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Title: It's official: Analysis says bailouts saved economy
Source:
chron
URL Source: http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/outlook/7160768.html
Published: Sep 4, 2010
Author: FROMA HARROP
Post Date: 2010-09-04 04:03:22 by lucysmom
Keywords: bailout, economy, unemployment
Views: 143909
Comments: 163
Using econometric models, Alan Blinder and Mark Zandi argue that the bailouts, the stimulus and other extraordinary actions saved America from nothing less than another Great Depression. Blinder was vice chairman of the Federal Reserve. Zandi is chief economist at Moody's Analytics and advised Republican presidential candidate John McCain. Had Washington not taken any aggressive steps starting in 2008, the results would have been horrific, their study says. Real gross domestic product would have fallen a "stunning" 12 percent, rather than the actual decline of 4 percent. Nearly 17 million jobs would have vanished, twice as many as the real count. And the unemployment rate would have peaked at 16.5 percent. ... Ignoring what might have happened had the government not launched a vigorous response may be irresponsible, but it can be good politics. That's because many Americans — seeing the weak job picture and forgetting their own terror during the early days of the economic freefall - can be convinced that such polices were ineffective and possibly counterproductive. They remind me of family members who, four weeks after a quadruple bypass, want to know why Grandpa isn't dancing. At least the family knows that the operation was needed.
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#69. To: mininggold, Ignore Amos, skippy (#67)
Recant? One can't "recant" for another, whiningdope! Skippy is just a mindless little wimp.
I was thinking more of the notion that "big-government" can solve all problems. To me, that began some during Hoover, and became the norm under FDR. But you are correct, of course. Maybe the most accurate thing to say is the problems began when the Constitution was tossed aside. In any event, it makes Skippy's statement: ______________________________________________________________________________ Ignore must feel very privileged to have an esteemed poster like you as a friend, to help him out.
"Look you leftist pervert, make sure you keep your Mr Winky away from your family's new addition or I will send some fellow salad tossers to square away your sorry butt. Got it??" The good "cop", Jethro Tull explaining how to prevent a Palin family tradition in YOUR family.
All the disastrous decisions we're dealing with now started with Bush, all the more ridiculous. Skippy is a typical leftwingnut pinhead.
Well, that's certainly what the folks at Lewrockwell.com think. Yes, in many respects Lincoln was a tyrant. However, the challenges we face today are directly related to the restructuring of the U.S. that took place place in the 1910s.
Why not address the question to him/her? I see you purposely avoided the issue, whinigdope. Typical of leftwingnut pinheads.
Naaaah, but I will agree that Skippy needed to go all the way back to Lincoln to find the origins of this nation's constitutional problems.
"Look you leftist pervert, make sure you keep your Mr Winky away from your family's new addition or I will send some fellow salad tossers to square away your sorry butt. Got it??" The good "cop", Jethro Tull explaining how to prevent a Palin family tradition in YOUR family.
He listens about as well as . . . .you :-)
______________________________________________________________________________ You're right. Widespread belief that big government can steer the economy started with Roosevelt / Hoover and ended after Johnson / Nixon. However, it could have never been put into practice without the mechanisms put into place in the 1910s. Unfortunately, the Obamunists still cling to the false belief that big government can steer a complex economy of 300 million people, in a global economy of 6.5 billion people. Their simpleton beliefs is why they are failing.
I see you purposely avoided the issue, whinigdope. Typical of leftwingnut pinheads. He's tired of discussing stuff. Will you be my discussion pal now? He hates the word 'Bush', so how do you feel about that?
"Look you leftist pervert, make sure you keep your Mr Winky away from your family's new addition or I will send some fellow salad tossers to square away your sorry butt. Got it??" The good "cop", Jethro Tull explaining how to prevent a Palin family tradition in YOUR family.
I'm sure he'll recant it if your arguments are factual and persuasive.
"Look you leftist pervert, make sure you keep your Mr Winky away from your family's new addition or I will send some fellow salad tossers to square away your sorry butt. Got it??" The good "cop", Jethro Tull explaining how to prevent a Palin family tradition in YOUR family.
I don't get emotional about words.
Then why do you post that picture showing your emotions?
"Look you leftist pervert, make sure you keep your Mr Winky away from your family's new addition or I will send some fellow salad tossers to square away your sorry butt. Got it??" The good "cop", Jethro Tull explaining how to prevent a Palin family tradition in YOUR family.
My bozo list is at 1, and quite a while back the Skipster said he was putting me on bozo. His post to me today was the first I've heard from him since then. Well, I got all excited - "Hey, Skippy is actually posting to li'l ol' me. Glory be!" As you can imagine, I immediately checked my bozo filter to make sure it was at zero. Imagine my disappointment when alas, it was still at 1. So I'll give the Skipster the scorn he deserves. And I stand by my statement he posts nothing of substance.
______________________________________________________________________________ Farting isn't an emotion, whiningdope!
And yet YOU brought it up. Why? US Corporations, aggregate, pay very little US tax compared to the corporation of other nations.
Why do you bother? He and Boofer and Mad Dog and Mud ALL post the same crap. Life here has gotten so much better with all three on Bozo.
Margin tax rates are meaningful to the discussion. The fact that few people in the U.S. pay them is meaningless because few people in any country pay them. You are comparing apples to oranges in order to confuse your dimwitted followers like luscy's mom. The fact remains that the U.S. and Japan have by far the highest margin corporate taxes in the world. Yes, there are deductions for special interests. The results are clear -- the U.S. system punishes job creating entrepreneurs with high tax rates and gives breaks to large, politically connected companies. The answer isn't to raise marginal rates further. Tax rates need to be lowered and deductions for special interests needs to be eliminated.
Maybe whiningdope isn't as cowardly and stupid as you, dwarf.
Did you know that doctors with decent social skills aka bedside manner, seldom get sued?
People are sitting on their money rather than putting it at risk because of government policies, namely increased regulations, looming tax increases, government mandated medical insurance costs, and god-forbid cap and trade. And to think - all those years I've been told them business guys deserve lots more money than us regular folk because they're risk takers.
Since I have Ibluamadogsky on bozo, care to tell me what this is all about?
"How many confirmed NV Mig kills do YOU have general? I only have three." - Mad Dog, the village idiot's hemorrhoid.
Clinton had no idea what was going to happen once Bush and the Republicans took over.
"How many confirmed NV Mig kills do YOU have general? I only have three." - Mad Dog, the village idiot's hemorrhoid.
You're still missing the point as usual. You have no clue whatsoever. Here is the unintended consequence of government healthcare idiocy -- 50% of doctors in the U.S. refuse to take Medicaid patients and a growing number are refusing to take Medicare. Just wait until Obamacare kicks in and we'll see most of the remaining doctors fleeing from both.
It gives you something to be outraged about (the only thing the US manufactures anymore).
I don't hate Bush, but I do think he was a disaster of a president.
He can pay his Chinese workers $0.60 an hour, that might have something to do with it.
______________________________________________________________________________ You are a stubborn old coot because you refuse to listen to the people (like the Intel CEO) who actually know why the economy is languishing. It cost Intel $1 billion more (due to various government tax and regulatory insanities) to build (not operate, but BUILD) a fab in the U.S. than it does elsewhere (and not just in China, but in Taiwan too). Insofar as operational costs are concerned, the people in Taiwan do not make 60 cents an hour. Skilled workers in China make more than that too.
The problems started before that. In the 1910s we got: Panic of 1797, Duration, 3 years Recession of 1802–1804 Depression of 1807, Duration 3 years and on, and on
Recession of 1802–1804 Depression of 1807, Duration 3 years LOL - you just killed your own case. 3 years. 2 years. 3 years. compared to the Great Depression - 1929-1941 Every heard of boom/bust cycles? They are as old as capitalism itself.
______________________________________________________________________________ Then it was the founding fathers themselves that cast it aside.
Maybe the most accurate thing to say is the problems began when the Constitution was tossed aside. Then it was the founding fathers themselves that cast it aside. No ......................... Have you followed the discussion on this thread at all? If you have, how did you come to THAT conclusion?
______________________________________________________________________________ Recession of 1802–1804 Depression of 1807, Duration 3 years Great Depression -- 13 years. The Great Depression started after the Federal Reserve was created, which the left claimed they needed to "smooth out" short term boom and bust cycles. There was nothing smooth about the Great Depression. The Great Depression was primarily caused by the Federal Reserve. Even Ben Bernacke believes this. ROTFLMAO. It's happening again. If we didn't have TARP, "Stimulus", GM bailout, etc. we would have had a somewhat sharper decline (to correct past government distortions in the market), but we'd be well along the road to recovery today. We are NOT on the road to recovery today, because of the government.
Why thank you. That sounds almost friendly.
Before the Great Depression there was the Long Depression. In the United States, economists typically refer to the Long Depression as the Depression of 1873–79, which followed the Panic of 1873. The National Bureau of Economic Research dates the contraction following the panic as lasting from October 1873 to March 1879. At 65 months, it is the longest-lasting contraction identified by the NBER, eclipsing the Great Depression's 43 months of contraction.[4] [5] After the panic, the economy entered a period of rapid growth, with the U.S. growing at the fastest rates ever in its history in the 1870's and 1880's. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Depression
Yes you did.
Yep, and it was also caused by expansionary monetary policies. During the Civil War, the U.S. government temporarily left the gold standard and inflated the money supply to pay for the war. After the Civil War the country moved back to the gold standard (actually a bi-metal standard, which was another problem that we can discuss on another thread). The market had to correct past government actions. The severity of the correction depends on the severity of government interference in the economy. It still lasted half the amount of time as the Great Depression which occurred after the left got the monetary tools they needed to "smooth" these things out. Nothing has been smoothed out. Things have only gotten worse.
I apologize for that comment. I usually don't make personal attacks. I'm just on edge today for a few reasons.
No, the Long Depression lasted almost 2 years longer than the GD.
I'm sorry - hope everything is ok.
Comments (110 - 163) not displayed.
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestWhy don't you just recant what Skip posted?
#70. To: jwpegler, Skip Intro and go directly to democrat fax machine (#66)
This is where our long-term problems come from.
All the disastrous decisions we're dealing with now started with Bush,
all the more ridiculous.
Zero diddled while America burned
#71. To: Ibluafartsky (#69)
Recant? One can't "recant" for another, whiningdope! Skippy is just a mindless little wimp.
#72. To: Ignore Amos, skippy (#70)
In any event, it makes Skippy's statement:
#73. To: mininggold (#68)
Sorry, but it was the Civil War and Lincoln, the first Republican.
American public policy has been dominated by Democrats who don't care and Republicans that don't dare -- Dick Armey
#74. To: mininggold (#71)
Ignore must feel very privileged to have an esteemed poster like you as a friend, to help him out.
#75. To: Ibluafartsky (#72)
Skippy is a typical leftwingnut pinhead.
#76. To: mininggold (#67)
Why don't you just recant what Skip posted?
Do you mean respond to instead of recant? I have. And I'll be looking forward to your posts to Gnu about his Bush obsession.
Not long after I arrived here, I did.
Zero diddled while America burned
#77. To: Ignore Amos (#70)
(Edited)
I was thinking more of the notion that "big-government" can solve all problems. To me, that began some during Hoover, and became the norm under FDR.
American public policy has been dominated by Democrats who don't care and Republicans that don't dare -- Dick Armey
#78. To: Ibluafartsky (#74)
Why not address the question to him/her?
#79. To: Ignore Amos (#76)
Do you mean respond to instead of recant? I have.
#80. To: mininggold (#78)
He hates the word 'Bush', so how do you feel about that?
#81. To: Ibluafartsky (#80)
I don't get emotional about words.
#82. To: mininggold, Skip Intro and proceed directly to democrat talking points (#79)
Zero diddled while America burned
#83. To: mininggold (#81)
Then why do you post that picture showing your emotions?
#84. To: jwpegler (#45)
#85. To: mininggold (#81)
#86. To: war (#84)
(Edited)
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#87. To: war, mininggold (#85)
Why do you bother?
#88. To: jwpegler (#19)
Regardless, you're missing the point. The NET outcome of the government's rules...
#89. To: jwpegler (#24)
If I RISK that money on a new business or to expand an existing business in a poor economic climate (created by government policies) then I may LOSE it all.
#90. To: mininggold (#75)
Naaaah, but I will agree that Skippy needed to go all the way back to Lincoln to find the origins of this nation's constitutional problems.
#91. To: jwpegler (#86)
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#92. To: lucysmom (#88)
Did you know that doctors with decent social skills aka bedside manner, seldom get sued?
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#93. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#29)
That is all the "stimulus" and bailouts accomplished. Status quo.
#94. To: Ignore Amos (#30)
Again I ask - why do you folks hate him so?
#95. To: jwpegler (#31)
So why in the hell should he build a new plant in the U.S., rather than in Taiwan, or China? He shouldn't and he's not.
#96. To: lucysmom (#94)
I don't hate Bush
That's good. If you have hatred toward someone far removed from you (as I assume Bush is) and who probably doesn't know you, it only hurts you, not him. but I do think he was a disaster of a president.
See? Even people from opposite ends of the political spectrum can find agreement at times.
Zero diddled while America burned
#97. To: lucysmom (#95)
He can pay his Chinese workers $0.60 an hour, that might have something to do with it.
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#98. To: jwpegler, Ignore Amo (#66)
The seeds of the economic problems began with FDR. edit: on second thought, they probably began with Hoover
#99. To: lucysmom (#98)
Panic of 1797, Duration, 3 years
Zero diddled while America burned
#100. To: Ignore Amos (#70)
Maybe the most accurate thing to say is the problems began when the Constitution was tossed aside.
#101. To: lucysmom (#100)
Zero diddled while America burned
#102. To: lucysmom (#98)
(Edited)
Panic of 1797, Duration, 3 years
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#103. To: jwpegler (#97)
You are a stubborn old coot ...
#104. To: jwpegler (#102)
Great Depression -- 13 years. The Great Depression started after the Federal Reserve was created, which the left claimed they needed to "smooth out" short term boom and bust cycles.
#105. To: war (#34)
BTW, told ya...
#106. To: lucysmom (#104)
Before the Great Depression there was the Long Depression.
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#107. To: lucysmom (#103)
(Edited)
Why thank you. That sounds almost friendly.
the era of big government is over -- Bill Clinton
#108. To: jwpegler (#106)
It still lasted half the amount of time as the Great Depression...
#109. To: jwpegler (#107)
I'm just on edge today for a few reasons.
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