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Title: Happy 10th Birthday, Bush Tax Cuts! You've been a failure in every conceivable way
Source:
Slate
URL Source: http://www.slate.com/id/2296578
Published: Jun 10, 2011
Author: Annie Lowery
Post Date: 2011-06-10 10:59:53 by go65
Keywords: None
Views: 42463
Comments: 143
Unfortunately, the tax cuts never translated into robust economic growth, either. Indeed, the aughts saw the worst growth since World War II. From 2001 to 2007, annual GDP growth averaged just 2.4 percent per year, lower than in any other postwar business cycle. The contrast is starker still when judging against the previous decade. In real terms, GDP grew half as much from 2001 to 2010 as from 1991 to 2000.
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#50. To: Rudgear (#27)
A budget surplus has nothing to do with whether one earns his money or steals it.
It is our responsibility to protect that child once that child’s born too. When we start debating a budget, let’s make sure we don’t cut 100,000 vaccines. Let’s make sure we’ve got health insurance. We seem to worship what we cannot see, but as soon as that baby’s born, oh no, we don’t want to be intrusive. Texas is going to shrink government until it fits inside a women’s uterus. Senator Leticia Van de Putte
It has everything to do with government stealing more than they claim they need from those who earn and therefore own the money.
war has to do something for entertainment. The voices in his head aren't speaking to him and his imaginary friends have found reasons not to come over anymore.
That's a lie. It was worse, when you strip away the government manipulation. But blaming the financial collapse on Herr Dumbass- much of a buffoon as he was- is akin to assigning the sinking of the Titanic on only one of the sailors... when there was plenty of blame to spread around. The reality that this is inevitable conclusion of a Ponzi scheme, concocted in 1912, at Jeckyll Island. And when it was put together, they knew that we'd reach this point, sooner or later. Well, we're at the end of the road... the banksters have robbed and pillaged the economy for every amount of capital value they can, and now they're intentionally tanking out the economy. Soon, they'll move on to rob another country (or maybe the entire world in one fell swoop, if the Euro doesn't implode too soon). Assigning this disaster to just Bush, Clinton, Obama or even Reagan, is a failure to understand what's really going on, or intentional obfuscation of the truth. In other words, you're either ignorant to reality, or a shill. Which is it?
List of those unable to think: Bumper sticker on DwarF's car: You've been asked to explain that chart several times Erica. You've yet to do so once.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" I don't think anyone would dispute the role of sub-prime lending in the mortgage meltdown, however as it has been painstakingly explained to you several times, these riskier loans were not made under the auspices of CRA. Furthermore the entire CRA loan program was such a small portion of the overall mortgage market that it is absurd to conclude that CRA had anything to do with the meltdown. There is an argument to be made that the GSEs loosened lending standards to help minority borrowers, and that the big banks were complicit in as much as they outsourced their due diligence to predatory mortgage brokers who conned uninformed borrowers to mistate their financial circumstances in order to qualify for loans they had no realistic ability to pay back. Sometimes these mortgage brokers were a subsidiary of the company which built the new homes and offered special financing packages on the inflated sale price. The mortgage rating agencies also played a role by failing to perform their fiduciary responsibility to properly rate the risk of these loans. The list of bad characters who participated in the real estate boom and bust is endless. The overarching theme in this tragedy is the FAILURE of market forces in a deregulated environment to work as advertised to prevent the financial meltdown. The obvious solution would be to reenact the strict regulations that prevented this type of crisis for over sixty years, which is exactly why a cabal of conservative bloggers first conspired to create the smear that CRA was to blame.
Weren’t the majority of the subprime loans made by mortgage service companies not subject to the CRA? This is true. But it is largely beside the point. A huge driver of the demand for subprime loans was the demand for CRA bonds. Banks operating under the CRA could meet their obligations by buying up CRA loans or MBS built from CRA loans. The CRA created a demand that the mortgage servicers were meeting. What's more, many smaller mortage service companies hoped to be acquired by larger banks. Increasing their CRA lending made them more attractive take-over targets. A study put out by the Treasury Department in 2000 found that the CRA was encouraging the mortgage servicers to provide loans to low-income borrowers, in part because the CRA loans had been so successful. Finally, the Clinton adminstration threatened to subject the mortgage companies to the CRA if they didn't comply voluntarily. They promptly agreed to increase their CRA-type lending in order to escape the kind of public scrutiny that comes with official CRA regulated status.
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
There is the matter of debt that Clinton and Gore wanted to use the budget surplus to pay down.
It is our responsibility to protect that child once that child’s born too. When we start debating a budget, let’s make sure we don’t cut 100,000 vaccines. Let’s make sure we’ve got health insurance. We seem to worship what we cannot see, but as soon as that baby’s born, oh no, we don’t want to be intrusive. Texas is going to shrink government until it fits inside a women’s uterus. Senator Leticia Van de Putte
http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=21121&Disp=0
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
war has to do something for entertainment. The voices in his head aren't speaking to him and his imaginary friends have found reasons not to come over anymore.
This is true. Which means GAME OVER. CRA bonds, as was explained to you, were private placements and not sold on the general market. You HATE ni**ers Paddy...we get that. But it's also what makes you stupid.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" NOw stomp your feet and hold your breath until your face turns blue, Rudy...
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" His name is Brian. Be nice.
You HATE ni**ers Paddy...we get that. But it's also what makes you stupid Have you gone into your 6 pack phase now? And as was explained to you is beside the point.
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
It is your point. CRA loans were just not enough to cause the crisis. And the "fact" that private lenders were loopholing CRA regs reinforces my point that Booosh abdicated oversight.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" Do you blame Bush for your diaper rash, too?
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
FN and FM did not cause the mortgage crisis. And his "new agency" was a new layer of bureaucracy inside the US Treasury that would have exercised the same oversight of the GSE's as the US Congress and would not have affected the mandate of the GSE's one bit.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" You just admitted they did. was a new layer of bureaucracy inside the US Treasury that would have exercised the same oversight of the GSE's as the US Congress and would not have affected the mandate of the GSE's one bit. And Barney Fag, deeply vested in FN, FM interests did everything he could to block this legislation which would have no effect on the GSEs. I wonder why?
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
You're out of your fucking mind. I am at a level so far above you on this that you can't tell your thumb from your dick. FN and FM did not cause the mortgage crisis.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" There is more to this ugly situation. New research by Edward Pinto, a former chief credit officer for Fannie Mae and a housing expert, has found that from the time Fannie and Freddie began buying risky loans as early as 1993, they routinely misrepresented the mortgages they were acquiring, reporting them as prime when they had characteristics that made them clearly subprime or Alt-A. An Alt-A mortgage is one in which the quality of the mortgage or the underwriting was deficient; it might lack adequate documentation, have a low or no down payment, or in some other way be more likely than a prime mortgage to default. Fannie and Freddie were also reporting these mortgages as prime, according to Mr. Pinto. Market observers, rating agencies and investors were unaware of the number of subprime and Alt-A mortgages infecting the financial system in late 2006 and early 2007. Of the 26 million subprime and Alt-A loans outstanding in 2008, 10 million were held or guaranteed by Fannie and Freddie, 5.2 million by other government agencies, and 1.4 million were on the books of the four largest U.S. banks. But because of Fannie and Freddie's mislabeling, there were millions more high-risk loans outstanding. That meant default rates as well as the actual losses after foreclosure were going to be outside all prior experience. When these rates began to show up early in 2007, it was apparent something was seriously wrong with assumptions on which AAA ratings had been based. It is easy to see how this misrepresentation was a principal cause of the financial crisis. -- You just said you agreed with all this
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
Don't put words in my mouth. You're an asshole and thus the stench is unbearable.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" FN and FM don't originate loans. The probability is that a mortgage that was issued in 1993, when interest rates were high, had been re-fi'd and thus paid down and off the books by 2006. Feel free to tell me how FN and FM caused the Northern Rock failure. Then you can move on to how they caused the Bradford and Bingley failure. Then the Redwood Trust failure. The mortgage crisis wasn't caused by mortgages issued in 1993 or 1999.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" So then what do you call it?
It is our responsibility to protect that child once that child’s born too. When we start debating a budget, let’s make sure we don’t cut 100,000 vaccines. Let’s make sure we’ve got health insurance. We seem to worship what we cannot see, but as soon as that baby’s born, oh no, we don’t want to be intrusive. Texas is going to shrink government until it fits inside a women’s uterus. Senator Leticia Van de Putte
But because of Fannie and Freddie's mislabeling, there were millions more high-risk loans outstanding. Mr. Pinto invented his own definitions for "subprime" and "Alt-A" loans.
It is our responsibility to protect that child once that child’s born too. When we start debating a budget, let’s make sure we don’t cut 100,000 vaccines. Let’s make sure we’ve got health insurance. We seem to worship what we cannot see, but as soon as that baby’s born, oh no, we don’t want to be intrusive. Texas is going to shrink government until it fits inside a women’s uterus. Senator Leticia Van de Putte
British companies? I guess your point is that these security packages here contained assets from those banks and thus, the GSEs would have nothing to with them? My reply? straw man Nobody claims that EVERY single bad asset was the result of GSEs and the CRA. And also, nogbody claims you are not knowledgable in this area. The problem is that it comes across through such an obvious political bias that it lacks credibility (at least how you portray things here). You think BUSH is the cause of every bad thing that ever happened and you think every thing about the CRA is just peachy. It is OBVIOUS that the CRA was the match that lit the fire (more like blow torch actually).
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
I've been trying to find what his issue was with the loans. The only possibility is that he mislabels mortgages with <20% down as subprime even though they required both superior credit and PMI. I also have no idea how he is coming up with an Alt-A definition unless he believes that applying current FICO standards, i.e. post mortgage meltdown standards which are much, much higher than they were in the earlier 2000's, to the loans made in 1993 is somehow "logical".
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" The Northern Rock failure - which happened in GB and not in the US - was the first one and caused investors, globally, to re-examine the underlying creditworthiness of the assets. What the investors found was that the assets were grossly overleveraged. This was no more apparent than in Redwood Trust, Thornburg and other private label mortgage originators that lent long and borrowed short. Investors demanded either more margin built into the assets that they used to secure credit lines or they cut back on credit lines or, worse, both. Eventually, this caught up to institutions like Bear Stearns. Bear Stearns had 10's of billions of dollars in liquidity when their Alt-A Trust was "performing" when it began to underperform, those credit lines got yanked. That had a "cascade effect" that first rolled through the housing market and then rolled through Wall Street and the banks. The irony of this is that mnost of the ALM's in the major banks REALIZED that their exposure to a burp in the general economy or the housing market specifically could leave them in a vulnerable position. So, in late 2005 and early 2006, banks started to curtail lending and focused on building a deposit base. The problem, though, was that on the portfolio side, PM's were buying the very same assets that the ALM's feared were going to underperform. The above, is the cause of the financial crisis. Nowhere in any of the above can the GSE's be found until the decline in the housing market took off and debt service underperformed.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" If I leave the front door wide open and neglect to keep an eye on it, when I find that my TV is gone and my fridge is emptied the blame begins and ends with me.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" Thanks for that UNIQUE analysis. Got anything to back it up? Timeline here shows US and worldwide problems starting much earlier and NR being only one minor event among many. http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/business/features/article_1434735.php/CHRONOLOGY_US_financial_crisis
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
No ramping up of CRA enforcement under Clinton in the 90s, no subprime crisis. Period I personally saw the difference in loan qualifications before and after.
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
Even authors who support his work because it supports their anti-government, anti-regulation agenda, describe his definitions as "unique".
It is our responsibility to protect that child once that child’s born too. When we start debating a budget, let’s make sure we don’t cut 100,000 vaccines. Let’s make sure we’ve got health insurance. We seem to worship what we cannot see, but as soon as that baby’s born, oh no, we don’t want to be intrusive. Texas is going to shrink government until it fits inside a women’s uterus. Senator Leticia Van de Putte
Have you looked at the economy? Timeline here shows US and worldwide problems starting much earlier and NR being only one minor event among many. Chuckles...the failure of a major bank a "minor event". Say good night, Gracie. Of course the ripples began prior, doofus. The NR failure wasn't caused by a snap of the fingers. The Fed, BoE and ECB had ALL clamped down on credit. What is the result of that? A credit crunch and a slowing economy. What happens when an economy slows?
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" Now tap your ruby slippers. When do you stop blaming Clinton AND exonerating Boosh?
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" Do you have a link to his "definitions" or am I close in my speculation as to what they are?
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" Your link backs me up, doof.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" Timeline here shows US and worldwide problems starting much earlier and NR being only one minor event among many. Nothing at this liberal website to indicate this one event to have the impact you claimed it had.
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
Typical. Even with you pointing that out, he will just pretend still not to see that obvious fact.
These high risk loans did NOT happen before Clinton ramped up enforcement of the CRA. You damn well know it's true, as much as you want to pretend otherwise.
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
You posted a blurb that claimed FN and FM mis-labeled "high risk" loans in 1993 thus understating how many were out there and thus causing the financial crisis. Now you're claiming that enforcing CRA provisions in 1997 caused high risk loans to be made thus causing the financial crisis. Refer back to my comment about you not knowing your thumb from your dick in this discussion.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" The obvious fact is that he's in over his head. So yea, you're correct.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!" One event does not preclude another. Both are culpable actions under Democrats.
Now, I know Iām not going to change the minds of any of the True Believersā¦those who read all of Reverend Alās sermons, and say things like, āYou know, global warming can mean warmer OR colder, wetter OR drier, cloudier OR sunnier, windier OR calmer, ā¦ā. Can I get an āamenā??
Read this until it sinks in...1993 was BEFORE 1997. You claimed that HIGH RISK loans were made in 1993. Then you claimed that HIGH RISK loans were not made until after Clinton "enforced CRA" in 1997. You'd better make sure that's your thumb you're sucking on.
America...My Kind Of Place... "I truly am not that concerned about [bin Laden]..." "THE MILITIA IS COMING!!! THE MILITIA IS COMING!!!"
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestNevertheless, there is no such thing as a budget surplus. Government doesn't make money. It confiscates it under the IRS. Common sense should tell you that.
#51. To: lucysmom (#50)
#52. To: go65 (#0)
Indeed, the aughts saw the worst growth since World War II. From 2001 to 2007, annual GDP growth averaged just 2.4 percent per year
mcgowanjm, ferret mike, skippy, fartboy/yukko, white sands, bucky, lucys idiot mom, e_type_jackoff, go56, badlie, wreck, calCON, mininggold, war, Banjo Boris, Biff, Godwinson and meguro. If you're on the above list, you're too fucking stupid to hold a real conversation.
#53. To: Capitalist Eric (#52)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#54. To: no gnu taxes, war (#48)
#55. To: Thunderbird (#54)
Furthermore the entire CRA loan program was such a small portion
#56. To: Rudgear (#51)
It has everything to do with government stealing more than they claim they need from those who earn and therefore own the money.
#57. To: Thunderbird (#54)
#58. To: lucysmom (#56)
There is the matter of debt that Clinton and Gore wanted to use the budget surplus to pay down.
#59. To: no gnu taxes (#55)
Furthermore the entire CRA loan program was such a small portion
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#60. To: Rudgear (#58)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#61. To: war (#60)
#62. To: war (#59)
CRA bonds, as was explained to you, were private placements and not sold on the general market.
#63. To: no gnu taxes (#62)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#64. To: war (#63)
#65. To: no gnu taxes (#64)
(Edited)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#66. To: war (#65)
FN and FM did not cause the mortgage crisis.
#67. To: no gnu taxes (#66)
You just admitted they did.
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#68. To: war (#67)
#69. To: no gnu taxes (#68)
You just said you agreed with all this
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#70. To: no gnu taxes (#68)
But because of Fannie and Freddie's mislabeling, there were millions more high-risk loans outstanding.
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#71. To: Rudgear (#58)
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A BUDGET SURPLUS!!
#72. To: no gnu taxes (#68)
Of the 26 million subprime and Alt-A loans outstanding in 2008, 10 million were held or guaranteed by Fannie and Freddie, 5.2 million by other government agencies, and 1.4 million were on the books of the four largest U.S. banks.
#73. To: war (#70)
Northern Rock Bradford and Bingley
#74. To: lucysmom (#72)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#75. To: no gnu taxes (#73)
British companies? I guess your point is that these security packages here contained assets from those banks and thus, the GSEs would have nothing to with them?
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#76. To: no gnu taxes (#73)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#77. To: war (#75)
(Edited)
#78. To: war (#76)
#79. To: war (#74)
I also have no idea how he is coming up with an Alt-A definition ...
#80. To: no gnu taxes (#77)
Thanks for that UNIQUE analysis. Got anything to back it up?
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#81. To: no gnu taxes (#78)
No ramping up of CRA enforcement under Clinton in the 90s, no subprime crisis.
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#82. To: lucysmom (#79)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#83. To: no gnu taxes (#77)
Thanks for that UNIQUE analysis. Got anything to back it up?
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#84. To: war (#80)
Thanks for that UNIQUE analysis. Got anything to back it up?
#85. To: war (#83)
"Your link backs me up, doof."
#86. To: war (#81)
#87. To: no gnu taxes (#86)
These high risk loans did NOT happen before Clinton ramped up enforcement of the CRA
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#88. To: Ferret Mike (#85)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
#89. To: war (#87)
#90. To: no gnu taxes (#89)
--GW Bush
--Sarah Palin's version of "The Midnight Ride of Paul revere"
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