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Title: Hyundai Hypes Hydrogen on Cross-Country Cruise
Source:
Autopia
URL Source: http://www.wired.com/autopia/2011/09/hyundai-hydrogen/
Published: Sep 12, 2011
Author: Alexander George
Post Date: 2011-09-12 14:25:56 by jwpegler
Keywords: None
Views: 6275
Comments: 23
Hyundai is hyping hydrogen, cruising cross-country in a fuel-cell Tucson to turn people on to the fuel of the future. We’ve seen this before, from the likes of Daimler and Honda and even Toyota, all of whom firmly believe hydrogen will mend our fuelish ways. For all the love hybrids and battery electrics get these days, several leading automakers still say hydrogen is the best long-term play. Hyundai’s been experimenting with hydrogen for more than a decade, and it is conducting a 4,500-mile tour through 15 states in the Tucson ix FCEV and to promote its advancements and advocacy of the technology. This is the company’s third-gen Tucson fuel cell vehicle, and Hyundai let us put a few miles on the car during its drive through San Francisco. Aside from a paint job featuring colorful handprints — to promote the automaker’s Hope on Wheels fundraising program — the fuel cell Tucson looks like the Tucson you’d see in any showroom. Turn the key – ignition isn’t the right word here – and you notice a difference, however. The vehicle begins with a sucking sound, like a valve slowly closing. If you’re outside the car, you hear a slight hum from the drivetrain. But inside the car, which is comfortable and quite nicely appointed, the Tucson is as silent as an electric vehicle. Which, of course, it is. The only difference is the Tucson uses a fuel cell instead of a battery to provide most of the juice. Hyundai says the 100-kilowatt fuel cell is the same size as the 2.4-liter engine in a conventional Tucson. The fuel cell and motor are under the hood, and the 21 kilowatt-hour battery is under the floor. A tank at the rear holds 144 liters of hydrogen at 700 bar (roughly 10,000 PSI). Everything is packaged tidily out of the way, leaving plenty of interior room. On the road, the machine drives like any other Tucson, but with a little less power. The motor is good for 100 kilowatts (134 horsepower), which is considerably less than the 165 horsepower provided by a Tucson GL with a four- banger. But there’s loads of torque and, of course, nothing more noxious than potable water coming out of the tailpipe. Hyundai wouldn’t let us really open it up, though. Joshua Marmelstein, the engineer riding shotgun with us, asked us to keep the motor output below 25 kilowatts. Hydrogen may be the most plentiful element in the universe, but isn’t exactly easy to come by when you need to fill your tank. Hyundai didn’t want us using so much that the Tucson wouldn’t reach its next stop. Still, we got a good enough feel for the Tucson to say that it is, like the Honda FCX Clarity and the Mercedes-Benz F-Cell we’ve driven, a real car. You could drive it all day long, quite happily. It does everything you want it to. The big pitch for hydrogen is, of course, that it offers the zero tailpipe emissions and energy independence of battery electric vehicles without the limited range and long recharge time. You can fill the Tucson’s tank quite quickly, and it has a range of 650 kilometers (roughly 404 miles). Hyundai says it gets the equivalent of 70 mpg, or more than twice the highway fuel economy of a four-cylinder Tucson. Hyundai isn’t alone in preaching the hydrogen gospel. Honda’s been leasing the Clarity for a couple of years, and both Mercedes-Benz and Toyota plan to offer fuel cell vehicles for sale in 2015. The two automakers are shooting for a price in the $50,000 ballpark. The price is driven in large part by the fuel cells, which use rare materials like platinum. But cost has always been only part of the problem. There is no significant infrastructure to speak of for producing, distributing and storing hydrogen on a large scale. There are half a dozen or so stations in California — the latest opened near Los Angeles earlier this year, and public stations beyond the Golden State are few and far between. It’s enough of a problem that Hyundai will rely upon support vehicles carrying tanks of hydrogen to get it through the midwest. And then there’s the whole issue of how hydrogen is produced, the fact it’s most often transported by truck, the argument that it won’t be adopted fast enough to make a difference, and… and… but those are issues for another post. Actually, we’ve already written that post. The bottom line is, Hyundai — like Daimler and Honda — are optimistic the infrastructure issue will be sorted out. Company spokesman Christopher Hosford suggests starting with hydrogen stations along trucking routes. Do that, he says, and the rest of the country will follow. Maybe. It it does, it could do worse than to do so in a Tucson ix FCEV.
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#1. To: jwpegler (#0)
Right now you can buy a NEW auto off of the showroom floor that will get almost 40 mpg claimed. For 40% of that price. Do you know how many miles you need to drive to "break even"? I don't, but it's ALOT. Then there is the FACT that this technology will NOT work DEPENDABLY in the far north. (Know what happens to batteries at -50 F?) Know how much "greenhouse gases" are the TRUE result if these vehicles manufacture? Does it really cheer you up that a critical gas for human life, (you know WATER H2O etc.), will become FUEL in the future? Really? Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucccccccccccckkkkkkeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrsssssssssss. I'll be the one passing you in my 3/4 ton RAM pick-em-up truck or my "eco beater" with a heater. I'm going to help save the planet by never buying one of these d@mned FRAUD vehicles.
Spoiled, stupid and ignorant, brain dead phuckwads, libTURD fools, tools, and idiots, are the real sickness; the messiah "king" obammy and his regime are only the symptoms.
Interesting article - this certainly shows more promise than strictly battery vehicles. In a similar vein - I seem to remember - now several years ago - reading about standard internal combustion engines being slightly modified to run on hydrogen. Is that possible, or is my memory incorrect?
__________________________________________________________________________________________ Yes, BMW was showing off a car that could burn either gas or liquid hydrogen for fuel. This is different than fuel cells, which use a chemical reaction to produce electricity. Every other auto company rejects the BMW approach of using hydrogen as a combustible. While GM,, Mercedes and others have plans to launch fuel cells cars in 2014 or 2015, BMW doesn't have any concrete plan to launch their bi-fuel car.
Is that possible, or is my memory incorrect? Look up wood gasifier. The gas produced from wood is partly hydrogen.
Do you know how many miles you need to drive to "break even"? As is always the case with a new technology, early adopters will be relatively wealthy people. The revenue they supply will help cover R&D costs so the per unit price can come down. It was the same with color televisions, VCRs, personal computers, cell phones and many, many other technologies.
That may be the case with plug-in hybrids, but not fuel cell cars. The fuel cell stack can operate at sub-zero temperatures as low as -25 degrees Celsius
LMAO! Duh. Please don't talk to me as if I was some libTURD FOOL. I'm talking about EXACTLY what and how "new" technologies become commonly accepted, and adopted. I am more than a little familiar with the transitional considerations of any new technology. The IS NO SILVER BULLET in our energy quest, (or ANY other for that matter). I support ALL technologies and approaches. THEN WE LET TIME AND THE MARKET DECIDE. AND UNTIL this, (OR ANY OTHER), new technology makes SENSE, PRICE WISE in the market to the people, the well meaning people pushing it are just going to be pissing up a rope. That is the way a market economy works, otherwise you'd be reading about what a classic HIT the Edsel was.
Spoiled, stupid and ignorant, brain dead phuckwads, libTURD fools, tools, and idiots, are the real sickness; the messiah "king" obammy and his regime are only the symptoms.
That may be the case with plug-in hybrids, but not fuel cell cars. The fuel cell stack can operate at sub-zero temperatures as low as -25 degrees Celsius LOL! -25C? "DUDE"! LOL!, get a grip! -24C is -13F! That's NOT winter here above the Mason Dixon line, that's SPRING. Here in the so called "banana belt", the AVERAGE winter temp here is below -13F for SIX MONTHS of the year. WE call it "winter". Why don't YOU buy one and let us know how it works out for you? Since I doubt that you have ever had any professional training in Engineering I will tell you what EVERY engineer is taught from day ONE. "PRICE is ALWAYS part of the SPEC." "PRICE is ALWAYS a design constraint." ALWAYS. (and PAYING for a year's use when you actually get six months of use for your money, is NOT going to sell alot of these rigs in the north.) OBVIOUSLY that could change. OBVIOUSLY I am only addressing the current state of the technology.
Spoiled, stupid and ignorant, brain dead phuckwads, libTURD fools, tools, and idiots, are the real sickness; the messiah "king" obammy and his regime are only the symptoms.
That's NOT winter here above the Mason Dixon line, that's SPRING. No it's not spring. A lot of people in Minnesota and elsewhere either put blankets over their internal combustion engines to keep them warm so that they will start or use space heaters in the garage.
Once you stop acting like a fool I will stop treating you like one.
Uh-huh. It still uses an electric motor, an idea so innovative that it's been around for ~100 years. Nobody buys 'em. WHY? Because they don't make economic sense. Two words came to mind when I read this sentence, "bomb" and "Hindenburg." 'Nuff said. Demonstrating the first point I made: they're not economically viable. Anyone who has the $50K for one of these, will more likely buy something more practical... Like a BMW. Roadster. 2-Seater. Z-4... You get the idea. Only LEFT- WING LOONS would spend that amount of coin on this kind of crap- to demonstrate their green "snobbery" (aka idiocy). Translation: Whistling Past the Graveyard.
To:Skippy, toe-jam, old man Fred Alzheimers Mertz, _jim, loonymom/ming, e-type-jackoff, goober56, Wrek, calcon, dummy DwarF, continental op, Biff, gobsheit and meguro From: Capitalist Eric Message: You're SOCIALIST morons. ESAD. That's been the biggest problem with them since day one, Hiroshima on wheels!!!
When asked by a Liberal what I bought my Granddaughter for her 1st birthday I replied, "MORE AMMUNITION"!!!! -----------------------------"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
. LOL! Hey shithead, speaking the TRUTH about how new technology displaces older technology is hardly being "a fool". However being a gold plated pedant such a YOU are doesn't make you anything more or less than an arrogant FOOL. LOL! Good luck with dat dim buld!
Spoiled, stupid and ignorant, brain dead phuckwads, libTURD fools, tools, and idiots, are the real sickness; the messiah "king" obammy and his regime are only the symptoms.
. LOL! The point FOOL is that these rigs are NOT field tested or rated, YET. YOU don't have even a F ing clue what you are talking about boy. You don't know shit all about living in, or working in, or anything practical about being in an actual NORTHERN climate do you boy? LMAO!!!!! But... hey tell us all about it you know nothing Kalipornian, (or whatever). LOL! Cheechako wannabes such as you don't EVER even make it to Christmas let alone to SPRING around here boy. LOL! NONE of this diminishes the POTENTIAL of this technology. But ... it's NOT even close YET is it genius? LMAO!!!!!
Spoiled, stupid and ignorant, brain dead phuckwads, libTURD fools, tools, and idiots, are the real sickness; the messiah "king" obammy and his regime are only the symptoms.
Hydrogen fuel cells are the future of the automobile and every car company in the world knows it, which is why they are investing billions in their development. Damilier (Mercedes) is working with a company in Germany to roll out hydrogen refueling stations along the autoban. GM is working with the gas company in Hawaii to do this same thing. As with all new technologies, the price will come down dramatically as the technology is adopted.
Sorry, but that's wishful thinking. Think about it; how is liquid hydrogen generated? There's only one feasible way to do this... electrolysis. The net amount of energy to create a comparable amount of BTUs is larger for hydrogen as compared to gasoline. This is the same economic reality that dooms electric cars to the economic abyss. From a practical perspective- including all costs of fuel production- "green" cars don't even get close to gasoline. Diesel? Yeah. Hydrogen or batteries? LOL.
To:Skippy, toe-jam, old man Fred Alzheimers Mertz, _jim, loonymom/ming, e-type-jackoff, goober56, Wrek, calcon, dummy DwarF, continental op, Biff, gobsheit and meguro From: Capitalist Eric Message: You're SOCIALIST morons. ESAD. Nope. Add in the cost of our wars and aide to the Middle East and gas is not $4 gallon. It's $17 a gallon. Every major auto company believes that hydrogen vehicles are the future. There are breakthroughs all of the time in hydrogen production, fuel cell efficiency and fuel cell costs. This is the future of the automobile. Without question.
Pulling numbers out of your ass, doesn't impress me. Now you're starting to sound like goober56.
To:Skippy, toe-jam, old man Fred Alzheimers Mertz, _jim, loonymom/ming, e-type-jackoff, goober56, Wrek, calcon, dummy DwarF, continental op, Biff, gobsheit and meguro From: Capitalist Eric Message: You're SOCIALIST morons. ESAD. Hyundai Tucson Fuel Cell Travels Record 1,480 Miles in 24 Hours Aug 06, 2015: The Hyundai Tucson Fuel Cell has set a new record for distance traveled in 24 hours. A pair of hydrogen pioneers traveled 1,480.73 miles in 24 hours, driving around the clock on public roads in Germany to mirror everyday conditions. For the journey, drivers Arnt-Gøran Hartvig and Marius Bornstein covered a route of around 186 miles between Vatenfall’s hydrogen station in HafenCity, Hamburg, and a Shell hydrogen station in Sachsendamm, Berlin, as many times as possible 24 hours. Since refueling the Tucson Fuel Cell takes as little as three minutes, both drivers were able to spend the bulk of their time on the road. The full 24-hour drive was captured on GoPro dashboard cameras and this isn’t the first time both drivers have put the Hyundai Tucson Fuel Cell to the test. Last June, they set a record traveling nearly 435 miles on a single tank with the Tucson Fuel Cell and have also driven from Oslo to Monaco, refueling only at the hydrogen stations already installed along the 1,404-mile route. “This endurance drive highlights both the practicality of our fuel cell electric vehicle’s long driving range and the environmental credentials of our technology,” said Thomas A. Schmid, chief operating officer at Hyundai Motor Europe. “Our Fuel Cell program has already delivered many world firsts, so it is fitting that the Hyundai ix35 Fuel Cell has once again delivered a new benchmark.”...SNIP The Viking & The Scientist Published on Aug 5, 2015:We are at a transitional point of technology in the automotive industry. 2 Characters join forces to put to the test a Hydrogen fueled car and see how far they can go in 24hrs on public roads and in turn set a world first record.
YOU don't have even a F ing clue what you are talking about boy. You don't know shit all about living in, or working in, or anything practical about being in an actual NORTHERN climate do you boy? LMAO!!!!! LMAO!!!!! ROFLMAO Another effing moron bites the dust
Another effing moron bites the dust Do you want your jwpegler name back? I'll open it up to you and forget our feud if you would like me to.
The two automakers are shooting for a price in the $50,000 ballpark.
#2. To: jwpegler (#0)
HA! The tea-party, INDEED! They're so . . . ah . . . common
#3. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#2)
Is that possible, or is my memory incorrect?
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#4. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#2)
In a similar vein - I seem to remember - now several years ago - reading about standard internal combustion engines being slightly modified to run on hydrogen.
#5. To: Mad Dog (#1)
Right now you can buy a NEW auto off of the showroom floor that will get almost 40 mpg claimed. For 40% of that price.
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#6. To: Mad Dog (#1)
(Edited)
Then there is the FACT that this technology will NOT work DEPENDABLY in the far north.
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#7. To: jwpegler (#5)
As is always the case with a new technology, early adopters will be relatively wealthy people.
#8. To: jwpegler (#6)
Then there is the FACT that this technology will NOT work DEPENDABLY in the far north.
#9. To: Mad Dog (#8)
-13F!
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#10. To: Mad Dog (#7)
Please don't talk to me as if I was some libTURD FOOL.
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#11. To: jwpegler (#0)
(Edited)
We’ve seen this before, from the likes of Daimler and Honda and even Toyota, all of whom firmly believe hydrogen will mend our fuelish ways.
the fuel cell Tucson looks like the Tucson you’d see in any showroom.
I'll have to take that on "faith," since I'd never buy a Hyundai, and won't waste my time in one of their showrooms... A tank at the rear holds 144 liters of hydrogen at 700 bar (roughly 10,000 PSI).
The two automakers are shooting for a price in the $50,000 ballpark.
But cost has always been only part of the problem... And then there’s the whole issue of how hydrogen is produced....
Yeah, it's so expensive (and dangerous) as to preclude its economic viability. Company spokesman Christopher Hosford suggests starting with hydrogen stations along trucking routes. Do that, he says, and the rest of the country will follow.
#12. To: Capitalist Eric (#11)
A tank at the rear holds 144 liters of hydrogen at 700 bar (roughly 10,000 PSI). Two words came to mind when I read this sentence, "bomb" and "Hindenburg." 'Nuff said.
#13. To: jwpegler (#10)
#14. To: jwpegler (#9)
#15. To: Capitalist Eric, cz82 (#11)
(Edited)
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#16. To: jwpegler (#15)
As with all new technologies, the price will come down dramatically as the technology is adopted.
#17. To: Capitalist Eric (#16)
(Edited)
From a practical perspective- including all costs of fuel production- "green" cars don't even get close to gasoline.
Oh, God, can you ever imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon Johnson were president? -- Jackie Kennedy
#18. To: jwpegler (#17)
Nope. Add in the cost of our wars and aide to the Middle East and gas is not $4 gallon. It's $17 a gallon.
This is the future of the automobile. Without question.
#19. To: jwpegler (#0)
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2015/08/hyundai-tucson-fuel-cell-travels-1-480-miles-in-24-hours.html
#20. To: Mad Dog (#14)
The point FOOL is that these rigs are NOT field tested or rated, YET.
Mad Dog: But ... it's NOT even close YET is it genius?
#21. To: Operation 40 (#19)
Operation 40
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#22. To: Operation 40 (#20)
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#23. To: Operation 40 (#19)
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