[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Mail]  [Sign-in]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register] 

Utopian Visionaries Who Won’t Leave People Alone

No - no - no Ain'T going To get away with iT

Pete Buttplug's Butt Plugger Trying to Turn Kids into Faggots

Mark Levin: I'm sick and tired of these attacks

Questioning the Big Bang

James Webb Data Contradicts the Big Bang

Pssst! Don't tell the creationists, but scientists don't have a clue how life began

A fine romance: how humans and chimps just couldn't let go

Early humans had sex with chimps

O’Keefe dons bulletproof vest to extract undercover journalist from NGO camp.

Biblical Contradictions (Alleged)

Catholic Church Praising Lucifer

Raising the Knife

One Of The HARDEST Videos I Had To Make..

Houthi rebels' attack severely damages a Belize-flagged ship in key strait leading to the Red Sea (British Ship)

Chinese Illegal Alien. I'm here for the moneuy

Red Tides Plague Gulf Beaches

Tucker Carlson calls out Nikki Haley, Ben Shapiro, and every other person calling for war:

{Are there 7 Deadly Sins?} I’ve heard people refer to the “7 Deadly Sins,” but I haven’t been able to find that sort of list in Scripture.

Abomination of Desolation | THEORY, BIBLE STUDY

Bible Help

Libertysflame Database Updated

Crush EVERYONE with the Alien Gambit!

Vladimir Putin tells Tucker Carlson US should stop arming Ukraine to end war

Putin hints Moscow and Washington in back-channel talks in revealing Tucker Carlson interview

Trump accuses Fulton County DA Fani Willis of lying in court response to Roman's motion

Mandatory anti-white racism at Disney.

Iceland Volcano Erupts For Third Time In 2 Months, State Of Emergency Declared

Tucker Carlson Interview with Vladamir Putin

How will Ar Mageddon / WW III End?

What on EARTH is going on in Acts 16:11? New Discovery!

2023 Hottest in over 120 Million Years

2024 and beyond in prophecy

Questions

This Speech Just Broke the Internet

This AMAZING Math Formula Will Teach You About God!

The GOSPEL of the ALIENS | Fallen Angels | Giants | Anunnaki

The IMAGE of the BEAST Revealed (REV 13) - WARNING: Not for Everyone

WEF Calls for AI to Replace Voters: ‘Why Do We Need Elections?’

The OCCULT Burger king EXPOSED

PANERA BREAD Antichrist message EXPOSED

The OCCULT Cheesecake Factory EXPOSED

Satanist And Witches Encounter The Cross

History and Beliefs of the Waldensians

Rome’s Persecution of the Bible

Evolutionists, You’ve Been Caught Lying About Fossils

Raw Streets of NYC Migrant Crisis that they don't show on Tv

Meet DarkBERT - AI Model Trained On DARK WEB

[NEW!] Jaw-dropping 666 Discovery Utterly Proves the King James Bible is God's Preserved Word

ALERT!!! THE MOST IMPORTANT INFORMATION WILL SOON BE POSTED HERE


Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

United States News
See other United States News Articles

Title: Do you think this is a reasonable math prbolem for a 4th grader?
Source: [None]
URL Source: [None]
Published: May 24, 2016
Author: me
Post Date: 2016-05-24 16:48:35 by no gnu taxes
Keywords: None
Views: 1771
Comments: 30

John saves $1 on day 1, $3 on day 2, $6 dollars on day 3, 10 dollars on day 4 and so on.

Given this pattern, how long will it take John to save $165?

This seems like at the very least a 7th grade problem.

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

#1. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

It's prbolematic.

Roscoe  posted on  2016-05-24   16:52:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Roscoe (#1)

I wish the edit function worked on Titles.

Obama has played at being a president while enjoying the perks … golf, insanely expensive vacations at tax-payer expense. He has ignored the responsibilities of the job; no plans, no budgets, no alternatives … just finger pointing; making him a complete failure as a president

no gnu taxes  posted on  2016-05-24   16:52:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

It'd take a sharp 4th grader.

Why do you ask?

A government strong enough to impose your standards is strong enough to ban them.

ConservingFreedom  posted on  2016-05-24   16:53:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: ConservingFreedom (#3)

This and other similar problems are on my daughter's 4th grade end of year math test.

I doubt many of the parents could solve this problem.

BTW, this is a public school. Ironically, the private schools here are much easier.

Obama has played at being a president while enjoying the perks … golf, insanely expensive vacations at tax-payer expense. He has ignored the responsibilities of the job; no plans, no budgets, no alternatives … just finger pointing; making him a complete failure as a president

no gnu taxes  posted on  2016-05-24   16:58:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

John saves $1 on day 1, $3 on day 2, $6 dollars on day 3, 10 dollars on day 4 and so on.

Given this pattern, how long will it take John to save $165?

It depends on the definition of "and so on".

rlk  posted on  2016-05-24   17:16:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

John saves $1 on day 1, $3 on day 2, $6 dollars on day 3, 10 dollars on day 4 and so on.

1,3,6,10?

What is the pattern? Add $3 to the amount saved each day? 6+3 does not equal 10.

***If we really want to be great again, go ask Uncle Sam to get back on our side of the border, get out of our wallets, get out of our papers and property, get out of our bodies, and get out of our way.*** “Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality.” ― Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

TheFireBert  posted on  2016-05-24   17:16:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: TheFireBert (#6)

1,3,6,10?

What is the pattern?

1 + 2 = 3; 3 + 3 = 6; 6 + 4 = 10.

10 + 5 = 15; 15 + 6 = 21; ...

A government strong enough to impose your standards is strong enough to ban them.

ConservingFreedom  posted on  2016-05-24   17:25:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: ConservingFreedom (#7)

Yeah, comes out to 9 days.

The public schools here are hard because they expect parents to carry half the water for them.

My daughter has at least an hour of homework every night on issues they expect us to teach her.

Obama has played at being a president while enjoying the perks … golf, insanely expensive vacations at tax-payer expense. He has ignored the responsibilities of the job; no plans, no budgets, no alternatives … just finger pointing; making him a complete failure as a president

no gnu taxes  posted on  2016-05-24   17:30:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: TheFireBert (#6) (Edited)

First you have to solve the pattern:

Day: ..1 .... 2 ... 3 ..... 4 ....... 5 ...
Amt: $1 .. $3 .. $6 .. $10 ... ($15)

The pattern is the previous day's amount plus the day #. Day 6 would be $15 + 6 = $21.

I'd say tough for a 4th grader.

misterwhite  posted on  2016-05-24   17:32:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: TheFireBert (#6)

What is the pattern?

The pattern is "Add the number of the day to the total from the day before".

It would be easier to find the answer by mechanical computation than to derive an algebraic expression and solve it.

Day 1 = $1 2 = $3 3 = $6 4 = $10 5 = $15 6 = $21 7 = $28 8 = $36 9 = $45 10 = $55 11 = $66 12 = $78 13 = $91 14 = $105 15 = $120 16 = $136 17 = $153 18 = $171

So, it would take 18 days to save $165 (or $166, or $169, all the way up to $171).

This is a pretty hard problem. You either "see" the pattern outright (which I did) or you spend endless time trying to find some sort of progression.

Worse, the end-point doesn't land on $165, so you have to have the broader sense to recognize that $165 is within the set of solutions for Day 18.

If the number were set, instead at $16,304, one would have to derive a formula. There is a formula for this sort of repeating sequence it resembles an interest problem), so once again one will either remember that formula, or one will have to derive it. It would take me a long time to do that.

This is a bit much for a 9 year old.

Vicomte13  posted on  2016-05-24   17:36:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Vicomte13 (#10)

It actually comes out to 9 days.

1+3+6+10+15+21+28+36+45=165

Obama has played at being a president while enjoying the perks … golf, insanely expensive vacations at tax-payer expense. He has ignored the responsibilities of the job; no plans, no budgets, no alternatives … just finger pointing; making him a complete failure as a president

no gnu taxes  posted on  2016-05-24   17:39:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

With the dept of education it is a 7th grade problem, get rid of the Dept of education and it will be a second grade problem.

The womb, the most dangerous place on earth.

BobCeleste  posted on  2016-05-24   19:40:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

That depends on the child and good teachers apparently some adults here didn't quite get the question which might mean comprehension isn't being taught.

paraclete  posted on  2016-05-24   20:28:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: no gnu taxes (#0)

Do you think this is a reasonable math prbolem for a 4th grader?

No, it is basically an algebra problem though it can be solved by brute force addition if the student recognizes the pattern and can add.

потому что Бог хочет это тот путь

SOSO  posted on  2016-05-24   21:59:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: SOSO (#14)

Add what?

Fred Mertz  posted on  2016-05-24   22:12:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Fred Mertz (#15)

The sum of numbers starting with 1, 1+2=3, 3+3=6, 6+4=10, 10+5=15, etc. etc. That is an inelegant way for solve the problem that was proposed using just arithmetic. There is a more elegant algebraic approach using mathematics. Both are well above 4th grade level expectations.

потому что Бог хочет это тот путь

SOSO  posted on  2016-05-24   23:26:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Fred Mertz (#16)

The sum of numbers starting with 1, 1+2=3, 3+3=6, 6+4=10, 10+5=15, etc. etc. That is an inelegant way for solve the problem that was proposed using just arithmetic. There is a more elegant algebraic approach using mathematics. Both are well above 4th grade level expectations.

Before you ask the answer is n(n+1)/2.

потому что Бог хочет это тот путь

SOSO  posted on  2016-05-24   23:30:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: SOSO (#17)

Before you ask the answer is n(n+1)/2.

That gives a digit, for n=9 it would yield 45 (9*10/2), correct for the ninth digit in the sequence, but not the sum of the digits.

The formula for the sum is:

f(n) = n(n+1)(n+2)/6

For n=9:

f(9) = 9(10)(11)/6

f(9) = 990/6 = 165

nolu chan  posted on  2016-05-25   1:29:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: no gnu taxes (#11)

It actually comes out to 9 days.

1+3+6+10+15+21+28+36+45=165

You're right. I was ignoring the cash already accumulated and just looking at the day's number.

Vicomte13  posted on  2016-05-25   9:35:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: nolu chan (#18)

The formula for the sum is:

f(n) = n(n+1)(n+2)/6

Why divided by 6? That is not intuitive.

Vicomte13  posted on  2016-05-25   9:52:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Vicomte13 (#20)

I'm certainly not going to through the algebraic manipulations it would take to form an equation. My guess is you would have to solve it like forming the equation for figuring each period payment to pay off an interest loan. You form a general equation, multiply by a factor, and then subtract the original equation. You eliminate all the middle terms, allowing you come up with an equation based on the number of terms.

That is at the very least high school level math.

Obama has played at being a president while enjoying the perks … golf, insanely expensive vacations at tax-payer expense. He has ignored the responsibilities of the job; no plans, no budgets, no alternatives … just finger pointing; making him a complete failure as a president

no gnu taxes  posted on  2016-05-25   10:18:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: nolu chan (#18)

That gives a digit, for n=9 it would yield 45 (9*10/2),

Correct.

потому что Бог хочет это тот путь

SOSO  posted on  2016-05-25   20:16:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Vicomte13 (#20)

Why divided by 6? That is not intuitive.

1*2*3... Not easy to explain.

The sum of the first positive integers 1+2+3 ... (n-2)+(n-1)+(n)

for n=100

1+100
2+99
3+98
[...]
98+3
99+2
100+1

50x101 = 5050

50 × 101 = (100/2) × 101 = (100/2) × (100 + 1)

Substituting n for 100, we get (n/2) × (n + 1) for the SUM of the first n integers.

Or n(n+1)/2

Now let us look at the 4th grade problem (not):

(1)   1     1            1
(2)   3     4           12
(3)   6    10          123
(4)  10    20         1234
(5)  15    35        12345
(6)  21    56       123456
(7)  28    84      1234567
(8)  36   120     12345678
(9)  45   165    123456789

For n=9, there is 9*1, 8*2, 7*3, 6*4, 5*5, 4*5, 3*6, 2*7, and 1*9. A fourth grader might just add them up.

Each of the numbers 1 thru 9 of the sequence is made by the sum of the first n integers, or n(n+1)/2.

For n=4, the sequence number is 10 (1+2+3+4).

For n=4, the sum of n=1 thru n=4 is (1) + (1+2) + (1+2+3) + (1+2+3+4) or 1+3+6+10 = 20

1 + 3 + 6 + 10 + 15 + 21 + 28 + 36 + 45

(1)  9*0 + 1 = 1       1
(2)  9*0 + 3 = 3       4
(3)  9*0 + 6 = 6      10
(4)  9*1 + 1 = 10     20
(5)  9*1 + 6 = 15     35
(6)  9*2 + 3 = 21     56
(7)  9*3 + 1 = 28     84
(8)  9*4 + 0 = 36    120
(9)  9*5 + 0 = 45    165

9*16=144 plus 1+3+6 + 1+3+6 + 1 = 21. Total 165.

To get the sequence number, multiply n*n+1 (two factors) and divide by 2 (1*2).

For n=4, multiply 4 x 5 = 20, divide by 2, and the number is 10.

For the sum of all sequence numbers to n, multiply n*n+1*n+2 (three factors) and divide by 6 (1*2*3).

For sum n=4, multiply 4 x 5 x 6 = 120, divide by 6, and the sum is 20.

g(n) = n(n+1)/2

f(n) is the sum of the numbers 1 through n.

So:

f(n) = g(1) + g(2) + ... + g(n)

And:

f(n) = n(n+1)(n+2)/6

nolu chan  posted on  2016-05-25   20:30:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: nolu chan (#23) (Edited)

goldilucky  posted on  2016-05-27   14:58:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: nolu chan (#23)

This is calculus and is advanced math more suitable for college students. In order for one to understand calculus you have to understand the basic concept of algebra and the FOIL method before you can integrate this into calculus. Therefore, it is not suitable for a fourth grader.

goldilucky  posted on  2016-05-27   15:01:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: nolu chan (#23) (Edited)

goldilucky  posted on  2016-05-27   15:02:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: goldilucky (#25)

it is not suitable for a fourth grader.

I agree and did sort of signify that I do not see it as a fourth-grade question. It is nothing I ever saw in fourth grade.

Now let us look at the 4th grade problem (not):

nolu chan  posted on  2016-05-27   18:01:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: nolu chan (#27)

I missed that one. Thanks.

goldilucky  posted on  2016-05-28   12:49:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: misterwhite (#9)

I'd say tough for a 4th grader.

Exactly!

Thinking like a 4th grader I would wonder what the question was getting at. They have their head filled with so much other crap that extrapolating a pattern out of a seemingly random (at first) set of numbers... seems like insanity. And with no algebraic background to back up the higher level of thinking, I would assume they have little basis to solve the problem with.

No wonder they go on to political science or psychology; at least then they can make stuff up and no one will call them out on it!

***If we really want to be great again, go ask Uncle Sam to get back on our side of the border, get out of our wallets, get out of our papers and property, get out of our bodies, and get out of our way.*** “Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality.” ― Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

TheFireBert  posted on  2016-05-31   21:28:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: TheFireBert (#29)

This is a common question on the SATs -- determining the pattern of numbers. But if the kids were being taught patterns in class, this problem isn't that bad.

But throwing this problem out of the blue at a ten-year-old would stump him.

misterwhite  posted on  2016-06-01   9:00:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Mail]  [Sign-in]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register] 

Please report web page problems, questions and comments to webmaster@libertysflame.com