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Title: Three Articles that help explain Israel
Source:
WELS (Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod)
URL Source: http://www.wels.net/news-events/for ... december-2008/invisible-church
Published: Jun 24, 2012
Author: various - Noted at end of each article.
Post Date: 2012-06-24 10:03:21 by SJN
Keywords: None
Views: 260777
Comments: 482
The Invisible Church As the Bible describes the church, it becomes clear that the church is both what we see and what we cannot see. Church. The word paints a picture. You see the building in which you worship. It may be a small, white-frame building set on a hill in the quiet countryside. Or it may be a large, stone structure occupying a street corner in a busy city. It’s not unusual for us to think of a building when we think of church. Worship is an important part of our lives, and that worship takes place in a building we love, whether it is fancy or plain. But that is not the way the word church is used in the Bible. In Scripture, church most often refers to people and not to buildings. The church is invisible In the New Testament the word ecclesia is often translated as church. Ecclesia refers to a group of people who have been called together. It is an assembly. Yet even that definition does not fully explain what the church is. As the Bible describes the church, it becomes clear that the church is both what we see and what we cannot see. The church is both visible and invisible. Why would we call a church invisible? You can see a building. You can see the people who gather in that building. Yet we do speak of the church as invisible in the Apostles’ Creed when we confess “I believe in the holy Christian church, the communion of saints.” Sometimes people mistakenly use the term saint to refer to a person who does an abundance of good deeds, someone who helps others. But the Bible uses the term to describe simply a believer. We even distinguish between believers who have been called home to heaven and those who still battle in this world. We speak of saints triumphant and saints militant. The apostle Peter describes these believers as “a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God” (1 Peter 2:9). Together all believers form the holy Christian church, a “spiritual house” made up of living stones chosen by God. When the Holy Spirit works faith in our hearts, we become part of this structure. The Lord Jesus can see the faith in our hearts. We, however, can only see the fruits of faith and not the faith itself. Because we cannot see faith, the church is invisible to our eyes. The prophet Elijah did not recognize that there were still seven thousand believers in Israel (1 Kings 19:8-18). He thought that he was the only believer left. Likewise, we cannot always tell whether a person is a believer or an unbeliever. As the Bible describes the church, it becomes clear that the church is both what we see and what we cannot see. Although the church may be invisible to us, the Lord sees his church clearly. “The Lord knows those who are his” (2 Timothy 2:19). At the same time each person knows what is in his or her heart. Trusting in the promises the Lord gives us, we know that we belong to that communion of saints, the church of God. Characteristics of the invisible church This invisible gathering of all believers is not limited by geography. The apostle John reminds us that believers come from different places and “from every nation, tribe, people and language” (Revelation 7:9). In addition, the church is not limited by time. All believers who have lived, are now living, and will live until Jesus returns at the end of time—all these believers are part of this church. The church, the body of all believers, is invisible, and it is also universal. Once again we confess this fact in the Third Article of the Apostles’ Creed. “I believe in the holy Christian church.” The first people who used this confession of faith said, “I believe in the holy catholic church.” The word catholic originally had no denominational connotation. It simply meant universal. When catholic became associated with a particular organization, the word Christian was substituted to prevent confusion. In the Apostles’ Creed we confess that we believe that the Lord gathers together everyone whose faith is in Jesus Christ as the Savior. People believe in many things. We say that we believe in our team, in our country, and in people who are dear to us. Likewise, many people believe in some religious figure other than Christ. God’s invisible church gathers together only those people who confess Jesus as their Savior. We distinguish ourselves from the followers of Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, and every other religion. We confess that Jesus Christ is true man and true God. We believe that Christ is sinless and perfect and that he is the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. As the Bible describes the church, it becomes clear that the church is both what we see and what we cannot see. In a world that suggests that it does not matter what you believe as long as you believe, it becomes important to remember that the invisible church gathers together all believers in Christ. Without faith in Jesus we cannot be saved. Without Jesus we have no part in the communion of saints, the gathering of all believers. Jesus makes that clear when he says, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). People die. Church buildings may fall apart. Congregations may disband. But the invisible church continues. The Lord has promised that there will always be true believers who are kept faithful by the power of God. “My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand” (John 10:27,28). What a comfort it is to know that the Holy Spirit, who calls us to faith, also preserves us in that faith through the gospel in Word and sacraments! It is easy to become attached to a congregation. It is in that fellowship that we listen to the good news of Jesus proclaimed. There we hear that our sins are forgiven. In our congregation we draw close to Jesus as we receive the sacrament of his body and blood. Likewise the building in which a congregation worships may be a special place. It may be the same structure in which we were baptized, confirmed, and married. It reminds us of all the blessings God has showered upon us. But we are part of something that is even more valuable, the holy Christian church. Our triune God has brought us together with people we may never see or know on this side of eternity. Through faith the Lord has made us a part of the congregation of all believers. Right now we are not able to see this church in its entirety. Yet what is invisible to our eyes now will be seen when the Lord returns in glory. What a joy it will be to see all believers from every part of the world and from all times! The day will come when we will gather together and praise the God of grace who gives us membership in his family, the invisible church. That church is not really invisible. It is only invisible to us. God sees it clearly. James Korthals, a professor at Wisconsin Lutheran Seminary, Mequon, Wisconsin, is a member at David’s Star, Jackson. Peter's Picture of the Church 1 Peter 2:4-10 The word "temple" in our modern society usually describes a large, beautiful building which is used for the worship of some god. The use of such temples goes back thousands of years. Peter used it to paint a beautiful word picture of Jesus and his church in 2:4-8. Made up of living stones Jesus is pictured in many ways in John's gospel. Peter adds his own picture here, when he writes, "The Lord Jesus is the living stone" (v. 4). In verse 6 he gives the original source for this statement (Isaiah 28:16), where God said, "Look! I'm laying a stone in Zion [another name for Israel], a very special cornerstone of great value, and the person who believes in him will never be disappointed." In the ancient world the cornerstone was more than a stone on which was carved the date of construction. The cornerstone determined the length, the width, and the height of the building, so that the whole building depended on that cornerstone. That is the picture Peter uses to describe the church in verse 5a, where he says, "And since you are living stones, as you come to him you are built up into a spiritual temple," of which Jesus is the cornerstone. The church is built on Jesus, and around Jesus, the cornerstone. And it is made up of people who are like Jesus--perfectly holy beings in God's sight. That is the way God sees every person who truly believes in Jesus as his or her Savior, because our God-given faith makes us new creatures who are perfectly holy in God's sight, and every such person "will never be disappointed" on Judgment Day. Then Peter explains in verse 7, "This means that he's of great value to you people who believe in him, but for those who don't believe in him, 'the stone which the builders [the Jewish nation as a whole] decided was no good, is the very one which has become the cornerstone'; and 'the stone which will make people stumble, and the rock which will make them fall.' "How clear Peter makes it that Jesus is the difference between eternal life and eternal damnation. We are now a holy group of priests Next Peter uses a new metaphor in verse 5 when he says that the believers who come to Jesus as living stones "are built up into a spiritual temple, to be a holy group of priests, who offer up spiritual sacrifices which God is happy to receive." He continues in verses 9,10, "There was a time when you were no people at all, but now you are God's people. You who never knew God's mercy have now received his mercy." Praise the Lord! Peter is reminding us that there was a time when we were all outsiders, so far as God is concerned, unbelievers who had never heard of the triune God. But now that we have heard the good news and have come to believe it, we are God's people, while the Jews, as a nation, have rejected their Messiah and are outsiders. Now you must take note of the fact that every believer is a priest whose principal occupation it is to offer spiritual sacrifices to our triune God each day of our lives. Yes, from morning to evening we offer our God our thanks and praises for the undeserved love he has shown us by sending first his Son to atone for all our sins, and then his Holy Spirit who has brought us to believe the good news that all our sins are forgiven by Jesus' death on the cross, so that we are now God's children who are perfectly holy in God's sight. Our task as priests is to also bring him our other sacrifices. First there are our time and our talents which we spend carrying out the different tasks we can do as members of our congregations. In some cases we may give our Lord all of our time and talents to serve as pastors, teachers, missionaries, or church office workers. All of us, whether we are active workers or not, can offer the Lord a portion of our financial resources, which represent the value of our time spent in some gainful occupation. And of course the temple in which we serve is known to us as the church, the whole body of believers. The picture of the church that Peter gives us here is perhaps the most complete picture to be found anywhere in the Bible. Julian Anderson is a retired pastor and seminary professor living in Naples, Florida. Samuel: A Judge in Israel Concentrating on the Lord is daunting when dangers clamor for attention. Think back 300 years before Samuel. Following the death of those who carved a Jewish homeland out of Canaan, “another generation grew up, who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel” (Judges 2:10). To awaken his spiritually-anesthetized people, God enlisted neighboring nations to harass, enslave, and terrorize Israel. Slapped to consciousness, God’s people recognized their sin, pleaded for forgiveness, and prayed for relief. God then raised up leaders—judges—who with the Lord’s power pushed back the oppressors. Moral and spiritual health flourished. But “when the judge died, the people returned to ways even more corrupt than those of their fathers . . .” (Judges 2:19). Repenting to God This cycle of godlessness, oppression, repentance, freedom, upright living, and a return to godlessness repeated itself until Samuel. Remember Eli and his sons? 1 Samuel 7 brings us to a repentance and freedom section of that cycle and to Samuel as Israel’s final judge. The Ark of the Covenant remained in the border town of Kiriath-Jearim for 20 years after the Philistines captured it and then returned it to stem a Lord-induced plague. During those two decades “all the people of Israel mourned and sought after the Lord” (7:2). To confirm that renaissance of faith, Samuel summoned his countrymen to a spiritually essential, but politically provocative, act—national purification and rededication. Israel was not a free country. Philistine overlords kept close watch. When their surveillance noticed huge numbers of Israelites staging at Mizpah (literally, “look out point”), their early-warning alarms wailed. Mizpah was a military gem mounted in hills about eight miles north of Jerusalem. Soon the sound of Philistine marching boots, the clank of armor, and the bellow of war trumpets echoed off Mizpah. “When the Israelites heard of it, they were afraid . . .” (7:7). No doubt. Concentrating on the Lord is daunting when dangers (dare we add personal problems or financial difficulties) clamor for attention. Victory through God Samuel, however, urged Israel to fasten on God. “Do not stop crying out to the Lord our God for us, that he may rescue us” (7:8). Strength was not in their military might, but in the Lord’s omnipotence. God confirmed that. With Israeli knees bent in prayer and without an Israeli sword unsheathed, God’s deafening thunder routed the Philistine army. Panicked, the troops stumbled south toward safety. Their backs made easy targets. The Philistine losses that day did not completely free Israel. We await Saul and David to accomplish that. Israel, however, did enjoy a season of peace with Philistia and, as a fringe benefit, with the Amorites. Concentrating on the Lord is daunting when dangers clamor for attention. To mark the victory, Samuel set up a monument called Ebenezer (“stone of help”). Ebenezer stones (church cornerstones, wedding anniversaries, birthdays) remind us, “Thus far has the Lord helped us.” But our most conclusive proof that there’s always an upside in our downside world is Jesus, “the stone the builders rejected [that] has become the capstone” (1 Peter 2:7). James A. Aderman is pastor at Fairview, Milwaukee.
(The Following article should help to illuminate why the Nation of Israel and it's people have seen thousands of years of turmoil).
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#19. To: SJN, mcgowanjm (#18)
The Roots of Christian Zionism sowed by Scofield The Roots of Christian Zionism sowed by Scofield from Chuck Coty on Vimeo.
I am more interested in Christians who have either misunderstood the clear scripture on just what Israel is/means, or have purposefully warped what the Bible has to say. So many Christians have bought in to the Israel propaganda and seem unwilling to look at what the Gospel actually says. (Yes, the fallout of such misunderstanding is politically clear).
I'll listen to more of this video later. I only caught a little bit of it for now. But yes, clearly Dispensationalism is contrary to various clear and explicit Bible statements and based on misinterpretations of several Bible prophecies (mostly in the Old Testament).
You have planks over your eyes and your heart is stone cold. Jimmy's mad at God...Because the Free Will he's given man has been abused (by listening too much to the whispers of Satan). Thus, Jimmy's (ironically) agree to do Satan's bidding. As "revenge". If THAT isn't crazy, what is?? May our Lord and Savior have mercy on you. That depends on Jimmy humbling hilsef, doesn't it?
The Dark hates the Light.
JM's resistance of the beast you worship is truly the work of the Lord. Jesus, afterall, was a rebel.
Sorry, I failed to ping you to #24
So...It's your contention that God is to blame for JM's rejection of God...and worship of Satan? Wanna clarify?
No God, no Satan. One can't exist without the other. So when is God going to do domething about this Satan person? Waiting...waiting...waiting...
I guess God doesn't think this would be as interesting a place without ole Satan here to mix things up a little.
Ha. The last thing that needs to happen is for the gods to pull up this planets file for review. It won't be pretty when it happens.
Never swear "allegiance" to anything other than the 'right to change your mind'!
A self-evident truth.
Yeah, I s'pose a little diversity never hurt anyone.
Btw, I believe in a creator. I'm just not sure of his religious affiliation.
First....It's Mister Jimmie to you, Lib...;} Second...not mad at anyone....I don't get mad...I get even. Your god(s) fucked up the planet they created. Planet Hell. Second....It's ONLY free will until us 30 year long(period of Independence from ancestor fuckups and senility;) mortals decide that it IS PLANET HELL and act accordingly.... and then your vengeful god(d) who fucked this place up and created us decide to send us to the ETERNAL Burning tire Junk pile.... That's your god? Fuck him.....;}
;}
That depends on the nature of "doing something"... Do you mean eliminate Satan? That'll be after the Second Coming....Until then, the Evil of Satan is becoming increasingly stronger during his last days (which is upon us).... For now Satan is given a free shot at whispering in your ear about sinning, reed, being your own god, etc., and ignoring Jesus' offer of Eternal Life (see John 3:16). So for now you have your own FREE WILL to do as you please. Choose wisely. No God, no Satan. One can't exist without the other. Yes, both exist. And so do demons. We see God in some people AND the Devil - THAT much is clear even to an Un-Believer.
Will you pass The Almighty's test and humble yourself? Or succumb to your nature and the lies of Satan? The REALLY "interesting" place will be God's Heaven - and its unimaginable glory. The OTHER place - not so much. Imagine spending ALL Eternity with THE worst of human elements.
It won't be pretty when it happens. That's called 'Judgment Day'. When the Book of Life is opened, and the record of EVERY SINGLE moment of your life is recorded (we have ALL sinned) it won't be pretty. THE Big Question: Will *your* name be there? Or will Jesus Christ testify on your behalf? God will NOT allow sinners NOT cleansed by the Blood of Jesus (that's everyone, btw) into His Kingdom (barring special circumstances that ONLY He knows).
Only if you let it consume your soul.
Close, but NO cigar come Judgment Day. You may want to refine your belief and invest in the destination of your soul. Just sayin'...
Don't forget to give him a tract. I'm sure he's interested after your ... ugh, blather.
. When Jesus Christ said "it is finished."
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
I see the tracts are getting under the skin a bit. Perhaps you would like to take it beyond a 23 page tract, Biff? As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world he didn't exist." As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
SJN: Amen Sister, says it all.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
And unless and until you do....well....here I am..... And just like that you disappear!!! You were given a padded room by Stonie for a reason. Enjoy your silence:
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
Just to get confirmation based on your post...are you a preterist? If you are, because Chuck Coty is, then you should really put up some actual quotes from Scofield that show how he is a zionist or encouraged zionism.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
I'm in Mexifornia - I'm already there.
For now Satan is given a free shot at whispering in your ear about sinning, reed, being your own god, etc., and ignoring Jesus' offer of Eternal Life (see John 3:16). So for now you have your own FREE WILL to do as you please. Choose wisely. Beautifully put. We have free will exactly so we can determine our own paths. Even in the midst of evil, some people have acted righteously and nobly. (Think Hitler and people hiding/helping Jews at their own risk).
Can't argue with your statements. What is interesting is men like Scofield and Ironside wrote their books well before Israel became a nation again. Not one of the dispensational writers equate the current nation of Israel to the prophetic Israel after the second Coming of Christ. Gentlemen like Scofield, Ironside and Ryrie are used as "striking posts" for preterists who do not believe in a physical second Coming of Christ and a physical Kingdom on earth for 1000 years as mentioned in Revelation. They believe all has been fulfilled. Some preterists believe there will be a Second Coming but it will not be like Revelation outlines. Some believe along with the postmillennials that the Second Coming is real but there is no 1000 years of Christ's reign on earth. In both cases I see more of a straying from the Bible than they claim of the premillennials. At the two extremes I see major issues. One is given over to detailed timelines that many take as "certain." On the flip side the other group thinks all prophecy is fulfilled to include Revelation or discard Revelation. Like you, I try to keep it simple and look at what HAS BEEN revealed and not try to go off on tangents that are not there. In the end all this prophecy sniping has accomplished one thing. Dividing the Body of Christ. To the point where one side calls the other the "h" word and end fellowship. Just the "thing" the adversary wants to see. If you are interested, John MacArthur has a sermon on the future of Israel at this link: www.gty.o rg/Downloads/PDF...thur_on_future_israel.pdf MacArthur is the most neutral figure on the debate that I have come across. If you do read the link, let me know what you think. And if I seemed slippery in the above paragraphs I will state clearly. I do believe there will be a physical Reign of Jesus Christ on earth for 1000 years before the Great White Throne Judgment. And this is why: Revelation 19 New King James Version (NKJV) 19 After these things I heard[a] a loud voice of a great multitude in heaven, saying, “Alleluia! Salvation and glory and honor and power belong to the Lord [b] our God! 2 For true and righteous are His judgments, because He has judged the great harlot who corrupted the earth with her fornication; and He has avenged on her the blood of His servants shed by her.” 3 Again they said, “Alleluia! Her smoke rises up forever and ever!” 4 And the twenty-four elders and the four living creatures fell down and worshiped God who sat on the throne, saying, “Amen! Alleluia!” 5 Then a voice came from the throne, saying, “Praise our God, all you His servants and those who fear Him, both[c] small and great!” 6 And I heard, as it were, the voice of a great multitude, as the sound of many waters and as the sound of mighty thunderings, saying, “Alleluia! For the[d] Lord God Omnipotent reigns! 7 Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints. 9 Then he said to me, “Write: ‘Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!’” And he said to me, “These are the true sayings of God.” 10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, “See that you do not do that! I am your fellow servant, and of your brethren who have the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.” 11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. 12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had[e] a name written that no one knew except Himself. 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean,[f] followed Him on white horses. 15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp[g] sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS. 17 Then I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the birds that fly in the midst of heaven, “Come and gather together for the supper of the great God,[h] 18 that you may eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of captains, the flesh of mighty men, the flesh of horses and of those who sit on them, and the flesh of all people, free[i] and slave, both small and great.” 19 And I saw the beast, the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against Him who sat on the horse and against His army. 20 Then the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone. 21 And the rest were killed with the sword which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh. Revelation Chapter 20 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished. But after these things he must be released for a little while. 4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a[a] thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years. 7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. 9 They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. 10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where[b] the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. 11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God,[c] and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.[d] 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.(NKJV)
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
Could not get the vid to work but will try again. I guess my point is, it is nice to view a video hit piece without actually reading the works of dispensationalists. I have read the works of Scofield, Ironside and Ryrie. If someone would like to point out just what portions of Scriptures they got wrong, I can comment. I see too often hit pieces try to tell the story with innuendo from one side. I also challenge anyone to produce something that shows a traditional dispensationalist has departed from Biblical christology and soteriology.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
SJN: Amen Sister, says it all. It is my understanding that you do not believe women are to be telling (teaching or preaching) men anything. Given this, I find your comment as referred above to SJN's posting that I've bolded in the quoted material. Am I incorrect in my understanding? If you desire, I will tell you where I received my 'undertanding' from.
Given I won't repost in the quote box your profanity, please note the post I respond to. Mr. Jim you have to make up your mind. Are you serious about blaming God when in another breath you tell us He does not exist and that gaia is your god? Then is gaia to blame and what kind of gaia is it if it let things get out of control? Your entire persona is a huge contradiction. What is evident is anger at the sad state of worldly affairs. For that you get no argument. Where we part company is with the Solution. You have anger towards the awful things going on in the world and project that anger towards those who offer the Gospel, which IS THE ANSWER. But you reject that Message because you choose to live by the same standards of life of which is the world you hate.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
Given this, I find your comment as referred above to SJN's posting that I've bolded in the quoted material. Am I incorrect in my understanding? If you desire, I will tell you where I received my 'undertanding' from. This is a Bible study thread. I showed agreement with her quote about presenting the Gospel. SJN is not preaching or telling to me what we both already know. It was brotherly encouragement for posting a piece on the Great Commission. And yes, rowdee we receive our understanding from God through His Holy Word and His Holy Spirit.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
I fully understand this thread as being a Bible Study, and I think it is great. What I was attempting to point out was that SJN's article pointed to the Gospel being spread worldwide....and you specifically noted to her what she had posted 'says it all'. It couldn't say it all if there are only certain classes of people who could do such spreading of God's Word. Hence, the bringing of women into the issue of spreading the Word. While you apparently know one another, there are many who will just read and be silent as they attempt to learn more. SJN is evangelizing, spreading the word, even if they are commentaries written by others--she surely believes in the doctrines, etc. Heaven knows how badly this old world needs His words spread. Sorry if you thought I was attempting to subvert the thread.
Heaven knows how badly this old world needs His words spread. Sorry if you thought I was attempting to subvert the thread. Rowdee, you are not subverting the thread, and I do know clearly your intent on bringing up the issue. You are correct in a sense that over the past year or so SJN, me and others (here and at LP) have asked for prayers for various illnesses, and family members and have, as much as you can in "posting land", formed a fellowship of prayer and sharing Scriptures. I do not "pretend" to be a pastor and don't think SJN is seeing herself as at the pulpit preaching to men in the congregation. I wish you could have been here a few months ago when there was a person who tried doing this.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
How exactly do you know what are the lies of Satan? He doesn't exactly go around and give press conferences to publicize his activities.
As iron sharpens iron, So a man sharpens the countenance of his friend. -Proverbs 27:17 (NKJV)
lol Well that it about as clear as mud.
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#20. To: whyofcourse (#19)
#21. To: whyofcourse (#19)
#22. To: SJN, Satan's Tool, mcgowanjm (#5)
I have no doubt that anything to do with the Gospel is "crazyland" to you.
#23. To: SJN, mcgowanjm (#18)
I don't post anything on your thread. Why don't you try treating individuals as they treat you, instead of lumping people together?
#24. To: Liberator (#22)
#25. To: mcgowanjm (#17)
#26. To: Logsplitter (#24)
JM's resistance of the beast you worship is truly the work of the Lord.
#27. To: Liberator (#26)
#28. To: Logsplitter (#27)
(Edited)
So when is God going to do domething about this Satan person?
#29. To: Logsplitter (#27)
So when is God going to do domething about this Satan person? Waiting...waiting...waiting...
#30. To: Logsplitter (#27)
One can't exist without the other.
#31. To: NewsJunky (#28)
#32. To: Liberator (#26)
#33. To: Liberator, All (#22)
Jimmy's mad at God..Because the Free Will he's given
#34. To: Logsplitter (#24)
JM's resistance of the beast you worship is truly the work of the Lord. Jesus, afterall, was a rebel.
#35. To: Logsplitter, Redleghunter (#27)
So when is God going to do domething about this Satan person? Waiting...waiting...waiting...
#36. To: NewsJunky, Logsplitter (#28)
I guess God doesn't think this would be as interesting a place without ole Satan here to mix things up a little.
#37. To: Brian S, Logsplitter (#29)
Ha. The last thing that needs to happen is for the gods to pull up this planets file for review.
#38. To: Logsplitter (#31)
Yeah, I s'pose a little diversity never hurt anyone.
#39. To: Logsplitter (#32)
Btw, I believe in a creator. I'm just not sure of his religious affiliation.
#40. To: Liberator (#39)
Say hello to your grandma for me.
#41. To: Liberator, Logsplitter (#35)
So when is God going to do domething about this Satan person? Waiting...waiting...waiting... That depends on the nature of "doing something"...
#42. To: Biff Tannen, Liberator (#40)
Don't forget to give him a tract. I'm sure he's interested after your ... ugh, blather.
#43. To: Logsplitter, Liberator (#27)
No God, no Satan. One can't exist without the other. So when is God going to do domething about this Satan person? Waiting...waiting...waiting...
#44. To: SJN, Biff Tannen, Liberator (#1)
"Our calling as the church is to preach the gospel. However, the call to preach the gospel is like a two-sided coin. One aspect of preaching the gospel is sharing the Word and promises of God with both the lost and the found. But on the other side of the coin, preaching the gospel also means to keep the Word for the world. As the Bible encourages us: "Watch your life and doctrine closely" (1 Timothy 4:16). "Be ready always to give an answer" (1 Peter 3:15; KJV). "Rightly dividing the word of truth" (2 Timothy 2:15; KJV). Christ did not intend for us to have only one side of the coin or the other. They are two different aspects of the same call. Christ wants us to both share the Word and keep the Word so that both we and our hearers be saved."
#45. To: mcgowanjm, SJN, A K A Stone (#16)
You keep your holy roller ziofundy bible cartoons off my thread and I'll stauy away from yours....
#46. To: whyofcourse (#19)
#47. To: Liberator (#36)
Imagine spending ALL Eternity with THE worst of human elements.
#48. To: Liberator, Logsplitter, Redleghunter (#35)
Do you mean eliminate Satan? That'll be after the Second Coming....Until then, the Evil of Satan is becoming increasingly stronger during his last days (which is upon us)....
#49. To: SJN (#20)
I am more interested in Christians who have either misunderstood the clear scripture on just what Israel is/means, or have purposefully warped what the Bible has to say. So many Christians have bought in to the Israel propaganda and seem unwilling to look at what the Gospel actually says. (Yes, the fallout of such misunderstanding is politically clear).
#50. To: SJN, whyofcourse (#21)
I'll listen to more of this video later. I only caught a little bit of it for now. But yes, clearly Dispensationalism is contrary to various clear and explicit Bible statements and based on misinterpretations of several Bible prophecies (mostly in the Old Testament).
#51. To: redleghunter, Liberator, SJN (#44)
Our calling as the church is to preach the gospel. However, the call to preach the gospel is like a two-sided coin. One aspect of preaching the gospel is sharing the Word and promises of God with both the lost and the found. But on the other side of the coin, preaching the gospel also means to keep the Word for the world. As the Bible encourages us: "Watch your life and doctrine closely" (1 Timothy 4:16). "Be ready always to give an answer" (1 Peter 3:15; KJV). "Rightly dividing the word of truth" (2 Timothy 2:15; KJV). Christ did not intend for us to have only one side of the coin or the other. They are two different aspects of the same call. Christ wants us to both share the Word and keep the Word so that both we and our hearers be saved."
#52. To: mcgowanjm, Liberator (#33)
#53. To: rowdee (#51)
It is my understanding that you do not believe women are to be telling (teaching or preaching) men anything.
#54. To: redleghunter (#53)
#55. To: rowdee, SJN, GarySpFc, Liberator (#54)
While you apparently know one another, there are many who will just read and be silent as they attempt to learn more. SJN is evangelizing, spreading the word, even if they are commentaries written by others--she surely believes in the doctrines, etc.
#56. To: Liberator, Logsplitter (#36)
the lies of Satan?
#57. To: NewsJunky (#56)
How exactly do you know what are the lies of Satan? He doesn't exactly go around and give press conferences to publicize his activities.
#58. To: redleghunter (#57)
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