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Title: No Mass Shootings: The Myth of Australia’s Gun Control Policy (More mass shootings then in America per capita, gun confiscations miserable failure)
Source: [None]
URL Source: https://caffeinatedthoughts.com/201 ... -australia-gun-control-policy/
Published: Jun 16, 2016
Author: SHAUN BROYHILL
Post Date: 2017-03-14 11:40:58 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 2206
Comments: 23

Many people are pushing for the United States to model it’s gun policy after Australia with extremely strict gun control as well as gun confiscation. They point to Australia having “no mass shootings” since 1996 when these laws were enacted.

I would like to tell you how the media, gun control advocates and liberals are again wrong with this agenda, as well as explain to you a bit more about the Australia phenomenon. First, regardless of what the media and liberals tell you, mass shootings have occurred in Australia. Let’s look at just the last 3 years.

In 2011, there was a mass shooting in Hectorville. In 2014, one in Hunt, and again in 2014 one in Wedderburn (which was a 4 hour siege of a neighborhood).

“But wait, that’s only 3 since 2011! We’ve had 29 in America alone in that same time period!”

This is also a bit of trickery with numbers and comparing statistics. Yes, there have been 29 in America since 2011, and I do not dispute that. But let’s dig deep into numbers- Australia only has 23 million people living in it (with a large amount of those very spread out). But let’s just stick to quantity and not density. The United States has nearly 14 times as many people, at nearly 320 million. So if you compare apples to apples, if Australia had as many people as the United States and the ratio of mass killings to total populace remained the same, Australia would have 42 mass killings compared to 29 in the United States. That is 13 more!

Finally, if someone really wants to kill someone, they will find a way. Let’s look at the recent Cairns child killings in Australia where someone killed 8 children with a knife. Or the Quaker Hill Nursing home arson in Australia that killed 11 by fire. Or the Lin killings, also in Australia, that killed 5 with a hammer.

The facts are this: gun control doesn’t work, and pointing towards programs on other countries that are statistically manipulative does not solve the problem. Bad people will still find a way to get guns or kill by other methods. I would much rather people have the right to own a gun and give them the capacity to defend themselves than take away that right and leave them defenseless from those that will kill or harm regardless.

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#1. To: paraclete (#0)

This is also a bit of trickery with numbers and comparing statistics. Yes, there have been 29 in America since 2011, and I do not dispute that. But let’s dig deep into numbers- Australia only has 23 million people living in it (with a large amount of those very spread out). But let’s just stick to quantity and not density. The United States has nearly 14 times as many people, at nearly 320 million. So if you compare apples to apples, if Australia had as many people as the United States and the ratio of mass killings to total populace remained the same, Australia would have 42 mass killings compared to 29 in the United States. That is 13 more!

When are you guys going to stop massacring each other?

Maybe if you had more guns in good peoples hands it wouldn't happen so much of the time.

A K A Stone  posted on  2017-03-14   11:42:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: A K A Stone, paraclete (#1)

" When are you guys going to stop massacring each other?

Maybe if you had more guns in good peoples hands it wouldn't happen so much of the time. "

Here is a novel idea. Try much harsher punishments on those convicted of violent crimes.

Si vis pacem, para bellum

Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God.

There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."Theodore Roosevelt-1907.

I am concerned for the security of our great nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious forces working from within." -- General Douglas MacArthur

Stoner  posted on  2017-03-14   11:57:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: A K A Stone (#0) (Edited)

The facts are this: gun control doesn’t work, and pointing towards programs on other countries that are statistically manipulative does not solve the problem.

statistics are the defense of a scoundrel

The whole point is Australia has less bad people than the US, no, I didn't say they have no bad people they also don't have large dangerous animals roaming about. You can't take a per head of population statistic and scale it up otherwise you get rediculous statistics like Australia is the the largest emitter of green house gases. The fact is gun control has worked in keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of bad people but there are nuts everywhere and the more guns you have in a society the more gun related deaths you have, the same goes for automobiles. You don't let someone get behind the wheel of an automobile without making sure they are qualified to use it

The Australian has access to guns they just are limited for choice and have to have a valid reason for owning a gun. It is a difference in the way we think, we actually think everyone has the right to be free of the risk of gun related death, just as we think everyone has the right to be free of automobile related death. Our news is not full of gun related crime incidents and deaths although there seems to be a greater incidence in one state than others, that state has a higher ethnic population

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-14   17:24:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Stoner (#2)

Hows that working out for you? you have the largest prison population in the world and it hasn't curbed violent crime, we prefer our system of restricting opportunity, it is victim focused policing rather than freedom related policing.

Gun freedom has only made you a more violent society, we don't want to go down the same road, so our children grow up without expectancy that a major achievement in life is possession of a weapon

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-14   19:51:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: A K A Stone (#0)

Don't forget thats while having Obummer ruling Amerika! People lost hope and turned to crime to make it. Thats when Obummer and associates flooded the market with illegal guns(Gunner Runner) to upset the people to make them want to ban guns.

Without the basic right to defend yourself with a gun you have no rights at all!!!!!!!!

BTW I guaranty that the progressives ruling Australia cooked the books and crime is much worse than they claimed.

Justified  posted on  2017-03-14   20:50:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Justified (#5)

BTW I guaranty that the progressives ruling Australia cooked the books and crime is much worse than they claimed.

so your contention is that our media are in league with government to keep the truth from us. I can see that there is little reporting of affairs in the middle east and some strange fixation on the sage words of some yellow headed dickhead in another place, but generally speaking incidence of violent crime are reported

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-14   20:58:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: paraclete (#6)

so your contention is that our media are in league with government to keep the truth from us. I

And you are not?

Have you not been watching what has been going on with governments being proven liars all over the world by wiki leaks?

Governments are the biggest liars. The more progressive they become the bigger the lie they tell.

Justified  posted on  2017-03-14   21:10:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Justified (#7)

Governments are the biggest liars. The more progressive they become the bigger the lie they tell.

I think that is true of governments of all persuasions, it is actually the longer they are in power the bigger the lie, excepting for the present circumstance where the louder you shout the bigger the lie

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-14   21:43:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: paraclete (#8)

I think that is true of governments of all persuasions, it is actually the longer they are in power the bigger the lie, excepting for the present circumstance where the louder you shout the bigger the lie

True but I still think the more control they have the more they have to lie to keep sheeple occupied with muddied truth. It always starts out im the government and im here to help! Progressive governments to me equal that of dictatorships. ;)

I do bitch alot about the federal or central government. US founding fathers are right about the farther away you are from the government the less you are represented and the more you are abused.

Justified  posted on  2017-03-15   9:45:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: paraclete (#4)

" Hows that working out for you? you have the largest prison population in the world "

Well, not as well as it could be. We need to complete a bunch of death penalties. No repeat offenders. Unfortunately, we have too many slick tongued lawyers, liberal parole boards, and liberal judges.

I suggested more harsh penalties for your country, because you do not want the option of potential victims being able to defend themselves. That encourages crime.

But compared to you, at least here in the states, we have the right to bear arms, and can defend ourselves. You are stuck on wanting to take every ones guns, to bring about a fantasy of no violence, and turn the general population into prey waiting to be slaughtered, and make life safe for the predators. Not going to happen here in the states. If you get your dream of no weapons, when one of the predators is about to gut you like a fish, just remember, YOU ASKED FOR IT !

I will keep my firearms thank you. BTW, I have never been a victim of violent crime.

Snowflakes like you, and all your fellow gun control fanatics, while I will give you the benefit of the doubt that you have good intentions ( I think ), but you are all undeniably naive, stuck on being incredibly stupid, or you have ulterior motives!

Lions do not want the sheep to have the means to defend themselves !

Like I said, I will keep mine ! If you want to blindly step into the showers, you go right ahead !!!

Si vis pacem, para bellum

Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God.

There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."Theodore Roosevelt-1907.

I am concerned for the security of our great nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious forces working from within." -- General Douglas MacArthur

Stoner  posted on  2017-03-15   12:39:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Stoner (#10)

But compared to you, at least here in the states, we have the right to bear arms, and can defend ourselves. You are stuck on wanting to take every ones guns, to bring about a fantasy of no violence, and turn the general population into prey waiting to be slaughtered, and make life safe for the predators. Not going to happen here in the states. If you get your dream of no weapons, when one of the predators is about to gut you like a fish, just remember, YOU ASKED FOR I

NRA propaganda. We are not about taking guns away but regulating what guns can be used and who can possess them. The NRA hates the idea that we could successfully do that. Our circumstance is the way we want it, we don't need to change because you think we should be like you. We are not lobbying in your country for change but the NRA is lobbying here for change. If your politicians use us as an example, it should inform you there might be a better way, that is all.

our penalties are appropriate, we do not have a policy of locking up offenders forever, so we don't have a three strikes rule, what we have is a judiciary who take previous record into account when sentencing. We know that in a small number of cases there will be re-offenders, but what we have observed is that harsher penalties only mean we have to construct more prisons, so we have harsh penalties for some offences, like terrorism, and trafficing. As far as I am aware penalties have not deterred anyone from committing anything other than a minor offence.

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-15   22:17:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: paraclete (#11)

Your whole screed is so FOS, I don't know where to start. It is nothing but snowflake propaganda.

" We are not lobbying in your country for change ". Oh really ? Then WTF are you doing here, on an American Forum, spewing your BS views on arms ?

Si vis pacem, para bellum

Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God.

There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."Theodore Roosevelt-1907.

I am concerned for the security of our great nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious forces working from within." -- General Douglas MacArthur

Stoner  posted on  2017-03-16   9:53:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: paraclete (#11)

NRA propaganda.

Your country has more mass shootings then America per capita.

You have a beautiful country but you are lead by tyrants who take your guns away so you can't defend yourself.

Your destiny is a Chinese slave colony unless you get your heads out of your assholes.

A K A Stone  posted on  2017-03-16   10:04:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: A K A Stone (#13) (Edited)

I think you need to follow your own advice, if ever a nation has its head up its arsehole it is yours

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-17   12:11:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: paraclete (#14)

The United States has nearly 14 times as many people, at nearly 320 million. So if you compare apples to apples, if Australia had as many people as the United States and the ratio of mass killings to total populace remained the same, Australia would have 42 mass killings compared to 29 in the United States. That is 13 more!

Read it over and over until you understand that.

When you understand it get back to me.

A K A Stone  posted on  2017-03-17   13:01:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: A K A Stone (#15)

What I understand is this more population doesn't make you smarter, nor does it lessen the incidence of violent crime or the miss use of guns. using statistics to argue a point is the refuge of a scoundrel. Australia is accused of many things because of its smaller population and vast lands, but being the murder capital of the world isn't one of them.

The interesting thing about this is the concern the US gun lobby places on it, and yet the possession of weapons isn't on the debate agenda in Australia. It is a non issue, we have more important things to worry about than whether a pirile mind thinks they should possess an assault weapon. We don't have teenagers shooting up schools or theatres, that is the only statistic that interests us. So we arn't interested in importing US weapons and I suggest that this is what is behind these debates.

When you have digested this get back to me

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-17   20:57:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: A K A Stone (#15)

Just a follow up so you arn't living in the dark created by NRA propaganda

https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2015/06/australia-hasnt-had-a-mass-shooting-since- 1996/

When you understand the facts get back to me

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-18   8:01:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: paraclete (#16)

You are a dumb person. If you had more people you would have more murders. You have more per your smaller population. Your country is so stup8d they prosecute people for replica non working guns. Your body lacks testosterone and is full of estrogen.

The right to own firearms is absolute. The right to kill people who want to take your guns is also absolute.

The right for liberals to breathe is not absolute.

Comprende dummy?

A K A Stone  posted on  2017-03-18   8:40:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: paraclete (#17)

australia-hasnt-had-a-mass-shooting-since- 1996

Liar

Monaash University Shooting.

Hectorville Siege

Hunt Family Murders

Logan Shooting

Moma Drug Deal Shooting

Sydney Siege

Cairns Child Killings

The backpack murders

How many blacks do you have? They commit most of our crimes.

A K A Stone  posted on  2017-03-18   8:49:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: paraclete (#17)

https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2015/06/australia-hasnt-had-a-mass-shooting-since- 1996/

When you understand the facts get back to me

Sorry! We couldn't find the page you've requested

A K A Stone  posted on  2017-03-18   9:16:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: A K A Stone (#19) (Edited)

We don't have blacks in the sense you do we have some africans mainly sudanese and somali refugees and they have proved problematical and don't fit in so commit street crime, rapes and muggings. Our aboriginal community seem to be violent among themselves and commit petty crime etc but they don't use firearms. the people who are a problem are mainly refugees and migrants from the middle east, lebanese and iraqi muslims and asia, vietnamese.

You don't understand the background of the crimes you have listed, they are just headlines to you and you are calling the author of the article a liar

You want to understand the circumstance of mass killing you may find that guns are used less often than you think but since Port Arthur the number killed in any event has been greatly reduced and few incidents could be considered as anything like the scale before Port Arthur

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_Australia

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-18   9:27:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: A K A Stone (#20)

don't know why that URL doesn't work if you google mass shootings in australia you can find the article but here is the text

Australia Hasn’t Had A Mass Shooting Since 1996

John Donohue and Stanford University Jun 26, 2015, 1:00pm ⋅

The recent Charleston murders have renewed the sporadic debates over whether gun control might have prevented this latest of tragedies.

This article was originally published on The Conversation as "How US Gun Control Compares To The Rest Of The World". Read the original article.

Australia Hasn’t Had A Mass Shooting Since 1996

The story of Australia, which had 13 mass shootings in the 18-year period from 1979 to 1996 but none in the succeeding 19 years, is worth examining.

The turning point was the 1996 Port Arthur massacre in Tasmania, in which a gunman killed 35 individuals using semiautomatic weapons.

In the wake of the massacre, the conservative federal government succeeded in implementing tough new gun control laws throughout the country. A large array of weapons were banned – including the Glock semiautomatic handgun used in the Charleston shootings. The government also imposed a mandatory gun buy back that substantially reduced gun possession in Australia.

The effect was that both gun suicides and homicides (as well as total suicides and homicides) fell. In addition, the 1996 legislation made it a crime to use firearms in self-defense.

When I mention this to disbelieving NRA supporters they insist that crime must now be rampant in Australia. In fact, the Australian murder rate has fallen to close one per 100,000 while the US rate, thankfully lower than in the early 1990s, is still roughly at 4.5 per 100,000 – over four times as high. Moreover, robberies in Australia occur at only about half the rate of the US (58 in Australia versus 113.1 per 100,000 in the US in 2012).

How did Australia do it? Politically, it took a brave prime minister to face the rage of Australian gun interests.

John Howard wore a bullet-proof vest when he announced the proposed gun restrictions in June 1996. The deputy prime minister was hung in effigy. But Australia did not have a domestic gun industry to oppose the new measures so the will of the people was allowed to emerge. And today, support for the safer, gun- restricted Australia is so strong that going back would not be tolerated by the public.

That Australia hasn’t had a mass shooting since 1996 is likely more than merely the result of the considerable reduction in guns – it’s certainly not the case that guns have disappeared altogether.

I suspect that the country has also experienced a cultural shift between the shock of the Port Arthur massacre and the removal of guns from every day life as they are no longer available for self-defense and they are simply less present throughout the country. Troubled individuals, in other words, are not constantly being reminded that guns are a means to address their alleged grievances to the extent that they were in the past, or continue to be in the US.

How US Gun Control Compares To The Rest Of The World

To quote President Obama the day after the shooting in the AME Church,

“At some point, we as a country will have to reckon with the fact that this kind of mass violence does not happen in other advanced countries. It doesn’t happen in other places with this kind of frequency. It is in our power to do something about it.”

So far, however, the US has not done “something about it.” The National Rifle Association (NRA), it seems, has so much power over politicians that even when 90% of Americans (including a majority of NRA members) wanted universal background checks to be adopted following the Newtown killings of 2012, no federal action ensued. Certainly, it’s unlikely that any useful legislation will emerge in South Carolina.

The NRA stranglehold on appropriate anti-crime measures is only part of the problem, though.

The gun culture’s worship of the magical protective capacities of guns and their power to be wielded against perceived enemies – including the federal government – is a message that resonates with troubled individuals from the Santa Barbara killer, who was seeking vengeance on women who had failed to perceive his greatness, to the Charleston killer who echoed the Tea Party mantra of taking back our country.

I’ve been researching gun violence – and what can be done to prevent it – in the US for 25 years. The fact is that if NRA claims about the efficacy of guns in reducing crime were true, the US would have the lowest homicide rate among industrialized nations instead of the highest homicide rate (by a wide margin).

The US is by far the world leader in the number of guns in civilian hands. The stricter gun laws of other “advanced countries” have restrained homicidal violence, suicides and gun accidents – even when, in some cases, laws were introduced over massive protests from their armed citizens.

The State Of Gun Control In The US

Eighteen states in the US and a number of cities including Chicago, New York and San Francisco have tried to reduce the unlawful use of guns as well as gun accidents by adopting laws to keep guns safely stored when they are not in use. Safe storage is a common form of gun regulation in nations with stricter gun regulations.

The NRA has been battling such laws for years. But that effort was dealt a blow earlier this month when the US Supreme Court – over a strident dissent by Justices Thomas and Scalia – refused to consider the San Francisco law that required guns not in use be stored safely. This was undoubtedly a positive step because hundreds of thousands of guns are stolen every year, and good public policy must try to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and children.

The dissenters, however, were alarmed by the thought that a gun stored in a safe would not be immediately available for use, but they seemed unaware of how unusual it is that a gun is helpful when someone is under attack.

For starters, only the tiniest fraction of victims of violent crime are able to use a gun in their defense. Over the period from 2007-2011, when roughly six million nonfatal violent crimes occurred each year, data from the National Crime Victimization Survey show that the victim did not defend with a gun in 99.2% of these incidents – this in a country with 300 million guns in civilian hands.

In fact, a study of 198 cases of unwanted entry into occupied single-family dwellings in Atlanta (not limited to night when the residents were sleeping) found that the invader was twice as likely to obtain the victim’s gun than to have the victim use a firearm in self-defense.

The author of the study, Arthur Kellerman, concluded in words that Justice Thomas and Scalia might well heed:

On average, the gun that represents the greatest threat is the one that is kept loaded and readily available in a bedside drawer.

A loaded, unsecured gun in the home is like an insurance policy that fails to deliver at least 95% of the time you need it, but has the constant potential – particularly in the case of handguns that are more easily manipulated by children and more attractive for use in crime – to harm someone in the home or (via theft) the public at large.

More Guns Won’t Stop Gun Violence

For years, the NRA mantra has been that allowing citizens to carry concealed handguns would reduce crime as they fought off or scared off the criminals.

Some early studies even purported to show that so-called right to carry laws (RTC) did just that, but a 2004 report from the National Research Council refuted that claim (saying it was not supported by “the scientific evidence”), while remaining uncertain about what the true impact of RTC laws was.

Ten years of additional data have allowed new research to get a better fix on this question, which is important since the NRA is pushing for a Supreme Court decision that would allow RTC as a matter of constitutional law.

The new research on this issue from my research team at Stanford University has given the most compelling evidence to date that RTC laws are associated with significant increases in violent crime – particularly for aggravated assault. Looking at Uniform Crime Reports data from 1979-2012, we find that, on average, the 33 states that adopted RTC laws over this period experienced violent crime rates that are 4%-19% higher after 10 years than if they had not adopted these laws.

This hardly makes a strong case for RTC as a constitutional right. At the very least more research is needed to estimate more precisely exactly how much violent crime such a decision would unleash in the states that have so far resisted the NRA-backed RTC laws.

In the meantime, can anything make American politicians listen to the preferences of the 90% on the wisdom of adopting universal background checks for gun purchases?

Gun Control Around The World

As an academic exercise, one might speculate whether law could play a constructive role in reducing the number or deadliness of mass shootings.

Most other advanced nations apparently think so, since they make it far harder for someone like the Charleston killer to get his hands on a Glock semiautomatic handgun or any other kind of firearm (universal background checks are common features of gun regulation in other developed countries).

Germany: To buy a gun, anyone under the age of 25 has to pass a psychiatric evaluation (presumably 21-year-old Dylann Roof would have failed). Finland: Handgun license applicants are only allowed to purchase firearms if they can prove they are active members of regulated shooting clubs. Before they can get a gun, applicants must pass an aptitude test, submit to a police interview, and show they have a proper gun storage unit. Italy: To secure a gun permit, one must establish a genuine reason to possess a firearm and pass a background check considering both criminal and mental health records (again, presumably Dylann Roof would have failed). France: Firearms applicants must have no criminal record and pass a background check that considers the reason for the gun purchase and evaluates the criminal, mental, and health records of the applicant. (Dylann Roof would presumably have failed in this process). United Kingdom and Japan: Handguns are illegal for private citizens. While mass shootings as well as gun homicides and suicides are not unknown in these countries, the overall rates are substantially higher in the United States than in these competitor nations.

While NRA supporters frequently challenge me on these statistics saying that this is only because “American blacks are so violent,” it is important to note that white murder rates in the US are well over twice as high as the murder rates in any of these other countries.

Lax Gun Control In One Nation Can Create Problems In Another Of course, strict gun regulations cannot ensure that the danger of mass shootings or killings has been eliminated.

Norway has strong gun control and committed humane values. But they didn’t prevent Anders Breivik from opening fire on a youth camp on the island of Utoya in 2011? His clean criminal record and hunting license had allowed him to secure semiautomatic rifles, but Norway restricted his ability to get high-capacity clips for them. In his manifesto, Breivik wrote about his attempts to legally buy weapons, stating, “I envy our European American brothers as the gun laws in Europe sucks ass in comparison.”

In fact, in the same manifesto (“December and January – Rifle/gun accessories purchased”, Breivik wrote that it was from a US supplier that he purchased – and had mailed – ten 30-round ammunition magazines for the rifle he used in his attack.

In other words, even if a particular state chooses to make it harder for some would-be killers to get their weapons, these efforts can be undercut by the jurisdictions that hold out from these efforts. In the US, of course, gun control measures at the state and local level are often thwarted by the lax attitude to gun acquisition in other states.

The Conversation

Read more at https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2015/06/australia-hasnt-had-a-mass- shooting-since-1996/#GhCas3oIF5cd42oZ.99

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-18   9:39:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: A K A Stone (#18) (Edited)

The only dummy here is you. look in my youth, I used to carry a loaded rifle in my golf bag. absolutely stupid, but I justified it as for shooting crows while playing golf. If I shot at a crow I would have no idea where the bullet would land. When i was very young I took my uncles pistol out of its holster and pointed it at another child yes he was careless. Later in life my son went on the rampage and stole weapons from a neighbour, stole a motor bike and rode around like the terminator, we ended up with a siege and fortunately the only casualty was the house. now all of this was before Port Arthur

I know enough about guns and the use of them to know that the community is better off without them

paraclete  posted on  2017-03-18   9:48:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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