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Title: Which Babies Should Get the Death Sentence?
Source:
Townhall
URL Source: http://www.freerepublic.com/%5Ehttp ... _should_get_the_death_sentence
Published: Aug 22, 2012
Author: Terry Jeffrey
Post Date: 2012-08-22 06:43:53 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 15617
Comments: 38
Americans witnessed a remarkable drama this week when some of our most exalted politicians frantically scrambled to reassure voters that they, too, believed that the United States ought to permit the deliberate killing of at least some innocent human beings. They apparently did so to persuade the public they are caring, compassionate and -- above all -- reasonable people. The drama started when Rep. Todd Akin, the Republican nominee in the U.S. Senate race in Missouri, expressed his view that no innocent human being ought to be deliberately killed. However, that was not the only thing Akin expressed. "What about in the case of rape. Should it (abortion) be legal or not?" Charles Jaco of KTVI in St. Louis asked Akin in an interview broadcast over the weekend. "Well, you know, people always want to try to make that as one of those things, well, how do you slice this particularly tough ethical question," said Akin. "It seems to me, first of all, from what I understand from doctors, that's really rare. If it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down. But let's assume that maybe that didn't work or something. You know, I think there should be some punishment, but the punishment ought to be on the rapist and not attacking the child." Akin's answer had two distinct parts. In the first, he made a claim about the physiological likelihood of a rape victim conceiving a child as the result of the criminal act committed against her. In the second, he made a policy statement about whether aborting such a child ought to be permitted. The first part of Akin's answer was worse than gratuitous. It made a claim he could not back up and did so in language that itself raised questions. But what about the second part of Akin's statement -- that rapists ought to be punished but not children conceived through rape? Is this a logical, morally defensible, even laudable and courageous position? A good place to find the basic premises for conducting that analysis is on the website of Mitt Romney's presidential campaign. It includes a statement explaining Romney's position on abortion. "Mitt Romney is pro-life," says the first sentence of this statement. "Mitt believes that life begins at conception and wishes that the laws of our nation reflected that view," it further says. "Because the good heart of America knows no boundaries, a commitment to protecting life should not stop at the water's edge. Taking innocent life is always wrong and always tragic, wherever it happens," it also says. "Americans have a moral duty to uphold the sanctity of life and protect the weakest, most vulnerable and most innocent among us," it concludes. "As president, Mitt will ensure that American laws reflect America's values of preserving life at home and abroad." Now, I have not quoted here every word from Romney's campaign statement on abortion. But the term "rape" does not appear in it anywhere. So, here is the syllogism a logical person might begin to construct from what Romney's campaign say about Romney's position on abortion: 1) "Life begins at conception," 2) "taking innocent life is always wrong and always tragic, wherever it happens," 3) "Americans have a moral duty to uphold the sanctity of life and protect the weakest, most vulnerable and most innocent among us," and 4) "Mitt will ensure that American laws reflect America's values of preserving life at home and abroad." Therefore? Given Romney's premises, what would be the logical position for Romney to take on whether American law should permit the taking of an innocent human life conceived through a rape? "Gov. Romney and Congressman Ryan disagree with Mr. Akin's statement, and a Romney-Ryan administration would not oppose abortion in instances of rape," Romney campaign spokeswoman Amanda Henneberg told multiple news organizations on Monday. This has been Romney's position ever since he declared himself pro-life. "I am pro-life," Romney wrote in a July 26, 2005, op-ed in the Boston Globe. "I believe that abortion is the wrong choice except in cases of incest, rape and to save the life of the mother." So, if abortion is not the "wrong choice" in cases of rape, what kind of choice is it? Who exactly benefits when the government permits the deliberate killing of an innocent child conceived through rape? "And in the quiet of conscience, people of both political parties know that more than a million abortions a year cannot be squared with the good heart of America," says the abortion statement on Romney's website. Do those same consciences think permitting the deliberate killing of some innocent children can be squared with the good heart of America -- as long as it is only certain categories of children, such as those conceived through rape? Rep. Todd Akin's substantive position that we should protect the right to life even of those conceived through rape -- who are themselves a second victim of that evil act -- is not only in keeping with the good heart of America, it is plain and simply right.
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#1. To: A K A Stone (#0)
BUWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....8D That's your Take away, Stone. Think that covers it? But you Still believe in Legitimate Rape. And that Women don't get pregnant from Legitimate Rape. It's those Juices don't cha know. WHERE"S THE WOMEN here at LF? Cause the next time a Woman comes on here, I'm bringin' it up.....;}
And that Women don't get pregnant from Legitimate Rape. I wonder if the chances of having an ectopic pregnancy goes up when conception occurs from a rape.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
I don't see why. The egg is moving here, not the sperm. Or the egg trying to escape?...;) I just had an encounter with rape. I can see now why families brought a lunch to the Hanging...;} And to be reminded every day of your life by the baby? No fcuking way. I'd anything to rid myself of Anything having to do with the rapist. (Turn out the lights, the party's over) Now this! Mr. Akin’s comments, made in an interview Sunday with a St. Louis television station, were not the only factor propelling abortion prominently into the national political dialogue. Meeting in Tampa, Fla., ahead of next week’s National Republican Convention, the party’s platform committee on Tuesday adopted a policy statement calling for a ban on abortion without an exception for rape. The Democratic National Committee immediately labeled that “the Akin Plank” as they tried to create a gender gap in both the presidential and Congressional races. Akin Says He Is Staying in Senate Race, Defying G.O.P., New York Times, August 21 Republican stalwarts gathered and drank the Cool Aid with the provision calling for a ban on abortion even in cases of rape. This is the equivalent of political suicide. This minority of the nation is so utterly callous and offensive. It is not going unnoticed. Now that it's a part of the platform, what will Romney do? Run against his party. Ed Rollins, H.R. Haldeman, even Ronald Reagan would have shut this down with absolute force early on. Too late. Name it and claim it Republicans. You are unmasked. Michael Collins August 21, 2012 - 9:03pm
So.. is terminating an ectopic pregnancy considered an abortion? If so, then I can't figure out how any obstetrician manages to avoid it.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
I'm having a debate right now on Facebook with a women who I went to elementary school with in Michigan. She's a doctor now. Her comments are very disturbing. First, she refuses to use the term abortion -- she talks about "women's health issues" instead. Second, she absolutely believes that taxpayers should be forced to pay for abortions and that that the government should force organizations to pay for employee health plans that include abortions. She thinks that a person's or organization's religious convictions are completely irrelevant to "women's health issues". We are never going to change the hearts and minds of these leftist lunatics. They completely vested in a model of government force, coercion, and tyranny. It's a waste of time even trying. All we can do is expose how crazy these people are to the rest of the population and try to defeat them at the polls.
Legitimate Rape There are women who cry rape when no rape was committed. This is called a FACT. My guess is that this is what he was trying to say, but did so very clumsily. Women don't get pregnant from Legitimate Rape There is no question that Akin is a blithering idiot -- about on the same level as the illustrious Joe Biden. Here's the difference -- the GOP tried to get Akin to resign while the Democrats continue to embrace the walking embarrassment better known as the Vice President. It demonstrates a fundamental difference in the character of the people who make up the two parties.
Actually Akin (and many who claim to be pro-life) have the position that women should not be allowed to decide whether or not they are willing to make the sacrifice to carry to term, a rapists' spawn. I believe it is each woman's human right to make this decision.
That simply means someone that was really raped and not pretending to be raped in order to get an abortion. That would be what people did if the constitution was followed and abortion was unlawful instead of color of law legal.
She sounds insane.
I believe it is each woman's human right to make this decision. Hello Jameson. Is that the only instance that you approve of abortion? Now lets be honest. If abortion is murder. Then if you carry that out to the logical conclusion wouldn't you have to conclude that an abortion in the case of rape is still a taking of innocent life. It would be punishing the kid for the fathers crime. That is what I believe. I know it is asking a lot for a woman to carry a baby that that is there because she is a victim of rape. But killing a baby is also not right. We live in a fallen world and that is some of the consequences of sin. If people obeyed Gods law there wouldn't be any abortions. Then there would be no need for the debate if someone should get an abortion because they were raped. So just because there is sin in the world. Doesn't mean that we have to accept murder as right.
On second thought. Tell her she is right abortion is not a very good term. Murder is more accurate.
I don't approve of abortion. However, I also don't think anyone should have the right to make a life or death decision regarding the victim of rape. right or wrong.... it is the victim's choice, not yours - and not mine. it's that simple.
No woman should have to bear the young of someone who committed such a heinous act of violence against her. I support abortion in instances of incest and rape.
No baby should be ripped to shreds because of something their father did. Would you at least be in favor of giving the baby pain killers before the murder?
I knew you were for abortion. Just like I know you are going to vote for the one that looks like your son. Liar.
Actually, this has always been my position. You just never paid attention to the scores of times I offered it. A woman is not breeding stock. She is a human being who has a right to have her mental health to be given consideration. If it would be torture and trauma to let a man do this to her, she should definitely have the right to end the pregnancy in the case of rape, or if the pregnancy endangers her life. All you show here is you never hear anything unless it is what you want to hear. and you have no consideration for anyone but yourself.
Would you at least be in favor of giving the baby pain killers before the murder?" No man should assault a woman and do grievous physical harm to her and destroy her sense of well being and human dignity. A rapist is never a father; just a criminal who does not have the right to physically assault people and destroy important aspects of their lives. 75% of Americans believe as I do on this question, many of them just as pro-life as I am about abortion. I'd worry about that if you indeed want Willard and his dog Ryan who is an Akin clone in the unpopular 'person-hood for a fertilized egg game to be elected.
Your calice disregard for the unborn. I know. It was kind of my point. Mrs Infanticide.
I support the woman's right to decide. 100% and I'll never support anyone who does not.
100% and I'll never support anyone who does not. I think if a woman gets an abortion. She and the abortionist should be shot in the head. Either that or set up a fake abortion clinic. When the slut comes to kill her baby. Lock her up until she delivers. Then execute the slut for attempted murder. You lack morals.
So according to the rat Obama supporter. Assault is worse then murder. Got ya dork.
What hypocrisy!!! You push your morality, but when it comes to walking the talk, you fold up like a cheap suit. WRT abortion, ultimately it comes down to the decision of the woman. You cannot force a woman to carry a baby to full term, no matter *what* you think. You can possibly influence, cajole, beg, whatever, but the practical fact is that *your* wishes will never be the only consideration, no matter what you think. So you can take your righteous attitude, and shove it all up your fat ass.
You support murderers. Noted. You're part of the problem with America.
100% and I'll never support anyone who does not. You have a 1970's mentality, set in stone before science understood what actually happens in the womb.
Oh really? what do you mean? you said: "science understood what actually happens in the womb." what do you mean by this?
I know a girl, 25, who has a lot of casual sex with a lot of partners, but for whatever reason, she will not use birth control. She has had 5 abortions. She uses abortion as birth control. Do you support that?
"If men through fear, fraud or mistake, should in terms renounce and give up any essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the great end of society, would absolutely vacate such renunciation; the right to freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of Man to alienate this gift, and voluntarily become a slave." Samuel Adams, Rights of the Colonists, 1772
She has had 5 abortions. She uses abortion as birth control. Do you support that? The discussion has been focused on the right of women who have been raped to dispose of the evil spawn of their attackers.... I guess you've failed to keep up.... your question has nothing to do with our discussion. But since you've asked.... No, I find the scenario you've presented to be quite tragic. (even if it is a made up story)
Yes it does. You brought it in when you said you support the right to kill your unborn 100 percent of the time.
I guess you've failed to keep up.... I guess it's you who has failed to keep up, since the article may be about rape and abortion, but the discussion has been about abortion in general. You even chimed in saying you're 100% for a woman's right to choose. Or, did you mean the right to choose to be raped? your question has nothing to do with our discussion. Wrong again, as I've already shown. But since you've asked.... No, I find the scenario you've presented to be quite tragic. Thanks, that's all you had to say, since I was merely curious about not only your political stance but also your intelligence level. (even if it is a made up story) Wow, wrong again. The girl is my wife's niece. I'm no longer curious about your political stance or your intelligence level.
"If men through fear, fraud or mistake, should in terms renounce and give up any essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the great end of society, would absolutely vacate such renunciation; the right to freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of Man to alienate this gift, and voluntarily become a slave." Samuel Adams, Rights of the Colonists, 1772
Really? Where did I SAY that? Your righteous indignation and false piety don't square with your own actions, stone... You talk the talk, you can't walk it. You're just another lunatic holy-roller, who hides his shame and internal emptiness by shouting even louder at others about how they are not what you demand. And let's face it- nobody really gives a shit what you think, especially WRT religion. It's not your business, and you're 'judgement' has all the value of a fart in a high wind.
WRT abortion, ultimately it comes down to the decision of the woman. You cannot force a woman to carry a baby to full term, no matter *what* you think.
100% and I'll never support anyone who does not. Learn to read and comprehend.....
100% and I'll never support anyone who does not. again, your failure to read and comprehend ........
I didn't care about your curiosity before you responded to me, and I care even less now. I don't care about your story, and I don't care about your need to share your shame with a bunch of random people on the net. Any woman who has been the victim of RAPE should have the right to kill off the spawn of her attacker, without the approval of anyone. That's my point. nothing more and nothing less.
I don't care about what you don't care about. That's my point. I don't care. You may go now.
"If men through fear, fraud or mistake, should in terms renounce and give up any essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the great end of society, would absolutely vacate such renunciation; the right to freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of Man to alienate this gift, and voluntarily become a slave." Samuel Adams, Rights of the Colonists, 1772
Thank you for admitting your mistake. Now quit trying to put words in my mouth, you moronic hypocrite
You're arguing the fcuking position.... Case Closed.
There are women who cry rape when no rape was committed. This is called a FACT. My guess is that this is what he was trying to say, but did so very clumsily. Women don't get pregnant from Legitimate Rape There is no question that Akin is a blithering idiot -- about on the same level as the illustrious Joe Biden. Here's the difference -- the GOP tried to get Akin to resign while the Democrats continue to embrace the walking embarrassment better known as the Vice President. It demonstrates a fundamental difference in the character of the people who make up the two parties. Better than A K A. but you're Still arguing the position. Every Day More and more realize there Is No difference between Akin/the GOP.
Rep. Todd Akin's substantive position that we should protect the right to life even of those conceived through rape -- who are themselves a second victim of that evil act -- is not only in keeping with the good heart of America, it is plain and simply right.
#2. To: mcgowanjm (#1)
But you Still believe in Legitimate Rape.
#3. To: mininggold (#2)
chances of having an ectopic pregnancy
#4. To: mcgowanjm, AKA Stone (#3)
#5. To: A K A Stone (#0)
(Edited)
"we must as a species go into a period of shrinkage that we have not experienced since the Dark Ages and the Black Plague" -- lucysmom
#6. To: mcgowanjm (#1)
(Edited)
"we must as a species go into a period of shrinkage that we have not experienced since the Dark Ages and the Black Plague" -- lucysmom
#7. To: A K A Stone (#0)
Rep. Todd Akin's substantive position that we should protect the right to life even of those conceived through rape.
#8. To: mcgowanjm (#1)
But you Still believe in Legitimate Rape.
#9. To: jwpegler (#5)
#10. To: Jameson (#7)
Actually Akin (and many who claim to be pro-life) have the position that women should not be allowed to decide whether or not they are willing to make the sacrifice to carry to term, a rapists' spawn.
#11. To: jwpegler (#5)
First, she refuses to use the term abortion -- she talks about "women's health issues" instead.
#12. To: A K A Stone (#10)
Is that the only instance that you approve of abortion?
#13. To: Jameson (#12)
#14. To: Ferret Mike (#13)
No woman should have to bear the young of someone who committed such a heinous act of violence against her. I support abortion in instances of incest and rape.
#15. To: Ferret Mike (#13)
. I support abortion in instances of incest and rape.
#16. To: A K A Stone (#15)
"I knew you were for abortion. Just like I know you are going to vote for the one that looks like your son."
#17. To: A K A Stone (#14)
"No baby should be ripped to shreds because of something their father did.
#18. To: Ferret Mike (#16)
Actually, this has always been my position
#19. To: Ferret Mike (#13)
I support abortion in instances of incest and rape.
#20. To: Jameson (#19)
I support the woman's right to decide.
#21. To: Ferret Mike (#17)
#22. To: A K A Stone (#20)
You lack morals.
"I am relying on my personal experience with Morons, which have been universally positive." -jwpegler
#23. To: Capitalist Eric (#22)
#24. To: Jameson (#19)
I support the woman's right to decide.
"we must as a species go into a period of shrinkage that we have not experienced since the Dark Ages and the Black Plague" -- lucysmom
#25. To: jwpegler (#24)
You have a 1970's mentality, set in stone before science understood what actually happens in the womb.
#26. To: Jameson (#19)
#27. To: We The People (#26)
I know a girl, 25, who has a lot of casual sex with a lot of partners, but for whatever reason, she will not use birth control.
#28. To: Jameson (#27)
your question has nothing to do with our discussion.
#29. To: Jameson (#27)
The discussion has been focused on the right of women who have been raped to dispose of the evil spawn of their attackers....
#30. To: A K A Stone (#23)
You support murderers. Noted.
"I am relying on my personal experience with Morons, which have been universally positive." -jwpegler
#31. To: Capitalist Eric (#30)
Really? Where did I SAY that?
#32. To: A K A Stone (#20)
I support abortion in instances of incest and rape. I support the woman's right to decide.
#33. To: A K A Stone (#28)
I support abortion in instances of incest and rape. I support the woman's right to decide.
#34. To: We The People (#29)
I'm no longer curious about your political stance or your intelligence level.
#35. To: Jameson (#34)
#36. To: A K A Stone (#31)
"I am relying on my personal experience with Morons, which have been universally positive." -jwpegler
#37. To: A K A Stone, SJN, All (#8)
That simply means someone that was really raped and not pretending to be raped in order to get an abortion. That would be what people did if the constitution was followed and abortion was unlawful instead of color of law legal.
#38. To: jwpegler (#6)
Legitimate Rape
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