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Title: Have seen effects of Keystone pipeline
Source:
Yuma Sun
URL Source: http://www.yumasun.com/opinion/keystone-76953-yuma-canada.html
Published: Feb 23, 2012
Author: Anthony James Fornof
Post Date: 2012-02-25 23:05:01 by lucysmom
Keywords: None
Views: 44463
Comments: 95
I would like to respond to Charles Davison's Feb. 13 letter to the editor regarding the Keystone XL pipeline. As a summer resident for some years now of Day County in South Dakota, I have observed firsthand some of the effects of the first Keystone pipeline now in operation. I am taken aback by Davison's statement that “the dangers of a leaking pipeline into the aquifers is nothing.” It is certainly nothing to him if it is not his water or land being contaminated. Keystone has had 13 leaks on U.S. soil since going operational. One in Day County was not reported to any government agency at the time of the spill. Lucky for Day County residents, it was a somewhat small and contained spill. Canada's part of the Keystone pipeline has had 21 spills. The jobs have been a fraction of what has been realized. All of the Native American tribes in our area were opposed to Keystone and are currently opposed to Keystone XL. Trans Canada (KSPL) got $2.85 million in tax credits and has paid $2.95 million in state property taxes. This is a half to a third of what they projected to pay. When right-of-way contracts were being negotiated with landowners, they were given the options of taking Trans Canada's deal or were told the right of way would be taken through eminent domain — their property being condemned. This was told to me directly by one of Trans Canada's negotiating agents. In Davison's letter, he advocates the government mandate the oil be sold domestically. Is he for more government control? Does he realize this oil is not “drilled” for but comes from “open pit” like operations in Canada? Our government does not tell Canada how or where to conduct the exploiting of its natural resources. Keystone XL oil will be sent to Texas and refined mostly into diesel fuel to be shipped to South American and European markets. Keystone XL will, by most accounts, cause our domestic fuel prices to rise.
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#16. To: lucysmom (#15)
And so many regulations are at the behest of businesses trying to corner the various markets. Because the dirty little secret is: free marketeers really do hate competition.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
No kidding! Just like they justify big financial rewards because they are "the risk takers" while seeking guarantees, and tax breaks because they are risk adverse. They demand safety and comfort to preform their market magic which may, or may not come to pass. When they fail to deliver on the promise, it's not their fault, it's the government's. "Merchants have no country. The mere spot they stand on does not constitute so strong an attachment as that from which they draw their gains." Thomas Jefferson
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
It means sometimes they go overboard on the hoops they make a company go through in order to do business in California.
How does California's environmental regulations impact the Keystone XL pipeline?
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
We are talking about this quote from you. "Ok, 'spane how supply is up, demand is down and prices are rising."
Yeah, what has that got to do with gas prices outside California?
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
"Ok, 'spane how supply is up, demand is down and prices are rising." California gets most of it's oil from SA and other foreign sources. It tends to be more expensive and the lobbyist for users and businesses in the Midwest that depend on cheaper oil prices to stay competitive, want to keep it that way.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
Gas prices are higher in California. I can get a gallon for 3.57 today, maybe cheaper. What about California?
I just told you we subsidize the cheaper energy in the Midwest by buying our supply from more expensive sources. You should be grateful.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
Why do you think I should be grateful? Why did you say that?
Why did you post that to Lucy? Don't you understand English? Do you really want Californians competing with you for oil? I thought you already knew the principles of THE FREE MARKET.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
Because I was hoping you would slip up so I would know you are both the same person.
Why do you have to be so dishonest? We are very different people who just happen to have some issues in common.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
I wasn't being dishonest. I told you exactly why. You two just pop up within minutes of each other regluarly. Like 9am then 9:02. Then later at night like 10:59 then 11:00. Not conclusive though. I'll try again in a few months to get you to slip up again.
You two just pop up within minutes of each other regluarly. Like 9am then 9:02. Then later at night like 10:59 then 11:00. Not conclusive though. I'll try again in a few months to get you to slip up again. That was after you already tried to deceive. We are both on PST that's why.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
You didn't think that up all by yourself, you got it from Eric - you should know better.
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
By that time, I'm in bed asleep.
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
Back to the issue of California's environmental regulations, do you remember what the bay area air quality was like in the 60s and 70s?
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
There are places here in Oregon with a similar price. And here it's illegal to pump your own gas. I haven't pumped my own gasoline in years, they have to hire attendants here to do that. It should be like that everywhere as it creates good, entry level jobs. And it hasn't led to higher gas prices here.
I do. It was extraordinarily horrible. Many people in other parts of the country have problems comprehending the shear size of the fleet of privately owned cars in California. The current regulations passed because it was a matter of survival to do so.
There must be a whole bunch of morons there for a law like that.
Maybe Kroger should have to hire someone to walk you through the store and put your groceries in the cart huh?
I remember the smog when the population wasn't half what it is now and I lived in the East Bay where it wasn't considered that bad. We did hold horse shows in Rodeo on weekends and by three o'clock in the afternoon everyone complained of headaches from the Union 76 pollution. I also remember going down the Santa Ana Freeway in the late seventies and not being able to see Santa Ana or even the car in front.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
It's the way people here want it. They have tried to make self serve legal time to time, but the people always vote such measures down. The same with a sales tax, we have never had one. They have never been able to pass a measure making one. Again, it's the preference of the people in this state.
Until the early seventies having attendants pump your gas was pretty much the standard across the country.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
Maybe people in your state are just to stupid to pump it themselves. Or are they lazy and stuck up?
So. When you used to go to the store they would go get you the merchandise just like I said about Kroger.
I thought you guys just loved those good old days. Was your grandfather lazy and stuck up too?
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
I don't know if there is a 'Kroger' here. I go to the Red Apple or Fred Meyers. Freddys has self serve cashier stations, but I always use a cashier, again, most people here do. The self serve check out points are not very popular here and they have trouble getting people to use them.
Some stores yes others no. Self serve gas started as an advertising gimmick, with the gas initially sold at a discount.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
It is about freedom baby. Freedom to choose. A law that says you can't pump your own gas is undue interference in a private business.
Freedom to choose. The way it should be.
We have a grocery chain here with all self serve cashiers. The kids love it as they get to buy booze without being carded.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
Yep, the people of Oregon got to choose and they chose no self serve. No one makes anyone live in Oregon.
Almost every country in the Middle East is awash in oil, and we have to side with the one that has nothing but joos. Goddamn, that was good thinkin'. Esso posted on 2012-01-13 7:37:56 ET
It is actually a testament to the success of regulations that people like Stone think we don't need them.
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
There is always unintended consequences to such back gimmicks. I was a cashier in 7 Elevens as a youth. It's one of the ways I afforded to go to college, I never took out loans. I was a stickler for I.D and very good at catching shoplifters. The las store I worked at is by the University of Oregon Campus when the parents of the guy who runs it now with his boyfriend ran it. They still own it but are retired. The frat boys and sorority girls called me 'Little Hitler' because stealing was a game to them and I was good at spoiling it. I wouldn't want a job like that these days though. The 7 Eleven on Blair Blvd near my place is a zoo. And I never liked selling booze or cigarettes anyway. I'm personally not into either.
It was as bad then as Beijing is now. A friend tells a story about moving to a new house and being stunned one morning, after a rain, to discover there was a view of a mountain from his bathroom window.
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
it creates good, entry level jobs Most people don't want to be forced to have a communist wiccan tree hugger pump their gas. Those pump jockeys could be out doing something useful, like cutting down trees to stimulate the Oregon economy. The state has been in an economic depression since the eco-nuts shut down the logging industry, many decades ago.
Obama's watch stopped on 24 May 2008, but he's been too busy smoking crack to notice.
Freedom doesn't mean other assholes voting to take your freedom away. That isn't free at all. Are you really that dumb?
I believe this. The first time I was in the LA area in Costa Mesa in the mid 1970s and I left the hotel one morning and was stunned to see the mountains in the distance for the first time. The weather had changed and blown out most the greenish and stinky smog. I was stunned to see them; I had had no idea they were there all that first week before this.
They pumped gas, checked the oil, added water to the radiator and window washers if needed; same with air in the tires, AND washed your windows. In addition they gave away dishes, sets of flatware, glasses, and toys.
Anyone claiming to be an expert is selling something. I brandish my ignorance like a crucifix at vampires. Aaron Bady
Comments (57 - 95) not displayed.
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestI know that's a Republican talking point - I'm wondering if you really know what that means.
#17. To: mininggold (#16)
And so many regulations are at the behest of businesses trying to corner the various markets. Because the dirty little secret is: free marketeers really do hate competition.
#18. To: lucysmom (#15)
I know that's a Republican talking point - I'm wondering if you really know what that means.
#19. To: A K A Stone (#18)
It means sometimes they go overboard on the hoops they make a company go through in order to do business in California.
#20. To: lucysmom (#19)
How does California's environmental regulations impact the Keystone XL pipeline?
#21. To: A K A Stone (#20)
"Ok, 'spane how supply is up, demand is down and prices are rising."
#22. To: A K A Stone (#20)
(Edited)
We are talking about this quote from you.
#23. To: lucysmom (#21)
Yeah, what has that got to do with gas prices outside California?
#24. To: A K A Stone (#23)
Gas prices are higher in California. I can get a gallon for 3.57 today, maybe cheaper. What about California?
#25. To: lucysmom (#21)
I just told you we subsidize the cheaper energy in the Midwest by buying our supply from more expensive sources. You should be grateful.
#26. To: A K A Stone, lucysmom (#25)
Why do you think I should be grateful? Why did you say that?
#27. To: mininggold (#26)
Why did you post that to Lucy? Don't you understand English?
#28. To: A K A Stone, lucysmom (#27)
Because I was hoping you would slip up so I would know you are both the same person.
#29. To: mininggold (#28)
Why do you have to be so dishonest? We are very different people who just happen to have some issues in common.
#30. To: A K A Stone (#29)
I wasn't being dishonest. I told you exactly why.
#31. To: A K A Stone (#29)
You two just pop up within minutes of each other regluarly. Like 9am then 9:02. Then later at night like 10:59 then 11:00. Not conclusive though. I'll try again in a few months to get you to slip up again.
#32. To: mininggold, A K A Stone (#30)
Then later at night like 10:59 then 11:00.
#33. To: mininggold (#28)
We are very different people who just happen to have some issues in common.
#34. To: A K A Stone (#23)
"Gas prices are higher in California. I can get a gallon for 3.57 today, maybe cheaper. What about California?"
#35. To: lucysmom (#33)
"Back to the issue of California's environmental regulations, do you remember what the bay area air quality was like in the 60s and 70s?"
#36. To: Ferret Mike (#34)
There are places here in Oregon with a similar price. And here it's illegal to pump your own gas.
#37. To: Ferret Mike (#34)
It should be like that everywhere as it creates good, entry level jobs. And it hasn't led to higher gas prices here.
#38. To: lucysmom (#33)
Back to the issue of California's environmental regulations, do you remember what the bay area air quality was like in the 60s and 70s?
#39. To: A K A Stone (#36)
#40. To: A K A Stone (#37)
Maybe Kroger should have to hire someone to walk you through the store and put your groceries in the cart huh?
#41. To: Ferret Mike (#39)
It's the way people here want it. They have tried to make self serve legal time to time, but the people always vote such measures down.
#42. To: mininggold (#40)
Until the early seventies having attendants pump your gas was pretty much the standard across the country.
#43. To: A K A Stone (#41)
Maybe people in your state are just to stupid to pump it themselves. Or are they lazy and stuck up?
#44. To: A K A Stone (#37)
"Maybe Kroger should have to hire someone to walk you through the store and put your groceries in the cart huh?"
#45. To: A K A Stone (#42)
So. When you used to go to the store they would go get you the merchandise just like I said about Kroger.
#46. To: mininggold (#43)
I thought you guys just loved those good old days. Was your grandfather lazy and stuck up too?
#47. To: mininggold (#45)
Some stores yes others no.
#48. To: Ferret Mike (#44)
Freddys has self serve cashier stations, but I always use a cashier, again, most people here do. The self serve check out points are not very popular here and they have trouble getting people to use them.
#49. To: A K A Stone (#46)
It is about freedom baby. Freedom to choose.
#50. To: Ferret Mike (#35)
The current regulations passed because it was a matter of survival to do so.
#51. To: mininggold (#48)
"We have a grocery chain here with all self serve cashiers. The kids love it as they get to buy booze without being carded."
#52. To: mininggold (#38)
I also remember going down the Santa Ana Freeway in the late seventies and not being able to see Santa Ana or even the car in front.
#53. To: Ferret Mike (#34)
here it's illegal to pump your own gas
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#54. To: mininggold (#49)
Yep, the people of Oregon got to choose and they chose no self serve.
#55. To: lucysmom (#52)
"A friend tells a story about moving to a new house and being stunned one morning, after a rain, to discover there was a view of a mountain from his bathroom window."
#56. To: mininggold (#40)
Until the early seventies having attendants pump your gas was pretty much the standard across the country.
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