to these tragic results. If you want to feel like Ramirez surely deserved it, this contemporaneous report from Montana's Daily Inter Lake has details on how bad and druggy the murdered man and his family are. Again, none of this seems to have any bearing on the event as presented in the video. See the video. Disturbing, natch:
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#1. To: A K A Stone (#0)
(Edited)
We'll be seeing a lot more of these questionable traffic stops now that SCOTUS has given cops carte blanche. Now they will be able to make a mistake, claim ignorance, and not be held accountable. Ignorance Is No Excuse for Wrongdoing, Unless You’re a Cop With Orwellian irony, the U.S. Supreme Court chose December 15, National Bill of Rights Day to deliver its crushing blow to the Fourth Amendment. Although the courts have historically held that ignorance of the law is not an excuse for breaking the law, in its 8-1 ruling in Heien v. State of North Carolina, the Supreme Court gave police in America one more ready excuse to routinely violate the laws of the land, this time under the guise of ignorance. The Heien case, which started with an improper traffic stop based on a police officer’s ignorance of the law and ended with an unlawful search, seizure and arrest, was supposed to ensure that ignorance of the law did not become a ready excuse for government officials to routinely violate the law. It failed to do so. In failing to enforce the Constitution, the Court gave police the go-ahead to justify a laundry list of misconduct, from police shootings of unarmed citizens to SWAT team raids, roadside strip searches, and the tasering of vulnerable individuals.
"if you're not cop, you're little people" I am unclear as to what was questionable about this stop? If you read this story and do some additional source checking, the officer was tipped that a fugitive wanted for questioning in an attempted murder and robbery (albeit from a drug dealer) could be in the car.
From the article : There is nothing in the video by the way, or in anything that the officer said to the four people in the car he pulled over in it, that shows any obvious legitimate reason for the stop to have occurred in the first place. It bears repeating: the more bullshit reasons police have to even initiate an encounter with a citizen, the more both citizen and even cop are at risk; and that the pettiest of traffic and other rules that give police a chance to initiate a confrontation with citizens at their will deserve more serious thought than people tend to give them. Of course, you and the other cop worshipers are applauding the fact that the cops can just make shit up without any fear of reprisal.
"if you're not cop, you're little people" I don't think you are doing any homework on this case. He acted on a tip. He stopped the car with the knowledge the wanted felon was inside. I am not sure where you can come up with it being an unlawful stop.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
I think you would agree that it isn't unreasonable to search a car that you pulled over that you believe, after being tipped off, houses a fugitive who had just shot and robbed someone. If the cop was randomly pulling over cars and searching them with no reason and charging people with crimes, it would be a Constitutional violation. This was a perfectly legal stop that resulted in a dead violent felon. A dead violent felon the officer knew by name before he shot.
Knowing his name doesn't make it legal. Did the felon have a gun? Did he attack or threaten the officer? How do you know he was guilty? Maybe you have more information that you hinted at.
He didn't have a gun. He threatened the officer by hiding his hands when the officer reasonably suspected he did due to the fact he was told the suspect shot someone earlier. Again, the stop was legal as he was pursuing a wanted fugitive. Jumping into a car and driving off does not create some sort of protection bubble from justice. I saw this the other day and thought it was really eye opening. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yfi3Ndh3n-g
#2. To: Deckard (#1)
questionable stops
#3. To: Nexus6 (#2)
(Edited)
#4. To: Deckard (#3)
#5. To: Nexus6 (#4)
#6. To: A K A Stone (#5)
#7. To: Nexus6 (#6)
A dead violent felon the officer knew by name before he shot.
#8. To: A K A Stone (#7)
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