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Title: Freedoms We had in the 19th Century We do NOT Have Now Thanks to "Progressives"
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Published: Apr 5, 2011
Author: Coral Snake
Post Date: 2011-04-05 02:10:25 by Coral Snake
Keywords: Freedoms, Liberty, 19th Century
Views: 24835
Comments: 42
These are the freedoms we had in the 19th Century that we DON'T have now thanks to "PROGRESSIVES". 1. Freedom of travel. As a general rule horses and wagons were not LICENSED and REGISTERED and one did not have to submit to sexually oriented "pat downs" in order to board the stage coach or "iron horse" (passenger train). What roads that existed were paid for by county and state taxation and since everybody paid the taxes everybody had free use of them. 2. Gambling and losing was a personal choice not the law. Yes, legal Faro banks were crooked for the most part and led some of their players to become gambling addicts but one had a choice of weather he was going to play or not. Nowdays Faro and other "casino gambling" is illegal with the exception of a few states, riverboats and Native American reservations. However there Is a Gamble which is little more than an old fashion Faro bank with Founding Fathers and dead presidents on the layout rather than the spade suit of cards and a high card bar. This is known as the Federal Reserve System. The difference is however the FARO RESERVE BANK is a monopoly whose game you are FORCED to play in (legal tender laws, no alternative Social Credit based legal tender currency issued directly by the treasury) and ALWAYS LOSE (through inflation and loss of the value of the "layout elements" (Federal Reserve Notes)) Even the most crooked Faro banks of old had to allow someone to win once and a while in order to keep its game going in competition with all the others. 4. Guns, With the exception of Native Americans and Blacks (guess who were the objects of GENOCIDES then) guns were freely available even in interstate commerce. They were even prominent merchandise in the early Sears and Mintgomert Wards general merchandise mail order cataloges of the last decade of the 19th century. Today you have to have some degree of Federal Firearms License (usually Collector of Curios and Relics if you are a simple homeowner) to by a gun in Interstate commerce unless it is a 19th century cartridge gun made before the last year of that century (1899) or used an 18th or early 19th century ignition system (Flintlock, Wheel Lock, Percussion Cap Muzzle loader). Some states like California, New York, Illinois and the like add other licensing requirements to these. the TWENTY THOUSAND GUN CONTROL LAWS that "progressives" have infected the constitutional right to bear arms with evenaffect TOY GUNS these days. Actually believe it or not toy guns in the 19th century were sinply deactivated REAL guns that could no longer fire a bullet through them that were given to children it that state because they were noi longer working as firearms or were obsolete as firearms. Indeed most Percussion revolvers that were not converted to cartridge guns became deactivated toys in the late 19th century and youth organizations of the late 19th century that were percursors to the Boy Scouts in the 20th century issued deactivated muzzle loaders to their youth units to display the unit's achievments as a unit on. Today toy guns that look "too real" (like airsoft guns and paintball guns that in fact are not really toys at all since they do shoot projectiles with potential injurious effect on an unprotected person) ahave to carry an orange muzzle or muzzle extension under the federal law and the laws of several states. This is supposidly to allow for the identification of fake guns by police officers (like a police officer can recognize an orange tip on a gun barrel from a distance. NOT). The actual purpose of these "orange tip" laws is to further demonise guns in general and facilitate the passage of even more laws against guns like airsoft, paintball and other "toy" guns and eventually REAL guns based on the legislative momentum against the "toys". The truth on this "orange tip" business is that the police have no business fireing back with a real gun, tazer or anything else at anyone but someone firing a real gun or tazer at them. The mere presence of a gun on the hip or in the hand "toy" or OTHERWISE is no reason for considering the person with it to be a criminal deserving of being shot ot tazed. These "mistaken identity" police shooting of kids with toy guns is just another outgrowth of the ARROGANCE in State law enforcement personel caused directly by "Progressive" passed or backed GUN CONTROL LAWS no matter what type of guns they cover, ARROGANCE that has eventually led to GENOCIDE in "gun controlled" nations throughout the 20th century. 5. Invention and innovation, In the 19th century copyright lasted a maximum of 28 years and had bo be renewed in the middle of that term (14 years). Patent lasted a maximum of 14 years and covered hardware inventions only (such as telephones, guns, clocks, vehicles, etc.) This allowed for a vast public domain of ideas, inventions and art that talented people could improve upon and create new copyrightable and patentable ideas, inventions and art when the copyrights and patents expired. Nowdays copyrights are not allowed to expire due to "progressive" control of the culture and the publishing companies that created it and that industry's hold over "progressive Liberal" lawmakers like Dianne Feinstein and "Progressive Neo-CON" lawmakers like Orren Hatch and former senator Chriss Dodd (Who is now the head of the MPPA, the "progressive" movie industry lobby that pushes for perminent copyright.) Patents now cover things like software, "genetically engineered life forms" and business models. (The Founders and even the people of the 19th century were still strong Bible believers and would have seen a "genetically engineered life form" as an ABOMINATION, NOT a patentable invention.) What perminant copyright and patents outside of inanimate hardware essentially mean is that "Progressives" and their overloards the ILLUMINATI own our culture on a perminent basis and that is probably THE MAJOR reason it has declined so badly in the 20th and 21st centuries. 6. Currency Choice, In the 19th century there were several types of money available. The top of the system was gold and silver coins. However if you wanted the value of the coins without the headache of carrying them around (especially for large transactions) you could trade them for paper gold and silver certificates. If you did not care about the particular metal that backed them there were Treasury of Coin notes they coulf be translated into. For those who did not care about backing and wanted to use fiat money there were also two choices in the 19th century. One was the "Lincoln Greenbacks", fiat money issued directly by the treasury on a debt free basis that would come to be called "social credit" in some circles. The other was National Bank Notes which were essentially usurous debt issued locally by banks with a national charter. Today you have a single choice for currency and that is usurous debt issued by the Federal Reserve System (FARO RESERVE BANK). Because of this the nation is now virtually bankrupted to whoever owns the Fed,(International Bankers). Another service "for the workers" you can thank the "progressives" for.
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#2. To: Skip Intro (#1)
Of course you can, its just now there are legal consequences.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
Forty acres of some elses land and a rented mule. I can hardly wait.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
As far as I know, you can print and use your own money. Several cities have a local currency. You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
Since when do you care about the immorality of the government seizing someone else s property and giving it away?
Well, [Yu-Kloughn v. 2.0's] got to do something for attention, his multiple personalities aren't speaking to him any more, and his imaginary friends keep finding excuses not to come over.
Now I don't mean to say all is bad these days. For instance, thanks to the efforts of tireless patriots like the Koch Brothers and Rush Limbaugh, we're about to rid the country once and for all of that annoying middle class, with their pretensions of importance and self worth. Soon they'll be back in the lower class where they belong, obeying the commands of their masters.
You are foreign born aren't you? I'm talking about share cropping. Once a very common occurrence in the US. And if you were lucky the soil was fertile enough to make the effort worthwhile. I also can't wait for the return of the popularity of indentured servitude where your owner could do almost anything with you according to their heart's desire. Including often not releasing one from the indenturement, due to "technicalities".
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
I don't know where you got that idea, comrade. My family has been in this country since the 1600's. Being a progressive, by definition you have some unconsidered and nonfactual ideas. 'Forty acres and a mule' referred to the Homestead Act of 1862 to encourage pioneers to settle the trans-Mississippi region, instead of passing it by on the way to the coast. I know you on the left like to rewrite history to suit your agenda, but it is ultimately ineffectual.
Well, [Yu-Kloughn v. 2.0's] got to do something for attention, his multiple personalities aren't speaking to him any more, and his imaginary friends keep finding excuses not to come over.
The "gun" passage - indicating that somehow we had more gun rights in the past shows how the right wing lies or is ignorant about history and probably gets their history from movies than from actually reading primary sources. But even when they watch movies they overlook the part where the lawman forces the cowboy to give up his gun as soon as he enters town or be arrested. Tombstone lawmakers in the 1880s did more to combat gun violence than the Arizona government does today. For all the talk of the "Wild West," the policymakers of 1880 Tombstone—and many other Western towns —were ardent supporters of gun control. In late 1880, as regional violence ratcheted up, Tombstone strengthened its existing ban on concealed weapons to outlaw the carrying of any deadly weapons within the town limits. The Earps (who were Republicans) and Doc Holliday maintained that they were acting as law officers—not citizen vigilantes— when they shot their opponents. That is to say, they were sworn officers whose jobs included enforcement of Tombstone's gun laws.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Oh so they were African slaves. Sorry
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
You missed the part I wrote about "someone's elses land". Of course the land you mention was taken from the Indians, but they generally didn't like sharecroppers.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
This whole argument of yours started because I pointed out the obvious gap in your so-called logic. Why should you, as a progressive, care about taking something from someone else and have it given to another? Its how you advocate this country be run. Unless there are protected categories of people to whom it doesn't apply, n'est ce pas?
Well, [Yu-Kloughn v. 2.0's] got to do something for attention, his multiple personalities aren't speaking to him any more, and his imaginary friends keep finding excuses not to come over.
No, YOU either misread my post or lacked historical perspective on the "someone's else land", probably due to some obsession or void in your education.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
I slammed your glaring hypocrisy and you have to make false accusations to divert attention.
Well, [Yu-Kloughn v. 2.0's] got to do something for attention, his multiple personalities aren't speaking to him any more, and his imaginary friends keep finding excuses not to come over.
You didn't even know what I was talking about, and evidently still don't. In case you can't read you made the argument and it's still based on a false premise. But if you are fine with that, so be it.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
During a 2A argument on LP, I absolutely KILLED an "I WANT A RoCKET LAUNCHER AND I WANT IT NOW" 2A thread when I pointed out the above fact about Tombstone and other towns in the "Wild West"...
Don't bother Rudy I have noticed this for a while now on the right - this distortion of facts/history by many on the right wing talking heads group which I then see parroted by their base. Colbert coined the term "truthiness" which means that a statement may feel true but is actually not based on facts. The right has adopted a narrative - and this narrative is based on truthiness. I can point facts to people like coral and the facts are ignored because people like coral have based their identity/world view on the narrative rather than the reality. Another example is the climate denying scientist who was praised by the right who after looking at all the data - concluded that the climate change advocates were correct in their findings - and instead of this causing reflection by the right who praised him turned into condemnation and ridicule of the man by his former backers. So even scientific peer review of data won't change their truthiness narrative. In many respects this means the right wing base has become like the communists were under Stalin - when evidence showed that collective farming did not work they ignored the evidence and continued with the narrative of their party line. It is kind of scary to share a nation with such ideologues when we as a nation are in a crisis that will last a long time where sober analysis of facts is needed. Coral, I don't know you and I hope my post directed at you was not taken in a harsh manner. I see you as a victim of manipulation more than anything else - even though I know me saying so seems incomprehensible to you at this moment.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Like people too poor to have anything to tax.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
There were some gun laws in the 19th century, mainly aimed at keeping Native Americans and blacks from getting guns. Give you THREE GUESSES who the victims of GENOCIDE were in 19th century America and you would only need to use TWO of them. Private guns are THE ONLY thing that keep Illuminati "Progressive" states from trying to kill off their supposed enemies by the MILLIONS. If you aren't one of the Anti-Semites that post on these forums you should take a look at the Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership site. www.jpfo.net or www.jpfo.org I trust them even over that lilly livered compromising so called "most powerful gun lobby" the NRA to present the TRUE history of "gun control".
I would like to point out that the laws in question in Tombstone and other "Wild West" towns did NOT abilish the right to keep guns in ones private home or place of business, or abolish interstate gun purchaes by individuals the way many of the twenty thousand modern gun laws do and even though there were enough gun laws in the 19th century to bring about the ATTEMPTED GENOCIDES of blacks and Native Americans there were in general more gun rights at the time than there are now with all the licensing, registration and ban laws on the books today at all levels of government (around twenty thousand when all levels of government jurisdiction in the nation as a whole are considered). And another truth of the time was at least one of the 19th century precursors to the Boy Scouts of America called the Sons of Danial Boone did encourage the purchase of deactivated muzzle loaders on the part of CHILDREN (with parental consent of course, however parental consent in matters of gun use by children is a matter of family discipline, not "gun control".) as a part of their uniforms and unit paraphenalia and little or no violence resulted from this. Violence results from the "Progressive" soft on crime attitude and giving the criminals "Progressives" let out with that attitude unarmed populations to pray upon through "gun control" NOT from the age of the gun owners.
I posted Tombstone as an example of 19th century gun restrictions - nothing to do with Blacks or Indians.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Coral is mcgowanj on crsytal...
Apparently not. The point is that the Tombstone Ordinence Number 9 was not a total ban on the possession on private arms which is what most "gun control" laws today attempt to achieve through registration, licensing and ultimately house to house confiscation using info gained from the registration and licensing. It was only a law to keep people from carrying weapons in public within the Tombstone town limits. I do not call that "gun control" at all in the modern sense of the word. It was more of a DRUNKS WITH GUNS control law than a modern "gun control" law. However There were gun BABS in the 19th century that were racially based and they playede a major part in the genocide attempts against Native Ameican and black peoples. Therefore I submit that MODERN "gun control" is a crime against humanity as the one cause of GENOCIDE that is one hundred percent PREVENTABLE.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
He also supported UNCONDITIONAL arms ownership and said that gun sports were better for people than sports played with the ball.
Did you two meet with some unfortunate circumstance?
Where did you go, coward?
I'm still here. I just have other things to do on my computer, (like software programming, piano practice in conjunction with my Yamaha Keyboard and book authoring) than post to forums and I took some time off for those. By the way I'm right about what Jefferson said on "gun control". He was against it and generally believe that people should take up the gun sports in preference to the ball sports of his time. (mainly an early soccker type form of football).
Where did I state otherwise?
I heard that we actually still have debtors prisons. Capitol one is involved I hear.
Is that where you get your history from? Fictional movies? Sheriffs regularly violate peoples rights. Now and in the past.
Poisoned tinned meat is no longer available for the military, and debtor's prisons are a thing of the past. Oh, for the good old days. lucysmom: Of course you can, its just now there are legal consequences. Rek: Oh, for the good old days. Forty acres of some elses land and a rented mule. I can hardly wait. Can any of you actually address the substance of the thread, without exaggerated spin or hyperbole? Do any of you care that your freedoms and liberties are being eroded? Do any of you even care that we have a Constitution or Bill of Rights?
Go for it.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
Poisoned tinned meat is no longer available for the military, and debtor's prisons are a thing of the past. Oh, for the good old days. These were all "freedoms" that we used to have. I don't miss them, do you? If you're talking about the freedoms we lost under the totally corrupt Bush Administration, then I would agree with you.
We'll get our manufacturing back at least the textile part when 19th century sweatshops become legal again. And I predict debtor prisons will make a come back with the full faith and backing of the Tea Baggers and labor in sweatshops will become a mandatory way to work off debt. And since most of the pop is full of debt up to their eyeballs it will only take a few tweaks of the economy to make it become so.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
Poorhouses employed their residents in for profit manufacturing to offset the cost of their care. Imagine the possibilities for corporations and investors!
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
I think you're right. The baggers also want to gut the child labor laws as well. With both parties supporting unlimited illegal immigration, the next thing up from slave labor has made a remarkable comeback, too. The freedoms I've lost because of the Bush Patriot Act are no longer being able to photograph buildings, bridges, or anything else the Homeland Security Gestapo deems "sensitive", the turning of air travel into a humiliating pain in the ass, and the knowledge that my Fourth Amendment rights exist on paper only. Unless Bush is now considered a "progressive", I don't blame the "progressives" for any of that.
We already have privately run, for profit prisons. We're nearly there.
And those are the freedoms we could get back in my lifetime if the same level of motivation was there as evidently is there for the ability to drink and brandish a firearm at will.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
Unfortunately the lost freedoms of the 19th century belonged to a select group of Americans, a minority of the population. If you were white, male, and had some money and land, life could be pretty good. Not so much for the rest of us. Women couldn't vote and were not free to do much more than marry and have children. There was the Chinese exclusion Act. Blacks could be murdered for any or no reason without penalty; and of course, they were enslaved for more than half the century. I doubt Native Americans miss the "freedom" of the 19th century (Trail of Tears and reservations). How are you going to get the majority on board when life for them back then was less free than it is now.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
Uh...no...Stone...the "movies" pretended that the opposite was true. Firearm ownership has a mythical history in the US. That's the same history that you accept as gospel.
America...My Kind Of Place...
LOL.... yea right.... good luck with that one.... that's all they have for "defense' or "proof"......
"I love the 45 caliber M1911, I respect the 9MM M9 Beretta but I only carry a CZ for my own personal protection". Quote courtesy of Lt Col John Dean Cooper, recognized as the Father of Modern Handgunning
Also, I'm no longer allowed to beat my servants, and I can't work my kids 18 hours a day in sweatshops. Lynching is a lost art, and as a factory owner I'm no longer allowed to lock my employees in the building, fires be damned.
#3. To: Skip Intro (#1)
Oh, for the good old days.
#4. To: Coral Snake (#0)
6. Currency Choice, In the 19th century there were several types of money available. The top of the system was gold and silver coins.
#5. To: Rek (#3)
#6. To: Coral Snake (#0)
#7. To: Rudgear (#5)
(Edited)
Since when do you care about the immorality of the government seizing someone else s property and giving it away?
#8. To: Rek (#7)
You are foreign born aren't you?
#9. To: Coral Snake, Skip Intro, lucysmom, Rek, Rudgear (#0)
4. Guns,
#10. To: Rudgear (#8)
I don't know where you got that idea, comrade. My family has been in this country since the 1600's.
#11. To: Rudgear (#8)
(Edited)
'Forty acres and a mule' referred to the Homestead Act of 1862 to encourage pioneers to settle the trans-Mississippi region, instead of passing it by on the way to the coast.
#12. To: Rek (#11)
#13. To: Rudgear (#12)
(Edited)
This whole argument of yours started because I pointed out the obvious gap in your so-called logic. Why should you, as a progressive, care about taking something from someone else and have it given to another? Its how you advocate this country be run. Unless there are protected categories of people to whom it doesn't apply, n'est ce pas?
#14. To: Rek (#13)
#15. To: Rudgear (#14)
(Edited)
I slammed your glaring hypocrisy and you have to make false accusations to divert attention.
#16. To: Godwinson (#9)
In late 1880, as regional violence ratcheted up, Tombstone strengthened its existing ban on concealed weapons to outlaw the carrying of any deadly weapons within the town limits. The Earps (who were Republicans) and Doc Holliday maintained that they were acting as law officers—not citizen vigilantes— when they shot their opponents. That is to say, they were sworn officers whose jobs included enforcement of Tombstone's gun laws.
Inarticulate Insights,
By Boofer
#17. To: war, Coral Snake (#16)
(Edited)
#18. To: Rudgear, Rek (#12)
Unless there are protected categories of people to whom it doesn't apply, n'est ce pas?
#19. To: Godwinson (#9)
The Fed EXPOSED!!! The FARO RESERVE BANK!!!
#20. To: war (#16)
(Edited)
The Fed EXPOSED!!! The FARO RESERVE BANK!!!
#21. To: Coral Snake, war (#19)
There were some gun laws in the 19th century, mainly aimed at keeping Native Americans and blacks from getting guns.
#22. To: Godwinson (#21)
Inarticulate Insights,
By Boofer
#23. To: Godwinson (#21)
The Fed EXPOSED!!! The FARO RESERVE BANK!!!
#24. To: Coral Snake (#23)
#25. To: Godwinson (#24)
The Fed EXPOSED!!! The FARO RESERVE BANK!!!
#26. To: Godwinson, Coral Snake (#24)
VIOLATES THE NATURAL RIGHTS OF MAN!
#27. To: Coral Snake (#25)
#28. To: Vermin Exterminator (#27)
The Fed EXPOSED!!! The FARO RESERVE BANK!!!
#29. To: Coral Snake (#28)
By the way I'm right about what Jefferson said on "gun control".
#30. To: Skip Intro (#1)
and debtor's prisons are a thing of the past.
#31. To: war (#16)
During a 2A argument on LP, I absolutely KILLED an "I WANT A RoCKET LAUNCHER AND I WANT IT NOW" 2A thread when I pointed out the above fact about Tombstone and other towns in the "Wild West"...
#32. To: Skip Intro (#1)
Skip Intro: Also, I'm no longer allowed to beat my servants, and I can't work my kids 18 hours a day in sweatshops. Lynching is a lost art, and as a factory owner I'm no longer allowed to lock my employees in the building, fires be damned.
#33. To: We The People (#32)
Can any of you actually address the substance of the thread, without exaggerated spin or hyperbole?
#34. To: We The People (#32)
Also, I'm no longer allowed to beat my servants, and I can't work my kids 18 hours a day in sweatshops. Lynching is a lost art, and as a factory owner I'm no longer allowed to lock my employees in the building, fires be damned.
#35. To: Skip Intro (#34)
(Edited)
These were all "freedoms" that we used to have. I don't miss them, do you?
#36. To: Rek (#35)
We'll get our manufacturing back at east the textile part when 19th century sweatshops become legal again. And I predict debtor prisons will make a come back with the full faith and backing of the Tea Baggers and labor in sweatshops will become a mandatory way to work off debt.
#37. To: Rek (#35)
We'll get our manufacturing back at east the textile part when 19th century sweatshops become legal again. And I predict debtor prisons will make a come back with the full faith and backing of the Tea Baggers and labor in sweatshops will become a mandatory way to work off debt.
#38. To: lucysmom (#36)
Poorhouses employed their residents in for profit manufacturing to offset the cost of their care.
#39. To: Skip Intro (#37)
(Edited)
The freedoms I've lost because of the Bush Patriot Act are no longer being able to photograph buildings, bridges, or anything else the Homeland Security Gestapo deems "sensitive", the turning of air travel into a humiliating pain in the ass, and the knowledge that my Fourth Amendment rights exist on paper only.
#40. To: Rek (#39)
And those are the freedoms we could get back in my lifetime if the same level of motivation was there as evidently is there for the ability to drink and brandish a firearm at will.
#41. To: A K A Stone (#31)
Is that where you get your history from? Fictional movies?
#42. To: We The People (#32)
Can any of you actually address the substance of the thread, without exaggerated spin or hyperbole?
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