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Title: New Zealand – Where did that warming go?
Source:
Jo Nova
URL Source: http://joannenova.com.au/2010/10/new-zealand-niwa/
Published: Oct 11, 2010
Author: Jo Nova
Post Date: 2010-10-11 23:20:05 by WhiteSands
Keywords: global warming
Views: 330
Comments: 23
Then: “We can’t find the keys (actually we’ve lost the car)”. Later: “We weren’t driving it”. Finally: “The car doesn’t exist”. There’s a litany of excuses. The National Institute for Water and Atmospheric Research (NIWA) claims New Zealand has been warming at 0.92°C per 100 years. But when some independent minded chaps in New Zealand graphed the raw NZ data, they found that the thermometers show NZ has only warmed by a statistically non-significant 0.06°C. They asked for answers and got nowhere, until they managed to get the light of legal pressure onto NIWA to force it to reply honestly. Reading between the lines, it’s obvious NIWA can’t explain or defend the adjustments. Richard Treadgold was one of that team and wrote it up here. August 2010: The NZ Climate Science Coalition’s put together legal claims. The NZCSC filed judicial review proceedings against NIWA, requesting the Court to: • Declare the 7SS invalid September 14th 2010: NIWA “defended itself” Treadgold colorfully summed up what happened when NIWA put out its defense. How can this be the action of earnest, dedicated scientists — their answer to months of implied accusations of dishonest science? Having suffered, according to their supporters, attempts to smear their top scientists, how can NIWA respond by saying they don’t want to be held responsible? They’re not defending the temperature record or the mistakes in it, they’re virtually saying: “You’re right, the dataset could be shonky, so we’re washing our hands of it.” Which gives us no confidence in the “science” they might have applied to it. What the hell’s going on? …it gets worse. NIWA has formally stated that, in their opinion, they are not required to use the best available information nor to apply the best scientific practices and techniques available at any given time. They don’t think that forms any part of their statutory obligation to pursue “excellence”. And that little bombshell just does my head in. For how can they pursue excellence without using the best techniques? NIWA denies there is any such thing as an “official” NZ Temperature Record, although they’re happy to create an acronym for it (NZTR). Specifically NIWA claims: Point 7: “There is no “official” or formal New Zealand Temperature Record;” (b) [NIWAs] website contains a page titled New Zealand temperature record (“NZTR”), being an informal description for a collection of different streams of climate information… Point 8: “The NZTR is not a record and is not a public record for the purposes of the PRA” It is a controlling public office in respect of the Database; and I wondered out loud in an email to Tony Cox about what it would mean, he replied off the cuff: The Defence, parts 7 and 8 are novel; the SOC is basically asserting either nonfeasance [not doing something which had to be done] or malfeasance [doing something wrong which had to be done]; the Defence is saying that nothing had to be done and wasn’t done. This is extraordinarily stupid. Anyone who has paid, been levied, fined or taxed on the basis of this [non-existent] record because a government, statutory body or private firm which charged the fee did so on the basis of this [non-existent] record could now sue for the recovery of the fee[s] they have paid. Class actions anyone? I’m not sure if there is any legal agency with any power to enforce some action at this point (do enlighten me), but it sure could be a gift — though possibly only if the people of New Zealand (and their friends) decide to run with NIWA’s admissions and pursue this to the end. All the documents, reports, contracts and parliamentary statements that relied on the New Zealand Temperature Record, are surely now begging to be challenged. All the people that mistakenly believed that the NZTR was more than just an unverified, unaudited, internal document, now need to reconsider where they stand. From Quadrant: Crisis in NZ Climatology and NZ Climate Crisis Gets Worse Links to the NZTR 7SS (7 station series) and 11SS (11 station series) 7SS only (one left click for a blowup) Thanks to Bryan Leyland and Richard C h/t to several other people who deserve to be named… (and I’ll do that as soon as I can find those comments). Thanks Richard C for those extra links and Tony Cox for his thoughts.
Think of this as a car crash. NIWA says: “The car’s fine, there’s nothing wrong with it.” The legal documents:
• Direct NIWA to prepare a valid replacement NZTRNZCSC: “It’s faulty.” NIWA: “It’s not ours.”
(f) It is not a controlling public office in respect of the NZTR, 7SS, 11SS or Marine Measurements for the purposes of the PRAThe implications are far reaching (if a bit open ended)
In a nutshell, it appears that what it means is what we make of it.
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#1. To: go65 (#0)
Care to debate THE ARTICLE? I didn't think so. You'd Better Run! And keep running.
(sneakypete)DID Palin say or write these things or not? (Mad Dog's reply) I don't know or F ing care. Pete, MD doesn't know or care what Palin says or writes, he'll support her no matter what.
what is it exactly that i'm supposed to debate?
Good to know you agree with everything in the article, and realize figures on global warming/climate change are being manipulated and lied about by global warming/climate change proponents.
(sneakypete)DID Palin say or write these things or not? (Mad Dog's reply) I don't know or F ing care. Pete, MD doesn't know or care what Palin says or writes, he'll support her no matter what.
Uh huh.
Hainan Island evacs 440 000. Indus River moves 20 Klicks to the West. Don't even ask what's happening in Central America. Australia worst harvest in progress. US cuts grain harvest by 12.7 MMT. Lowest Arctic Ice Extant by Volume ever. 2010 Hottest Year ever as deserts expand, glaciers contract around the world.
Locally we set a new record high yesterday and may possibly do the same today. It is bone dry here and has been for weeks now.
Same here, but unfortunately people often confuse "weather" with "Climate." Local point-in-time weather events neither prove nor disprove global warming, and it's rather dumb to suggest problems with seven sensors in New Zealand somehow disapprove global land, sea, and satellite data gathered from multiple different monitoring systems, all of which show the same trend. But again, I make the mistake in assuming that critics of global warming actually are interested in the science, or honest debate, rather than simply dismissing anything related to global warming on the basis of their political convictions.
You can do that across the US. It's going down to 'seasonal' here with 50's high 30's, but still no rain.
Which is a good reason why meteorologists are on the Wrong side of this and whose opinions aren't worth much. Hockey Stick confirmed. World moving out of the Holocene.
Are humans smarter than yeast. We lose organized religion and computers in 10 years. Because both will be seen as complete failures in resolving the massive implosion taking place.
The only ones interested in the science of global warming (now called climate change) ARE the critics. With all the evidence of fraud, collusion, "decline hiding" etc. etc. etc., my opinion is that anyone now supporting global warming malarkey has moved out of the "possibly insane" category and into the category of actively perpetrating the fraud. The global warming "scientists" will go the way of the geocentric "scientists" and witch hunters of Salem, to be laughed at in future history lessons. It is a shame go65, with all our abilities to use science to do very good things and find the truth of matters, that its reputation has been destroyed by those seeking control, power and money. Science will take a long time to recover. But it's on its way, thanks to true scientists like Hal Lewis and others.
(sneakypete)DID Palin say or write these things or not? (Mad Dog's reply) I don't know or F ing care. Pete, MD doesn't know or care what Palin says or writes, he'll support her no matter what.
So earth's climate has never changed? I really don't think there's any disputing that or that it always will be changing. After all most can look out their windows in North America and not see a mile high glacier. It's the human element in the equation that's being debated.
Sorry, but all the allegations of "climategate" were false as numerous investigations have concluded. It's unfortunate that our kids will suffer from folks like yourself who choose to keep their heads in the sand.
I didn't think so. You'd Better Run! And keep running. Keep the fire up, shoot them in the back even as they run away.
Clinton and Cuomo are the true bandits who lit the fuse to this economic crisis we're now in. All in the name of getting more minorities in houses: http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=12554
Coldest Summer in L.A. in DECADES.
Clinton and Cuomo are the true bandits who lit the fuse to this economic crisis we're now in. All in the name of getting more minorities in houses: http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=12554
Can you name me one climate scientist who has said global warming means that there would never be a record cold temperature? And when you are done striking out, compare the number of record cold temps with record heat temps over the last few years.
Wrong, and you know it.
Clinton and Cuomo are the true bandits who lit the fuse to this economic crisis we're now in. All in the name of getting more minorities in houses: http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=12554
The concept of globalwarming, GO, means hotter temperatures. Not lower.
Clinton and Cuomo are the true bandits who lit the fuse to this economic crisis we're now in. All in the name of getting more minorities in houses: http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=12554
Nope, correct. and Do you not see that some years are colder than others in the below? Now, tell us what the trend line indicates:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/jul/08/muir-russell-climategate-climate-science Setting the ‘Climategate’ Record Straight: Michael Mann Cleared http://www.ericpooley.com/2010/07/01/setting-the-climategate-record-straight-michael-mann- cleared/ Yep. And O.J. didn't do it. From Lewis letter: (sneakypete)DID Palin say or write these things or not? (Mad Dog's reply) I don't know or F ing care. Pete, MD doesn't know or care what Palin says or writes, he'll support her no matter what.
Correlation is not causation. Care to tell me why the 1930s were so cold???? How come Mann can't find his data for the "hockey stick"?
Clinton and Cuomo are the true bandits who lit the fuse to this economic crisis we're now in. All in the name of getting more minorities in houses: http://libertysflame.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=12554
Asking questions, being polite and not giving in is a surefire way to get banned.
I work hard to prevent them from brainwashing me ... and stay with hard science and SciFi as much as possible .... Goldi-Lox
#2. To: Wood_Chopper (#1)
Care to debate THE ARTICLE?
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#3. To: go65 (#2)
what is it exactly that i'm supposed to debate?
#4. To: Wood_Chopper (#3)
Good to know you agree with everything in the article, and realize figures on global warming/climate change are being manipulated and lied about by global warming/climate change proponents.
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#5. To: WhiteSands (#0)
(Edited)
#6. To: mcgowanjm (#5)
#7. To: Fred Mertz, mcgowanjm, whitesands, wood_chopper (#6)
Locally we set a new record high yesterday and may possibly do the same today. It is bone dry here and has been for weeks now.
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#8. To: Fred Mertz (#6)
Locally we set a new record high yesterday and may possibly do the same today. It is bone dry here and has been for weeks now.
#9. To: go65 (#7)
Same here, but unfortunately people often confuse "weather" with "Climate."
#10. To: go65 (#7)
But again, I make the mistake in assuming that critics of global warming actually are interested in the science, or honest debate, rather than simply dismissing anything related to global warming on the basis of their political convictions.
#11. To: go65 (#7)
But again, I make the mistake in assuming that critics of global warming actually are interested in the science, or honest debate, rather than simply dismissing anything related to global warming on the basis of their political convictions.
#12. To: Wood_Chopper (#11)
(Edited)
With all the evidence of fraud, collusion, "decline hiding" etc. etc. etc., my opinion is that anyone now supporting global warming malarkey has moved out of the "possibly insane" category and into the category of actively perpetrating the fraud. .
#13. To: Wood_Chopper (#11)
With all the evidence of fraud, collusion, "decline hiding" etc. etc. etc., my opinion is that anyone now supporting global warming malarkey has moved out of the "possibly insane" category and into the category of actively perpetrating the fraud.
It is a shame go65, with all our abilities to use science to do very good things and find the truth of matters, that its reputation has been destroyed by those seeking control, power and money.
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#14. To: Wood_Chopper (#1)
Care to debate THE ARTICLE?
#15. To: Fred Mertz (#6)
(Edited)
Locally we set a new record high yesterday and may possibly do the same today. It is bone dry here and has been for weeks now.
#16. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#15)
Coldest Summer in L.A. in DECADES.
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#17. To: go65 (#13)
Sorry, but all the allegations of "climategate" were false as numerous investigations have concluded.
#18. To: go65 (#16)
#19. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#17)
Wrong, and you know it.
Climategate scientists cleared of manipulating data on global warming
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/jul/08/muir-russell-climategate-climate-science
Setting the ‘Climategate’ Record Straight: Michael Mann Cleared
http://www.ericpooley.com/2010/07/01/setting-the-climategate-record-straight-michael-mann- cleared/
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#20. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#18)
The concept of globalwarming, GO, means hotter temperatures.
Reality check - Government spending is down, the deficit is down, government employment is down, and private hiring is up.
#21. To: go65 (#19)
Climategate scientists cleared of manipulating data on global warming
When Penn State absolved Mike Mann of wrongdoing, and the University of East Anglia did the same for Phil Jones, they cannot have been unaware of the financial penalty for doing otherwise. As the old saying goes, you don’t have to be a weatherman to know which way the wind is blowing. Since I am no philosopher, I’m not going to explore at just which point enlightened self-interest crosses the line into corruption, but a careful reading of the ClimateGate releases makes it clear that this is not an academic question.
#22. To: go65 (#20)
#23. To: go65 (#20)
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