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Title: LET’S END THIS DEBT CEILING DEBATE WITH A $1 OZ. $1T COIN
Source:
Pragmatic Capitalism
URL Source: http://pragcap.com/lets-end-this-de ... ing-debate-with-a-1-oz-1t-coin
Published: Jul 7, 2011
Author: Cullen Roche
Post Date: 2011-07-09 00:54:08 by lucysmom
Keywords: Debt Ceiling, Treasury vs Congress
Views: 63492
Comments: 102
A reader points out a very interesting loophole in the debt ceiling debate that would give the US Treasury the ability to tell the US Congress to take their fearmongering and shove it you know where. Reader “Beowulf” notes: “No, Tsy isn’t authorized to just “print” money, the Federal Reserve Act gives that power to the Fed, However, the Coinage Act grants the Secretary of the Treasury rather broad coin seigniorage authority. Geithner could sidestep the debt ceiling this afternoon by ordering the West Point Mint to coin a 1 oz. $ 1 trillion coin. Tsy can then present the jumbo coins at the NY Fed to buy back $1 trillion in Fed-held debt (the Fed has to accept it, a creditor can’t refuse legal tender paid in to settle a debt): (h) The coins issued under this title shall be legal tender… (k) The Secretary may mint and issue platinum bullion coins and proof platinum coins in accordance with such specifications, designs, varieties, quantities, denominations, and inscriptions as the Secretary, in the Secretary’s discretion, may prescribe from time to time.” The simple threat of doing this would end this debate right here and right now. It’s time for Congress to stop playing Russian roulette with the US economy. If you want to take a stand on spending then do so before you pass legislation that causes us to run up into the debt ceiling. Don’t use some phony law to try to scare people into thinking that we are Greece (something that’s entirely impossible anyhow).
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#1. To: Badeye, A K A Stone, hondo68, Fred Mertz, Godwinson, go65, war, no gnu taxes, Skip Intro, ferret mike, jwpegler, brian s, mcgowanjm, Capitalist Eric, Mininggold (#0)
Sounds crazy, but...
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
Ayyup, and they can put it in the Fort Knox vault, with all those gold bars they're supposed to have. But they'll probably end up spending it, which seems like the same thing as printing money, which causes further inflation. You know that when the socialists hear that they've coined a 1T coin, they're going to want to go out and spend at least 2T. As much as I like the idea of screwing the FED, I'm skeptical that this is a benificial scam.
Obama's watch stopped on 24 May 2008, but he's been too busy smoking crack to notice.
Ron Paul suggested that the Fed should destroy the bonds they bought which would have the same effect except there wouldn't be a 1T coin floating around causing potential legal, financial and poltical problems if it fell into the hands of a unsympathetic country that wanted to use it to buy more bonds.
And that's when you get hyperinflation. Adding actual zero's to the coin/paper of the realm. The problem will be when our colonies stop accepting it. And that's why we won't have inflation. We must lose our Empire first. Get isolated.
Like so many on the lunatic left, the author completely misunderstands the role that money plays in society, namely as A.) a medium of exchange and B.) store of value. Instead, the author believes that money is some kind of mysterious, magical thing that the government can simple conjure up to cure any and all ills. The sad fact is that most of our problems are directly related to the fact that the government has been able to create fiat money at will and force us all to accept it. The result? Booms, busts, inflation, debt. No thanks, been there, done that.
But they'll probably end up spending it, which seems like the same thing as printing money, which causes further inflation. You know that when the socialists hear that they've coined a 1T coin, they're going to want to go out and spend at least 2T. We print and issue money using it as collateral, similiar to how we used gold and silver for many years. As it is now we use the hot aire of capitalists as our collateral.
If booms, busts, inflation, and debt were a result of fiat money then how do you explain the booms, busts, inflation, and debt that happens with a precious metal backed currency?
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
How would a 1T coin fall into enemy hands?
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
It's not about screwing the Fed, nor is it a scam, it's about keeping Congress from murdering its hostages.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
Our whole ponzi economic system depends on inflation and the ever increasing numbers of it's participants. Just listen to the capitalists howl everytime someone suggests deflation is right around the corner. Even though they created the current deflated real estate market with their 'irrational exuberance' regarding prices and lack of ethical standards in marketing the instruments.
Creating money when there's nothing to back it up, is always a scam. That's how we got here. It's no different than running the printing presses at the US Treasury.
Obama's watch stopped on 24 May 2008, but he's been too busy smoking crack to notice.
Ben Bernanke was acceptable as Fed Chairman in part because he was willing to tolerate inflation and avoid deflation.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
I don't think that's how we got here. The discussion following the linked article is interesting, I recommend reading it.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
It's no different than running the printing presses at the US Treasury. Your capitalist 'free' market buddies would disagree. As they consider themselves the collateral.
OMG! You libTURDS are so stoopid that it still amazes me! YOU, (a gibbering libTURD FOOL), would just do what the feral gooberment has been doing and that got us into trouble you gibbering MORON. You "think" that just calling something worth some value will fix this situation you gibbering moron? It's how we got here in the first place fool. FIAT "money" has absolutely ZERO intrinsic value. There is ZERO "collateral" backing it up. Actual money, (commodity based money, ie PMs/Ae/Ar/Au), has intrinsic VALUE, and IS the ONLY "money" that is allowed by the US Constitution. (Not that THAT means squat to a libTURD fool like YOU.) SHOW us ALL where on ANY current feral gooberment fiat specie "note" there is a statement of a base COLLATERAL to it's "value" you gibbering moron. Between YOU and whinny Old I can feel the "smartness" being drained from the universe when you two MORONS "talk". You two are proof that you don't need to have even a basic mental ability to keep on living.
Spoiled, stupid and ignorant, brain dead phuckwads, libTURD fools, tools, and idiots, are the real sickness; the messiah "king" obammy and his regime are only the symptoms.
I've explained this many times, but you are too stupid to understand. During the 19th century the U.S. Government enforced a bi-metals standards with fixed exchange rates between gold and silver. The bi- metals standard was created to favor silver interests. Of course, it created boom and bust cycles, just like the Federal Reserve's fiat money, and just like all political manipulation of the money supply does. Unfortunately, the lunatic left learned the wrong lesson, as they always do. The right lesson is that government manipulation of the money supply to favor political interests is a fundamental problem that has to be eradicated.
So both systems create booms and busts. That's the whole purpose of the shark's periodically thinning the herd and cashing out at the same time. Unless your magical thinking leads you to believe that money just goes up in smoke.
You are not understanding again, as usual. POLITICAL MANIPULATION of the money supply causes boom and bust cycle. As Nobel Laureate Fredrich Hayek pointed out several decades ago, the real answer is to get government out of the money business altogether. We have the technology to make competing currencies a reality today. That's what we need to do.
POLITICAL MANIPULATION of the money supply causes boom and bust cycle. As Nobel Laureate Fredrich Hayek pointed out several decades ago, the real answer is to get government out of the money business altogether. No it's the manipulation of the economy by various components of the financial sector often combined with certain political allies usually in the form of legislators that causes booms and busts. The gov periodically tries to regulate it out of existence but so far has not been successful, and probably always will fail. The government is constitutionally mandated to provide in one way or another a system of currency.
As a country, we've been there, done that. The system had problems, we don't do that anymore. That being said, there are local currencies.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
no one admits the social contracts between government and local unions; yet, this is the entire heart of America's downfall for budgets, not just because of a pay grade and benefit package for each and every employee in government. Here is a plan that you don't here about ANYWHERE. Eliminate the current pay schedules of GS-1 to GS-18 federal employees. Downgrade the same package from 2% at the bottom of the tier group to 20% at the top of the tier group. It saves the federal budget; it saves America; these are federal employees, the largest organization of gangsters from around the world.
Do you really think they can compete with those located on Wall Street?
The Obama Federal Reserve runs Wall Street. When union BO speaks they jump. WS can't convince the rubes that hO's anything but bad economic news, so the markets jump DOWN.
Obama's watch stopped on 24 May 2008, but he's been too busy smoking crack to notice.
The Corps will just jump to another fifth world country where they can practice their utopian form of capitalism until the natives again wise up. It's the pubs who are stalling on the debt ceiling causing the current problem. They need to proudly take responsibility.
"That is usually what happens when a bus full of gasoline is rolling down a road and about to go off a cliff. What else can you call it? THERE ARE NO JOBS. THERE WILL BE NO JOBS. Remember when Madoff was discovered to be a ponzi. On the message boards the first questions asked by many people were "Where is the money?" No one could comprehend that a 56 Billion dollar fund had NO MONEY. They thought he had hid most of it. They could not comprehend the simplicity of the math of a ponzi and how it WORKS. You see.....things that appear very complex to the outside world of a ponzi are usually relatively elemental. Its just simple math..... There was ZERO money. NADA! NONE! Bernie simply maintained his vast yearly returns by paying out to the "lucky" ones that redeemed before the unlucky lower bigger part of his pyramid.....until he ran out of money."
And there still are many more out there similiarly stealing with the full blessing of Wall Street.
The Only way the Top 50 000 are getting richer. Warren Buffett becomes the Swedish Match King. Watch. "the age of economic growth is over. To cope with declining resources, and an eco-system tilting toward a death-spiral, we don't need more growth. We need to shrink our economies. They call it "de-growth."
No different than Social Security.
You are too funny. The Madoff's of the world are what made Social Security neccessary. After the last four years will anyone ever trust Wall Street again?
WHOAAA there pardner. SS is completely solvent and will be for at least 20 more years...
The world's Madoffs want to get their hands on all that SS money.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
The world's Madoffs want to get their hands on all that money. fixed it for ya. The parasite's only limit is the death of the host....;}
Crazy is raising the debt limit. The rationalizations for doing so are very similiar to a drunk's reasoning for demanding he be given another bottle of Jack Daniels.
Proxy IP's are amusing.....lmao
Wrong. Social Security started running an annual deficit this year and will continue to do so as the baby boomers flood into the system. It's broke.
No it's not broke, it has a $2.6 trillion dollar surplus. (wouldn't Wall Street high rollers love to get their hands on that! What percentage do you think they'd take in bonuses?)
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
Not hanging out with drunks, I wouldn't know what that might be. What I do know is that if we don't pay our bills, we've broken our word.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
Your brain has wandered off to Fantasy Land once again. What a surprise.
Right. Raygun/Greenspan SS/FICA tax. All of which was taken and replaced with IOU's. You or I did that we'd be put under the jail... For 30 years. How much longer do we wait for Reagan's Shining City on the Hill....8D
Your brain has wandered off to Fantasy Land once again. What a surprise. FOX NEws not very entertaining this AM, eh jw? ;} # Get more discussion results # Fixing Social Security – Permanently « US Public Policy / John ... uspublicpolicy.com/johnkoraska/blog/?p=19 - Cached Oct 19, 2010 – The huge cost increases of paying Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid ... The surplus FICA cash is replaced by US Treasury IOUs and put in the Trust Funds. ... The 1983 Greenspan commission on Social Security reforms resulted in Ronald Reagan raising: FICA OASDI tax rates, taxable wage base, ... # Paul Ryan's Killing of Social Security and Medicare mondaymorningeconomist.com/pualryan.html - Cached The GOP has hated Social Security and Medicare from day one, they just know ... fund ... is no reserve at all' [because it contains nothing but government IOUs], ... courtesy of Reagan and Greenspan raising the payroll deductions to SSA and ... To the employer who ponies up half of the FICA, Social security and ... #
Raising the debt ceiling doesn't pay our bills. It only allows this administration to continue to write BAD CHECKS, further excerbating the debt crisis we already face. And it will in fact 'break the word' to American Taxpayers...not that you on the Left give a rats ass about THAT. Finally, I'm sure you are very familiar with drunks goofy. I don't believe anyone could suffer you without being drunk first.
Proxy IP's are amusing.....lmao
You need to do more research. And it will in fact 'break the word' to American Taxpayers... Rather the Republican politicians word to Grover Norquist.
Von Mises associates any Government involvement in markets as "Socialism" , to mislead people into thinking Government is the enemy , when infact empire is the enemy and empire is Privatized.
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#2. To: lucysmom (#0)
(Edited)
by ordering the West Point Mint to coin a 1 oz. $ 1 trillion coin. Tsy can then present the jumbo coins at the NY Fed to buy back $1 trillion in Fed-held debt
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#3. To: lucysmom (#1)
#4. To: lucysmom (#1)
#5. To: lucysmom (#0)
(Edited)
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#6. To: hondo68 (#2)
Ayyup, and they can put it in the Fort Knox vault, with all those gold bars they're supposed to have.
#7. To: jwpegler (#5)
The sad fact is that most of our problems are directly related to the fact that the government has been able to create fiat money at will and force us all to accept it. The result? Booms, busts, inflation, debt.
#8. To: Pinguinite (#3)
Ron Paul suggested that the Fed should destroy the bonds they bought which would have the same effect except there wouldn't be a 1T coin floating around causing potential legal, financial and poltical problems if it fell into the hands of a unsympathetic country that wanted to use it to buy more bonds.
#9. To: hondo68 (#2)
As much as I like the idea of screwing the FED, I'm skeptical that this is a benificial scam.
#10. To: lucysmom (#7)
(Edited)
If booms, busts, inflation, and debt were a result of fiat money then how do you explain the booms, busts, inflation, and debt that happens with a precious metal backed currency?
#11. To: lucysmom (#9)
nor is it a scam
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#12. To: mininggold (#10)
Just listen to the capitalists howl everytime someone suggests deflation is right around the corner.
#13. To: hondo68 (#11)
Creating money when there's nothing to back it up, is always a scam. That's how we got here.
#14. To: hondo68 (#11)
Creating money when there's nothing to back it up, is always a scam. That's how we got here.
#15. To: lucysmom (#0)
(Edited)
#16. To: lucysmom, capitalist eric (#7)
If booms, busts, inflation, and debt were a result of fiat money then how do you explain the booms, busts, inflation, and debt that happens with a precious metal backed currency?
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#17. To: jwpegler (#16)
During the 19th century the U.S. Government enforced a bi-metals standards with fixed exchange rates between gold and silver. The bi- metals standard was created to favor silver interests. Of course, it created boom and bust cycles, just like the Federal Reserve's fiat money, and just like all political manipulation of the money supply does.
#18. To: mininggold (#17)
So both systems create booms and busts.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#19. To: jwpegler (#18)
(Edited)
You are not understanding again, as usual.
#20. To: jwpegler (#18)
We have the technology to make competing currencies a reality today. That's what we need to do.
#21. To: lucysmom (#20)
As a country, we've been there, done that.
#22. To: buckeroo (#21)
It saves the federal budget; it saves America; these are federal employees, the largest organization of gangsters from around the world.
#23. To: mininggold (#22)
think they can compete with those located on Wall Street
"We (government) need to do a lot less, a lot sooner" ~Ron Paul
#24. To: hondo68 (#23)
The Obama Federal Reserve runs Wall Street. When union BO speaks they jump. WS can't convince the rubes that hO's anything but bad economic news, so the markets jump DOWN.
#25. To: mininggold (#24)
#26. To: mcgowanjm (#25)
(Edited)
Remember when Madoff was discovered to be a ponzi. On the message boards the first questions asked by many people were "Where is the money?" No one could comprehend that a 56 Billion dollar fund had NO MONEY.
#27. To: mininggold (#26)
And there still are many more out there similiarly stealing with the full blessing of Wall Street.
#28. To: mcgowanjm (#25)
Remember when Madoff was discovered to be a ponzi. On the message boards the first questions asked by many people were "Where is the money?" No one could comprehend that a 56 Billion dollar fund had NO MONEY.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#29. To: jwpegler (#28)
(Edited)
No different than Social Security.
#30. To: jwpegler, mininggold, All (#28)
No different than Social Security
#31. To: mininggold (#29)
The Madoff's of the world are what made Social Security neccessary.
#32. To: lucysmom, All (#31)
The world's Madoffs want to get their hands on all that SS money.
#33. To: lucysmom (#1)
#34. To: mcgowanjm (#30)
(Edited)
SS is completely solvent and will be for at least 20 more years...
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#35. To: jwpegler (#34)
Social Security started running an annual deficit this year and will continue to do so as the baby boomers flood into the system. It's broke.
#36. To: Badeye (#33)
The rationalizations for doing so are very similiar to a drunk's reasoning for demanding he be given another bottle of Jack Daniels.
#37. To: lucysmom (#35)
(Edited)
it has a $2.6 trillion dollar surplus
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#38. To: jwpegler (#34)
#39. To: jwpegler lucysmom, All (#37)
it has a $2.6 trillion dollar surplus
#40. To: lucysmom (#36)
What I do know is that if we don't pay our bills, we've broken our word.
#41. To: Badeye (#40)
Raising the debt ceiling doesn't pay our bills.
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