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Title: The Fukushima crisis should not spell the end of nuclear power.
Source:
Monbiot
URL Source: http://www.monbiot.com/2011/03/16/atomised/
Published: Mar 16, 2011
Author: George Monbiot
Post Date: 2011-03-16 14:29:48 by go65
Keywords: None
Views: 18801
Comments: 27
The nuclear disaster unfolding in Japan is bad enough; the nuclear disaster unfolding in China could be even worse. “What disaster?”, you ask. The decision today by the Chinese government to suspend approval of new atomic power plants. If this suspension were to become permanent, the power those plants would have produced is likely to be replaced by burning coal. While nuclear causes calamities when it goes wrong, coal causes calamities when it goes right, and coal goes right a lot more often than nuclear goes wrong. The only safe coal-fired plant is one which has broken down past the point of repair. Before I go any further, and I’m misinterpreted for the thousandth time, let me spell out once again what my position is. I have not gone nuclear. But, as long as the following four conditions are met, I will no longer oppose atomic energy. 1. Its total emissions – from mine to dump – are taken into account, and demonstrate that it is a genuinely low-carbon option. 2. We know exactly how and where the waste is to be buried. 3. We know how much this will cost and who will pay. 4. There is a legal guarantee that no civil nuclear materials will be diverted for military purposes. To these I’ll belatedly add a fifth, which should have been there all along: no plants should be built in fault zones, on tsunami-prone coasts, on eroding seashores or those likely to be inundated before the plant has been decommissioned or any other places which are geologically unsafe. This should have been so obvious that it didn’t need spelling out. But we discover, yet again, that the blindingly obvious is no guarantee that a policy won’t be adopted.
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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 21.
#1. To: go65, Mad Dog (#0)
(Edited)
And politicians and plant owners are prepared to deal harshly with environmental saboteurs. Just say no to eco-nazis! Eco-nuts are responsible for 100's of thousands of spent fuel rods being stored at Fukushima. Eco-terrorists are directly responsible for the worst of the radioactive nightmare happening in Japan. These storage "pools" do not have the same durable containment vessels as the reactors, and are the source of most of the emissions. The stuff belching out of them is greatly hampering work on the reactors. Nuke power can be very safe, if you can keep eco kooks out of the process.
Yeah, like the storing of waste that stays dangerous for tens of thousands of years at the 'extinct' volcanic caldera of Yucca Mountain in Nevada, right? Gee, those 'extinct' volcanoes never erupt, right? Except when they do. The supply of fuel is finite, and the waste problem will never be solved.
You once again demonstrate your sheer ignorance of reality, with such a statement. If you KNEW what you were talking about, the quote above would be embarrassing to you. But for leftists like you, it's easier and more comforting, to be willfully ignorant. You're a putz.
I do what I'm talking about. I was one of thousands arrested protesting nuclear power waste disposal and weapons testing at Yucca Flats in March of 1988. I know much about this topic as a long time activist. Hey, we got the industry stifled and had a plant they had already bought much the equipment for canceled in Oregon. And thanks to Japanese stupidity and lack of concern for proper safety protocols we will now do it again. Obama may want nuke plants, but they will not be happening here.
Which means precisely dick. In 1988, I was working as a reactor operator, on an S5W-equipped submarine. And they don't even let you near the RPCP unless you seriously know your shit. I do. You don't.
I do. You don't. With that and a buck and a half you can go buy a cuppa coffee. I was got NBC* training in the Army to qualify to train to do radiological surveys on the ground and in the air when I was in the 82nd Aviation Battalion (now Brigade) because they need NCOs on flight status for this role. So what? It taught me things about radio-active contamination and protocol that helped when I learned about the nuclear waste problem and the foolishness of nuclear power, but leaders of the movement like Loyd Marbet know more about this topic than either you or me and he never served in the military. Historically, nuclear power came about to try to find a peaceful use of the technology developed to build the USS Nautilus and later reactor powered vessels, but that does not make you an expert on this topic just because you worked on this sort of craft before. Grow up, junior. *NBC= Nuclear, Biological, and Chemical
Exactly. So what? You're telling me that you're trained to hold a Geiger counter. BFD. Ah, we get to the money-quote. This demonstrates conclusively, that you don't know diddley shit about the subject. WHY is a long half-life a good thing? Why is a short half-life a bad thing? When you're able to grasp why your prejudices have you completely ass- backwards on nuclear power, then come back and join the adults. Because your "qualifications" are limited to being an "activist," and a monkey with a geiger counter. In other words, you're a professional BS artist. Unlike you, I've been there, DONE that. I've put my hands on fuel cells, I've literally sat on my ass on primary containment vessal, inside the primary shielding, with my arms resting on the control-rod drive mechanisms. Like most leftist "activists," a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. But you're even worse than the typical leftist- you have no knowledge, but think you have firm grip on reality. You're clueless. *NBC= Nuclear, Biological, and Chemical Wow. Did you read that in a book somewhere? LOL. Actually, it DOES. You're just too stupid and too propagandized, to understand that. Piss off, gramps.
To measure nuclear collateral effects at specific points to create a map and data base allowing military planners to take this factor into consideration when doing tactical and logistical military planning, people need to go into the field and get accurate radiation readings as specific points. So one has to be good with a map, and equipment much more accurate than a Geiger counter. We also wore IM93s, the older version of the piece of equipment I posted a picture of to in my last post to you. The military standard is one can only be allowed to absorb 50 Rads of radiation, but imagine them sticking with that in a nuclear war situation. They trained us in how to get accurate readings which is easier on the ground as one can get away from the magnetic moment of a vehicle which affects the reading. When doing it in a helicopter, this is a problem, but sometime the situation dictates accuracy be sacrificed for speed of information gathering when doing this mission. I was very much trained in this, and it is a common task all active duty unites train specific personnel for. I made sergeant E-5 in 2 years, 3 months because I was not only good at my job crewing a helicopter, but I volunteered for this sort of team to gather the promotion points involved. Asshole.
We also wore IM93s, the older version of the piece of equipment I posted a picture of to in my last post to you. The military standard is one can only be allowed to absorb 50 Rads of radiation, but imagine them sticking with that in a nuclear war situation. They trained us in how to get accurate readings which is easier on the ground as one can get away from the magnetic moment of a vehicle which affects the reading. When doing it in a helicopter, this is a problem, but sometime the situation dictates accuracy be sacrificed for speed of information gathering when doing this mission. I was very much trained in this, and it is a common task all active duty unites train specific personnel for. I made sergeant E-5 in 2 years, 3 months because I was not only good at my job crewing a helicopter, but I volunteered for this sort of team to gather the promotion points involved. Asshole. Bottom line is, you STILL haven't demonstrated that you know diddley shit about the subject. Very good. A text-book definition. Of course, any idiot can look the definition up on wikipedia, just as you did. But my question was- and STILL is- "WHY is a long half-life a good thing? Why is a short half-life a bad thing?" Please provide specific answers... IF you can. My bet is that you can't, because you don't know enough about the subject, to speak intelligently. It would be the same as me trying to discuss Shakespeare's Henry V with an illiterate... you just can't hold up your side of the discussion. That doesn't make me an asshole for knowing my shit- which I do. But it makes you a fool, for trying to bluff your way with your "activist" training. Thanks for the laughs, ass-hat.
Well, I am not about to give you a course on radiological surveys as the U.S. Army does them, shouldn't have to explain to a ding a ling like you that every fucking soldier knows what the fuck NBC means and calls protective masks protective masks, not 'gas masks.' And I don't give a rat's ass if you don't know I know what an isotope is, or how to read periodic table of elements, the difference between fission and fusion, why U235 is the isotope used in fission devices and not U238 which is what depleted Uranium is primarily, and many other things concerning things pertaining to this topic. I actually have a very good working knowledge of this subject bud. So you are free to stick your hubris and rudeness up your fat Cali ass.
#26. To: Ferret Mike. Capitalist Eric (#21)
He's back in California? I though he left a couple of years back for Pennsylvania or thereabouts with his mail order bride never, ever to return.
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest2. We know exactly how and where the waste is to be buried.
#3. To: hondo68 (#1)
"Nuke power can be very safe, if you can keep eco kooks out of the process."
#4. To: Ferret Mike (#3)
Yeah, like the storing of waste that stays dangerous for tens of thousands of years at the 'extinct' volcanic caldera of Yucca Mountain in Nevada, right?
#8. To: Capitalist Eric (#4)
(Edited)
#10. To: Ferret Mike (#8)
I do what I'm talking about. I was one of thousands arrested protesting nuclear power waste disposal and weapons testing at Yucca Flats in March of 1988. I know much about this topic as a long time activist.
#13. To: Capitalist Eric (#10)
(Edited)
In 1988, I was working as a reactor operator, on an S5W-equipped submarine. And they don't even let you near the RPCP unless you seriously know your shit.
#16. To: Ferret Mike (#13)
I was got NBC* training in the Army to qualify to train to do radiological surveys on the ground and in the air when I was in the 82nd Aviation Battalion (now Brigade) because they need NCOs on flight status for this role. So what?
It taught me things about radio-active contamination and protocol that helped when I learned about the nuclear waste problem and the foolishness of nuclear power,
Grow up, junior.
Historically, nuclear power came about to try to find a peaceful use of the technology developed to build the USS Nautilus and later reactor powered vessels, but that does not make you an expert on this topic just because you worked on this sort of craft before.
#18. To: Capitalist Eric (#16)
So what? You're telling me that you're trained to hold a Geiger counter.
#20. To: Ferret Mike (#18)
To measure nuclear collateral effects at specific points to create a map and data base allowing military planners to take this factor into consideration when doing tactical and logistical military planning, people need to go into the field and get accurate radiation readings as specific points. So one has to be good with a map, and equipment much more accurate than a Geiger counter.
Are you asking if I understand that decay of radioactive material is measured by determining how fast a discrete entity like atoms break down, I do. A half life of a radioactive element is the length of time it is estimated to take for approx. half of the material to decay. For example, the decay of say Carbon-14 for example is exponential and has a half-life of over 5500 years. Carbon-14 will deminish to half of it's original size at the point it reaches it's half life. After another period that long, there will be a quarter of the original amount remaining.
#21. To: Capitalist Eric (#20)
Bottom line is, you STILL haven't demonstrated that you know diddley shit about the subject.
Replies to Comment # 21. So you are free to stick your hubris and rudeness up your fat Cali ass.
End Trace Mode for Comment # 21.
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