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Elon Musk Delivers Stunning Remarks At Historic UK March (Tommy Robinson) Status: Not Logged In; Sign In United States News See other United States News Articles Title: New Mexico solar firm suspends 1 production line (Every time some one in the Green industry loses their job an angel gets it's wings!) Source: Business Week URL Source: http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9HE37RG2.htm Published: Aug 6, 2010 Author: NA Post Date: 2010-08-06 19:09:45 by Nebuchadnezzar Keywords: None Views: 7064 Comments: 26 New Mexico solar firm suspends 1 production line ALBUQUERQUE, N.M. Schott Solar is suspending one of its two concentrated solar power production lines in Albuquerque. Schott says the suspension will mean laying off about 30 temporary agency employees. The company blames slow growth in the North American market and a slowdown in the Spanish market. Company spokesman Matthew Kraft in Elmsford, N.Y., says Schott had 370 employees in Albuquerque before the announced layoffs. Schott produces photovoltaic panels and thermal receivers at its 200,000-square-foot Albuquerque plant, its flagship facility in North America. The concentrated solar power modules or thermal receivers are used in large-scale solar power plant trough systems. Officials say Schott's production of photovoltaic modules is not affected. Mainz, Germany-based Schott AG opened the Albuquerque plant last year. Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread   Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest #1. To: All (#0) Good. Solar is the biggest "dry well" around. We've subsidized those losers for 30+ years for NOTHING. Green industry = bullshit. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-06   19:10:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #2. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#1) Good. Solar is the biggest "dry well" around. We've subsidized those losers for 30+ years for NOTHING. No doubt that you would have said the same thing about the automobile in the 1910s. Currently, Americans pay anywhere from 5 cents to 17 cents a kilowatt hour for electricity. Hydroelectric power in the Northwest tends to be the cheapest. Electricity tends to cost the most in New York and New England. There are two kinds of solar energy -- solar thermal (concentrated solar power) and solar electric (photo-voltaics). Arizona is building the largest solar thermal plant in the world. When it's done in 2013, they expect the price per kilowatt hour will a 13 cents. It's not as cheap as coal or hydroelectric, but its within the U.S. averages. Silicon Valley has been pouring money into photo-voltaics for last few years. Prices have dropped over 100 fold in the last couple of decades. In fact, the price curve isn't very different than that of the micro-processor, which isn't a surprise given the similarities in the technologies. Here's the bottom line: In one hour more sunlight falls on the earth than what is used by the entire population in one year. So, entrepreneurs will make this work and they are making it work. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-06   19:45:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #3. To: jwpegler (#2) Arizona is building the largest solar thermal plant in the world. When it's done in 2013, they expect the price per kilowatt hour will a 13 cents. It's not as cheap as coal or hydroelectric, but its within the U.S. averages. Blah, blah, blah. AZ is doing it with the assistance of FED GOV. Subsidies. Bullshit on that. And no, it isn't cheap and they still, after 30+ years of sucking at the public teet, haven't made it economical. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-06   20:24:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #4. To: All (#3) Btw....currently the liars in the green movement are "promising" that their solar plans will cost "only" $.15/Kwhr. Compared to $.06/kwhr for coal. And Coal gives us Thorium which can be used in nuclear reactors. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-06   20:51:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #5. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#3) AZ is doing it with the assistance of FED GOV. Subsidies. No one builds any NUCLEAR power plants in the U.S. without any government subsidies. A LOT of subsidies. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-07   9:48:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #6. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#4) the liars in the green movement are "promising" that their solar plans will cost "only" $.15/Kwhr. Make no mistake, that price point will happen as the technology matures. Solar volataics is a similar technology as the microprocessor. There is more compute power in an iPhone today than there was in a huge data center in 1970 and the cost is a couple of hundred bucks versus tens of millions of dollars. The technology will get there. You can bet on it. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-07   9:59:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #7. To: jwpegler (#6) Make no mistake, that price point will happen as the technology matures. Zzzzzz.....zzzzzz...yeah I've been hearing the same song and dance from the unfeasible solar industry for about, let's see, 32 years plus. Solar volataics is a similar technology as the microprocessor. There is more compute power in an iPhone today than there was in a huge data center in 1970 and the cost is a couple of hundred bucks versus tens of millions of dollars. Flawed analogy. Solar hasn't come anywhere near accomplishing the same degree of increase in power in the same time frame the microprocessor did. Yet, the USG has subsidized the solar industry to a much higher degree. Go figure! The technology will get there. You can bet on it. Again, when? Still about 4 to 5 times more expensive than the more efficient nuclear energy. We've wasted billions upon billions on solar when a small fraction of said billions invested in nuclear power would have produced a far greater return. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-07   15:49:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #8. To: jwpegler (#5) No one builds any NUCLEAR power plants in the U.S. without any government subsidies. A LOT of subsidies. Hey, even if you get rid of the subsidies for both solar and nuclear guess which one wins hands down? I'm all for getting rid of all subsidies. Are you? Of course not. Solar withers on the vine without bribes. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-07   15:50:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #9. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#8) I'm all for getting rid of all subsidies. Are you? Of course not. No you are wrong. I am last person on earth that would want the government to subsidize anything. Even if you get rid of the subsidies for both solar and nuclear guess which one wins hands down? Solar withers on the vine without bribes. Wrong again. Nuclear has died on vine (no new plants since Jimmy Carter) in large part because of the lack of government subsidies. The utilities have made it very clear that they won't build new nuclear plants without massive government subsidies and loan guarantees. It looks like Obama is going to oblige them. On the other hand, Silicon Valley entrepreneurs and venture capitalists have been POURING their own money into solar technology start ups over the last few years because they know the technology is finally poised to become mainstream. For example, one company is working on a solar paint (nanonscale solar cells) that can be painted on anything, which capture more wavelengths of light than thin-film photo-voltaics, and will cost about 1/3 as much. It will probably take another decade or more, but solar power is going to happen, and when it happens it will happen quickly. Again, the sun dumps as much energy on the earth every hour as we need in a year. That's compelling proposition. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-07   16:36:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #10. To: jwpegler (#9) (Edited) Nuclear has died on vine (no new plants since Jimmy Carter) in large part because of the lack of government subsidies. The utilities have made it very clear that they won't build new nuclear plants without massive government subsidies and loan guarantees. It looks like Obama is going to oblige them. Wrong. They refused to permit them. In the late 80s or early 90s they had just gotten a plant up to low-power testing in California. Then the greens took over the small town the plant was located in and passed a referendum against all nuclear power. Here is the information: The 913 MW Pressurized Water Reactor at the Rancho Seco Nuclear Power Plant, located about 25 miles south of Sacramento, is owned by the Sacramento Municipal Utility District in and was operation from April 1975 to June 7, 1989. It was closed by public referendum. Typical of the bullshit the only true-efficient and clean industry this country has had to deal with. Billions of dollars down the drain. You need protection from the government to combat the frivolous law-suits the industry has to deal with. Also, California law PROHIBITS any new nuclear reactors. This is the law in California. Ludites. You guys in the green industry are nuts. In one year, 2011, our electrical bills are going to go up 21%!!!!!!!!! Reason? More "green" energy. All bullshit. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-07   18:02:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #11. To: jwpegler (#9) On the other hand, Silicon Valley entrepreneurs and venture capitalists have been POURING their own money into solar technology start ups over the last few years because they know the technology is finally poised to become mainstream. Horse crap again. There is a solar start-up in my office building. I go to lunch with the guys twice a month. They've spilled the beans as to where the vast majority of their money comes: California and the Federal teet. They couldn't exist if they didn't have enormous subsidies. Nor could "silicon" valley. This crap has been going on hard-core ever since Pelosi got her "energy" bill in 2007. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-07   18:04:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #12. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#10) Also, California law PROHIBITS any new nuclear reactors. This is the law in California. Wouldn't deporting 20 Million illegal aliens have the same effect as building several nuke plants? We could sell our surplus power to Mexico, and accept Pemex oil as payment. Once the oil runs out, we cut the juice. Hondo68  posted on  2010-08-07   19:15:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #13. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#10) (Edited) Ludites. That's the exact word I ready to use to describe you. You're stuck in the 1950s from a technology perspective. You're so closed minded that you refuse to even open your eyes and see what's been happening in solar over the last 5 years or so. There's no point in arguing with someone who is so closed minded and set in their ways. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-07   21:19:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #14. To: jwpegler (#13) That's the exact word I ready to use to describe you. You're stuck in the 1950s from a technology perspective. You're so closed minded that you refuse to even open your eyes and see what's been happening in solar over the last 5 years or so. There's no point in arguing with someone who is so closed minded and set in their ways. The difference is that IF Solar was economically viable, and it's not, I would support it. I have a degree in Physics, optics to be precise, so to call me Luddite is a joke. You even admit that solar's "breakthrough" has yet to happen. We know that nuclear is inexpensive and efficient, as well as safe. We can't say the same about solar, and you have admitted this. Thus why are you opposed to nuclear which is the better of the two, and proven at that? Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-07   22:24:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #15. To: jwpegler (#9) It will probably take another decade or more, but solar power is going to happen, and when it happens it will happen quickly. I hope you are correct. Liberals oppose any, all and every source of energy. solar and wind included. Feinstein wants desert swath off-limits to solar, wind In a move that could pit environmentalists and alternative energy industries against each other, the senator wants hundreds of thousands of acres in California designated as a national monument. March 25, 2009|Richard Simon WASHINGTON — While President Obama has made development of cleaner energy sources a priority, an effort is underway to close off a large swath of the Southern California desert to solar and wind energy projects. In a move that could pit usual allies -- environmentalists and the solar and wind industries -- against each other, Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) is preparing legislation that would permanently put hundreds of thousands of acres of desert land off limits to energy projects. The territory would be designated California's newest national monument. http://articles.latimes.com/2009/mar/25/nation/na-desert25 ----------------------------------------------------------- Toss: ADL,CAIR and the Vatican into the pit they belong in. WhiteSands  posted on  2010-08-07   22:28:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #16. To: WhiteSands (#15) Liberals oppose any, all and every source of energy. solar and wind included. Feinstein wants desert swath off-limits to solar This has been happening for some time. A couple of years ago Schwarzenegger was pissed as hell about the environmentalists blocking solar plants in the desert. Screw the wacko environmentalists. People come first. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-08   13:10:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #17. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#14) (Edited) I have a degree in Physics, optics to be precise, so to call me Luddite is a joke. You brought up the word first. I have degree in computer science. Calling me a Luddite is a joke too. Thus why are you opposed to nuclear which is the better of the two, and proven at that? Nuclear energy requires big government -- big government subsidies, big government regulations, big government controls. The market has not, will not, and in fact cannot do this on it's own. You will never be able to buy uranium at the Home Deport, so the very nature of the solution requires large government intervention. Hence, it's a poor solution. If the government subsidizes this, it means that there will be less incentives for investors and entrepreneurs to find better solutions, for example solar and hydrogen. [solar power is] still about 4 to 5 times more expensive than the more efficient nuclear energy. It cost about .10 per kilowatt hour for electricity in Arizona today. Some of it comes from natural gas, but they also have the largest nuclear power plant in the country. The plant took 12 years to build. When the largest solar thermal plant in the world comes online in Arizona in 2013, it will produce electricity at .14 per kilowatt hour. That's not 4 to 5 times as much. That's only 1.4 times as much. The cost of solar power has come down over 100 fold in the last 20 years. The plant will have taken 4 years to build. Sure, hydroelectric power in the Northwest costs half that. Try building a new damn today with the salmon and snail darters and everything else. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-08   13:24:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #18. To: jwpegler (#17) Nuclear energy requires big government -- big government subsidies, big government regulations, big government controls. The market has not, will not, and in fact cannot do this on it's own. You will never be able to buy uranium at the Home Deport, so the very nature of the solution requires large government intervention. Hence, it's a poor solution. If the government subsidizes this, it means that there will be less incentives for investors and entrepreneurs to find better solutions, for example solar and hydrogen. You need to educate yourself on how France became almost totally dependent upon NUCLEAR ENERGY. Clean, cheap and efficient energy. Much more so than the ever-promising-never-fulfilling solar. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-08   16:42:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #19. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#18) I think there are purposes for solar energy. I notice road signs and street lights are powered by them someplaces. The govt shouldn't subsidize it. As technology increases I'm sure more good uses will be found. But it is no substitute for oil and nuclear energy. We should utilize them all. I want a nuclear powered screw gun. A K A Stone  posted on  2010-08-08   16:50:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #20. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#18) (Edited) You need to educate yourself on how France became almost totally dependent upon NUCLEAR ENERGY. All owned, managed, and subsided by the socialist government. I knew you were going to bring France up so I went and looked. Current electricity rates in France are over .15 per kilowatt hour -- far more than electricity rates anywhere in the U.S. Your big government solutions died with the 1970s. May they rest in peace. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-08   16:58:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #21. To: jwpegler (#20) All owned, managed, and subsided by the socialist government. I knew you were going to bring France up so I went and looked. Current electricity rates in France are over .15 per kilowatt hour -- far more than electricity rates anywhere in the U.S. Your big government solutions died with the 1970s. May they rest in peace. Good point. But it is and has been done in the US much cheaper and under the free market. You realize that Spain, the model of "Green energy" is abandoning your green initiative don't you? I ask you to read this link and get back to me: http://www.windaction.org/news/27505 title: Spain admits that the green energy as sold to Obama is a disaster. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-08   17:09:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #22. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#21) under the free market Nuclear energy has never been part of the free market. The U.S. government started the nuclear power industry in 1948. It was part of a national plan, just like they had in the Soviet Union. The only difference was that the U.S. government told private companies what to do, instead of doing it themselves. The whole industry was created by the U.S. government Atomic Energy Commision, the U.S. government’s Argonne National Laboratory, and the U.S. government's Idaho National Engineering and Environmental Laboratory. The entire nuclear power industry was invented, subsided and pushed by the government. You realize that Spain Another socialist program has failed, just like the U.S. nuclear industry. So what else is new? jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-08   17:21:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #23. To: jwpegler (#22) Nuclear energy has never been part of the free market. The U.S. government started the nuclear power industry in 1948. It was part of a national plan, just like they had in the Soviet Union. The only difference was that the U.S. government told private companies what to do, instead of doing it themselves Sorry, today's nuclear industry meets the definition of free-market. Privately owned plants. Yes, they are heavily regulated- like almost all the big industries are in the US. If we had put the money we've wasted in solar into nuclear research only God knows how awesome our nation would be. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-08   20:01:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #24. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#23) today's nuclear industry meets the definition of free-market It meets the definition of a fascist economic system. Private "ownership" with complete government control. Kind of like George Bush's Wall Street fat cat bailouts. Fascist or any other form of government controlled, socialist economics is not the free market and it's certainly not the future. This is 1950s technology and a 1950s business model. No thanks. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-08   20:15:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #25. To: jwpegler (#24) Kind of like George Bush's Wall Street fat cat bailouts.... That Obama voted for in the US Senate. How you can deplore socialism and defend the subsidies given to the solar industry is beyond me. But hey, what ever helps you sleep at night is fine by me. Being a Democratic shill means you check your humanity at the door. Nebuchadnezzar  posted on  2010-08-08   22:53:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   #26. To: Nebuchadnezzar (#25) How you can deplore socialism and defend the subsidies given to the solar industry is beyond me. Where have I defended subsidies given to the solar industry. Show me. Where? You can't because I haven't. You're just delusional, about a great many things. jwpegler  posted on  2010-08-09   9:21:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply   Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest

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