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Title: Get ready to pay dearly for the ‘deal’ (can you believe this was written by an adult?)
Source:
Buffalo News, (a.k.a. Lake Erie Pravda)
URL Source: http://www.buffalonews.com/city/columns/rod-watson/article511557.ece
Published: Aug 4, 2011
Author: Rod Watson
Post Date: 2011-08-05 09:27:04 by Get Outta Dodge!
Keywords: None
Views: 138131
Comments: 205
First “they came for the socialists. . . .” And they got them . . . and the progressives, and the moderates, and the entire middle and working classes, not to mention the economy itself. They got them all. While Pastor Martin Niemoller’s famous quote referred to the Nazis, it could just as easily be applied to the tea party extremists who rolled President Obama and Democrats in a “deal” that will have dire consequences for a poor, job-hungry city such as Buffalo. Obama broke a cardinal rule of presidents: Never negotiate with terrorists. But using the word “negotiate” may be giving this White House too much credit. Afraid that a small band of tea party radicals would blow up the economy, feckless Democrats who have no idea how to craft a message simply caved instead of getting out front in the debate. Who’ll pay for their timidity? You will, if you need help with your heating bill, want Western New York’s transportation network maintained, or don’t want education on the chopping block. Buffalo Niagara gets millions in everything from transit aid to block grants for economic development. All such programs face added jeopardy because the president went back on his vow to demand the balanced approach of cuts and revenues that polls show most Americans want. It’s one thing not to be able to lead people where they don’t want to go. It’s quite another not to be able to lead them in the direction they’re already pointing. Instead, this deal—composed entirely ofcuts— will hurt older, poorer cities such as Buffalo and slow economic growth even more while doing nothing to create jobs. In fact, it will cost jobs. The Economic Policy Institute says the plan’s failure to extend emergency unemployment benefits and the payroll tax holiday—the one tax cut that should have been included— will lower the GDP by a combined 1.2 percent and cost 1.5 million jobs next year. Try telling the 7.7 percent of Western New Yorkers—and 10.2 percent of Buffalonians— who are looking for work that this makes sense. And now that they’ve tasted blood— yours, if you’re not wealthy—the extremists will be back for more. With plans to stack the new “supercommittee” with members opposed to raising revenue, it’s possible the right wing will even sacrifice defense by triggering the $1.2 trillion in across-the-board cuts that result absent any other deal. In other words, the damage has only begun as we transition to government by minority rule. At a time when the economy needs to be juiced, Washington will be run by those who drank the Kool-Aid. And where were Chuck “Press Re-lease a Day” Schumer or other Democratic leaders—including the president —who could counter the right-wing nonsense machine and put so much heat on the non-crazy part of the GOP that the debate never would have come to this? Obama’s somnolent “let your member of Congress know” had some last-minute effect. But imagine how a real leader—say, a progressive equivalent of Ronald Reagan—would have taken control of this debate upfront. But the outcome shouldn’t surprise. Obama took single-payer off the table before health care talks even began, and this time, he nixed the 14th Amendment option even quicker. If you’re looking to score on a used-car deal, this is the guy you want to negotiate with. In the meantime, optimists think we’ll now have a grand debate about the role of government as the rest of the deal is hashed out before the 2012 election. But that would require forceful leadership with the stomach for that debate. Unfortunately for poor cities such as Buffalo, what we have instead are Obama and Harry Reid. Poster Comment: Ohhhhhhhhhh . . . Tea Partiers are Nazis. How original. Can you believe this guy writes for a metropolitan daily? (Yeah, I guess I can.)
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#26. To: We The People (#8)
If you've read the Constitution, then you already know that it doesn't state that we are a capitalist nation. You'd also have to know that the folks who wrote it valued life, liberty and property and wrote it (the US Constitution) in such a way that it shapes and designs our government to protect those things. Even our laws are designed with capitalism in mind, protection of ownership, your life, your free will, your property, enforcement of contracts, etc. Other economic systems offer the same protections, but it doesn't matter because our Constitution guarantees them anyway. Actually the founders were more like mercantilists, which was the economic system in vogue when the country was founded. If you knew your history you would know we fought a Revolutionary War against rugged, unfettered, global capitalistism which had already resulted in a true TEA PARTY revolt.
BTW, you have me confused. What would you say is the term to best describe your own political beliefs? I remember you from LP, but I don't remember that you were on the left. Your advanced degree in LP training has you thinking everyone not an avid Teabagger has to be one of those nasty lefties. But all you have to do to prove your theory is dispute my statements with facts not innuendo.
I'm here, ming. Discuss away.
The point being made was that your smuggled assumption about this country and capitalism was false. Its a typical Palin defense to get all hyper-literal in response. You performed that role like a trouper.
Discuss away. the ball is still in your court since you refuse to explain your actions.
I did explain it in post #9. You might try going back and re-reading it. This time, and in the interest of honest debate, why don't you cut and paste the whole thing?
Discuss away.
That's crazy. We did not fight a revolutionary war against global capitalism. We fought a revolutionary war against England, which was not allowing the colonies to engage in free market activities.
LOL! I'd say that is yet to be proven. Its a typical Palin defense to get all hyper-literal in response. You performed that role like a trouper. A typical Palin defense? WTH does that even mean? Did my response offend you? If so, I'd say that's your problem. If there's something that you'd like to discuss, like adults, fire away. If you are looking for another damp pants prepubescent to argue with, look elsewhere.
What, the fact that folks who read this newspaper also vote has your tighty- whiteys in a bunch? Pffft.
Buh bye
Well at least now you're acknowleging the point being made, which is apparently a big step forward for you. The second thing the first American Congress did was enact a tariff. Does that sound like something captitalists would do?
It was one of the major reasons and the reason for the Boston Tea Party revolt. The other main reason was taxation without representation. Free markets had nothing to do with it otherwise why would the individual newly formed states institute a system of tariffs?
So long Badeye...
Well at least now you're acknowleging the point being made, which is apparently a big step forward for you. Do I know you? Are you posting under a new screen name? Have we exchanged posts before? You're making very little sense and I'm trying to figure out why you immediately act like my sisters spoiled daughter. Listen, if I've posted something to offend you, I apologize. The very fact that I have to say that, offends me. I have little patience with overly emotional, spoiled children. Like I said, if there's something that you would like to discuss, like adults, then have at it. If you're looking for another forum groupie who wants to argue just for the sake of idiotic arguments, then you need to look elsewhere. In short, grow up, show some respect, or I'll have no problem in making you magically disappear. Why do you think that war and I, who agree on practically nothing, can exchange posts for years and still remain friends and friendly? Here's a clue...It could be that we are both adults.
Does that sound like something captitalists would do? As a matter of fact, it does. Why do you think it doesn't?
It was one of the major reasons and the reason for the Boston Tea Party revolt. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Tea_Party Are you sure?
Why not? It's about the same meme the entire MSM has been using for the past week.
Obama has played at being a president while enjoying the perks … golf, insanely expensive vacations at tax-payer expense. He has ignored the responsibilities of the job; no plans, no budgets, no alternatives … just finger pointing; making him a complete failure as a president
For my money, I find you both good posters and contributors...I've found that I can agree or disagree with either of you and the conversation remains, for lack of a better word, cordial, i.e. no threats of violence, no comments about "Mom" or "Sis" or threats to reveal personal information. That said, as it is with Goodwinson and calcon, two other good - but opposite - guys, beyond this vouching for both of you, I'm Switzerland.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" I lurk to see if someone other than Myst or Pookie posts anything...
I can't argue with the sound logic of staying neutral. Sounds like some other fine advice we were given... "Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations — entangling alliances with none." ~ Thomas Jefferson
Why not? It's about the same meme the entire MSM has been using for the past week. If that were a student paper writing assignment in a Poli Sci 101 class, it would rate at best a C for structure. And an F for originality.
Please don't use Wikipedia as a source. It was an action against the actions of the East India Company and it's unholy alliance with England that really cared more about placating its plantation holdings and resultant trade in it's other, more coveted colony, India, than it did the American colonies.
Where's that Tea Party candidate sponsored legislation needed to enforce this?
Of course, its a very common tactic to take offense when challenged to backup your comments. Palin does it too all the time doesn't she? Meanwhile you've done very little to backup your assertions about Obama and/or capitalism. But go ahead and keep trying to make this about me and not the fact that you've painted with an overly broad brush.
Where's that Tea Party candidate sponsored legislation needed to enforce this? Excellent question, Ming. I'm serious If I get my friends in the Tea-party to sponsor such legislation, will you get your friends in the House and Senate to allow it to come to a vote. If it passes, will you ask your friend, President Obama, to sign it?
Ok...Why do you think protectionism and capitalism go hand in hand?
If I get my friends in the Tea-party to sponsor such legislation, will you get your friends in the House and Senate to allow it to come to a vote. If it passes, will you ask your friend, President Obama, to sign it? My personal Congresscritter Mike Thompson, whom I've never voted for, is on my shit list for being totally bought and paid for by the wine industry. My personal feeling... the Tea Party base will never let it happen.
Wow, really? Next you'll tell me the American stars on Betsy Ross's flag couldn't have replaced hammers or sickles "'cuz the date was too early." Small business mercantilism was the most popular economic system used during the founding days. The revolution was actually fought against the instituting of large corporate cronyism on the colonies by England. WHAT "large corporations" were there in 1773?? And I noticed part of your ludicrous analogy didn't mention "heroic Unions". And anyway, here I thought the basis of the American revolution was fought over "taxation without representation." You do remember that Tea Party? and I don't mean the current phonies. Uh-oh....lemme get out of the way of your quirky history lesson witty steamroller before I get hurt.
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
Give me a heads-up here before you "decide it isn't" so I can prepare my LMAO-muscles for another workout again.
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
OUCH! A "teabagger" crack that was indirectly aimed at my "teabag." By chance are you Willie Green's "life-partner"?
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
You're long on laughs. Thank you for that, Cousin Itt. Btw, what's a "quib"?
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
Wait...let me put on my magic 0bama-kaleidoscope 3-D glasses so I can get a "REAL" sense of history...OR, is it "herstory"? *yuk-yuk*
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
Clever. Faux news Check Looks like your mindless drone points are in order. Check in with skip and he'll give you your uniform. Yep, we know EXACTLY where T-Bird perches and parrots her marching orders... Add two more daily talking points drivel: "Koch Brothers!!" CHECK #36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
Nah...I thought Choo Choo Willie's life partner was named Lionel. Any thoughts on protectionism as a "capitalist" endevour?
Where's that Tea Party candidate sponsored legislation needed to enforce this? (Dodge): Excellent question, Ming. I'm serious If I get my friends in the Tea-party to sponsor such legislation, will you get your friends in the House and Senate to allow it to come to a vote. If it passes, will you ask your friend, President Obama, to sign it? (m.g.): My personal feeling... the Tea Party base will never let it happen. Why do you say that? Other than a general philosophy that gov't is too big and spends too much, the "tea party" (actually not a party in the political sense, but an amalgamation) is far from monolithic. Tell you what - If you'll admit that at least SOME in the "tea-party" are honest and upstanding, I'll do the same (((gulp))) for liberals. Liberals are just wrong politically, that's all
Speaking of suits, hey, you and your "friend" are looking fine here...thanks for the autograph. That said, nobody's stopping you from howling at the moon here, are they?
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
Lol...but ONLY if he's in a Union. Any thoughts on protectionism as a "capitalist" endevour? yes. I endorse heavy tariffs on imported slave-labor goods. And you??
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
"Koch Brothers!!" CHECK "Palin is the leader of Teabagger Terrorists!!" CHECK Thanks. We'll probably have a list of about 50 or so before they start being recycled. I'll set up my DVR to record MSNBC this evening. That should add about 35 or so.
You posed a perfect question, too. Was Congress out on the golf course with their lobbyists for all these years? Through the last 40+ years they certainly have ensured ALL citizens are victims to the trade imbalances while American government created all kinds of tax incentives for off-shore multinationals WHILE importing cheap labour. It is credible what these people in government have done to America.
THAT creates a conundrum for insane Leftists who require a identifying and smearing their sneaky enemy, "Teabaggers." This is "EXHIBIT A" as to why these people are colossal idiots who are missoing several common sense DNA. Tell you what - If you'll admit that at least SOME in the "tea-party" are honest and upstanding, I'll do the same (((gulp))) for liberals. You'll need the Hubble telescope and a barf-bag for that, won't ya?
#36. To: We The People (#24) I've really had enough of you. I just reviewed your account, and aside from [ridiculing] members of this site [like my neocon retarded son, yukon, and his brothers gatlin, and the ACLU Blackmailer], you have had zero to say here...so I'm just going to toss you [and your crazy conservative posts that exposed me as a damn hypocrite] under the bus. and no...that was NOT a threat! I've just banned your account. Neocon Mommy Goldi-Lox posted on 2011-07-31 13:56:29 ET
Me, I'd rather pay a little more for goods manufactured in the United States than see whole regions of the nation get thrown out of work. Steel is a good example where tariffs make sense (imo), especially when the foreign exporter is dumping their product to grab market share. However I would consider that position to be economic nationalism NOT capitalism, despite a shallow attempt by some to claim otherwise.
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestWhere in the constitution does it say we are a capitalist nation? Is that a rhetorical question?
#27. To: We The People (#25)
(Edited)
You weren't looking to discuss anything. You thought you had a gotcha moment and pulled the trigger. Not faulting you for that, I'm just saying that if you're going to do that, then you shouldn't complain about the tactics of others.
#28. To: mininggold (#23)
Why do you hate forum discussion and the First Amendment so much that you feel compelled to interfere and distract with another of your mindless quibs?
#29. To: We The People (#25)
You have to admit that your question of capitalism in the US Constitution was, well, let's just say it wasn't honest discussion.
#30. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#28)
I'm here, ming.
#31. To: Thunderbird (#24)
Meanwhile, you've yet to explain why an editorial in a money-making newspaper is your biggest "problem", or why economic calamity might be the only "answer".
#32. To: mininggold (#30)
I'm here, ming.
#33. To: mininggold (#26)
If you knew your history you would know we fought a Revolutionary War against rugged, unfettered, global capitalistism which had already resulted in a true TEA PARTY revolt.
#34. To: Thunderbird (#29)
The point being made was that your smuggled assumption about this country and capitalism was false.
#35. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#31)
I did explain it in post #9.
#36. To: Thunderbird (#35)
#37. To: We The People (#34)
I'd say that is yet to be proven.
#38. To: We The People (#33)
That's crazy. We did not fight a revolutionary war against global capitalism.
#39. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#36)
Buh bye
#40. To: Thunderbird, war (#37)
I'd say that is yet to be proven.
#41. To: Thunderbird (#37)
The second thing the first American Congress did was enact a tariff.
#42. To: mininggold (#38)
That's crazy. We did not fight a revolutionary war against global capitalism.
#43. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#0)
can you believe this was written by an adult?
#44. To: We The People, Thunderbird, Goodwinson, calcon (#40)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#45. To: war (#44)
I'm Switzerland.
#46. To: no gnu taxes (#43)
can you believe this was written by an adult?
#47. To: We The People (#42)
(Edited)
Are you sure?
#48. To: We The People (#45)
"Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations — entangling alliances with none." ~ Thomas Jefferson
#49. To: We The People (#40)
Listen, if I've posted something to offend you, I apologize. The very fact that I have to say that, offends me.
#50. To: mininggold, We The People (#48)
"Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations — entangling alliances with none." ~ Thomas Jefferson
#51. To: We The People (#41)
As a matter of fact, it does.
#52. To: Get Outta Dodge! (#50)
(Edited)
Excellent question, Ming. I'm serious
#53. To: mininggold (#16)
Neither [Lenin or Marx] were even born at the time [of the writing of the Constitution].
#54. To: We The People (#17)
Yes, I was a bad boy again. This time it's terminal. Unless I decide it isn't. ;o)
#55. To: Thunderbird (#19)
Now there you go asking a teabagger to think..that usually doesn't end well.
#56. To: mininggold, We The People (#20)
Liberator is always short on facts, which is why she substitutes her quibs for actual discussion.
#57. To: war (#21)
...and have a sense of REAL history...
#58. To: Get Outta Dodge!, Thunderbird, Skip intro (#22)
To: Skip intro and go directly do democrat talking points
Teabagger Check
"Palin is the leader of Teabagger Terrorists!!" CHECK
#59. To: Liberator (#55)
By chance are you Willie Green's "life-partner"?
#60. To: mininggold, We The People (#52)
(m.g.): Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations — entangling alliances with none." ~ Thomas Jefferson
#61. To: mininggold, Get Outta Dodge! (#23)
Why do you hate forum discussion and the First Amendment so much that you feel compelled to interfere and distract with another of your mindless quibs?. You too, have been called on to back up your distractions and have been proven to be another empty suit.
#62. To: Thunderbird (#59)
(Edited)
I thought Choo Choo Willie's life partner was named Lionel.
#63. To: Liberator (#58)
Add two more daily talking points drivel:
#64. To: Liberator (#62)
I endorse heavy tariffs on imported slave-labor goods.
#65. To: Get Outta Dodge!, mininggold (#60)
Why do you say that? Other than a general philosophy that gov't is too big and spends too much, the "tea party" (actually not a party in the political sense, but an amalgamation) is far from monolithic.
#66. To: Liberator (#62)
I endorse heavy tariffs on imported slave-labor goods.
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