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Economy
See other Economy Articles

Title: Krugman's Rightful Victory Lap - Mone Too...
Source: The NY Times
URL Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/03/opinion/03krugman.html?_r=1
Published: Jun 3, 2011
Author: Paul Krugman
Post Date: 2011-06-03 12:10:35 by war
Keywords: None
Views: 148760
Comments: 159

Earlier this week, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York published a blog post about the “mistake of 1937,” the premature fiscal and monetary pullback that aborted an ongoing economic recovery and prolonged the Great Depression. As Gauti Eggertsson, the post’s author (with whom I have done research) points out, economic conditions today — with output growing, some prices rising, but unemployment still very high — bear a strong resemblance to those in 1936-37. So are modern policy makers going to make the same mistake?

Mr. Eggertsson says no, that economists now know better. But I disagree. In fact, in important ways we have already repeated the mistake of 1937. Call it the mistake of 2010: a “pivot” away from jobs to other concerns, whose wrongheadedness has been highlighted by recent economic data.

To be sure, things could be worse — and there’s a strong chance that they will, indeed, get worse.

Back when the original 2009 Obama stimulus was enacted, some of us warned that it was both too small and too short-lived. In particular, the effects of the stimulus would start fading out in 2010 — and given the fact that financial crises are usually followed by prolonged slumps, it was unlikely that the economy would have a vigorous self-sustaining recovery under way by then.

By the beginning of 2010, it was already obvious that these concerns had been justified. Yet somehow an overwhelming consensus emerged among policy makers and pundits that nothing more should be done to create jobs, that, on the contrary, there should be a turn toward fiscal austerity.

This consensus was fed by scare stories about an imminent loss of market confidence in U.S. debt. Every uptick in interest rates was interpreted as a sign that the “bond vigilantes” were on the attack, and this interpretation was often reported as a fact, not as a dubious hypothesis.

For example, in March 2010, The Wall Street Journal published an article titled “Debt Fears Send Rates Up,” reporting that long-term U.S. interest rates had risen and asserting — without offering any evidence — that this rise, to about 3.9 percent, reflected concerns about the budget deficit. In reality, it probably reflected several months of decent jobs numbers, which temporarily raised optimism about recovery.

But never mind. Somehow it became conventional wisdom that the deficit, not unemployment, was Public Enemy No. 1 — a conventional wisdom both reflected in and reinforced by a dramatic shift in news coverage away from unemployment and toward deficit concerns. Job creation effectively dropped off the agenda.

So, here we are, in the middle of 2011. How are things going?

Well, the bond vigilantes continue to exist only in the deficit hawks’ imagination. Long-term interest rates have fluctuated with optimism or pessimism about the economy; a recent spate of bad news has sent them down to about 3 percent, not far from historic lows.

And the news has, indeed, been bad. As the stimulus has faded out, so have hopes of strong economic recovery. Yes, there has been some job creation — but at a pace barely keeping up with population growth. The percentage of American adults with jobs, which plunged between 2007 and 2009, has barely budged since then. And the latest numbers suggest that even this modest, inadequate job growth is sputtering out.

So, as I said, we have already repeated a version of the mistake of 1937, withdrawing fiscal support much too early and perpetuating high unemployment.

Yet worse things may soon happen.

On the fiscal side, Republicans are demanding immediate spending cuts as the price of raising the debt limit and avoiding a U.S. default. If this blackmail succeeds, it will put a further drag on an already weak economy.

Meanwhile, a loud chorus is demanding that the Fed and its counterparts abroad raise interest rates to head off an alleged inflationary threat. As the New York Fed article points out, the rise in consumer price inflation over the past few months — which is already showing signs of tailing off — reflected temporary factors, and underlying inflation remains low. And smart economists like Mr. Eggerstsson understand this. But the European Central Bank is already raising rates, and the Fed is under pressure to do the same. Further attempts to help the economy expand seem out of the question.

So the mistake of 2010 may yet be followed by an even bigger mistake. Even if that doesn’t happen, however, the fact is that the policy response to the crisis was and remains vastly inadequate.

Those who refuse to learn from history are condemned to repeat it; we did, and we are. What we’re experiencing may not be a full replay of the Great Depression, but that’s little consolation for the millions of American families suffering from a slump that just goes on and on.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 72.

#8. To: war (#0)

More ca ca from the NY Times...... aint that a surprise.....

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-03   18:00:59 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: CZ82 (#8)

Krugman is an editorial page contributor to the Times. He's syndicated and published elsewhere.

In other words, take your Sean Hannity talking point and stick it.

war  posted on  2011-06-03   18:42:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: war (#10)

Krugman is an editorial page contributor to the Times. He's syndicated and published elsewhere

And is that supposed to impress me into believing what he says..... not....

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-03   18:51:44 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: CZ82 (#11)

Of course, you can't cite a cogent reason WHY you don't believe him - even though what he predicted 2 years ago has come true.

war  posted on  2011-06-03   19:10:39 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: war (#13)

Of course, you can't cite a cogent reason WHY you don't believe him - even though what he predicted 2 years ago has come true.

That the stimulus would be a failure because of where it was targeted? (A way to keep his union pals working for awhile longer so he could reap the benefits of their campaign contributions for 2012)... So did he say that????

We didn't need the stimulus, plain, pure and simple.... It didn't accomplish anything other than to put us more in debt, and help bribe his "Gangsta" buddies for their support....

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-04   7:09:21 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: CZ82 (#33)

That the stimulus would be a failure because of where it was targeted?

It targeted consumers and public works projects.

We didn't need the stimulus, plain, pure and simple....

We were in the depths of a recession that was on its way to being a Depression. It did a great job of stopping that almost in its tracks. The problem is that it did little else.

Tax cuts, btw, are both stimulative AND put us into debt.

I've never seen you argue against one.

war  posted on  2011-06-04   7:20:14 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: war (#35)

We were in the depths of a recession that was on its way to being a Depression. It did a great job of stopping that almost in its tracks. The problem is that it did little else.

Ask the Japanese about stimulus plans, they did 8-10 of them and are still suffering to this day from that useless shit....

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-04   7:54:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: CZ82 (#38)

Ask the Japanese about stimulus plans

I worked for a Japanese company for 9 years. You can't stimulate an economy without giving incentive to spend money. All of their "stimulus" was to give incentive for foreign investments [capital outflow] and exports.

war  posted on  2011-06-04   8:59:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: war (#44)

Ask the Japanese about stimulus plans

I worked for a Japanese company for 9 years. You can't stimulate an economy without giving incentive to spend money. All of their "stimulus" was to give incentive for foreign investments [capital outflow] and exports.

But the point is their stimulus plans didn't work either!!!!! They are so far in debt it isn't funny and have publically said they were a waste of time.....

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-04   10:06:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: CZ82 (#53)

But the point is their stimulus plans didn't work either!!!!!

That may be your point that supports your agenda however that doesn't make it "the" point.

lucysmom  posted on  2011-06-04   10:18:19 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: lucysmom (#57)

But the point is their stimulus plans didn't work either!!!!!

That may be your point that supports your agenda however that doesn't make it "the" point

And the original point was..... "Back when the original 2009 Obama stimulus was enacted, some of us warned that it was both too small and too short-lived".

In essence do the same thing the Japanese did and failed at......

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-04   10:22:02 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: CZ82 (#59)

In essence do the same thing the Japanese did and failed at......

The Japanese did - and have done - nothing to stimulate domestic consumption.

war  posted on  2011-06-04   10:38:16 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: war (#63)

The Japanese did - and have done - nothing to stimulate domestic consumption.

So their population is growing but they're not buying anything made in their own country????

Sounds familiar doesn't it!!!!!

CZ82  posted on  2011-06-04   10:46:25 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: CZ82 (#66)

So their population is growing but they're not buying anything made in their own country????

Japan raised the consumption tax, what effect do you think that would have on domestic buying?

lucysmom  posted on  2011-06-04   10:54:07 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: lucysmom (#69)

I'm starting to get a little bit tired of spoon feeding these grossly under-informed people. All that they do is regurgitate talk radio and Fox News lies or believe some Moonbat website - as in Capitaine Erica.

war  posted on  2011-06-04   10:57:43 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 72.

#73. To: war (#72)

All that they do is regurgitate talk radio and Fox News lies or believe some Moonbat website - as in Capitaine Erica.

What gets me is when theory meets real life and fails, they seem to think reapplying the failed theory will yield a different result.

lucysmom  posted on  2011-06-04 11:10:11 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: war, Capitalist Eric (#72)

believe some Moonbat website - as in Capitaine Erica

Title: Krugman's Rightful Victory Lap - Mone Too...
Source: The NY Times
Post Date: 2011-06-03 12:10:35 by war

ROFLMAO!

They don't get any more moon-batty, than the NY Times.

Hondo68  posted on  2011-06-04 11:15:06 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#76. To: war (#72)

I'm starting to get a little bit tired of spoon feeding these grossly under-informed people.

Dumbass, you're a legend in your own mind.

All you do is take whatever situation exists and use whatever convenient, available left wing talking points that exist to credit moonbats if it's good news or blame conservatives if it's bad news.

That's it. That's all you are, and it's pretty fucking transparent.

You say we should have had more stimulus? 800 fucking billion was not enough? How much would have been enough? 900 billion? 2 trillion? 100 trillion?

Ask just about any small business owner right now what the problem is and they will tell you that they are content not to expand because they don't want to stick their necks out to wait for Obama's left wing Sword of Damacles to chop their head off.

no gnu taxes  posted on  2011-06-04 11:21:56 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 72.

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