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Title: Amtrak Chugs Deeper Into the Red
Source:
WSJ
URL Source: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100 ... 701866.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
Published: May 19, 2011
Author: Josh Mitchell
Post Date: 2011-05-19 13:40:34 by socalv8
Keywords: amtrak, tax dollars, money pit
Views: 12574
Comments: 40
Amtrak's financial losses are projected to widen this year despite rising ridership, the top executive of the government-subsidized rail system said Tuesday. Amtrak blames the red ink on rising compensation costs for union workers and increased costs for fuel, materials and other expenses. Amtrak is making money on its heavily traveled Northeast Corridor between Boston and Washington, serving mostly commuters, executives said. But money-losing, long-distance routes are a drag on the bottom line, Amtrak says. Amtrak officials project an operating loss of $506 million in the fiscal year ending Sept. 30, up from a loss of $419.9 million last year. Officials have projected a loss of $616 million next year.
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#1. To: socalv8, godwinson (#0)
THIS is socialism is action, gobsheit.
List of those unable to think: Bumper sticker on DwarF's car: It is America failing is what it is. Trains in socialist Europe don't have these problems. If America adopted the Euo-Socialist model then Amtrak would be fixed. By the way, how much profit do America's socialist built highways generate for the govt? Zero. The govt build the highways and charges nothing for their use.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
They use the peoples money to build it. It should be free.
------------------------------------- Perhaps if Amtrak were allowed to shut down unprofitable routes, it wouldn't have these problems. Of course, Amtrak's losses pail in comparison when you then of the hundreds of billions of dollars spent in the last thirty years on road/air support.
"Thats because your basically and idiot." 41 of 43 routes are unprofitable. Socialism is communism is economic suicide.
war has to do something for entertainment. The voices in his head aren't speaking to him and his imaginary friends have found reasons not to come over anymore.
Why aren't they allowed to shut them down?
Tea Bagger conservatives hate choo choos for some reason. I believe it's because they don't attract the strip malls like the highways do.
Perhaps someone could list a usage comparison. Daily air + auto passengers vs. Amtrak passengers.
No, a socialst aspect of America is failing, badly.
They are still the biggest conveyors of coal and certain ag products, that would not look good being spilled all over the highways.
How much profit does the highway system generate for the DOT? Last I looked the DOT made ZERO profit.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
I agree, let's shut down the routes that mostly the big ag and energy corporations use. But I don't want to hear the stupid east coasters whining when they run out of coal in the middle of winter. But hey, I'm tired of subsidizing their cheap coal.
Under the corporate model that's unofficially been adopted for the USA every department is now for profit.
Just like the post office. Why should rural areas pay so little for mailing service?
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Is it a loaded question if I ask how much profit the US military generates?
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
The so called conservatives on here are trying to use Amtrak as a reason why socialism does not work. Which makes sense only to kook conservative thinking. For example, the so called conservatives will argue that the New Deal did not end the Great Depression but rather WW2 spending did. What is funny about so called conservatives arguing this point is that more socialism required by WW2 spending ended the Great Depression when half hearted New Deal socialism did not. Thus, so called conservatives actually argue that socialism does work........
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
I keep thinking of the extra interstate lanes needed to accomodate all the coal transporting trucks that now will be sharing the road.
Do we have enough fossil fuel for all those trucks needed to replace rail? How much will those huge SUV cars cost now to fill up at the pump if we eliminated Amtrak?
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Federal gas tax. Check-mate.
List of those unable to think: Bumper sticker on DwarF's car: Check-mate. That's used to maintain the highway system - not for profit. It costs more to maintain the highways than the gas tax raises.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
It costs more to maintain the highways than the gas tax raises. Then you don't know how government contracts run- sucker. And to your original point, "The govt build the highways and charges nothing for their use," I easily demonstrated that you're a lying colostomy bag. It only took four words. LOL. Your attempted thread hijack has failed. Again.
List of those unable to think: Bumper sticker on DwarF's car: I write: "The govt build the highways and does not profit directly for their use". In other words, Socialism for the use of the masses.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
again it looks like you failed to read the article: Amtrak doesn't have the freedom to shut down unprofitable routes. Of course, absent government support airlines would have shut down years ago, and roads would never be built. Capitalism can be a bitch sometimes too.
"Thats because your basically and idiot." Remember, the lack of intelligent thought is a requirement to be a conservative nowadays. We've come a long way from Bill Buckley.
"Thats because your basically and idiot." Socialism always fails. Communism (which is Socialism in slow motion) always fails. That's a FACT. And at the end of the day, NOTHING you say will change that FACT.
List of those unable to think: Bumper sticker on DwarF's car: Socialism has been much the rule for most of human history. Actually capitalism is the new kid on the block.
They pay, right? Lemme guess, coal and ag producers are getting our tax money as a way to keep fares favorable?
Check-mate. Ouch. Eric has your number, hippy!
Ouch. Eric has your number, hippy! Federal gas tax = socialism Also the DOT does not profit from the federal gas tax nor is it enough to take care of the roads and highways, bridges, etc,
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Here is the answer: Mitch Daniels in Indiana leased a money losing toll road to a private firm for 75 years. The private firm will pay Indiana $3.8 billion which will be used for transportation projects. The firm will maintain and operate the toll road at a profit by operating it more efficiently than the stinking government can. Texas and Ohio are looking at doing the same thing. Even though Indiana is getting $3.8 billion (instead of losing money like it is today), the brain dead left just doesn't get it. They just don't understand. It's maddening.
Yep, it's socialism for big business. It's worth it to me though as a trade off as trains have much, much lower accident rates. And I and most others hate diverting around the messy toxic highway cleanups from those nasty accidents.
If I remember correctly from way back when, its a national security issue.
The Republican budget goes after children and the poor. Courage would be going after defense and the rich. Bill Maher
Of course not. If they did, they wouldn't be leftists.
List of those unable to think: Bumper sticker on DwarF's car: Your vision of America is a toll road every 20 miles? Kooks.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
That was certainly the vision of the people who built the Ohio Turnpike and Pennsylvania Turnpike. It was also the vision of the people in London and Singapore who built their road congestion pricing systems. Now I know how old you are. You don't have to stop to pay for tolls anymore. You put a transponder in your car that deducts money from a debit card when you pass through a toll area. This is the fair and efficient way to pay for roads -- make the people who use them pay. I favor this approach over any type of general tax to pay for roads. You are the kook and an obsolete one at that.
Failures.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Texas and Ohio are looking at doing the same thing. We tried that here in Virginia. The toll to use the Dulles Greenway have gone from $2.70 to $5.25 per trip over the last 2 years and will rise another .30 next year. It's lightly used and as a result, traffic on secondary roads that parallel is jammed. Even our Republican Congressman is fighting with them to limit future toll hikes.
"Thats because your basically and idiot." If there are alternate routes then you need a different approach. You need a general road pricing system around Dulles like they have in London and Singapore. When you enter Dulles from whatever road, the transponder would charge you. We're talking about doing this in Seattle to pay for several roads and bridges that need to be replaced and widened. Singapore has had this for more than a dozen years. It's the right approach.
mininggold said coal and ag products have to stay on rails.
Why aren't they allowed to shut them down? (money losing routes) They are still the biggest conveyors of coal and certain ag products, that would not look good being spilled all over the highways. If I remember correctly from way back when, its a national security issue. No current answer here, but some good info... That happened right after David Gunn took over from Warrington in 2003 and discovered that Amtrak was broke. The DOT loaned Amtrak $100 Million to cover payroll, with the condition that Amtrak could not add any new routes unless an interested third party guarenteed that Amtrak would not loose money. They have taken routes away in the past, but are they able to take away routes now? Yes, Amtrak can still cancel routes, recent examples are the Palmetto and the 3 Rivers.
Amtrak officials project an operating loss of $506 million in the fiscal year ending Sept. 30, up from a loss of $419.9 million last year. Officials have projected a loss of $616 million next year.
mcgowanjm, ferret mike, skippy, fartboy/yukko, white sands, bucky, lucys idiot mom, e_type_jackoff, go56, badlie, wreck, calCON, mininggold, war, Banjo Boris, Biff, Godwinson and meguro. If you're on the above list, you're too fucking stupid to hold a real conversation.
#2. To: Capitalist Eric (#1)
THIS is socialism is action
#3. To: Godwinson (#2)
Why don't you make like a tree and get out of here?
#4. To: socalv8 (#0)
Badeye posted on 2011-04-29 10:30:22 ET
#5. To: go65, Godwinson (#4)
#6. To: go65 (#4)
Perhaps if Amtrak were allowed to shut down unprofitable routes, it wouldn't have these problems.
#7. To: go65 (#4)
Of course, Amtrak's losses pail in comparison when you then of the hundreds of billions of dollars spent in the last thirty years on road/air support.
#8. To: mininggold (#7)
Of course, Amtrak's losses pail in comparison when you then of the hundreds of billions of dollars spent in the last thirty years on road/air support.
#9. To: Godwinson (#2)
It is America failing is what it is.
#10. To: socalv8 (#6)
Why aren't they allowed to shut them down?
#11. To: mininggold, socalv8 (#10)
#12. To: socalv8 (#9)
(Edited)
No, a socialst aspect of America is failing, badly.
#13. To: Godwinson (#11)
How much profit does the highway system generate for the DOT? Last I looked the DOT made ZERO profit.
#14. To: mininggold, socalv8 (#12)
#15. To: mininggold (#13)
Under the corporate model that's unofficially been adopted for the USA every department is now for profit.
#16. To: Rudgear, go65, mininggold (#5)
(Edited)
#17. To: Godwinson (#14)
Just like the post office. Why should rural areas pay so little for mailing service?
#18. To: mininggold (#17)
#19. To: Godwinson (#2)
the way, how much profit do America's socialist built highways generate for the govt? Zero. The govt build the highways and charges nothing for their use.
mcgowanjm, ferret mike, skippy, fartboy/yukko, white sands, bucky, lucys idiot mom, e_type_jackoff, go56, badlie, wreck, calCON, mininggold, war, Banjo Boris, Biff, Godwinson and meguro. If you're on the above list, you're too fucking stupid to hold a real conversation.
#20. To: Capitalist Eric (#19)
Federal gas tax.
#21. To: Godwinson (#20)
That's used to maintain the highway system - not for profit.
mcgowanjm, ferret mike, skippy, fartboy/yukko, white sands, bucky, lucys idiot mom, e_type_jackoff, go56, badlie, wreck, calCON, mininggold, war, Banjo Boris, Biff, Godwinson and meguro. If you're on the above list, you're too fucking stupid to hold a real conversation.
#22. To: Capitalist Eric (#21)
#23. To: Rudgear (#5)
41 of 43 routes are unprofitable. Socialism is communism is economic suicide.
Amtrak spokesman Steve Kulm said Amtrak continued to work on ways to raise revenue, including adding services like Wi-Fi to attract more riders, while making moves to cut costs, such as making its trains more energy-efficient. But he said the long-distance routes would continue to lose money.
"The Congress and this country need to make a policy decision: Do they want intercity long-distance trains or do they not?" Mr. Kulm said.
Cutting long-distance service would likely face opposition from lawmakers in the affected areas.
Badeye posted on 2011-04-29 10:30:22 ET
#24. To: Godwinson (#16)
What is funny about so called conservatives arguing this point is that more socialism required by WW2 spending ended the Great Depression when half hearted New Deal socialism did not. Thus, so called conservatives actually argue that socialism does work........
Badeye posted on 2011-04-29 10:30:22 ET
#25. To: Godwinson (#22)
Socialism for the use of the masses.
mcgowanjm, ferret mike, skippy, fartboy/yukko, white sands, bucky, lucys idiot mom, e_type_jackoff, go56, badlie, wreck, calCON, mininggold, war, Banjo Boris, Biff, Godwinson and meguro. If you're on the above list, you're too fucking stupid to hold a real conversation.
#26. To: Capitalist Eric (#25)
(Edited)
Socialism always fails. Communism (which is Socialism in slow motion) always fails
#27. To: mininggold (#10)
They are still the biggest conveyors of coal and certain ag products
#28. To: Godwinson, Capitalist Eric (#22)
Federal gas tax.
#29. To: socalv8, Capitalist Eric, mininggold (#28)
Federal gas tax. Check-mate.
#30. To: Godwinson, capitalist eric (#20)
(Edited)
It costs more to maintain the highways than the gas tax raises.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#31. To: socalv8 (#27)
They pay, right? Lemme guess, coal and ag producers are getting our tax money as a way to keep fares favorable?
#32. To: socalv8 (#6)
(Edited)
Why aren't they allowed to shut them down?
#33. To: jwpegler (#30)
the brain dead left just doesn't get it.
mcgowanjm, ferret mike, skippy, fartboy/yukko, white sands, bucky, lucys idiot mom, e_type_jackoff, go56, badlie, wreck, calCON, mininggold, war, Banjo Boris, Biff, Godwinson and meguro. If you're on the above list, you're too fucking stupid to hold a real conversation.
#34. To: jwpegler, capitalist eric, go65 (#30)
#35. To: Godwinson, go65, capitalist eric (#34)
(Edited)
Your vision of America is a toll road every 20 miles? Kooks.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#36. To: jwpegler (#35)
That was certainly the vision of the people who built the Ohio Turnpike and Pennsylvania Turnpike.
#37. To: jwpegler (#30)
(Edited)
Mitch Daniels in Indiana leased a money losing toll road to a private firm for 75 years. The private firm will pay Indiana $3.8 billion which will be used for transportation projects. The firm will maintain and operate the toll road at a profit by operating it more efficiently than the stinking government can.
Badeye posted on 2011-04-29 10:30:22 ET
#38. To: go65 (#37)
(Edited)
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#39. To: lucysmom (#32)
If I remember correctly from way back when, its a national security issue.
I'm interested and will try to find the law/reason.
#40. To: mininggold, lucysmom (#39)
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