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Title: Would the Founders Have Cared Where Ted Cruz Was Born?
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics ... here-ted-cruz-was-born/278917/
Published: Aug 24, 2013
Author: Garrett Epps
Post Date: 2013-08-24 11:33:52 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 5839
Comments: 14

From beginning to end, the debate over Senator Ted Cruz and his birth certificate has been silly. Like the "birtherism" debate surrounding Barack Obama, it shows that many Americans think our Constitution is a Harry Potter book of spells ("Mandamus! Habeas Corpus! Nullus indviduus mandatus!"). The "natural born" citizen clause in particular appeals to the mythological imagination.

The clause is found in Article II § 1 cl. 5, which contains three and only three requirements for a potential president: He or she must be 35 years old, must have lived in the U.S. for 14 years, and must be "a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution."

What was the reason behind this third requirement? Many people are convinced that the "purpose" of the Clause was to bar Alexander Hamilton (born in Nevis in the Caribbean) from the presidency. But the provision above says in so many words that anyone who is a citizen "at the time of the adoption of this Constitution" can be president. Hamilton had become a citizen of New York by act of the legislature in 1782. He didn't become president largely on account of the whole being-shot-to-death-by-Burr thing.

In fact, in 1787, no one over 11 -- not George Washington, not John Adams, not Thomas Jefferson -- was a "natural born citizen" of something called "the United States of America." The first "natural born citizen" to enter the White House, by my count, was Martin Van Buren in 1836 -- who was born in 1782, five years before Philadelphia.

I don't think that the Framers were even thinking about potential presidents born to American parents abroad. Their concern was naturalized citizens, and it was a lot more immediate and urgent.

Under British law, a foreigner could acquire "naturalized citizenship" only one way: by special Act of Parliament. Prince George of Denmark was naturalized in 1689 to permit him to become to marry Queen Anne. Despite 17 pregnancies, Anne never gave birth to an heir. Toward the end of her reign, this lack led Parliament to pass the Sophia Naturalization Act of 1705, by which Sophia, the Electress of Hanover, was made a British subject, and "the issue of her body" became heirs to the British throne. Sophia's son ascended to the throne in 1714 as George I. Had the Act not been passed, none of the Georges could have succeeded to the throne.

In other words, the Framers knew one thing about naturalization: It was the way countries shopped for kings.

In 1787, the United States seemed to be falling apart, and many worried that it might end up with an imported European monarch. In 1786, Nathaniel Gorham, later a Philadelphia delegate, had apparently written to Prince Henry of Prussia inquiring whether he'd enjoy being America's head of state. Newspapers during the Convention speculated that the delegates were offering the Crown to Frederick, Bishop of Osnaburgh, younger brother of George III (and later Duke of York). That wasn't true, but some worried that the danger of foreign princes might not abate even after ratification of a new Constitution. Someone might propose Henry or Frederick as the new president. The newly naturalized president might make his son vice president. Since many delegates expected presidents to be re-elected every four years until they died in office, the result would be a de facto monarchy.

That fear probably inspired the "natural born citizen" clause. I can't find any evidence that the Framers wanted to discriminate against the children of Americans anywhere. The first naturalization statute, passed in 1790, said that "children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of limits of the United States, shall be considered as citizens of the United States." (Citizenship did not extend to such children if their fathers had never lived in the U.S.)

The endless parsing of the Framers' unspoken thoughts on this subject -- as on so many others -- does our politics a disservice. There's no coded message in the "natural born citizen" clause. The Framers set up a government and left a lot of things -- including supervision of citizenship -- to Congress. In passing the Immigration and Naturalization Act, Congress extended citizenship to children of Americans born abroad.

This brings us back to Cruz, who was born in Canada in 1970 and came with his family to the U.S. at the age of 4. His mother, Eleanor, is a U.S. citizen by birth; his father, Rafael, is Cuban-born. In 8 U.S.C. 1401(g), Congress provides citizenship "at birth" for "a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years."

The Supreme Court, interpreting Congress's use of its power over citizenship, has noted that there are "two sources of citizenship, and two only: birth and naturalization." Congress extended citizenship to people like Cruz "at birth." Thus, Ted Cruz is what Barack Obama would have been if he really had been born in Kenya: a "natural born" citizen, eligible to be president.

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#1. To: A K A Stone (#0)

The Supreme Court, interpreting Congress's use of its power over citizenship, has noted that there are "two sources of citizenship, and two only: birth and naturalization.

Exactly right. I've been saying this since this birther nonsense started.

Here is the actual law on who is a natural born citizen:

The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:

(a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;

(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;

(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;

(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;

(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;

(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;

(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person (A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or (B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and

(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.


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jwpegler  posted on  2013-08-24   17:36:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: jwpegler (#1)

Perhaps that's the law now, but wasn't the law different at the time of Obama's birth? Snopes claims Obama is eligible for president because he was born in Hawaii, not because he was born in Kenya to a US citizen mother and non-citizen father, and says this:

The item quoted above posits that Barack Obama does not qualify as a natural-born citizen of the U.S. because the law in effect at the time he was born specified that "If only one parent was a U.S. citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least five of which had to be after the age of 16." Since Barack Obama only had one U.S. citizen parent (his mother), and his mother had not been residing in the U.S. for at least five years after the age of 16 when Barack was born (because she herself was only 18 at the time), then he's not a natural-born citizen.

(the provision regarding births outside the USA).

I think it's entirely possible he was born in Kenya and is ineligible for prez, and if so, the media and establishment just have political motive to ignore lawful requirements for this, just as they do for many other constitutional mandates. Politics just trumps the Constitution.

Pinguinite  posted on  2013-08-25   14:31:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Pinguinite (#2) (Edited)


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jwpegler  posted on  2013-08-25   17:31:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Pinguinite (#2)

Perhaps that's the law now, but wasn't the law different at the time of Obama's birth?

The current law regarding citizens at birth was passed in 1952. Obama is about my age -- he was born in the early 1960s.


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jwpegler  posted on  2013-08-25   17:33:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: jwpegler (#4) (Edited)

The current law regarding citizens at birth was passed in 1952.

It appears the initial law was indeed passed in 1952, however it was modified numerous times since then. In 1986, this law was amended to reduce the 5 year requirement to the current 2 year requirement by PL 99–653. That according to this cornell site:

www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1401

Therefore, the law on the books in 1962 appears to have required Obama's mother to have resided in the US at least 5 years after turning 14 for Obama to have naturalized status. Since she was only 18, that wasn't possible. Obama's only chance at naturalized citizenship then is for him to have been born in the US, which is the point of dispute.

Is that not correct?

Pinguinite  posted on  2013-08-27   20:47:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Pinguinite (#5)

which is the point of dispute.

Is that not correct?

Just because you were born here does that make you a citizen? On that cold dark night in 1962 when the Jackyl gave birth to something strange that night.

A K A Stone  posted on  2013-08-27   23:32:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Pinguinite (#5)

Therefore, the law on the books in 1962 appears to have required Obama's mother to have resided in the US at least 5 years after turning 14 for Obama to have naturalized status. Since she was only 18, that wasn't possible. Obama's only chance at naturalized [sic - you meant "natural born"] citizenship then is for him to have been born in the US, which is the point of dispute.

Is that not correct?

It might be correct.

Under the law of 1961, if Obama were born in Kenya to his 18 y.o mother, he would not have been born a citizen.

Under the law of 2000, when he ran for President and won, he would have been.

The law was changed in 1985. The narrow legal question is whether the law of 1961 applied to his natural born citizen status, or the law change of 1985 retroactively applied, making him natural born and thus eligible for the Presidency. Alternatively, the law of 1985 could be said to have naturalized him, by process of law change.

A key fact would be whether others born in 1961 to American parents who didn't meet the requirement automatically gained citizenship and its rights in 1985. That is a question of fact.

This is all something that is actually testable and adjudicable.

But it's almost moot now: Obama won re-election, and the Supreme Court isn't going to remove him.

Cruz is clearly natural born.

Vicomte13  posted on  2013-08-29   14:26:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: A K A Stone (#6)

Just because you were born here does that make you a citizen?

Yes.

Unless your parents were diplomats with immunity, if you were born on US soil you were subject to US jurisdiction at your birth, and therefore a US citizen, natural born, under the 14th Amendment.

Vicomte13  posted on  2013-08-29   14:27:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Vicomte13 (#8)

Yes.

So if a foreigner comes here and they give birth, their children are automatic citizens? I think not, regardless of the color of law.

Say we are in a war. The invaders have women soldiers. If they have a kid here are they then a citizen?

A K A Stone  posted on  2013-08-29   19:39:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Vicomte13 (#7)

The law was changed in 1985. The narrow legal question is whether the law of 1961 applied to his natural born citizen status, or the law change of 1985 retroactively applied, making him natural born and thus eligible for the Presidency. Alternatively, the law of 1985 could be said to have naturalized him, by process of law change.

From the constitution.

"No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed."

A K A Stone  posted on  2013-08-29   19:41:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: A K A Stone (#10)

"No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed."

Yes. But the Supreme Court has narrowed that ex post facto law clause to mean "no ex post facto criminal statute", and it will be the Supreme Court that would decide the issue concerning citizenship.

Vicomte13  posted on  2013-09-24   23:28:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: A K A Stone (#9)

So if a foreigner comes here and they give birth, their children are automatic citizens? I think not, regardless of the color of law.

Say we are in a war. The invaders have women soldiers. If they have a kid here are they then a citizen?

Yes, if a foreigner here who doesn't have diplomatic immunity, and her kid is born here, the kid is a citizen.

As far as the war issue goes, the issue has not been tested. What would likely be ruled is that the kid is not a citizen because the invaders were not "subject to US jurisdiction" as a matter of force and fact, not as a matter of law.

As a matter of fact and as a matter of law, though, illegal aliens are subject to US jurisdiction (it's why we can both take in personam custody of them and prosecute them in the courts), and therefore fall within the scope of the Amendment, and their children born here are US citizens by the 14th Amendment.

Back when the Amendment was made, people didn't believe that we were going to have to make the ex-slaves and their children voting citizens. Hence the effort to pass "grandfather clauses", and ultimately Jim Crow.

Vicomte13  posted on  2013-09-24   23:32:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Pinguinite (#5)

Therefore, the law on the books in 1962 appears to have required Obama's mother to have resided in the US at least 5 years after turning 14 for Obama to have naturalized status. Since she was only 18, that wasn't possible. Obama's only chance at naturalized citizenship then is for him to have been born in the US, which is the point of dispute.

Is that not correct?

If born in the U.S., he was a citizen at birth.

If born in Kenya, he could not have been.

scribd link to 66 Stat 163-282

66 Stat 163-282, Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952

Section 301 at page 236 [excerpt]

(7) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States by such citizen parent may be included in computing the physical presence requirements of this paragraph.

nolu chan  posted on  2013-09-25   0:52:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: All (#0)

hmm

A K A Stone  posted on  2014-10-16   21:45:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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