Corrupt Government
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Title: Nation of Takers, Not Makers~more work for govt. than manufacturing, farming, fishing, forestry, mining & utilities combined
Source:
WSJ
URL Source: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100 ... 4050204576219073867182108.html
Published: Apr 1, 2011
Author: STEPHEN MOORE
Post Date: 2011-04-01 09:06:01 by Happy Quanzaa
Keywords: Obama-doma-ding-dong
Views: 193046
Comments: 226
If you want to understand better why so many states—from New York to Wisconsin to California—are teetering on the brink of bankruptcy, consider this depressing statistic: Today in America there are nearly twice as many people working for the government (22.5 million) than in all of manufacturing (11.5 million). This is an almost exact reversal of the situation in 1960, when there were 15 million workers in manufacturing and 8.7 million collecting a paycheck from the government. It gets worse. More Americans work for the government than work in construction, farming, fishing, forestry, manufacturing, mining and utilities combined. We have moved decisively from a nation of makers to a nation of takers. Nearly half of the $2.2 trillion cost of state and local governments is the $1 trillion-a-year tab for pay and benefits of state and local employees. Is it any wonder that so many states and cities cannot pay their bills? Every state in America today except for two—Indiana and Wisconsin—has more government workers on the payroll than people manufacturing industrial goods. Consider California, which has the highest budget deficit in the history of the states. The not-so Golden State now has an incredible 2.4 million government employees—twice as many as people at work in manufacturing. New Jersey has just under two-and-a-half as many government employees as manufacturers. Florida's ratio is more than 3 to 1. So is New York's. Even Michigan, at one time the auto capital of the world, and Pennsylvania, once the steel capital, have more government bureaucrats than people making things. The leaders in government hiring are Wyoming and New Mexico, which have hired more than six government workers for every manufacturing worker. Now it is certainly true that many states have not typically been home to traditional manufacturing operations. Iowa and Nebraska are farm states, for example. But in those states, there are at least five times more government workers than farmers. West Virginia is the mining capital of the world, yet it has at least three times more government workers than miners. New York is the financial capital of the world—at least for now. That sector employs roughly 670,000 New Yorkers. That's less than half of the state's 1.48 million government employees. Don't expect a reversal of this trend anytime soon. Surveys of college graduates are finding that more and more of our top minds want to work for the government. Why? Because in recent years only government agencies have been hiring, and because the offer of near lifetime security is highly valued in these times of economic turbulence. When 23-year-olds aren't willing to take career risks, we have a real problem on our hands. Sadly, we could end up with a generation of Americans who want to work at the Department of Motor Vehicles. The employment trends described here are explained in part by hugely beneficial productivity improvements in such traditional industries as farming, manufacturing, financial services and telecommunications. These produce far more output per worker than in the past. The typical farmer, for example, is today at least three times more productive than in 1950. Where are the productivity gains in government? Consider a core function of state and local governments: schools. Over the period 1970-2005, school spending per pupil, adjusted for inflation, doubled, while standardized achievement test scores were flat. Over roughly that same time period, public-school employment doubled per student, according to a study by researchers at the University of Washington. That is what economists call negative productivity. But education is an industry where we measure performance backwards: We gauge school performance not by outputs, but by inputs. If quality falls, we say we didn't pay teachers enough or we need smaller class sizes or newer schools. If education had undergone the same productivity revolution that manufacturing has, we would have half as many educators, smaller school budgets, and higher graduation rates and test scores. The same is true of almost all other government services. Mass transit spends more and more every year and yet a much smaller share of Americans use trains and buses today than in past decades. One way that private companies spur productivity is by firing underperforming employees and rewarding excellence. In government employment, tenure for teachers and near lifetime employment for other civil servants shields workers from this basic system of reward and punishment. It is a system that breeds mediocrity, which is what we've gotten. Most reasonable steps to restrain public-sector employment costs are smothered by the unions. Study after study has shown that states and cities could shave 20% to 40% off the cost of many services—fire fighting, public transportation, garbage collection, administrative functions, even prison operations—through competitive contracting to private providers. But unions have blocked many of those efforts. Public employees maintain that they are underpaid relative to equally qualified private-sector workers, yet they are deathly afraid of competitive bidding for government services. President Obama says we have to retool our economy to "win the future." The only way to do that is to grow the economy that makes things, not the sector that takes things.
We've Become a Nation of Takers, Not Makers
More Americans work for the government than in manufacturing, farming, fishing, forestry, mining and utilities combined.
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#1. To: Happy Quanzaa (#0)
I don't really know jack squat about economics, but holy shit, if there are more workers employed by the government than in those fields combined that seems like trouble a-brewin' economics-wise.
------------------------------------- California is also at the bottom of government employee to population ratio.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
That only means Kalifornia isn't even bothering to fake it with phony make-work jobs, they just send most of their moochers food stamps and welfare checks in the mail.
This is exactly the problem. Add to takers people who are leaching off of the government transfer payments of various sorts, and the future looks very bleak.
This is the economic result of free trade as advocated by most Republicans and some Democrats (that seems to be the ratio). Especially notice that Republican online forum members and on talk radio and their talking head hosts always attack the wages American workers earn as being too high. I guess when the oligarchs drive wages down to pennies an hour manufacturing jobs may return - I say may because Americans tend to be uppity and demand things like rights and dignity so even then the jobs may not come back until the American will to stand up as a free man is broken.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Yes, and the few localities that have done this not only have lower costs, but also better service.
No, it's the economic result of power hungry politicians who keep creating more and more government agencies, departments and programs.
This is exactly the problem. Add to takers people who are leaching off of the government transfer payments of various sorts, and the future looks very bleak. Isn't it interesting the way the number of takers increases when the number of jobs decreases?
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
No, it's predictable.
Yep. Business tax reductions may be overrated as an economic stimulus because they're so low on the totem pole of expenses. For most businesses, the cost of labor is probably 15 times the cost of all state and local taxes, said Bartik of the Upjohn Institute. You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
Most of which were lobbied for by various business interests or created by neccessity in response to lousy or even dangerous business practices. The biggest problems arise when politicians do the bidding of those who send them the biggest bribes.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
You have the cause and effect backwards. The number of jobs have decreased because the government has become larded up with parasites draining the life out of the productive segment of the economy.
Stop trying to tie private sector employees together with government bureaucrats. In a competitive (and global) economy, wages rise or fall based on output (productivity). Government bureaucrats are not productive. In fact, for the most part they are counter-productive. Most of them should be made available to the market.
It's much easier for politicians to receive bribes and kick backs that way. We've already been down that road. Too much graft and corruption.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
What are you blathering about?
Read a good US history book. The USA didn't just magically appear on the day you were born.
"http://first-draft-blog.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5ced53ef0148c7a28c4b970c-320wi"
I've read many good history books. You leftists are the ones who are completely clueless with regards to U.S. history.
Do you want me to link you to megapages on Freerepublic where fucking so called conservatives griped about the wages of union auto workers (private sector) way before the bail outs of GM? More evidence Republicans (and I am sure blue dog Democrats) WANT to lower your wages as part of the globalization/free-trade ideology: Your Fat Paycheck Keeps Your Neighbor Unemployed: Kevin Hassett (Hassett is currently a senior fellow and director of economic policy studies at the American Enterprise Institute. He was John McCain's chief economic adviser in the 2000 presidential primaries and an economic adviser to the campaigns of George W. Bush in the 2004 presidential election and McCain in the presidential election of 2008.) The biggest problem with the labor market right now is that wages are too high.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
I find you pretty clueless about most things jwpegler so I doubt you read or understand what you read.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Well you can't really blame them because those people were getting paid way in excess of their productivity...... kinda like politicians.......
"I love the 45 caliber M1911, I respect the 9MM M9 Beretta but I only carry a CZ for my own personal protection". Quote courtesy of Lt Col John Dean Cooper, recognized as the Father of Modern Handgunning
Thank you for adding anecdotal evidence that so called conservatives as they exist online root for the devaluing of American labor.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
So in essence you think the auto workers are/were getting paid in line with their productivity.....
"I love the 45 caliber M1911, I respect the 9MM M9 Beretta but I only carry a CZ for my own personal protection". Quote courtesy of Lt Col John Dean Cooper, recognized as the Father of Modern Handgunning
I realize that's what you've been told, but it ain't so.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
Without historical perspective, he believes that government employee unions are the enemy.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
It's between employees and their employers. Every study I see shows American workers to be among the most productive on the planet - clearly the top 10 if not the top 5. I just want to point out so called conservatives - from radio, TV and online comments - have made it a pattern to take the side of the oligarchs and always claim the employees are making too much money for what they do. It seems the so called conservative commentators go out of their way to justify the compensations of the oligarchs/management classes and disparage the wages of middle class workers. In any case, what is "fair" compensation is a meaningless term since wages come from negotiations between employees and their employers.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
They just get silent after. They have these fake realities in their head - they make up reality about what the Republican party stands for and what it actually does - and then when you point it out to them that McCain's own economic honcho is advocating lowering wages for Americans - and the 40 year long history of Republicans advocating of free trade and exporting of jobs to Communist China and corrupt Mexico and they zone off like Zombies. They knee jerk and blame unions, blame Democrats blame everyone but the fucking ideology of their own fucking party. They so want to believe the GOP stands for something it is not their minds literally manufactures reality for them. It seems like when it comes to the online so called conservatives it is like conversing with brainwashed cult members.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
It's between employees and their employers. So what you're saying is "that's" the reason why most American auto workers are unemployed now. Was it because they were unproductive???? Or is it because they were paid way in excess of their productivity.....
"I love the 45 caliber M1911, I respect the 9MM M9 Beretta but I only carry a CZ for my own personal protection". Quote courtesy of Lt Col John Dean Cooper, recognized as the Father of Modern Handgunning
Was it because they were unproductive???? Or is it because they were paid way in excess of their productivity..... Neither.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
So why then????
"I love the 45 caliber M1911, I respect the 9MM M9 Beretta but I only carry a CZ for my own personal protection". Quote courtesy of Lt Col John Dean Cooper, recognized as the Father of Modern Handgunning
Like I said, you take the side of the oligarchs who export jobs overseas because paying cheap Mexican wages or cheaper Chinese wages trumps anything else or obeying laws in America is a problem so why not move to lawless nations where bribes will do nicely? The company would be profitable obeying all American laws and paying American middle class wages but why should the oligarchs get less bonus money when moving it overseas makes them more money? So at the end of the day, what you scumbag conservatives advocate for is degrading the American worker to the point he makes no money. You conservative / GOP scum will take the side of Communist China over an America because it is now linked to your party identity.
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
Notice how the right wingers fixate on auto unions over all other types of exported jobs when union and non union work not related to the auto industry have all went overseas. Notice he avoids the issue of why he thinks Americans make too much money now to be employed anyway?
"Keep Your Goddamn Government Hands Off My Medicare!" - Various Tea Party signs.
What Godwinson said and I would add poor management and bad design decisions that disadvantaged US auto makers in a competitive market place. It was not about the cost of the car, but about the car itself.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
How many losers on Neo-Con Central are in a position to influence anything? ZERO? Did you ever see the Simpsons episode where some panhandler asks grandpa Simpson for some spare change? Grandpa Simpson goes into a tirade about lazy bums. Then he immediately walks into to a Socialist Insecurity office and said: "I'm old gimme, gimme, gimme". That's Free Republic -- a bunch of loser know-nothings. They have nothing to do with anything.
Japanese auto makers have been more responsive to market trends while US manufacturers have been slow to catch on.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
I grew up in Detroit. I have many blogs about the brain auto companies. In short, they've had the most brain dead management on the planet for the better part of four decades and even worse union leadership. They are ALL completely clueless and have been for a long time, which is why the Japanese and Koreans have been able to kick their ass.
Their influence might be limited, but they do respond to cultural influences and parrot popular niche ideas just as you do.
You have the courage to tell the masses what no politician told them: you are inferior and all the improvements in your conditions which you simply take for granted you owe to the efforts of men who are better than you. Ludwig von Mises in a letter to Ayn Rand
LOL I've been a Vice President at a large corporation and a Chief Technology Officer at another company. I've had customer, revenue, and innovation responsibility over thousands of people across the world. I've also run a small business. I ALWAYS SUCCEED. What have you done? NOTHING. We know who the clueless moron is here. It's you -- the most ignorant person I have ever met on the internet.
I agree with poor management decisions, that maybe you shouldn't pay somebody $30 per hour to put screws in a dashboard when any idiot you bring in off the street can do that job for a lot less.... How long did it take to train those people anyway 10-15 minutes????? Their point and my point is those people are not "highly trained" so why pay them way in excess of their productivity. You have people that know way more (4 yrs plus of college) than them who get paid much less, so how is that fair.....
"I love the 45 caliber M1911, I respect the 9MM M9 Beretta but I only carry a CZ for my own personal protection". Quote courtesy of Lt Col John Dean Cooper, recognized as the Father of Modern Handgunning
They are at BMW, Mercedes and Toyota plants in south. But not at GM in Michigan or Ohio, which is why those states are economic disaster areas.
I don't parrot anything. I pioneer. On the other hand, you've gotten a lot better at Googling incorrect answers over the last year than you where when you started. At some point, you might even Google a correct answer on occasion.
Yep, but it did work for 25 years or so when the entire rest of the world was destroyed after WWII. But it doesn't work any longer. People like Lucysmon and Go65 have that 1950s and 1960s reference in their head. They have no clue on how the world has changed, why it's changed, what it means, and what we have to do to compete. At foreign auto transplants in the south, semi-skilled laborers get $14 (not $30) an hour AND they have to learn how to do more than one thing. If people don't like it, they should go learn a skill. Learn how to be an auto mechanic, framer, finished carpenter, cabinet maker, plumber, etc. These are good paying jobs. It's harder to find a good plumber than it is to find a good lawyer in most places. There is a huge demand. Even better - many should try to open a small business, as plumbers, carpenters, etc. This is what the country needs.
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Why don't you make like a tree and get out of here?
#2. To: Happy Quanzaa (#0)
Every state in America today except for two—Indiana and Wisconsin—has more government workers on the payroll than people manufacturing industrial goods. Consider California, which has the highest budget deficit in the history of the states. The not-so Golden State now has an incredible 2.4 million government employees—twice as many as people at work in manufacturing.
#3. To: lucysmom (#2)
California is also at the bottom of government employee to population ratio.
#4. To: Happy Quanzaa (#0)
We have moved decisively from a nation of makers to a nation of takers
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#5. To: jwpegler, Happy Quanzaa, Lucysmom (#4)
#6. To: Happy Quanzaa (#0)
(Edited)
Study after study has shown that states and cities could shave 20% to 40% off the cost of many services—fire fighting, public transportation, garbage collection, administrative functions, even prison operations—through competitive contracting to private providers.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#7. To: Godwinson (#5)
This is the economic result of free trade
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#8. To: jwpegler, Happy Quanzaa (#4)
We have moved decisively from a nation of makers to a nation of takers
#9. To: lucysmom (#8)
Isn't it interesting the way the number of takers increases when the number of jobs decreases?
#10. To: Godwinson (#5)
Especially notice that Republican online forum members and on talk radio and their talking head hosts always attack the wages American workers earn as being too high.
#11. To: jwpegler (#7)
(Edited)
No, it's the economic result of power hungry politicians who keep creating more and more government agencies, departments and programs.
#12. To: lucysmom (#8)
Isn't it interesting the way the number of takers increases when the number of jobs decreases?
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#13. To: Godwinson (#5)
(Edited)
attack the wages American workers earn as being too high.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#14. To: jwpegler (#13)
Government bureaucrats are not productive. In fact, for the most part they are counter-productive. Most of them should be made available to the market.
#15. To: Rek (#14)
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#16. To: jwpegler (#15)
(Edited)
What are you blathering about?
#17. To: Rek (#16)
Read a good US history book. The USA didn't just magically appear on the day you were born.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#18. To: jwpegler, Rek, Lucysmom (#13)
(Edited)
Stop trying to tie private sector employees together with government bureaucrats.
#19. To: jwpegler, Rek (#17)
I've read many good history books. You leftists are the ones who are completely clueless with regards to U.S. history.
#20. To: Godwinson (#18)
Do you want me to link you to megapages on Freerepublic where fucking so called conservatives griped about the wages of union auto workers (private sector) way before the bail outs of GM?
#21. To: CZ82 (#20)
Well you can't really blame them because those people were getting paid way in excess of their productivity...... kinda like politicians.......
#22. To: Godwinson (#21)
Thank you for adding anecdotal evidence that so called conservatives as they exist online root for the devaluing of American labor.
#23. To: jwpegler (#12)
You have the cause and effect backwards. The number of jobs have decreased because the government has become larded up with parasites draining the life out of the productive segment of the economy.
#24. To: Godwinson (#18)
Do you want me to link you to megapages on Freerepublic where fucking so called conservatives griped about the wages of union auto workers (private sector) way before the bail outs of GM?
#25. To: CZ82, lucysmom (#22)
So in essence you think the auto workers are/were getting paid in line with their productivity.....
#26. To: lucysmom, CZ82, jwpegler (#24)
#27. To: Godwinson (#25)
So in essence you think the auto workers are/were getting paid in line with their productivity.....
#28. To: CZ82 (#27)
So what you're saying is "that's" the reason why most American auto workers are unemployed now.
#29. To: lucysmom (#28)
Neither.
#30. To: CZ82, lucysmom (#27)
So what you're saying is "that's" the reason why most American auto workers are unemployed now.
#31. To: CZ82, lucysmom (#29)
#32. To: CZ82 (#29)
So why then????
#33. To: Godwinson (#18)
(Edited)
Freerepublic
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#34. To: Godwinson (#31)
Notice how the right wingers fixate on auto unions over all other types of exported jobs when union and non union work not related to the auto industry have all went overseas.
#35. To: Godwinson (#31)
Notice how the right wingers fixate on auto unions
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#36. To: jwpegler (#33)
How many losers on Neo-Con Central are in a position to influence anything?
#37. To: Godwinson (#19)
(Edited)
I find you pretty clueless
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#38. To: lucysmom (#32)
What Godwinson said and I would add poor management and bad design decisions that disadvantaged US auto makers in a competitive market place.
#39. To: CZ82 (#22)
(Edited)
So in essence you think the auto workers are/were getting paid in line with their productivity.....
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#40. To: lucysmom (#36)
parrot popular niche ideas just as you do
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
#41. To: CZ82 (#38)
(Edited)
maybe you shouldn't pay somebody $30 per hour to put screws in a dashboard when any idiot you bring in off the street can do that job for a lot less
"Everything that can be invented has been invented."-- Charles Duell, Commissioner of US Patent Office, 1899
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